# Software Build v11.0 & v10.2 2021.44.*



## iChris93

*Resources for Software Information:*

TeslaFi: Firmware Tracker
Teslapedia: Software Updates
NotATeslaApp: Software Updates
*v10.2 Software Versions:*

2021.44.5 4e2f134a19a4 (2021-12-09)
2021.44.6 7910e050c47a (2021-12-16)
2021.44.5.5 67398b4f7c3f (2021-12-20) (FSD Beta v10.7)
*v11.0 Software Versions:*

2021.44.25.2 dd199c7ac738 (2021-12-23) (Holiday Release)
2021.44.25.5 e5c3ff6278dc (2021-12-23) (Holiday Release & FSD Beta 10.8)
2021.44.25.6 1823f6dfe44d (2021-12-23) (Holiday Release & FSD Beta 10.8)
2021.44.30 6fdef98e323a (2022-01-01)
2021.44.30.5 81562c9c7b28 (2022-01-07) (FSD Beta 10.8.1)
2021.44.30.1 9a7d825385e6 (2022-01-08)
2021.44.30.5 81562c9c7b28 (2022-01-08)
2021.44.30.2 923700301e7c (2022-01-10)
2021.44.30.6 e0e2eba03127 (2022-01-12)
2021.44.30.7 f63a6a9b8140 (2022-01-13)
2021.44.30.8 bc988447aee7 (2022-01-15)
2021.44.30.10 94235fd818a0 (2022-01-18) (FSD Beta 10.9)
2021.44.30.11 d482a8934195 (2022-01-21)
2021.44.30.15 b917dc625efd (2022-02-01) (FSD Beta 10.10)
2021.44.30.12 40d80965e03d (2022-02-02)
2021.44.30.13 a674c57a84f8 (2022-02-09)
2021.44.30.14 36a2dfb898f6 (2022-02-11)
2021.44.30.21 c4a356541fbc (FSD Beta 10.10.2)
*Previous Software Thread:*

Software Build v10.2 2021.40



> *2021.44.5 Release Notes:*
> *Driver Door Unlock Mode* (Model 3 Model Y) (Available Worldwide)​Unlock only the driver door when approaching the vehicle by tapping Controls > Locks > Driver Door Unlock Mode.​​*Driver Profiles* (Model S Model 3 Model X Model Y) (Available Worldwide)​2021.44.5 release notes​Each Driver Profile will now have its own individual Work and Home address. To update, select your profile, tap Navigation and long press either Work or Home.​​*Vehicle Sync (Beta) (*Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+ Model 3 Model Y) (Available Worldwide)​Driver Profile settings such as seat, mirror and steering wheel positions can now synchronize across supported vehicles owned by the same Tesla Account. To enable for a particular profile, tap the Profile icon from the status bar > Driver Profile Settings > Vehicle Sync (Beta).​​Note: Some settings will only synchronize between the same vehicle type.​​Note: This feature is only enabled on select vehicles for testing.​​*Rear Cabin Climate (*Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+) (Available Worldwide)​Adjust the rear cabin climate from the front touchscreen by tapping Climate Controls > Rear Climate.​​*Autopark (*Model S Model 3 Model X Model Y) (MCU 2 HW 3) (Available Worldwide)​Autopark now identifies perpendicular parking spots using painted markings and road edges.​​*Rear Seatbelt Reminder (*Model S Model 3 Model X Model Y) (Available only in China)​Due to local safety regulations, your car's rear seatbelt reminder is enabled. If the seat has a child seat, tap the seat to mute the reminder for the rest of your trip.​​*Undocumented Update: Detect and Report Uneven Tire Wear and Low Tread Depth.*​​





> *2021.44.5.5 Release Notes:*
> *FSD Beta v10.7*​
> Improved object attributes network to reduce false cut-in slowdowns by 50% and lane assignment error by 19%.
> Improved photon-to-control vehicle response latency by 20% on average.
> Expanded use of regenerative braking in Autopilot down to 0mph for smoother stops and improved energy efficiency.
> Improved VRU (pedestrians, bicyclists, motorcycles, animals) lateral velocity error by 4.9% by adding more auto-labeled and simulated training examples to the dataset.
> Reduced false slowdowns for crossing objects by improved velocity estimates for objects at the end of visibility.
> Reduced false slowdowns by adding geometric checks to cross-validate lane assignment of objects.
> Improved speed profile for unprotected left turns when visibility is low.
> Added more natural behavior to bias over bike lanes during right turns.
> Improved comfort when yielding to jaywalkers by better modelling of stopping region with soft and hard deadlines.
> Improved smoothness for merge control with better modelling of merge point and ghost objects positioned at the edge of visibility.
> Improved overall comfort by enforcing stricter lateral jerk bounds inbtrajectory optimizer.
> Improved short deadline lane changes through richer trajectory modeling.
> Improved integration between lead vehicle overtake and lane change gap selection.
> Updated trajectory line visualization.
> ​





> *2021.44.25.2 Release Notes:*
> *Light Show* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Watch your Tesla dance to a choreographed light show any time of year. Open Toybox, tap Light Show and follow the instructions.​​*Customizable App. Launcher* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Drag and drop your favorite apps to any position along the bottom menu bar for easy access. To customize your menu bar, hold any icon and then drag to reorder. To adjust climate controls such as heated seats and defrost, tap on the temperature or swipe up from the bottom of the screen.​​*Simplified Controls* (Model 3 Model Y)​The display has been simplified to focus on navigation, media and the most common primary controls.​
> For windshield wipers and status bar information, tap Controls
> For charging controls tap Controls > Charging
> For trip and odometer information tap Controls > Trips
> For tire pressure information tap Controls > Service
> Note: Activating the windshield wipers via the stalk will continue to display the wiper card.​​*Blind Spot Camera* (May Require Certain Hardware)​You can now automatically see a live camera view of your blind spot whenever you activate the turn signal. To enable, tap Controls > Autopilot > Automatic Blind Spot Camera.​​*Edit Waypoints*​Easily reorder or add multiple destinations to your route with updated arrival times. To add a stop, or edit a trip, initiate a navigation route, and tap the more options button on the turn list.​​*TikTok* (MCU 2, Available only in certain regions)​You can now watch TikTok from your touchscreon. To launch, tap the Theater icon from the bottom bar and select TikTok while your car is in park.​​*Sonic the Hedgehog* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Jump into the original Sonic the Hedgehog! Speed by in a blur using the supersonic spin attack at high speed, defy gravity around loop- the-loops and defeat Dr. Eggman as the fastest hedgehog of al time. Gotta Go Fast!​​*The Battle of Polytopia - Multiplayer Support* (MCU 2)​You can now play The Battle of Polytopia with friends using the multiplayer mode.​​*Sudoku* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Fill every square and enjoy this classic logic puzzle game, featuring five difficulty levels and a smart hint system for beginners.​​*Cold Weather Improvements*​You can now precondition the cabin from the Tesla app when your battery is at a lower state of charge. Simply turn on the climate from your Tesla app and override the previous setting by tapping "Yes" on the confirmation pop-up window.​​Note: To protect your car's battery, climate will remain unavailable under extreme low charge scenarios. This feature requires the Tesla mobile app version 4.4.0 or later.​​*Automated Seat Heaters*​First row seat heaters can now automatically regulate seat temperature based on the cabin environment and the climate control set temperature. To access seat heating controls, tap the temperature settings to bring up the HVAC panel.​​Note: HVAC system must be in Auto to use automatic seat heating.​​*Manage Dashcam Clips* (Dashcam MCU 2)​Easily delete all dashcam video clips directly from the touchscreen by tapping Controls > Safety > Dashcam > Delete Dashcam Clips​​*Dark Mode*​You can now change to a dark themed display. Tap Controls > Display > Appearance and select Dark.​​*Hide Map Details*​Simplify your navigation app and hide map details by tapping the pin button on the map.​​*New V11 UI* (Undocumented Change)​The car now features an updated UI that is consistent with the redesigned Model S. With it comes new and reorganized menus and options.​​





> *2021.44.25.6 Release Notes:*
> *FSD v10.8 Release Notes*​
> Improved object attributes network to reduce false cut-in slowdowns by 50% and lane assignment error by 19%.
> Improved photon-to-control vehicle response latency by 20% on average.
> Expanded use of regenerative braking in Autopilot down to 0mph for smoother stops and improved energy efficiency.
> Improved VRU (pedestrians, bicyclists, motorcycles, animals) lateral velocity error by 4.9% by adding more auto-labeled and simulated training examples to the dataset.
> Reduced false slowdowns for crossing objects by improved velocity estimates for objects at the end of visibility.
> Reduced false slowdowns by adding geometric checks to cross-validate lane assignment of objects.
> Improved speed profile for unprotected left turns when visibility is low.
> Added more natural behavior to bias over bike lanes during right turns.
> Improved comfort when yielding to jaywalkers by better modelling of stopping region with soft and hard deadlines.
> Improved smoothness for merge control with better modelling of merge point and ghost objects positioned at the edge of visibility
> Improved overall comfort by enforcing stricter lateral jerk bounds in trajectory optimizer.
> Improved short deadline lane changes through richer trajectory modeling.
> Improved integration between lead vehicle overtake and lane change gap selection.
> Updated trajectory line visualization.
> Press the "Video Record" button on the top bar UI to share your feedback. When pressed, your vehicle's external cameras will share a short VIN-associated Autopilot Snapshot with the Tesla engineering team to help make improvements to FSD. You will not be able to view the clip.​​





