Software v10.2 2019.40.50.1 7fefc12d805a (12/24/2019). The Christmas Eve Update

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Mike

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Hmm. For what it's worth, none of that happens in our car.

But it's understandable that passengers would be alarmed by what's happening in yours.

Here's our sitch:
  1. We only use Autopilot on freeways.
  2. We never cancel Autopilot by yanking the wheel. Instead, we place our foot on the accelerator to hold speed steady and stalk-up to calmly and quietly disengage it when necessary (and engage Joe Mode to quiet the chimes a bit).
  3. We never "chase nags." Instead, we keep hands in our lap on the wheel providing a gentle turning force either direction, and never hear nag beeps. That habit of providing steering pressure is not stressful, and your hands are ready in case you need quick action.
  4. We so far have disabled Lane Departure and Emergency Lane Departure features. In my opinion those are annoying and not necessary. My brother has a Toyota with Lane Departure Warning enabled, and I beg him each time I'm in his car to turn it off.
  5. We don't see any phantom braking lately. Haven't seen those on our local (Norther California Bay Area) roads in over a year. Had a few in early/mid-2018, but subsequent releases cleaned them up for us on our roads.
I also follow most of your suggested techniques.

However, for passenger comfort, since 10.x has come online, the ping-ponging/over-correcting that now happens on sweeping curves or once a shoulder line is re-acquired (after a hunt for lane center after a lane split/end), I do take manual control of the steering.

And in eastern Ontario freeways in poor weather, 10.x is now too eager to relinquish control (alarms) back to the driver......and the copilot is NOT amused.
 

SalisburySam

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I’ve had 31 firmware updates since my LR RWD EAP/FSD purchase in July, 2018. Now on v40.50.1 and still have phantom braking. Some releases seemed to ameliorate this annoyance, but with the most recent update phantom braking is back. Recent 300-mile trip, 14 phantom braking events, bug reports each time. On 3 occasions, I noticed the speed limit change momentarily to a slower speed when a secondary but wide road passed over me on an Interstate. I guess those 3 occasions aren’t really phantom braking events since the car thought the speed limit changed...but very much an annoyance nonetheless.

Tesla, please, please, please devote a resource or two to still-happening phantom braking. It’s definitely killing my enjoyment of the car when passengers are riding with me.
 

bsunny

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Applying pressure to the wheel is an unfortunate necessity during autopilot. I wish the car had another way as I prefer to drive two handed. Alas two handled does not work for me as I seem to subconsciously drive with the car and that gets me the nag. This update has some problem where it unexpectedly drops out of autopilot. Suddenly the gentle pressure that autopilot was applying to my hand is gone and now my hand is turning the wheel in a jerk, startling both my wife and me. Oops.
I agree with your description and assessment of AP’s “are you paying attention” requirement. I helps me understand why it keeps nagging me. It causes me to hold on tighter, making it less relaxing and I consciously jiggle the steering wheel to get it to “see” me... and ultimately, I think it overrides AP and bounces me out. I’ve tried the scroll button method some people have suggested but I also like to hold the steering wheel (at 10 and 2) and it just adds more need for my attention to be diverted to see if it is nagging me (via a warning on display) so I can tweak it, or just move it every so often (how often I have not figured out and not sure I like that method enough to care.)

I’m expecting all this will improve, but for now I wish I could figure out a way to be able to relax my grip and keep AP going without me either overriding it accidentally or being considered inattentive. (Note: I am posting this here in response and also because I think (maybe) this was slightly better when I drove yesterday on 3019.40.50.5... I will post there or on another more appropriate location if I do notice a difference after I get to test it out more in a few days.)
 

MelindaV

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I agree with your description and assessment of AP’s “are you paying attention” requirement. I helps me understand why it keeps nagging me. It causes me to hold on tighter, making it less relaxing and I consciously jiggle the steering wheel to get it to “see” me... and ultimately, I think it overrides AP and bounces me out. I’ve tried the scroll button method some people have suggested but I also like to hold the steering wheel (at 10 and 2) and it just adds more need for my attention to be diverted to see if it is nagging me (via a warning on display) so I can tweak it, or just move it every so often (how often I have not figured out and not sure I like that method enough to care.)

I’m expecting all this will improve, but for now I wish I could figure out a way to be able to relax my grip and keep AP going without me either overriding it accidentally or being considered inattentive. (Note: I am posting this here in response and also because I think (maybe) this was slightly better when I drove yesterday on 3019.40.50.5... I will post there or on another more appropriate location if I do notice a difference after I get to test it out more in a few days.)
the steering wheel doesn't register squeezing the wheel, but any slight torque on it. for me, just holding the wheel lightly is enough to show the car Im there. I use AP daily and can't remember the last nag I've seen.
 

bsunny

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the steering wheel doesn't register squeezing the wheel, but any slight torque on it. for me, just holding the wheel lightly is enough to show the car Im there. I use AP daily and can't remember the last nag I've seen.
Yep, thanks, I do know that. But I’ve tried holding lightly, resting my hands downward maybe, but feel like I have to “jiggle” it (torque) often enough for it to be sure I’m paying attention... and I have to consciously not grab it tighter... and if I torque just the wrong way, it pops out of AP because it thinks I am overriding. I actually like that it’s so easy to override when necessary, but I have not been able to find that sweet spot. I’m sure it’s just me. 🥴
 

DocScott

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Yep, thanks, I do know that. But I’ve tried holding lightly, resting my hands downward maybe, but feel like I have to “jiggle” it (torque) often enough for it to be sure I’m paying attention... and I have to consciously not grab it tighter... and if I torque just the wrong way, it pops out of AP because it thinks I am overriding. I actually like that it’s so easy to override when necessary, but I have not been able to find that sweet spot. I’m sure it’s just me. 🥴
For me, I'd say it was maybe 1500 miles of driving on AP before it finally became second-nature. Before that, I was often falling back on the jiggling technique.

