V9 Feature: No Confirmation Lane Change

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SoFlaModel3

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#4
So now the blue banner at the top of the screen is used to indicate the direction of the upcoming lane change?
After playing back my own video I realized that the car won't change lanes without your hands on the wheel. That's such a smart feature!!! It's going to make us all better Autopilot drivers.
 

GDN

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#5
After playing back my own video I realized that the car won't change lanes without your hands on the wheel. That's such a smart feature!!! It's going to make us all better Autopilot drivers.
Didn't your first freeway entrance and lane change happen without hands on the wheel? And you were able to cruise a ways without touching the wheel? Was it just coincidental timing? What would happen if you just adjusted the volume instead of torquing the wheel? Will have to trial this in the AM.
 

SoFlaModel3

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#6
Didn't your first freeway entrance and lane change happen without hands on the wheel? And you were able to cruise a ways without touching the wheel? Was it just coincidental timing? What would happen if you just adjusted the volume instead of torquing the wheel? Will have to trial this in the AM.
Will play more (cautiously) tomorrow on my rush hour commute but it seems to be clear that it won’t change lanes if you’re not holding the wheel. The first merge was necessity because I would have run out of road.
 

garsh

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#7
I tried it out this morning.

When merging onto the interstate, it got confused. It popped up the warning about an upcoming lane change. But then we ran out of on-ramp right before it initiated the turn signal, so the car got "shoved" into the slow lane by the disappearing on-ramp lines.

But the turn signal remained on - it wanted to switch to the left lane. I just cancelled that before it got started.
 

Dogwhistle

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#8
Yeah, merging on-ramps still seem to be the biggest thing baffling NoA. I think it has mostly to do with the granularity of the map info it has for each one, many it just doesn’t have enough info to know what to do! Most of mine, it just runs out of lane, and force-merges.
 

JWardell

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#10
Has anyone else been repeatedly annoyed when attempting to cancel a NOA lane change? Since it often trues to change at the wrong time, I often try to cancel, and hitting the blinker stalk then leaves your blinker on. So now you look like some idiot swerving back and forth in the lane with left blinker on (by NOA) then right blinker on (by me cancelling) and sometimes back to left blinker on again as I attempt to cancel out the now-stuck-on right blinker.
Or maybe they've improved this...
 

JWardell

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#12
I just tap the screen to cancel. No blinker issues.
That may be new...documentation always said use signal. One of the long list of Tesla issue/feedback emails I've sent that never got a response.
I should have a chance to test some more tomorrow.
 

GDN

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#13
I also gave it a shot on the commute this morning, and while it handled two lane changes OK it couldn't handle my on ramp at all, or maybe I just didn't give it time. Traffic was moving about 30 MPH, bumper to bumper and no one let's you over easy. The car turns the blinker on and slows down and then speeds up a bit and I've got cars behind me, I just took over. I want the NN to learn and I want it to get better, so will use it when I can, but rush hour right now isn't the best place. It will get better I'm sure and will give it another shot another time.

I also had a much better experience with NOA in general today about suggesting lane changes. I turned Mad Max down to average and it was 200% better. Mad Max suggests many lane changes and not worth it in my opinion, at least not in moderate traffic. Again - a months time we hope to see improvements and will try again. @JWardell - not sure which option you have, but might consider turning it down to average if you are on Mad Max for those lane changes. For the record to cancel - I also hit the blue notice at the top of the driving directions.
 

theblindtree

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#14
I tried it out on my morning commute as well, and other than one confusion with a lane change (a safe merge but in a construction zone), it performed much better than I expected. In fact, it handled most of the changes, on-ramp and off-ramp, with some degree of skill. Impressive!

That being said, I would still rate NoAP at the skill level of a driver's education student - pretty good, getting more confident, still needs work on responsive behavior reaction awareness. I'm always surprised that any car that I can clearly see merging into my lane seems to catch AP off guard... (Well, not surprised but rather curious about the interpretation)
 

NOGA$4ME

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#15
Regarding merging onto the highway...sometimes it works well, and sometimes the system is just a bit slow.

Many human drivers will start their lane change at the absolute earliest possible opportunity, sometimes cutting across the solid white line. At the very least the merge will initiate at the end of the solid white line/beginning of the dashed line.

With NoA, it first has to detect the highway lane (after the end of the solid white line); then it has to warn you about a lane change (steering wheel shake/beep); then it has to turn on the blinker and...ooops, just ran out of lane!

Meanwhile, everyone behind you has pulled into the left lane and is now blocking you from merging in.

It's not an easy problem to solve, but I suspect the car is up to it. They/we just need to get more confident in its abilities and then they can reduce the time it takes to make lane change decisions (and maybe avoid the time delay to allow you to cancel).
 

FRC

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#16
I, like many, just came from 5.15 thru 8.4 t0 8.5. I had a chance for 80 mile test run this morning and was pretty impressed. The main reason for my trip was to test 8.5 out, so I was able to play around with it quite a bit. Like @GDN(BTW, GDN, what does NN mean). I have lane change set to medium. Lane changes were smooth and for the most part appropriate. I think @theblindtree says it well, much like a third week drivers ed student. improving all the time. Cancelling lane change is unwieldy, can be done with turn stalk with practice, and you've got to be pretty quick to cancel with screen tap.