> *2021.44.30.5 Release Notes:*
> *FSD v10.8.1 Release Notes*​​*The release notes are the same as 10.8 2021.44.25.6. However there is a new disclaimer:*​​*Full Self-Driving (Beta) Suspension*​*We have reset the 'Forced Autopilot Disengagements' counter on your vehicle to 0.*​​*For maximum safety and accountability, use of Full Self-Driving (Beta) will be suspended if improper usage is detected. Improper usage is when you, or another driver of your vehicle, receive five *Forced Autopilot Disengagements'. A disengagement is when the Autopilot system disengages for the remainder of a trip after the driver receives several audio and visual warnings for inattentiveness. Driver-initiated disengagements do not count as improper usage and are expected from the driver. Keep your hands on the wheel and remain attentive at all times. Use of any hand-held*​​





> *2021.44.30.6 Release Notes:*
> *Track Mode* (Model S 2021+ Plaid)​Optimize your Plaid configuration for dynamic driving exclusively on closed courses and experience the unmatched performance at many different venues. To enable, tap Controls > Pedals & Steering > Track Mode.​
> Thermals: The heat pump system cools more aggressively, maximizing powertrain endurance and performance. Enable post-drive cooling to shorten wait times between sessions.
> Drive Systems: Torque vectoring authority is increased across the three motors, elevating the vehicle's agility and cornering capability. The accelerator pedal allows more precise torque control, and regenerative braking power is strengthened to recover more energy.
> Suspension: Adaptive damping reduces vehicle motions, improving handling and promoting driver confidence. Ride height is automatically set to 'Low' upon drive off.
> Display: A track-focused interface includes a lap timer, G-meter (real-time accelerometer), vehicle thermals monitor, Dashcam video capture, vehicle telemetry capture, and offers customization options.
> *Boombox Megaphone *(requires PWS)​Project your voice with additional authority using the new Megaphone function. Tap Toybox > Boombox > Megaphone.​Note: Your car must be in park to use Megaphone.​
> *Subwoofer* (Premium Audio, MCU 2)​You can now adjust your subwoofer by bringing up your Media Player, and tapping the settings icon > Tone.​​*Use Comfort Damping Suspension in Autopilot* (S & X, Adaptive Suspension)​Your vehicle will now automatically transition to Comfort Suspension Damping when Autopilot is engaged. This setting is enabled by default. To disable, tap Controls > Suspension > Use Comfort Damping in Autopilot.​​*Car Wash Mode* (Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+)​Car Wash Mode closes all windows, locks the charge port and disables windshield wipers, Sentry Mode, Walk-Away Door Locks and parking sensor chimes. For automatic car washes with conveyor belts, the Free Roll option shifts to Neutral and prevents the parking brake from automatically applying if you leave. To access, tap Controls > Service > Car Wash Mode.​​*Sentry Mode Live Camera Access* (Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+ Model 3 Model Y, MCU2, Available in new regions)​You can now view your car's surroundings from the Tesla app when parked to confirm the safety of your environment before returning to your car. Live Camera is end-to-end encrypted and cannot be accessed by Tesla. To enable or disable, tap Controls > Safety > 'View Live Camera via Mobile App' from the vehicle touchscreen display.​​Note: This feature requires mobile app version 4.2.1 or higher, and Premium Connectivity.​​





> *2021.44.30.10 Release Notes*
> *FSD Beta 10.9*​
> Improved intersection extents and right of way assignment by updating modeling of intersection areas from dense rasters ("bag of points") to sparse instances. Increased intersection region IOU by 4.2%. The sparse intersection network is the first model deployed with an auto-regressive architecture that runs natively with low latency on the TRIP Al accelerator chip, through innovations in the Al compiler stack.
> Upgraded generalized static object network to use 10-bit photon count streams rather than 8-bit ISP tonemapped images by adding 10-bit inference support in the Al compiler stack. Improved overall recall by 3.9% and precision by 1.7%.
> Made unprotected left turns across oncoming lanes more natural by proceeding straight into intersection while yielding, before initiating the turn.
> Improved lane preference and topology estimation by 1.2% with a network update and a new format for navigation clues.
> Improved short deadline lane changes with better modeling of necessary deceleration for maneuvers beyond the lane change.
> Improved future paths for objects not confined to lane geometry by better modelling of their kinematics.
> Made launches from stop more calm when there is an imminent slowdown nearby.
> Improved gap selection when yielding to a stream of oncoming cars on narrow roads.





> *2021.44.30.15 Release Notes*
> *FSD Beta 10.10*​
> Smoother fork maneuvers and turn-lane selection using high fidelity trajectory primitives.
> Disabled rolling-stop functionality in all FSD Profiles. This behavior used to allow the vehicle to roll through all-way-stop intersections, but only when several conditions were met, including: vehicle speed less than 5.6 mph, no relevant objects/pedestrians/bicyclists detected, sufficient visibility and all entering roads at the intersection have speed limits below 30mph.
> Improved generalized static object network by 4% using improved ground truth trajectories.
> Improved smoothness when stopping for crossing objects at intersections by modeling soft and hard constraints to better represent urgency of the slowdown.
> Enabled lane changing into an oncoming lane to maneuver around static obstacles, when safe to do so.
> Improved smoothness for merge handling by enforcing more consistency with previous cycle's speed control decisions.
> Improved handling of flashing red light traffic controls by adding more caution for events where crossing vehicles may not stop.
> Improved right of way understanding at intersections with better modeling of intersection extents.





> *2021.44.30.21 Release Notes*
> *FSD Beta v10.10.2 Release Notes*​
> Smoother fork maneuvers and turn-lane selection using high fidelity trajectory primitives.
> Disabled rolling-stop functionality in all FSD Profiles. This behavior used to allow the vehicle to roll through all-way-stop intersections, but only when several conditions were met, including: vehicle speed less than 5.6 mph, no relevant objects/pedestrians/bicyclists detected, sufficient visibility and all entering roads at the intersection have speed limits below 30mph.
> Improved generalized static object network by 4% using improved ground truth trajectories.
> Improved smoothness when stopping for crossing objects at intersections by modeling soft and hard constraints to better represent urgency of the slowdown.
> Enabled lane changing into an oncoming lane to maneuver around static obstacles, when safe to do so.
> Improved smoothness for merge handling by enforcing more consistency with previous cycle's speed control decisions.
> Improved handling of flashing red light traffic controls by adding more caution for events where crossing vehicles may not stop.
> Improved right of way understanding at intersections with better modeling of intersection extents.


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## Mike

My car is downloading 2021.44.5 and I can’t seem to find a thread for that…


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## Francois Gaucher

Just received 44.5 , 30 minutes ago. No release notes yet. Seems for Canadian owners


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## Veedio

Francois Gaucher said:


> Just received 44.5 , 30 minutes ago. No release notes yet. Seems for Canadian owners


Just "Minor bug fixes and improvements" for my M3. Seems to have additional features for S/X.


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## JWardell

Actually some decent changes here


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1469122291741216772

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1469132586886864899


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## garsh

Release notes added to original post.



iChris93 said:


> *Release Notes:*
> *Driver Door Unlock Mode* (Model 3 Model Y) (Available Worldwide)​Unlock only the driver door when approaching the vehicle by tapping Controls > Locks > Driver Door Unlock Mode.​​*Driver Profiles* (Model S Model 3 Model X Model Y) (Available Worldwide)​2021.44.5 release notes​Each Driver Profile will now have its own individual Work and Home address. To update, select your profile, tap Navigation and long press either Work or Home.​​*Vehicle Sync (Beta) (*Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+ Model 3 Model Y) (Available Worldwide)​Driver Profile settings such as seat, mirror and steering wheel positions can now synchronize across supported vehicles owned by the same Tesla Account. To enable for a particular profile, tap the Profile icon from the status bar > Driver Profile Settings > Vehicle Sync (Beta).​​Note: Some settings will only synchronize between the same vehicle type.​​Note: This feature is only enabled on select vehicles for testing.​​*Rear Cabin Climate (*Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+) (Available Worldwide)​Adjust the rear cabin climate from the front touchscreen by tapping Climate Controls > Rear Climate.​​*Autopark (*Model S Model 3 Model X Model Y) (MCU 2 HW 3) (Available Worldwide)​Autopark now identifies perpendicular parking spots using painted markings and road edges.​​*Rear Seatbelt Reminder (*Model S Model 3 Model X Model Y) (Available only in China)​Due to local safety regulations, your car's rear seatbelt reminder is enabled. If the seat has a child seat, tap the seat to mute the reminder for the rest of your trip.​


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## garsh

For anybody who has installed this version, please post a picture of the "about" screen.
I'd like to confirm that this is still listed as v10.2.


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## iChris93

garsh said:


> For anybody who has installed this version, please post a picture of the "about" screen.
> I'd like to confirm that this is still listed as v10.2.


Still 10.2

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1469121158247292939


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## Mike

Welp, my trunk lights are still not working when the car is sound asleep and I open the trunk via the latch over the rear license plate.

I always drive with my trip odometer showing and I wonder if using the washer fluid control still results in the trip odometer being hidden…


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## TrevP

Happy to report that 2021.44.5 has fixed the quirk with the charge port flap 👍🏼


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## GDN

Love the cloud profiles coming, but so much for a little hope for a holiday release ! Maybe this is just a little teaser/test.


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## iChris93

GDN said:


> Love the cloud profiles coming, but so much for a little hope for a holiday release ! Maybe this is just a little teaser/test.


It's all the 🔥 you're getting this year!


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## GDN

iChris93 said:


> It's all the 🔥 you're getting this year!


Well - hopeful for some 🔥, but if we get ☁ settings and that maybe brings some 🌧, we could be once again without 🔥 🔥 !!


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## Mike

Mike said:


> Welp, my trunk lights are still not working when the car is sound asleep and I open the trunk via the latch over the rear license plate.
> 
> I always drive with my trip odometer showing and I wonder if using the washer fluid control still results in the trip odometer being hidden…


And I can report that use of the washer fluid button whilst my odometer card is showing will result in the odometer card not coming back on its own…


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## garsh

Undocumented update in 2021.44.5:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1470283749074079747

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1470285086289395715


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## Kizzy

garsh said:


> Undocumented update in 2021.44.5:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1470283749074079747
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1470285086289395715


Well, _this_ is fascinating. I wonder if they're measuring differences in revolutions between wheels on the same axle (traction control can detect single wheel slippage, right?). But tread depth all around-how does that work? Cameras can track vehicle speed and do math on wheel speed? Fascinating!