I do think the system discourages hands on wheel at 10 and 2, at least if (like me) you're nearly ambidextrous and thus tend to have the two hands balanced. I tend to drive on AP with just one hand at 2, and then let the resistance of the wheel support the weight of my hand. But that's ironically less safe than if I could just drive with hands balanced. I wish the system either used gaze-tracking or pressure on the wheel rather than torque.
 

JeanDeBarraux

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To me, the car's "intelligence" has a long way to go before FSD is even close to a reality. Setting aside all the really tricky/unexpected things that come up driving on city streets, if the car can't even handle a car turning left in front of it without totally freaking out, this whole thing is dead in the water and will only ever be worth anything on highways.
At the moment, AP/EAP should only be used on divided highways (where a car turning in front of you would not happen unless, perhaps, if there was an accident). If you use it elsewhere, you can't complain.

Just imagine having to figure out how they translated the commands in french...I barely use them because I don't know them, not that I didn't try.
I just might end up switching language to english, but it's just against my principles :rolleyes:
They have a few examples in the documentation. Also, if you don't say anything after activating voice control, it will come up with a few suggestions. If your voice control is like mine, none of those commands work. "Aller à la maison" or "Aller au travail" just responds with an english "Navigating to Unknown". Almost all the other commands (even the ones that used to work, like "Appeler") respond with "Unrecognized command".
I've tried switching to English, but I get the same behaviour.
 

Jason Krellner

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At the moment, AP/EAP should only be used on divided highways (where a car turning in front of you would not happen unless, perhaps, if there was an accident). If you use it elsewhere, you can't complain.
I did not say I use AP/EAP outside of divided highways. I don't. But I do use TACC everywhere and that's when I get the phantom and ill-advised braking.

I then extrapolated that to the future, where we will all apparently have access to FSD on city streets. And my point was that if TACC can't even handle a common event like someone turning left in front of you, then that does not bode well for FSD's viability in the near future.
 

Mike

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But I do use TACC everywhere and that's when I get the phantom and ill-advised braking.
Same here.

I wish for "dumb" cruise control in these situations.

On curvy 2 lane (secondary) highways, any oncoming traffic has a 50-50 shot of giving me the brakes if said traffic is on the other side of a rise and (appears to be) coming from my right.
 

Jason Krellner

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I wish for "dumb" cruise control in these situations.
Hear, hear. I've been calling for this since I got the car. To me, we should be able to have "dumb" cruise control when EAP/NOA is not engaged. Perhaps a user-selectable option? I've always been a fan of regular cruise control, as I like to control when the vehicle slows down.
 

Mesprit87

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Also, if you don't say anything after activating voice control, it will come up with a few suggestions. If your voice control is like mine, none of those commands work. "Aller à la maison" or "Aller au travail" just responds with an english "Navigating to Unknown". Almost all the other commands (even the ones that used to work, like "Appeler") respond with "Unrecognized command".
I've tried switching to English, but I get the same behaviour.
Thanks for the tip, the other known commands for work, home or call always worked in my case. Haven't tried them since 2019.40.50 though.
 

Mike

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Hear, hear. I've been calling for this since I got the car. To me, we should be able to have "dumb" cruise control when EAP/NOA is not engaged. Perhaps a user-selectable option? I've always been a fan of regular cruise control, as I like to control when the vehicle slows down.
That would be a great option.

With V10.x seemingly relinquishing control back to me for a single seconds worth of a splash of water and then locking me out for a while.....and then having no cruise control at all just sucks.
 

JeanDeBarraux

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Thanks for the tip, the other known commands for work, home or call always worked in my case. Haven't tried them since 2019.40.50 though.
They used to work prior to installing 50.1. I was updated to 50.5 yesterday and 50.7 this morning. Voice commands still don't work in French, but when I switched the language to English, I was able to use "Drive home" or "Go to work" successfully. But very few of the other commands worked.
 

GDN

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Am i the only one that’s still on this version?
Per Teslafi you are not, but you are definitely at the tail end. With over 92% of the Teslafi represented fleet on 50.7 I would think you are justified in opening a Service ticket from your app and see if they wouldn't try to push it. I figure we are just a week or so away from another big release, but I'm just guessing.

screen-shot-2020-01-11-at-4-26-03-pm-png.31688
 

Mistersandman

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Per Teslafi you are not, but you are definitely at the tail end. With over 92% of the Teslafi represented fleet on 50.7 I would think you are justified in opening a Service ticket from your app and see if they wouldn't try to push it. I figure we are just a week or so away from another big release, but I'm just guessing.

View attachment 31688
Ticket opened. Thanks. And Yeah, I thought it was odd especially since I’ve usually been one of the earlier ones to get a new version when it’s released.
 

sduck

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Am i the only one that’s still on this version?
Ummm, no, I'm still on it, mostly by accident though. My car is in tesla body shop limbo - I dropped it off on December 30 and got the notification for an update later that day. So I'm one of the ones on teslafi gumming up the numbers.