nema 10-30/ 14-50

webdriverguy

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#1
Hi Guys,

Got my M3 just over two weeks and loving it. So far I am doing SC and some charging on 110v outlet which is very slow. I plan to install a nema 14-50 outlet. My panel is 125 amps and I see that I have 30 amp breaker which the dryer uses which has the nema 10-30.

I was wondering if there is no place in the panel to put a 50amp breaker for nema 14-50 is it possible to share the 30amp breaker between the dryer and install a new nema 10-30 outlet in my garage? Because at a time I am going to use the dryer or charge my tesla.

Feedback appreciated
 

Dr. J

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#2

John

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#3
The way it works is that you have a main breaker that can handle the load of all the circuits it serves, and then each of those circuits has a breaker that can handle all of the current of the outlets on that circuit.

Whenever you start powering a new device, or make a change to a circuit to power a new device, you need to reassess the breakers. For instance, if you upsize a breaker on a circuit, you need to revisit the size of the main breaker and perhaps upsize it as well. And of course the actual wires in that hierarchy all need to be sized appropriately to handle the new current.

If you do share the 10-30 outlet, make sure both devices CAN'T be on at the same time (perhaps unplug one to plug the other into the same outlet). Also, on your Model 3 you must limit the charging current to a level that won't trip the breaker. If you have a 30A breaker, set the car to 24A (always 80% of breaker rating in the US).

What I did was to install a new NEMA 14-50 near my garage door on a new dedicated circuit. It required me to add a breaker for it, upsize my main breaker, and also upgrade the short wires between the main panel and the sub-panel box. With a 50A breaker, this setup can comfortably handle the 32A of the Mobile Connector, or even the 40A of the Gen 1 Mobile Connector if I bought one off of eBay or something.
 
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iChris93

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#4
Alternatively, you could move two 15 amp circuit breakers to a tandem breaker to open up some slots in the panel.

You must also consider exactly what @John said.
 
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webdriverguy

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#5
Thanks for the quick replies guys. Being a newbie gives me some info befor I talk to my electrician.

@John I you don’t mind sharing can I ask how much the 14-50 install cost you?
 

slacker775

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#6
It sounds like you are in a situation pretty to similar to what i had. I’m also on a 125A main panel though my dryer is two stories up, so no ability to use something like Dryer Buddy with that. I wasn’t going to be able to add a 14-50 without upgrading the panel, but I was able to add a 14-30. In your situation, I think I would really look at Dryer Buddy first as it could be the cheapest overall option. If you do wind up having to get a new outlet installed, you may be lucky and be able to get a 50A (esp if you have some gas appliances), but if you have to go with a 30A, it’s still 22mph charge rate which really isn’t too bad. Certainly a lot better than the ~4mph on a regular outlet.
 

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I had a similar situation to you; it was too expensive to get a NEMA 14-50 outlet installed in my garage.

I bought a Dry Buddy instead, it’s a Dryer Buddy Plus Auto with two NEMA 10-30 outlets. It’s been working great so far (22 miles per hour of charge) and Brad of BSA is super responsive. https://www.bsaelectronics.com/

Basically, you plug the Dryer Buddy into your current dryer outlet, then you plug your dryer and the Tesla NEMA 10-30 adapter into the Dryer Buddy. The Dryer Buddy will automatically shut off power to the UMC if the dryer is on, so there’s no extra load.

Let me know if you have any questions.
 

webdriverguy

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#9
Thanks Jim. My only issue is the dryer is in basement and garage is above. I could get a extension but I am thinking I don’t want to do that.
 

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#10
What's the logic in buying a portable EVSE and installing a socket and leaving the portable EVSE permanently affixed in the socket, vs. just installing a fixed EVSE?

Or, contrarily, if you're unplugging and plugging in a portable EVSE daily, you'll wear out the socket pretty quickly.
 

garsh

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What's the logic in buying a portable EVSE and installing a socket and leaving the portable EVSE permanently affixed in the socket, vs. just installing a fixed EVSE?
  1. What makes you think he's buying one? Why wouldn't he use the one included with the car?
  2. Even if he is buying one, they're currently less expensive than a Tesla wall charger ($300 vs $500).
Or, contrarily, if you're unplugging and plugging in a portable EVSE daily, you'll wear out the socket pretty quickly.
Has anybody actually had a 240v outlet wear out quickly? I understand that it can happen *eventually*. And I can understand it being a *concern*. But even the inexpensive ones you buy at Lowes or Home Depot are built much sturdier than a standard cheap NEMA 5-15 outlet, and even those will last for many, many years with regular plugging/unplugging.
 

KarenRei

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#12
  1. What makes you think he's buying one? Why wouldn't he use the one included with the car?
Then he doesn't have one in the car. But if he's okay with that...

Has anybody actually had a 240v outlet wear out quickly? I understand that it can happen *eventually*. And I can understand it being a *concern*. But even the inexpensive ones you buy at Lowes or Home Depot are built much sturdier than a standard cheap NEMA 5-15 outlet, and even those will last for many, many years with regular plugging/unplugging.
Ever used a power socket at an airport which isn't relatively new? Very common problem.
 

garsh

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Ever used a power socket at an airport which isn't relatively new? Very common problem.
Sure. But those see several _dozens_ of plugging/unplugging events every day. And those are NEMA 5-15. I'm really curious if anybody has had wearing out issues with the sturdier 240v outlets.
 

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#14
When my NEMA was installed one of the reasons it was so expensive was it had to be a heavier duty outlet rated for more unplug and replug events. It's really damn sturdy. I'd probably wear the prongs out on the EVSE before that outlet. Some of the outlets for dryers are very flimsy though as they're designed to be plugged in and left for 20 years.
 

garsh

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Some of the outlets for dryers are very flimsy though as they're designed to be plugged in and left for 20 years.
I bought my NEMA 14-50 outlets from Lowes. Just regular (but modern) "dryer" outlets. They seem very sturdy. I couldn't plug in the EVSE initially because the outlet was so tight. I had to force the contacts apart a bit first.
 
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I'm really curious if anybody has had wearing out issues with the sturdier 240v outlets.
Personally, no, but why take a chance? Even with the use of a high quality commercial grade receptacle, I am leaning with KR on this for a smidgon increased level of safety with this high (relatively speaking) amperage connection point where a potential issue could result in a catostropic event. I have (3) HPWCs in various locations for guests, however, I have charged an S with a constantly docked UMC on a 14-30 for 80 and 160-mile RT commutes for the first 5 years of Veronica’s life. I keep my Tony Williams 50' and my 40' TucsonEv stretched UMCs in the cars. Both Veronica and Kay currently charge with a Gen 2 MC NEMA 6-20. Btw, I think the Dryer Buddy is a slick clever product.
 
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webdriverguy

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#18
I tend to agree leaving it plugged in to avoid any issues. I think even when left plugged in the power draw might be very low when it’s not supplying power.
 

BigBri

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I bought my NEMA 14-50 outlets from Lowes. Just regular (but modern) "dryer" outlets. They seem very sturdy. I couldn't plug in the EVSE initially because the outlet was so tight. I had to force the contacts apart a bit first.
Yeah the ones at the hardware stores seem pretty sturdy. The one in my house (which was build last year) is a piece of garbage in comparison. I've never seen the lower grade plug at my big box stores. Tends to be the 20+ dollar one.