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## Mike

Kizzy said:


> Well, _this_ is fascinating. I wonder if they're measuring differences in revolutions between wheels on the same axle (traction control can detect single wheel slippage, right?). But tread depth all around-how does that work? Cameras can track vehicle speed and do math on wheel speed? Fascinating!


Hopefully it is more developed than the promise of automatic wipers based only on cameras


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## kornerz

Looks like there are 2 new items under "Service" menu:
"Towing" which displays a reminder how to tow a Tesla and "Seat Calibration":


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## GDN

This seat calibration is interesting and welcome. This is one reason I'm excited about profiles in the cloud. For some reason I can not make the seat in the car I don't drive as often match the settings I've finally dialed in on the one I drive daily. No matter how many times I move it and tweak it, just can't get it to sit like the other car. This would be great to ensure the car knows exactly where the seat it, then be able to use the settings that I like and am used to in both cars.


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## Mike

kornerz said:


> Looks like there are 2 new items under "Service" menu:
> "Towing" which displays a reminder how to tow a Tesla and "Seat Calibration":
> 
> View attachment 40672
> View attachment 40673
> View attachment 40674


I know that my seat-back will have a 5% chance of not going into its correct position once I'm in the seat and have pushed the brake to activate my saved settings.

My "hack" for the past 3.5 years has been to manually activate the seat-back for about a second and then select the (pop up) option that forces the seat to go into it's saved setting…


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## GDN

Mike said:


> I know that my seat-back will have a 5% chance of not going into its correct position once I'm in the seat and have pushed the brake to activate my saved settings.
> 
> My "hack" for the past 3.5 years has been to manually activate the seat-back for about a second and then select the (pop up) option that forces the seat to go into it's saved setting…


It is these little things that drive me nuts - should be the simplest to fix with a couple of interns and it has been an issue since they rolled the first 3 out the door.


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## FRC

Mike said:


> I know that my seat-back will have a 5% chance of not going into its correct position once I'm in the seat and have pushed the brake to activate my saved settings.
> 
> My "hack" for the past 3.5 years has been to manually activate the seat-back for about a second and then select the (pop up) option that forces the seat to go into it's saved setting…


I never had a problem with my seats settings and positions in 100K+ miles until a recent mobile service. The wiring harness(?) under the drivers seat had to be replaced as it was throwing a safety warning. Replacing this harness required removal of the drivers seat. After the tech left I drove the car and was suspicious that the seat was not in my saved position, nor could I adjust it to my liking. The tech returned, and in 4 1/2 minutes tightened up a plug under the seat and now I'm back to normal.

I'm wondering @Mike if your issue might be as easily resolved?


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## Mike

@FRC, it could be that simple, next time I'm so disposed I'll root around and see…


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## JWardell

Looks like 44.25 is the Holiday release we've all been waiting [over a year] for


http://imgur.com/a/z5OybMp


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## FRC

JWardell said:


> Looks like 44.25 is the Holiday release we've all been waiting [over a year] for
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/a/z5OybMp


Looks great! You can see details of this release in the 2021 holiday release thread.


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## JeffC

kornerz said:


> Looks like there are 2 new items under "Service" menu:
> "Towing" which displays a reminder how to tow a Tesla and "Seat Calibration":
> 
> View attachment 40672
> View attachment 40673
> View attachment 40674


Question for all: My seats work consistently now. If I do a seat calibration will I need to re-adjust my saved seat settings?

That said, the ability to share driver settings across cars is cool.


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## garsh

There appears to be a big rollout of 2021.44.6 happening today.

This might be preparation for giving most people the 2021.44.25 holiday release.


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## rrollens

Just downloaded 44.6 after a long absence of no new updates. Have not received any update that provided the remote Sentry mode viewing. Any idea what's up with that?


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## garsh

rrollens said:


> Just downloaded 44.6 after a long absence of no new updates. Have not received any update that provided the remote Sentry mode viewing. Any idea what's up with that?


Did you turn on the feature?


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## rrollens

garsh said:


> Did you turn on the feature?


Thank you! I had turned off Sentry Mode while I was downloading update. Forgot to turn it back on! Appreciate the help.


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## GDN

Had a heck of a time getting this install to start. The car had been having problems for a bit - stereo not playing right, cutting in and out, no blinker noise, so rebooted on the way home. From the app said install now - once the 2 minute countdown timer ended it displayed a message saying the install was scheduled for a time just a few minutes past the current time. It took another reboot and trying from the car, then again from the phone to get it started. Hoping it completes normally.


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## iChris93

GDN said:


> Had a heck of a time getting this install to start. The car had been having problems for a bit - stereo not playing right, cutting in and out, not blinker noise, so rebooted on the way home. From the app said install now - once the 2 minute countdown timer ended it displayed a message saying the install was scheduled for a time just a few minutes past the current time. It took another reboot and trying from the car, then again from the phone to get it started. Hoping it completes normally.


Which update?


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## GDN

iChris93 said:


> Which update?


44.6. It just completed, it took about 40 minutes to install.


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## garsh

rrollens said:


> Thank you! I had turned off Sentry Mode while I was downloading update. Forgot to turn it back on! Appreciate the help.


You also need to turn on "View Live Camera via Mobile App", as shown in the picture.


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## $ Trillion Musk

Can someone please explain how to activate the Christmas light show for the Model 3/Y? Thanks!


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## iChris93

$ Trillion Musk said:


> Can someone please explain how to activate the Christmas light show for the Model 3/Y? Thanks!


need the new update. Then it looks like it's from the toy box.


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## FRC

iChris93 said:


> need the new update. Then it looks like it's from the toy box.


Also, you need the updated headlights. My 2018 won't be enabled, but my wife's 2021 will. Not sure when the delineation occurred.


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## GDN

FRC said:


> Also, you need the updated headlights. My 2018 won't be enabled, but my wife's 2021 will. Not sure when the delineation occurred.


I noticed in the videos that have surfaced that the new headlights were definitely shown with each of the smaller lights being activated individually. I hoped this wouldn't exclude the older cars, but that we might just not get as much light dancing.


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## SoFlaModel3

I think this Tweet is a good indicator of the holiday update pushing tonight…


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1474144811951214592


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## FRC

GDN said:


> I noticed in the videos that have surfaced that the new headlights were definitely shown with each of the smaller lights being activated individually. I hoped this wouldn't exclude the older cars, but that we might just not get as much light dancing.


I can't find it; but a post here indicated that only the updated headlights would qualify. They even showed the difference between the old and new headlights.


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## Rick Steinwand

It's started!

44.x is being updated.


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## GDN

Looks like it is on its way - with a .2 bug fix - the early testing must not have gone so well.


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## Rick Steinwand

It's here. 44.x is being updated.


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## Mike

Been on 44.6 for a day.

The auto wipers _still_ do not function unless there is enough background contrast for the camera to detect water droplets.

Today was a drive with steady light snow and salt spray.

When there was a large dark vehicle ahead of me or there were streetlights or some other contrast, they worked perfectly.

No background contrast, no auto wipes…just continual required use of the "single sweep" button on the end of the turn signal stalk.


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## Phillyasian

Mike said:


> Been on 44.6 for a day.
> 
> The auto wipers _still_ do not function unless there is enough background contrast for the camera to detect water droplets.
> 
> Today was a drive with steady light snow and salt spray.
> 
> When there was a large dark vehicle ahead of me or there were streetlights or some other contrast, they worked perfectly.
> 
> No background contrast, no auto wipes…just continual required use of the "single sweep" button on the end of the turn signal stalk.


You know you can manually turn on continuous wiper blades,right?


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## kornerz

Got 44.25.2 today in EU.

Good news: 
it seems to include Live Sentry View for Europe (will need to enable premium connectivity subscription to test):









Bad news (for me): browser window is now even smaller, thanks to a large header with Entertainment tabs:









Also card with current trip consumption/odometer is gone into Settings window, I've used to have it always on.


----------



## kornerz

For those not following "holiday release" thread:
44.25.2 has live Sentry viewing enabled for Europe.


----------



## sterickson

I don't know what it is, but I'm installing 2021.44.25.6. Still FSD Beta?

It needs to be added to the poll, please.


