OEM 18" Tires; starting to notice a whine about 40 kph

Mike

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#1
Situation: I have about 12,500 kms on the OEM 18" tires. They have been rotated at 10,000 Kms. The tread wear on all four tires is even.

Yesterday, I noticed a subtle whine that became apparent at about 40 kph.

Since then, I have confirmed that the subtle noise is constant in frequency and apparent loudness regardless of the speed above 40 kph and regardless of the type of solid surface materiel I drive on.

The sound is kind of like when driving on old fashioned bias ply tires and one would enter onto a freeway made of concrete.

Anyone else noticing any sort of tire whine?

PS: I did a rudimentary check of the bearings on all four wheels and all four wheels do no exhibit any play.
 

garsh

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#2
... I have confirmed that the subtle noise is constant in frequency and apparent loudness regardless of the speed above 40 kph and regardless of the type of solid surface materiel I drive on.
I don't know of any kind of tire issue where the frequency *doesn't* change with speed.
What makes you think this is caused by the tires?
 

Mike

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#3
I don't know of any kind of tire issue where the frequency *doesn't* change with speed.
What makes you think this is caused by the tires?
I had a (new) 2007 Honda Civic Hybrid (for about 18 months).

About six months into ownership, while on a very long distance trip, we began to experience a "howl" that got louder as the trip progressed.

When we got home, I observed that the two rear tires were bald (!) on the inboard portion of the tread area.

As it turned out, there was a TSB that addressed the issue of abnormal wear on the inner portions of the rear tires accompanied by a loud noise.

The fix was (IIRC), a new lower control arm for each side....... I also got them to replace the tires.......

The above experience included the noise coming on at speeds about 30 kph and it did not/did not change in frequency, it only got louder.

This is why I think my current situation may be related to tire noise.

If any music is played, I don't hear the new noise (yet).

But when my wife travels with me, there is no music playing and yesterday I heard this for the first time.

As an aside, last week I did a 1157 km run in two days with my brother, with no music playing.

I did not hear then what I am hearing now.

In any case, I'll monitor and report back in a few weeks if no one else has the same issue.
 

Mike

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#7
Any change in the six weeks since you last reported?
Actually, I think so.

Either I'm used to it now or it has become less noisy because of tire wear in.

In any event, today when I go for a drive I will specifically listen for it (no music when my wife is in the car) and report back.
 

PNWmisty

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#8
Front to back and then back to cross to opposite front.
The Michelin Primacy MXM4 tires have an asymmetrical design. This means they have an inside and an outside and must be mounted on the rim accordingly. Some asymmetrical tires have directional tread patterns (different depending upon direction of rotation) and it looks like the MXM4's are directional. I was under the impression (perhaps mistaken) that directional tires shouldn't be rotated from one side to the other but the Model 3 Owner's Manual doesn't address rotation patterns. On other cars with directional tread, I've had good results just rotating from front to back and back again, tires never swapping sides.

Did Tesla rotate them? What do you know about this?
 

Mike

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#9
and it looks like the MXM4's are directional.
I have reviewed the tires and no where on them is any designation that they are "directional".

A 2+55 primer on asymmetrical versus directional:



These are photos of the actual tread patterns on all four tires:

Drivers front:
drivers-front-jpg.17057

Drivers rear:
drivers-rear-jpg.17058

Pax front:
pax-front-jpg.17059

Pax rear:
pax-rear-jpg.17060


As one can see, the larger tread blocks are on the outside of all four tires.

I was under the impression (perhaps mistaken) that directional tires shouldn't be rotated from one side to the other
You are correct.

If the tires are stamped with a "directional" label plus an arrow indicating same, then one does not cross tires from one side to the other.

Did Tesla rotate them? What do you know about this?
No, I did the rotation myself a while back.

From this thread:

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=43&affiliate=JQ8

t1-png.17066

And from this thread:

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/cross-rotating-michelin-mxm4-19.47752/page-2

t2-png.17067

I'm over 5,000 kms after the first rotation and using a depth gauge across all four tires, they are all still within 1/32" of tread depth of each other.

Like everything else, YMMV.

As for the noise: it is still there, but much less so. In fact, the HVAC fan on speed "1" creats more cabin white noise than the tires.......
 
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13004

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#10
Front to back and then back to cross to opposite front.
Not going to tell folks how often or in what pattern they should rotate their tires 'cause opinions are like.......

Anywayz, my goal (since I am a super cheapskate) to increase the service life of my tires (I think I stated this on sum other thread around here) is to introduce as many wear patterns as possible to each tire AND since Tesla’s are loaded up with both front and rear camber and sum toe thrown in the mix, I never rotate my tires in a pattern such that it will have them spin in the same direction from one tire rotation to another which just exacerbates cupping/noise/vibration. I am not one to worry about directional or asymmetric requirements. One should always follow Tesla and tire expert's guidelines for rotation, tire pressure, and alignment specs and one should never drive their Kawasaki ZRX1200R (pipe, advancer, jet kit) on one wheel at highway speeds :p.

On a side note the 3 will require much less effort for me to achieve a minimum of 60,000 miles on a set of tires since it is shipped with decent alignment settings as compared to an early S, which is basically one hot sloppy mess and needed much re-work to suit my particular needs. I like to visually inspect and touch my tires on a routine basis whether it be with an IR temp gun (I have one, but mostly use it to check on electrical installs) , rubbing them fore and aft, and rubbing them from side-to-side (inboard-to-outboard) while in the garage parked. Ones hand can easily feel excessive cupping (rough in one direction and smooth in the other direction) that is more prevalent on the inboard side of the tire since that is where most of the scrubbing pressure is placed during normal driving as it fights the increased outer (affective) diameter and may need to be addressed by various methods.
 
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