I've done several road-trips, and it's been interesting to see the evolution of autopilot regarding lane changes. Back in October, under EAP, I would find myself behind another vehicle going much slower than TACC was set, simply because I didn't notice the gradual deceleration and was content to let TACC do the work. With confirmed lane change, the car would nag me to change lanes instead of remaining behind a slower vehicle. Certainly an improvement, but a bit like travelling with you spouse! I'm really looking forward to 8.5 on my upcoming 8,000 mile trip. I think it will be seamless on the open uncongested stretches, and will be very helpful on unfamiliar urban interchanges.

The only real issue I had today was upon exit from the highway. I had AP set at 80 mph and follow set at 3. I was following a vehicle in the left lane at about 70 mph. There was another vehicle in the right lane very slightly behind me also going about 70. As my exit was looming about a mile ahead NOA signaled a right hand lane change. I could tell this was going to be an issue and let it play out to see what would happen. I felt like there were three options...1) There was sufficient room ahead to accelerate and make the lane change(this is the option I would have chosen)...2) We could slow down and pull in behind the car on my right. 3) We could miss our exit and continue to the next one. NOA chose none of these, instead we rode for almost a mile with the blinker on until the right lane car slowed enough for NOA to safely change lanes. I don't know what would have happened if right lane hadn't slowed. I certainly could have overridden NOA and avoided the situation, but I was too curious to see what would happen.

I can confirm that NOA won't change lanes without "hands-on-wheel". I typically ride with my left hand hanging from the wheel and rarely see nags. This set-up also avoided the nag during lane changes. But if you're not "hands-on-wheel" when the lane change alert begins, even if it nagged 2 seconds prior, it won't lane change until you are again "hands-on-wheel'.

All in all, I'd give this update a solid A-. Can't wait to see what's next.
 

GDN

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#17
@SoFlaModel3 Can you comment on your wipers coming on during the video. I'll be honest and say I can't tell if it was raining on not, but your wipers thought so. The wiper action might or might not be something they are working on in the beta releases.
 

GDN

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#18
I, like many, just came from 5.15 thru 8.4 t0 8.5. I had a chance for 80 mile test run this morning and was pretty impressed. The main reason for my trip was to test 8.5 out, so I was able to play around with it quite a bit. Like @GDN(BTW, GDN, what does NN mean). I have lane change set to medium. Lane changes were smooth and for the most part appropriate. I think @theblindtree says it well, much like a third week drivers ed student. improving all the time. Cancelling lane change is unwieldy, can be done with turn stalk with practice, and you've got to be pretty quick to cancel with screen tap.

I've done several road-trips, and it's been interesting to see the evolution of autopilot regarding lane changes. Back in October, under EAP, I would find myself behind another vehicle going much slower than TACC was set, simply because I didn't notice the gradual deceleration and was content to let TACC do the work. With confirmed lane change, the car would nag me to change lanes instead of remaining behind a slower vehicle. Certainly an improvement, but a bit like travelling with you spouse! I'm really looking forward to 8.5 on my upcoming 8,000 mile trip. I think it will be seamless on the open uncongested stretches, and will be very helpful on unfamiliar urban interchanges.

The only real issue I had today was upon exit from the highway. I had AP set at 80 mph and follow set at 3. I was following a vehicle in the left lane at about 70 mph. There was another vehicle in the right lane very slightly behind me also going about 70. As my exit was looming about a mile ahead NOA signaled a right hand lane change. I could tell this was going to be an issue and let it play out to see what would happen. I felt like there were three options...1) There was sufficient room ahead to accelerate and make the lane change(this is the option I would have chosen)...2) We could slow down and pull in behind the car on my right. 3) We could miss our exit and continue to the next one. NOA chose none of these, instead we rode for almost a mile with the blinker on until the right lane car slowed enough for NOA to safely change lanes. I don't know what would have happened if right lane hadn't slowed. I certainly could have overridden NOA and avoided the situation, but I was too curious to see what would happen.

I can confirm that NOA won't change lanes without "hands-on-wheel". I typically ride with my left hand hanging from the wheel and rarely see nags. This set-up also avoided the nag during lane changes. But if you're not "hands-on-wheel" when the lane change alert begins, even if it nagged 2 seconds prior, it won't lane change until you are again "hands-on-wheel'.

All in all, I'd give this update a solid A-. Can't wait to see what's next.
NN - Nerual Network. Some of the new things in our IT world. I don't pretend to understand it at all, but they are pretty dang cool. I need to read and understand more about them.
 

slotti

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#19
Glad to hear is was working for you. I had the complete opposite experience this morning on my commute. Was excited about using the new feature but it pretty much failed during the entire drive. Granted, I am in LA and traffic on 101, 405 and 10 makes it tough for the car to do any auto lane change, but it would be very illogical about the entire drive. Transition from 405 to I-10. One mile ahead and the car wants to get into the most left passing lane. 500 feet to the exit and no indication of moving to the right, so I had to take over.
Exiting I-10. I was already in the most right lane. Exit is coming up, 300 feet in front of the exit, the car puts on the turn signal, moves to the right side of the lane....I am thinking great. I am 50 feet away from the actual off-ramp and the car jerks to the left and pulls into running traffic. I was barely able to avoid a collision with the cars on my left.
 

panpanbebe

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#20
I can’t find if this is the beat setting for the new features Tesla just add on?

Do I need “Require lane change confirmation” to be off in order for Lane notification to activate it?
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