----------



## garsh

Holiday Release Notes added to OP.
🎅


iChris93 said:


> *2021.44.25.2 Release Notes:*
> *Light Show* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Watch your Tesla dance to a choreographed light show any time of year. Open Toybox, tap Light Show and follow the instructions.​​*Customizable App. Launcher* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Drag and drop your favorite apps to any position along the bottom menu bar for easy access. To customize your menu bar, hold any icon and then drag to reorder. To adjust climate controls such as heated seats and defrost, tap on the temperature or swipe up from the bottom of the screen.​​*Simplified Controls* (Model 3 Model Y)​The display has been simplified to focus on navigation, media and the most common primary controls.​
> For windshield wipers and status bar information, tap Controls
> For charging controls tap Controls > Charging
> For trip and odometer information tap Controls > Trips
> For tire pressure information tap Controls > Service
> Note: Activating the windshield wipers via the stalk will continue to display the wiper card.​​*Blind Spot Camera* (May Require Certain Hardware)​You can now automatically see a live camera view of your blind spot whenever you activate the turn signal. To enable, tap Controls > Autopilot > Automatic Blind Spot Camera.​​*Edit Waypoints*​Easily reorder or add multiple destinations to your route with updated arrival times. To add a stop, or edit a trip, initiate a navigation route, and tap the more options button on the turn list.​​*TikTok* (MCU 2, Available only in certain regions)​You can now watch TikTok from your touchscreon. To launch, tap the Theater icon from the bottom bar and select TikTok while your car is in park.​​*Sonic the Hedgehog* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Jump into the original Sonic the Hedgehog! Speed by in a blur using the supersonic spin attack at high speed, defy gravity around loop- the-loops and defeat Dr. Eggman as the fastest hedgehog of al time. Gotta Go Fast!​​*The Battle of Polytopia - Multiplayer Support* (MCU 2)​You can now play The Battle of Polytopia with friends using the multiplayer mode.​​*Sudoku* (May Require Certain Hardware)​Fill every square and enjoy this classic logic puzzle game, featuring five difficulty levels and a smart hint system for beginners.​​*Cold Weather Improvements*​You can now precondition the cabin from the Tesla app when your battery is at a lower state of charge. Simply turn on the climate from your Tesla app and override the previous setting by tapping "Yes" on the confirmation pop-up window.​​Note: To protect your car's battery, climate will remain unavailable under extreme low charge scenarios. This feature requires the Tesla mobile app version 4.4.0 or later.​​*Automated Seat Heaters*​First row seat heaters can now automatically regulate seat temperature based on the cabin environment and the climate control set temperature. To access seat heating controls, tap the temperature settings to bring up the HVAC panel.​​Note: HVAC system must be in Auto to use automatic seat heating.​​*Manage Dashcam Clips* (Dashcam MCU 2)​Easily delete all dashcam video clips directly from the touchscreen by tapping Controls > Safety > Dashcam > Delete Dashcam Clips​​*Dark Mode*​You can now change to a dark themed display. Tap Controls > Display > Appearance and select Dark.​​*Hide Map Details*​Simplify your navigation app and hide map details by tapping the pin button on the map.​​*New V11 UI* (Undocumented Change)​The car now features an updated UI that is consistent with the redesigned Model S. With it comes new and reorganized menus and options.​


----------



## tivoboy

Yeah I’m really going to miss the easy access to the cards with power usage trip meters and tire pressure. Big step back if you ask me.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

Fell asleep before the push 🤦🏻‍♂️
Both cars updating now!


----------



## $ Trillion Musk

44.6 installed yesterday but now it’s prompting to install 44.25.2. Wouldn’t that be a step down?


----------



## SoFlaModel3

$ Trillion Musk said:


> 44.6 installed yesterday but now it's prompting to install 44.25.2. Wouldn't that be a step down?


25 > 6 and that's the holiday update so go for it!!


----------



## airbutchie

Installing now….


----------



## garsh

We've finally gotten to v11.0


----------



## Mike

Phillyasian said:


> You know you can manually turn on continuous wiper blades,right?


Yea…if I didn't know that, I would have run into something about four winters ago.


----------



## evannole

Mr. Spacely said:


> ~ FSD visualizations can be adjusted for enhanced or standard size.
> ~ Speedometer is bigger and top left for easy viewing.
> ~ The blind spot camera is clear and on the left for easy viewing (I don't see the need for it anyway because: 1. I rarely drive myself anymore, and 2. I could just look at the traffic visualization on the screen and see if a car is there).
> ~ Card display is not gone.
> ~ Auto seat heaters can be set manually as needed.


I hope you're right, but so far I see no indication that the visualizations panel can be shrunk, and it also appears that the card display is gone. I guess we'll know more in the coming hours.


----------



## Kizzy

garsh said:


> We've finally gotten to v11.0


Still on North American map version 2020.48-12628, I see.


----------



## TrevP

Visualizations can’t be altered unless you have FSD. I just checked on my car and it’s still the same old thing. Otherwise this is a solid update!


----------



## harrison987

These new icons are going to take some getting used to....


----------



## Perscitus

Just as predicted by people criticizing the look and feel based on all the employee screen captures - v11 needs v11.1/v11.2 GUI TLC before even fully rolling out across the drone fleet, typical. 

Why Tesla can't hire some seasoned GUI devs and introduce practical QoL changes instead of changes for the sake of changes, baffles the mind. 

Buy hey, at least we have TikTok (so wow!), wider FSD vaporware (much yes) forced integration and more games (if you're going to bring Sonic at least port the Christian Whitehead retroengine flavor) now...


----------



## shareef777

So wife’s Y went from 2021.36.8->2021.44.6 on Wednesday and then to 2021.44.25.2 today.

My 3 still sitting on 2021.36.8.10 since the 12th.


----------



## Perscitus

That's the staggered push instead of pull fuzzy logic Tesla has been following with OTA update rollout since 2017 and earlier.

Most of the time it makes little sense. 
And no, its not well setup when it comes to salt and peppering with regard to geofencing, FSD/non-FSD (aside from FSB beta vs non-beta builds), AP1/2/3/3.5 and incremental software update path.


----------



## Kimmo57

I can't express how much this UI sucks. Everything you need in the winter is hidden and the wiper UI is made even worse🤬 I would absolutely go back if I could. They have also introduced new translation errors in Finnish. On park it says the trunk and frunk are opened. Who the hell designs these? 😡


----------



## ig0p0g0

Kimmo57 said:


> I can't express how much this UI sucks. Everything you need in the winter is hidden and the wiper UI is made even worse🤬 I would absolutely go back if I could. They have also introduced new translation errors in Finnish. On park it says the trunk and frunk are opened. Who the hell designs these? 😡


I haven't downloaded it yet, but isn't the taskbar customizable?


----------



## harrison987

ig0p0g0 said:


> I haven't downloaded it yet, but isn't the taskbar customizable?


only one area of the taskbar. The problem is it is not fully customizable. Most of the icons you can add are just app shortcuts (spotify, radio, texting, games). I was hoping I could add seated heating control back on as a shortcut, but that has gone bye-bye (only accessible by clicking the temp icon).


----------



## SalisburySam

Went from v36.5.1 to v44.25.2 this morning, after a 38-day wait. Updates typically take between 18-23 minutes to complete; this one to 36 minutes, by far the longest I’ve had. Changes have already been described so I’ll skip that…def looking forward to some of them, and to see what broke. While still evident, v36.5.1 was one of the better updates for phantom braking for me. What a great Christmas present this would be if v44.25.2 reduced PB further indicating that it might actually be solvable, and more importantly, that Tesla actually shivs a git about PB.


----------



## $ Trillion Musk

SoFlaModel3 said:


> 25 > 6 and that's the holiday update so go for it!!


I was thinking in terms of decimals 😂. Ok will do.


----------



## lance.bailey

just installed v11, my model 3 midrange is in the low 56000's VIN range so it will be interesting to see how much of the hardware constrained good stuff (blind spot) is available. i'm starting to see hw constraints creep in (CCS support for one) so it will be annoying to see more of those limitations poke up their ugly head.


----------



## TrevP

I got you guys covered!
It's officially Version 11 now


----------



## Rick Steinwand

shareef777 said:


> So wife's Y went from 2021.36.8->2021.44.6 on Wednesday and then to 2021.44.25.2 today.
> 
> My 3 still sitting on 2021.36.8.10 since the 12th.


When Momma's not happy....

It's better this way, trust me.


----------



## CubedRoot

kornerz said:


> Got 44.25.2 today in EU.
> 
> Good news:
> it seems to include Live Sentry View for Europe (will need to enable premium connectivity subscription to test):
> View attachment 40796
> 
> 
> Bad news (for me): browser window is now even smaller, thanks to a large header with Entertainment tabs:
> View attachment 40797
> 
> 
> Also card with current trip consumption/odometer is gone into Settings window, I've used to have it always on.


Pardon the ignorance, but would you mind sharing what you're using to display all that data? Is that teslalogger + scanmytesla? Im currently using TeslaMate and have the web interface external facing, but I'd love to get these stats you're seeing


----------



## Kimmo57

harrison987 said:


> only one area of the taskbar. The problem is it is not fully customizable. Most of the icons you can add are just app shortcuts (spotify, radio, texting, games). I was hoping I could add seated heating control back on as a shortcut, but that has gone bye-bye (only accessible by clicking the temp icon).


I hoped for the same. Instead the seat heater icons are now replaced with empty useless space in the bottom bar.


----------



## $ Trillion Musk

Light show in action.


----------



## airbutchie

I can confirm that my 3rd party power frunk and trunk (from TeslaOffer) doesn't open/close during the Christmas Light Show... If anyone has Hannshow or another 3rd party power frunk/trunk, does it open/close during the light show? With that said, my auto present lighted door handles (also from TeslaOffer) did swivel open/close, as part of the show... Just an FYI...


----------



## shareef777

Dang, new update is awesome but one huge oversight for me is user profile loading. Now whenever I get in my wife’s Y and press the brake pedal it auto loads her profile. She’s 4’10” and I’m 5’10”. Let’s just say it started to get very uncomfortable as I tried to figure out how to switch profiles while being crushed by the car. It should have had a pop up card style layout (similar to how it now pops up for the garage opener).


----------



## shareef777

$ Trillion Musk said:


> Light show in action.


Ok, the light show is a pretty cool gimmick, my family enjoyed it a lot 😆


----------



## shareef777

Another issue, you can apparently sign up for premium subscription from the car now. Not cool considering anyone other then the card owner can now authorize a charge against the card.


----------



## Mike

harrison987 said:


> only one area of the taskbar. The problem is it is not fully customizable. Most of the icons you can add are just app shortcuts (spotify, radio, texting, games). I was hoping I could add seated heating control back on as a shortcut, but that has gone bye-bye (only accessible by clicking the temp icon).


Welp, guess I'm not going to accept this version (or future updates) if the heated seat controls are now lost under some layer of taps on a screen.

And am I right in my interpretation, any odometer cards are also now hidden under extra taps of the screen?


----------



## evannole

Mike said:


> Welp, guess I'm not going to accept this version (or future updates) if the heated seat controls are now lost under some layer of taps on a screen.
> 
> And am I right in my interpretation, any odometer cards are also now hidden under extra taps of the screen?


That appears to be the case, yes. Instead, we get instant access to games, which can't - and shouldn't -actually be played while driving. Utterly stupid. I will be sticking with my current 2021.36.x until they address this nonsense.


----------



## kornerz

CubedRoot said:


> Pardon the ignorance, but would you mind sharing what you're using to display all that data? Is that teslalogger + scanmytesla? Im currently using TeslaMate and have the web interface external facing, but I'd love to get these stats you're seeing


That one: https://teslaownersonline.com/threads/realtime-model-3-can-data-dashdboard.15651/
Raspberry Pi with CAN adapter in the center console, capturing data and displaying in the browser.


----------



## Needsdecaf

Where do you see your profiles now?


----------



## Mike

evannole said:


> That appears to be the case, yes. Instead, we get instant access to games, which can't - and shouldn't -actually be played while driving. Utterly stupid. I will be sticking with my current 2021.36.x until they address this nonsense.


The heated seats being automatic is a great concept, but having to tie it to automatic climate control is a non starter for me.

To prevent any interior window fogging, my "hack" for the last four winters precludes using automatic mode because automatic mode insists on enabling recirculating air.

My winter time manual control of the HVAC system is: set the temperature to 20C, fresh air only, fan speed one and have airflow out the floor, windscreen and mains with the main vents aimed at the side windows.

I agree that all the development energy going into these games is a misallocation of user interface resources.


----------



## Dick Blonov

Needsdecaf said:


> Where do you see your profiles now?


Under controls.


----------



## Dick Blonov

Kimmo57 said:


> I can't express how much this UI sucks. Everything you need in the winter is hidden and the wiper UI is made even worse🤬 I would absolutely go back if I could. They have also introduced new translation errors in Finnish. On park it says the trunk and frunk are opened. Who the hell designs these? 😡


Probably the same people that managed to screw up the French language text that was fine (sort of) before :smirk:

The French now says Ouvert instead of Ouvrir.

On to 2021.44.25.3...

Phil


----------



## BuzzinAround

Gosh the v11 interface is a step backwards. It’s so un-intuitive as most controls are hidden in some sub menu now. Admittedly looks very clean though…

On an additional note, does anyone notice this bug? 

After a notification appears (ex Sentry Notice) it does not completely disappear. Rather, a very faint bubble shows up under the vehicles animation (left of screen). At first I thought this was screen burn in, but is indeed something showing up in the UI? You can still read the old notification in this faint print.


----------



## BuzzinAround

I guess some people would have the bug I state. If you look under the reorganized menu section's picture at this link https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/663/first-look-at-tesla-s-new-v11-ui

You can see the old notification said "Charging Equipment Not Ready".


----------



## rwsimon

The odometer/efficiency card is something I keep visible at all times. Replacing it with a screen that blocks the nav map is a non-starter. Several other changes that removed things permanently located on the screen are also a bad choice but I would live with them. Removing the odometer card is a deal-breaker for me. I will not be installing this update. I hope this is corrected on a future update or I may be stuck with old software.

Seriously, is there anyone who likes that the cards are gone? Sure, some folks don’t care, but were they a problem for anyone?


----------



## Rick Steinwand

airbutchie said:


> I can confirm that my 3rd party power frunk and trunk (from TeslaOffer) doesn't open/close during the Christmas Light Show... If anyone has Hannshow or another 3rd party power frunk/trunk, does it open/close during the light show? With that said, my auto present lighted door handles (also from TeslaOffer) did swivel open/close, as part of the show... Just an FYI...


I believe the trunk did nothing in the video I saw yesterday of a 3 or Y, only did lights and windows.

I have Hannshow trunk/frunk and although I can open/close the trunk from the touch screen, can only open the frunk, which wouldn't look good in a light show. Since the stock power trunk opens & closes the same way, I'm hoping there's a hook in the API to at least do the trunk.


----------



## Park2670

I loved the cards and am super bummed they are gone. I don’t play any of the games and wish they weren’t stupid shortcuts.


----------



## fazluke

it is common, any change is rejected. it all started with the car design itself.


----------



## airbutchie

Rick Steinwand said:


> I believe the trunk did nothing in the video I saw yesterday of a 3 or Y, only did lights and windows.
> 
> I have Hannshow trunk/frunk and although I can open/close the trunk from the touch screen, can only open the frunk, which wouldn't look good in a light show. Since the stock power trunk opens & closes the same way, I'm hoping there's a hook in the API to at least do the trunk.


Hey Rick.. thanks for the info… however, if you watch the video towards the end, all the power trunks opened for each vehicle… it's very subtle, but noticeable…


----------



## rwsimon

Change is not the problem. Having a car where you can’t see the odometer and the GPS at the same time is.


----------



## Ayellowdog

New software stinks. Just when I got used to where all the icons are at, it’s totally different.


----------



## skygraff

Ayellowdog said:


> New software stinks. Just when I got used to where all the icons are at, it's totally different.


I'm okay with change but not when it undermines usability and safety. We are still required to drive and/or supervise so, unless there's a major uptick in voice command capability, moving more immediate need items to a nested location is dangerous. At the very least, include everything as a customizable icon so we can make our own choices.


----------



## francoisp

lance.bailey said:


> just installed v11, my model 3 midrange is in the low 56000's VIN range so it will be interesting to see how much of the hardware constrained good stuff (blind spot) is available. i'm starting to see hw constraints creep in (CCS support for one) so it will be annoying to see more of those limitations poke up their ugly head.


The album artwork is now displayed for songs on the USB drive.


----------



## slasher016

Overall, I think the update is pretty good. Don't like not seeing trip efficiencies though via the cards. I'm not sure it has to be card, but it should be easier to get to and not hide your entire map. And the seat warmers absolutely need to come back. There's plenty of room next to the temp icon...


----------



## msjulie

Ugh my first response is [email protected] Heated seats are used daily so thanks for nothing there. Ditto for checking tire pressure so thanks again for getting rid of the cards 😡

Guess I’ll be holding off on this thanks Trevor for the video


----------



## JWardell

The new UI looks great at first glance. But once you drive a few hours on it as I did today, you quickly learn Tesla has made some MAJOR mistakes here! I can't beleive anyone actually tested this!

Navigation no longer shows estimated charge at destination! What?? This might be the single most important feature of an EV's UI! I need to know how much battery I will have on a particular drive, like you know, driving to both our families on christmas eve! Now you just have to blindly trust that it will pick a supercharger if needed, as if it knows you are able to charge at your destination?

Furthermore, you can't show superchargers on the map anymore! Again, super important, especially while on a trip, to hit the supercharger bolt and see nearby chargers on your route. They will be drawn on a map but only while zoomed in. 

People are going to be stranded without these.

So thrilled to get blind spot cameras, this was a simple addition that was promised years ago. But not up top where they can be easily seen, but bottom right, behind your hand on the steering wheel...what!?!

You can customized quick icons on the buttom, great. But..you can only choose from things that are useless, half of which can't be used while driving! Quick access to games, but no quick access to seat heaters? Glovebox? Tire pressures? Etc .... Things I need to do while driving quickly where it's dangerous to go several levels deep.

Really, I think this was only tested on a desk.

Also, something is screwy with HVAC. I always keep mine at auto 68F. Never change. Today, I had heat coming from the floor (or seat heaters...despite turning them off I am confident they stayed on), while freezing cold air was blowing at me from the dash. Hours of driving today, uncomfortably hot on back and bottom, and uncomfortably cold on hand, arms, face, and shoulders. What?

I'll accept the design choices, but literally no thought was put into the HMI here, I get the feeling some important people were fired, or elon is forcing stupid things down peoples throat down to every detail like the yoke.


----------



## dburkland

After a few drives with Tesla OS 2021.44.25.6 (aka FSD Beta 10.8) I noticed several issues with the V11 UI that I wanted to call out:


Dropped Frames - FSD visualizations appear to momentarily freeze and it looks as if the MCU is dropping frames.
Laggy Inputs - Inputs sometimes lag especially when using the window slider.
Stability - The new UI appears to have stability issues as illustrated in this video. Just before hitting record, the UI completely froze and the only way to recover the interface was to perform a soft reset of the MCU.
Shortcuts Missing - No longer can you double tap the speed limit sign to set the current speed limit to match your desired offset (ex. +5mph or 113% of current speed limit).
Text Alignment - Things like the speed unit (MPH, KPH, etc) are not center aligned under the current speed.
Wiper Controls - It would be nice to have a shortcut for the wiper controls present much like we did with the card in the previous UI.
Favorite Apps - I would like to see support for additional favorite apps as 4 is not enough and there is enough screen real estate to allow for more.
Status Logos - Removal of the cellular & WiFi connectivity icons from the upper right was a mistake and needs to be brought back.

Link to video 👇


----------



## AndrewF

This UI update is a major step backwards. Removing front seat heating controls and the defrost controls from direct access on the control strip is actually dangerous. There is plenty of open space on the strip to but them back and the customizable section and recent apps section is useless.


----------



## garsh

JWardell said:


> Navigation no longer shows estimated charge at destination! What??


It does for me, but only when I switch to the route overview.



JWardell said:


> Furthermore, you can't show superchargers on the map anymore!


I thought mine was still showing them, but I'll try to pay attention today.


----------



## Thiery

Am I the only one?
Since v11 update, I can’t find carwash mode anymore (2021PM3)
It disappeared from the service menu…

Also: where is the option to resize windows: I miss that bigger navigation portion. Elon used to say that the windows would be resizable so you could reduce the left size of the screen to make the maps/right interface bigger

We have a 15inch screen, TESLA, not a 17 AND an instrument cluster.
We should be home he one getting a 17 inch multi function screen.
MS/X could use a 15 inch screen because the have another sceeen for speed and else.

Where is the promised Apple Music function?


----------



## Thiery

Am I the only one?
Since v11 update, I can’t find carwash mode anymore (2021PM3)
It disappeared from the service menu…

Also: where is the option to resize windows: I miss that bigger navigation portion. Elon used to say that the windows would be resizable so you could reduce the left size of the screen to make the maps/right interface bigger

We have a 15inch screen, TESLA, not a 17 AND an instrument cluster.
We should be home he one getting a 17 inch multi function screen.
MS/X could use a 15 inch screen because the have another sceeen for speed and else.

Where is the promised Apple Music function?


----------



## Bigriver

JWardell said:


> Furthermore, you can't show superchargers on the map anymore!


It's there… just a game to find where they moved it. Go to Navigation, and now there are 3 options: home, work, charging. The Charging screen gets back to what we are used to. BTW this is always one of the first things I show people about the Tesla, so I was quite alarmed that it might be missing.


----------



## francoisp

Park2670 said:


> I loved the cards and am super bummed they are gone. I don't play any of the games and wish they weren't stupid shortcuts.


Yeah me too. Maybe Tesla could had a shortcut for them.


----------



## Jonmir

Anybody else lose RADIO functionality with the new Christmas update? I know radio is streamed. All other streaming is fully functional, though very difficult to find. My radio presets still are displayed, but no sound. Could be operator error since many aspects of the new UI are less readily obvious and available. Just curious if anyone else has found this issue.


----------



## Hollywood7

msjulie said:


> Ugh my first response is [email protected] Heated seats are used daily so thanks for nothing there. Ditto for checking tire pressure so thanks again for getting rid of the cards 😡
> 
> Guess I'll be holding off on this thanks Trevor for the video


Since you can set the heat seaters to AUTO now, you should like this change?


----------



## ssc8666

Can someone show me how to bring up the tire pressure display?


----------



## msjulie

Hollywood7 said:


> Since you can set the heat seaters to AUTO now, you should like this change?


I turn on/off the pass seat heat for my daughter when she is up front but off when the hubby is there - complete opposites they are in that regard. For me it's always been super annoying to hit so many buttons for rear seat heat, now it's 2x from before for everything. And I really prefer heated seats completely independent of cabin temp; don't you ever want to warm your sore back on an otherwise hot day? Maybe that's just me 

I'm more peeved at the apparent lack of thought in many of the changes - I was looking forward to blind spot cameras but well not yet for me with the other losses. I'm still annoyed that the map got smaller in the last big update in favor of more cartoon animations on the left - tons of wasted space there for non FSD cars.

It really shouldn't be that hard to have a decent UI team help AND more importantly let the user really customize the controls with what matters.

We never use games, Spotify, etc so waste of space AND loss of potential improvements for our use.

I'd much rather have the energy display the S (used to?) have and the quick nav next-steps on the left (together) even with the map up but nope no option for some really simple flexibility. It's a shame as the potential is there.

First world problem for sure


----------



## msjulie

> You can customized quick icons on the buttom, great. But..you can only choose from things that are useless, half of which can't be used while driving! Quick access to games, but no quick access to seat heaters? Glovebox? Tire pressures? Etc .... Things I need to do while driving quickly where it's dangerous to go several levels deep.


Yes!!

I thought of another actually really big annoyance with this upgrade - now I needless have to teach the family how to find things that used to be front and center and obvious - like the heated seat controls.


----------



## garsh

ssc8666 said:


> Can someone show me how to bring up the tire pressure display?


Read the release notes, either from within your car, or posted in the OP of this thread.
Tesla actually explains how to find all of the information that used to be accessible from the cards.

You're still not going to like it though.


----------



## garsh

How do I save dashcam footage in v11?

I used to tap on the dashcam icon while driving, but that appears to be gone now.


----------



## Dick Blonov

garsh said:


> How do I save dashcam footage in v11?
> 
> I used to tap on the dashcam icon while driving, but that appears to be gone now.


Under controls. This is going to take some getting used to...


----------



## rwsimon

It would be a really helpful bit of community service if someone would compile a list of all the things that have disappeared from the main screen along with instructions on how to now access those items. Without that information, it is difficult to decide whether or not to do the update since there is no turning back after it is done. Maybe somebody will be generous enough to put together such a list. Too bad Tesla didn’t think it was important enough to provide it themselves.


----------



## JustTheTip

What a stupid update. Sigh. I like the turn signal blind spot cameras. That’s literally it.


----------



## GDN

rwsimon said:


> It would be a really helpful bit of community service if someone would compile a list of all the things that have disappeared from the main screen along with instructions on how to now access those items. Without that information, it is difficult to decide whether or not to do the update since there is no turning back after it is done. Maybe somebody will be generous enough to put together such a list. Too bad Tesla didn't think it was important enough to provide it themselves.


I think a large number of them have been discussed in a few threads, and screen shots published before the release. Tesla won't ever put such a list together as they just want to sell us on the new features. This software is just like all others they've put out, most is a few steps forward and a step or two back sometimes. You might delay it, but then you will eventually have to get on board as software will have something in it you need, or they will force the install perhaps.

I didn't get it til last night, and have not even been out to the car to play, not even the light show, but it is best to embrace it and then we can give Tesla some feedback and I think we'll see them adapt and give us the changes we need.


----------



## SalisburySam

Tesla owner: “Thank goodness the UI can’t get worse!”
Elon: “Hold my beer.”


----------



## HeavyPedal

JWardell said:


> So thrilled to get blind spot cameras, this was a simple addition that was promised years ago. But not up top where they can be easily seen, but bottom right, behind your hand on the steering wheel...what!?!


This was the first thing my wife and I noticed. Terrible positioning. If my right hand is at 2 o'clock, I have to move it to see the camera.



> Navigation no longer shows estimated charge at destination!


This needs to be fixed. Now.


----------



## Madmolecule

I wish they would enhance car wash mode. I used it yesterday for about the third time and it is not very intuitive. I had the rollers go under me because one I stopped on the track I thought it would automatically be in Neutral

A cool soundtrack, and a voice celebrity trainers/DJ with surround cameras. This could be a great use of the game engine and AI to show visual cleaning with real time gauges, animations and cameras. a very cool spaceX dirty world reentry afterwords,

still waiting on environmentally friendly, laser controlled, Tesla designed car washes, specifically for Teslas at all supercharger locations. They should be part of a full cadre of self service bays at the supercharger. Other should include advanced BMS calibration, and camera calibration As well as alignment diagnosis,


----------



## JWardell

garsh said:


> It does for me, but only when I switch to the route overview.
> 
> I thought mine was still showing them, but I'll try to pay attention today.


That's where it is missing. During long drives I regularly tap to the route overview to check on charge level at destination and then may choose to pick a supercharger in between if I feel it's necessary. I can't do either now.


----------



## FRC

garsh said:


> It does for me, but only when I switch to the route overview.
> 
> I thought mine was still showing them, but I'll try to pay attention today.


You can bring them up from the navigation menu (or it might be the charging menu), but they don't remain on the screen by default. I think this will be a significant headache for road trippers.


----------



## FRC

ssc8666 said:


> Can someone show me how to bring up the tire pressure display?


In the service submenu. The pressures are displayed at the 4 corners of the car shown.


----------



## Thiery

Where is the carwash mode now????


----------



## FRC

Thiery said:


> Where is the carwash mode now????


Washed away?


----------



## Bigriver

Thiery said:


> Where is the carwash mode now????


It's under the service menu on 2021.44.25.6. Perhaps it got inadvertently left out of some of the other holiday permutations?


----------



## Bigriver

I just tried a phone call. I could find no way to end the call from the screen, and voice command obviously doesn’t work when on a phone call. And no visible sign on the screen that a phone call is active…. Only thing I could see to do is end the phone call from my phone. But we aren’t supposed to be touching our phones while driving.

Please someone, tell me that I’m the one who is so dumb that I can’t figure it out. I’m really rooting for the programmers and hope it’s not their oversight.


----------



## francoisp

ssc8666 said:


> Can someone show me how to bring up the tire pressure display?


----------



## ssc8666

francoisp said:


> View attachment 40827





francoisp said:


> View attachment 40827


For whatever reason, the ..psi is not showing up on my Model3.


----------



## GDN

ssc8666 said:


> For whatever reason, the ..psi is not showing up on my Model3.


Agree - but I've not taken a drive since the install. If it will at least show the "- psi" then you'll know where to expect it. The actual pressure doesn't show up until you drive however, that is how it previously worked too.


----------



## Nom

I really like the new UI. Made me smile. Enjoying the music interface. Appreciating the UX tweaks.

That said, no long trip yet. I too like seeing the superchargers on the map.

One thing I could not find - the tire pressure. Went to service menu and could not find it. Am I blind?


----------



## r-e-l

Horrible update ....

Colors of icons make it looks like a phone ... but that just a matter of taste.

the fact that the flash cards are gone is horrible, horrible ... to think we lost that one and kept the stupid animated perspective - wow ...
All those buttons that are now two clicks away ...

Not only it hurts usability but its un safe ... why are the buttons of defrost, car seat warmer ...? are two clicks away. It's very distracting and for what?

Feels a design team that lost is vision/direction and making changes for sake of changes ... other than the video cam for turn signal, find this update to be useless. 

1. Design team here is something you can focus : make the map size bigger -yes, bring back some of the space you took a year ago and then some ... we dont need so much white space.
2. Browser - can you fix it and give us full screen browser (in parking mode)?


----------



## ateslik

I can see nearby chargers by asking over voice to “show nearby superchargers”. I would orefer the icon, but whatever, this works


----------



## SoFlaModel3

Charging locations are there.

Tap Navigate, then charging


----------



## SAronian

Touch the navigate entry field and then choose the Charging Tab to see Superchargers on the map


----------



## FRC

Nom said:


> I really like the new UI. Made me smile. Enjoying the music interface. Appreciating the UX tweaks.
> 
> That said, no long trip yet. I too like seeing the superchargers on the map.
> 
> One thing I could not find - the tire pressure. Went to service menu and could not find it. Am I blind?


You're not blind, you have to be driving the car.


----------



## GDN

I guess this works for finding chargers and I try to put my mindset in long term mode or to new owners, the Navigate and then Charging likely makes sense. The set of icons in the lower right of the map, now moved to the upper right was also very intuitive. They could just as easily leave that icon for multiple ways to access the same things. It doesn't make sense to remove it. I'm still trying to fully understand what the "pointer" does that they put in the place of the lightning bolt.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

GDN said:


> I guess this works for finding chargers and I try to put my mindset in long term mode or to new owners, the Navigate and then Charging likely makes sense. The set of icons in the lower right of the map, now moved to the upper right was also very intuitive. They could just as easily leave that icon for multiple ways to access the same things. It doesn't make sense to remove it. I'm still trying to fully understand what the "pointer" does that they put in the place of the lightning bolt.


That pointer turns off extra labeling on the map to make it "cleaner" though I prefer seeing the extra labeling.


----------



## FRC

GDN said:


> I guess this works for finding chargers and I try to put my mindset in long term mode or to new owners, the Navigate and then Charging likely makes sense. The set of icons in the lower right of the map, now moved to the upper right was also very intuitive. They could just as easily leave that icon for multiple ways to access the same things. It doesn't make sense to remove it. I'm still trying to fully understand what the "pointer" does that they put in the place of the lightning bolt.


The pointer removes some of the extraneous details from the map, like parks and businesses.


----------



## GDN

SoFlaModel3 said:


> That pointer turns off extra labeling on the map to make it "cleaner" though I prefer seeing the extra labeling.


Thanks I saw a few things disappear, but agree things I want to see - road markers, etc. Thought there must have been more. Preferably just put the lightning bolt back.


----------



## GDN

I'm hopeful calibrating the driver seat will also now allow it to save when I make small tweaks to the seat position, it hasn't saved a tweak in years for me. A word of WARNING however, calibrating the seat will wipe out your existing setting. Or perhaps it leaves the seat where it "Thinks" your setting would have been after calibration. Mine was not left in a drivable position. The same with Easy Exit. I had to reset them both from scratch after the calibration. Hoping it might take care of the little tweaks however.

Along the line of seats, I thought the beta of profile to the cloud was supposed to have been activated in a previous release, but I don't find it anywhere now.


----------



## Bigriver

JWardell said:


> That's where it is missing. During long drives I regularly tap to the route overview to check on charge level at destination and then may choose to pick a supercharger in between if I feel it's necessary. I can't do either now.


There are 3 different versions of "the holiday update" and I'm wondering if (gasp) they didn't get them identical? I have just double and triple checked that:

Estimated charge level at destination is shown when in the trip overview view. I might have to scroll down to see it, but I believe I have always had to.
I can add the superchargers superimposed on the trip overview. I even went to my model X that has not gotten any holiday update and the view looks essentially the same to me.















And then there is always the possibility that I'm totally misunderstanding the issues.


----------



## lance.bailey

i have dash cam set to record on horn tap. not as road friendly as a screen tap (i used to use both btw) but a horn tap is easier than tapping a sequence of menus


----------



## lance.bailey

auto seat heaters are a nice idea, but not for everyone at everytime. depending on my wearing a longer coat that covers my personal trunk area or a shorter bomber jacket i need more or less heat to achieve the temperature setting. so a tap up and down would be handy. 

some of the missing icons from the new screen are handled fine by voice commands but I have yet to get the voice commands to work for seat heaters. no matter what I do "lower/disable/turn-off" the seat hears get set to max. sigh.


----------



## Bigriver

lance.bailey said:


> but I have yet to get the voice commands to work for seat heaters. no matter what I do "lower/disable/turn-off" the seat hears get set to max. sigh.


Oh you are going to love this…. It needs you to tell it how many pieces of bacon you want the seat heater set to: "set the driver's seat heater to 1 piece of bacon"


----------



## Nom

Admittedly have only gone for short drives but I like the new looks! I’m getting used to the music selection approach and like it. So far auto seat heaters seem reasonable to me. Enjoying the blind spot option but not used to using it yet. I’m a happy camper so far.


----------



## Rick Steinwand

airbutchie said:


> Hey Rick.. thanks for the info… however, if you watch the video towards the end, all the power trunks opened for each vehicle… it's very subtle, but noticeable…


That was a different video I watched first. A recent one I saw (TESLA shining on the garage door), did have the trunk move.

I can tell you that the trunk in my '18 M3 with Hansshow, did not open the trunk when I ran the show.


----------



## Rick Steinwand

JWardell said:


> The new UI looks great at first glance. But once you drive a few hours on it as I did today, you quickly learn Tesla has made some MAJOR mistakes here! I can't beleive anyone actually tested this!
> 
> Navigation no longer shows estimated charge at destination! What?? This might be the single most important feature of an EV's UI! I need to know how much battery I will have on a particular drive, like you know, driving to both our families on christmas eve! Now you just have to blindly trust that it will pick a supercharger if needed, as if it knows you are able to charge at your destination?
> 
> Furthermore, you can't show superchargers on the map anymore! Again, super important, especially while on a trip, to hit the supercharger bolt and see nearby chargers on your route. They will be drawn on a map but only while zoomed in.
> 
> People are going to be stranded without these.
> 
> So thrilled to get blind spot cameras, this was a simple addition that was promised years ago. But not up top where they can be easily seen, but bottom right, behind your hand on the steering wheel...what!?!
> 
> You can customized quick icons on the buttom, great. But..you can only choose from things that are useless, half of which can't be used while driving! Quick access to games, but no quick access to seat heaters? Glovebox? Tire pressures? Etc .... Things I need to do while driving quickly where it's dangerous to go several levels deep.
> 
> Really, I think this was only tested on a desk.
> 
> Also, something is screwy with HVAC. I always keep mine at auto 68F. Never change. Today, I had heat coming from the floor (or seat heaters...despite turning them off I am confident they stayed on), while freezing cold air was blowing at me from the dash. Hours of driving today, uncomfortably hot on back and bottom, and uncomfortably cold on hand, arms, face, and shoulders. What?
> 
> I'll accept the design choices, but literally no thought was put into the HMI here, I get the feeling some important people were fired, or elon is forcing stupid things down peoples throat down to every detail like the yoke.


Many of us in the Midwest got our first chance to check out the new UI driving while it was snowing, which was fun not being able to find the defrost button and to be able to turn off the wipers. (I know how to now.)

REALLY BAD TIMING.


----------



## JWardell

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Charging locations are there.
> 
> Tap Navigate, then charging





SAronian said:


> Touch the navigate entry field and then choose the Charging Tab to see Superchargers on the map


But can you do that when you are already navigating?
Most of the time I am looking for superchargers, I am on a trip already navigating somewhere. Could simply tap the bolt and it would zoom out and show you.



Bigriver said:


> There are 3 different versions of "the holiday update" and I'm wondering if (gasp) they didn't get them identical? I have just double and triple checked that:
> 
> Estimated charge level at destination is shown when in the trip overview view. I might have to scroll down to see it, but I believe I have always had to.
> I can add the superchargers superimposed on the trip overview. I even went to my model X that has not gotten any holiday update and the view looks essentially the same to me.
> 
> View attachment 40833
> View attachment 40834
> 
> 
> And then there is always the possibility that I'm totally misunderstanding the issues.


I think you're on to something here. Definitely not what I see.

Lots more driving tomorrow to test further.


----------



## PaulK

I will write to Tesla:

+1: allow resizing of the map to shrink car animation 

+1: bring back single tap icons, or allow replacement of items like Spotify, Streaming and phone with more critical items like defrost and heated seats. Safety issue. 

+1: bring back or allow alternate view of wh/mi without covering up the map. Safety issue. 

** when using the mode for setting rear seat heaters on / off it should also permit setting front heated seats. They are visible but tapping them does nothing. 

** a shortcut to recirculate on/off that’s always available on the screen would be handy. A BMW I used to own had a button on the steering wheel to toggle recirc. Very handy when a truck suddenly accelerates in front of you, or when you realize you’ll be driving past Harris Ranch (cow pastures, or “Dairy- Air”)


----------



## SoFlaModel3

JWardell said:


> But can you do that when you are already navigating?
> Most of the time I am looking for superchargers, I am on a trip already navigating somewhere. Could simply tap the bolt and it would zoom out and show you.


Yes you can. Now that Tesla added Waypoints you can tape the map anywhere while navigating and the Navigate option will reappear.


----------



## GDN

I'll have to see this in action as well. Have not made a drive yet, but just two days ago I wanted to know if there was anyone at my upcoming SC stop. Tapping the lightning bolt would show me the SC and how many stalls were occupied while not interfering with the navigation. It really needs to remain that way. 

My navigation was set to my house, but it had added the SC stop. Why, when it knows the SC is your next destination, it doesn't just go ahead and show you the number of stalls available I'm not quite sure. That would be the nice addition. Don't just show me the black marker for my destination, but make it red and show the number of stalls.


----------



## GDN

I believe this changed some time back, but just realized it now that we have dedicated icons for radio vs streaming - when you switch to radio the last station is playing, when you select streaming you must then choose a station, it does not play automatically.


----------



## Perscitus

GDN said:


> I believe this changed some time back, but just realized it now that we have dedicated icons for radio vs streaming - when you switch to radio the last station is playing, when you select streaming you must then choose a station, it does not play automatically.


Yes its been like that for a while now, perhaps ever since v10/v10.x GUI days (both the discrete icons and the auto-radio-resume vs manual-stream-resume behavior).

I know because when parking the car for extended periods of time I toggle all data syphoning options to off (including switching to vanilla radio) just for that extra bit less vamipre drain.

Hopefully v11 gets polished faster than v9/10 back in their infancy.


----------



## msjulie

r-e-l said:


> Horrible update ....


Sadly I am equally disappointed



r-e-l said:


> Colors of icons make it looks like a phone ... but that just a matter of taste.
> 
> the fact that the flash cards are gone is horrible, horrible ... to think we lost that one and kept the stupid animated perspective - wow ...
> All those buttons that are now two clicks away ...


1000 agree - what loss, if someone couldn't find them ok have the other paths but why take away something useful that was relatively easy to get w/o taking eyes off the road



r-e-l said:


> Not only it hurts usability but its un safe ... why are the buttons of defrost, car seat warmer ...? are two clicks away. It's very distracting and for what?
> 
> Feels a design team that lost is vision/direction and making changes for sake of changes ... other than the video cam for turn signal, find this update to be useless.


Worse than useless, things we have muscle memory for again changed for what appears to be whim vs function and worse, no way to get back what matters to an individual owner. Can count on one hand the number of times Netflix has been used, less for games or Spotify and yet those are the 'important' shortcuts we have access to vs heated seats, tire pressures, etc. Rear seat heaters always were super annoying now all are.

Foolishly I thought we might get more flexibility not less; blind spot camera useful but I've hoped for a live energy gauge (like the S) since I often track how usage vs prediction is going to fine tune super charging stops.

I feel like Tesla doesn't want us driving these cars actually, they think we really will just be passengers and so why do we need any of those silly 'car' controls



r-e-l said:


> 1. Design team here is something you can focus : make the map size bigger -yes, bring back some of the space you took a year ago and then some ... we dont need so much white space.


Yes, let me have a bigger map vs all that dead space around my car on the road cartoons; might come as a surprise but I'm looking out the front window and scanning side to side so all that animation does nothing for me. The map though, with traffic, IS useful

First world holiday disappointments


----------



## tivoboy

kornerz said:


> Got 44.25.2 today in EU.
> 
> Good news:
> it seems to include Live Sentry View for Europe (will need to enable premium connectivity subscription to test):
> View attachment 40796
> 
> 
> Bad news (for me): browser window is now even smaller, thanks to a large header with Entertainment tabs:
> View attachment 40797
> 
> 
> Also card with current trip consumption/odometer is gone into Settings window, I've used to have it always on.


What is the lower picture of?


----------



## tivoboy

Why does it almost always seem as if it is one step forward and at least one plus step backwards with the updates. I’ve done software development and delivery on and off now for nearly 30 years and I get the feeling that some of this is being designed and developed in a vacuum and THEN tested out in a live setting or with real input.


----------



## slasher016

garsh said:


> How do I save dashcam footage in v11?
> 
> I used to tap on the dashcam icon while driving, but that appears to be gone now.


Honk your horn.... (if you have that setting turned on)


----------



## Klaus-rf

msjulie said:


> Rear seat heaters always were super annoying now all are.


So it's "balanced" now?


----------



## msjulie

Klaus-rf said:


> So it's "balanced" now?


Sure, equally sh1t


----------



## lance.bailey

Bigriver said:


> Oh you are going to love this…. It needs you to tell it how many pieces of bacon you want the seat heater set to: "set the driver's seat heater to 1 piece of bacon"
> View attachment 40835
> 
> View attachment 40836


cute.

however "cute" does not negate stupid.

the voice system recognizes "lower driver seat heater" or "decrease driver seat heater" or "turn off driver seat heater" but always responds with "driver seat heater set to maximum" and then does exactly that..

even if I ate bacon I would not think think to say that. and now that the heater icon is hidden, I don't know if i am on 1 or 2 or 3 bacon strips, I just want it lowered or raised as per my current buttometer reading.


----------



## francoisp

lance.bailey said:


> cute.
> 
> however "cute" does not negate stupid.
> 
> the voice system recognizes "lower driver seat heater" or "decrease driver seat heater" or "turn off driver seat heater" but always responds with "driver seat heater set to maximum" and then does exactly that..
> 
> even if I ate bacon I would not think think to say that. and now that the heater icon is hidden, I don't know if i am on 1 or 2 or 3 bacon strips, I just want it lowered or raised as per my current buttometer reading.


If you swipe up from the bottom of the screen you quickly get that info. It's not like before but it's easy enough.


----------



## lance.bailey

if i swipe up from the bottom of the screen, and see the heaters, then i'll adjust the heaters from there.


----------



## Bigriver

francoisp said:


> If you swipe up from the bottom of the screen you quickly get that info. It's not like before but it's easy enough.


I don't know how long it will take to train my eyes to hone in on just the seat heater on the climate control screen, as it is rather busy. I also often have just the heat seaters on, and the swipe up turns on the heating system. And as soon as I turn off the fan, all info disappears.

I'm liking a bit better using the < or > on either side of the temp to pull up this simplified screen. It also turns the fan on as it pulls it up, but my brain can more quickly grasp the seat heater info I was seeking. And nicely, there is also the defrost I need in a hurry sometimes.











lance.bailey said:


> the voice system recognizes "lower driver seat heater" or "decrease driver seat heater" or "turn off driver seat heater" but always responds with "driver seat heater set to maximum" and then does exactly that..


I consistently got it to set the seat heater last night based on the bacon voice request. Now when I tried it, I had a high miss rate with it misunderstanding, and a number of times also adjusting the fan. Any voice request with "to" in it is often misunderstood as "2". And "drivers seat heater" does not smoothly roll off my tongue. So I will resort primarily to the double touch with the small screen I show above.


----------



## DarkNRG

Just getting towards cold days in Maryland, and I needed to air up the tires just a bit. Miss just using the “tire pressure” voice command. Also my wife misses the button for the seat heater.

The blind spot camera was a good add though. Long overdue. So was the subwoofer control.


----------



## Perscitus

@JWardell did the initial v11 releases change around CAN message addressing some more? Render ScanMyTesla and homebrew logger, HUD and dash display definitions obsolete again?

Seeing some conflicting reports about aftermarket auto-frunk/trunk and self-presenting doors actuating during default and script-edited Christmas light show demos.


----------



## CATSLAMY

Where did the cellular strength indicator get moved to in 2021.44.25.6?


----------



## rwsimon

Is there a voice command for the Trips screen? ”Odometer” used to open the odometer card, but that command is no longer recognized. Neither is “trips”.


----------



## francoisp

CATSLAMY said:


> Where did the cellular strength indicator get moved to in 2021.44.25.6?


At the top right of the service page I find the signal strength of my home wifi. I haven't tested this but likely it will show the cellular signal strength when away from home.


----------



## tencate

Hmmm. I was just on the phone, called mum, and can't hang up the phone without reaching for my cell phone  and pressing the red "hang up" button. What am I missing? She hangs up and my phone stays connected. Very odd. Bug?


----------



## bwilson4web

Your Jeopardy question, "What is 2021.44.25.6?" <GRINS>

Perhaps some thread titles could use an edit?

Bob Wilson


----------



## Klaus-rf

bwilson4web said:


> Your Jeopardy question, "What is 2021.44.25.6?" <GRINS>
> 
> Perhaps some thread titles could use an edit?
> 
> Bob Wilson


"Would that be 'Light Urple'"?"


----------



## Numbersix

Put me down in the 66% negative, 33% positive category. For every good thing they added, they screwed up two things at least. Maybe I’m more towards 75👎 25👍. If this was your first software release, 2021.44.25.2, then you’ll be fine but for those of us not new to Tesla before December 24th, it’s awful. Lots of handy at-the-fingertips things are now in a menu, gone or broken. One of the only positives is USB album art, somehow that got fixed. A few of my files still don’t play I’ll have to track down that problem but it’s probably due to high sample rate or resolution FLAC file. Biggest 👎 for me is no more cards for trip meter, tire pressure and wipers. No more simple out of the way icon to toggle dashcam on/off, music favorites layout completely screwed up, swiping up from the bottom (on tunes) doesn’t do anything like before. So I’m pretty bummed.


----------



## garsh

bwilson4web said:


> Your Jeopardy question, "What is 2021.44.25.6?" <GRINS>
> 
> Perhaps some thread titles could use an edit?
> 
> Bob Wilson


I'm generally not counting the FSD Beta builds as the "most recent".


----------



## JWardell

Ok after a day of rest and restart and another long drive: Destination charge level IS there, but even when going to overview you have to manually scroll all the way down and it is in light grey. Also, if you want to see superchargers instead of just tapping the icon on the map now you have to click navigate, then the hamburger, then add stop, then charging, and you finally get an overview of superchargers...if you haven't crashed into a tree yet.

Another mystery, cell/wifi connection level is gone. Many times today when maps were slow to refresh I would glance to see if it's a weak signal, but you can't do that anymore.


----------



## iChris93

JWardell said:


> Destination charge level IS there, but even when going to overview you have to manually scroll all the way down and it is in light grey.


This is how it has been for a while.


----------



## ateslik

JWardell said:


> Ok after a day of rest and restart and another long drive: Destination charge level IS there, but even when going to overview you have to manually scroll all the way down and it is in light grey. Also, if you want to see superchargers instead of just tapping the icon on the map now you have to click navigate, then the hamburger, then add stop, then charging, and you finally get an overview of superchargers...if you haven't crashed into a tree yet.
> 
> Another mystery, cell/wifi connection level is gone. Many times today when maps were slow to refresh I would glance to see if it's a weak signal, but you can't do that anymore.


cell and wifi icons and strength indicators are in the top of the Controls section of the Car icon.


----------



## Mike

Hollywood7 said:


> Since you can set the heat seaters to AUTO now, you should like this change?


The AUTO seat heaters will only function when the HVAC is in "auto".

With four winters experience in my TM3, "auto" only leads to window fogging because it insists on using recirculating (moisture laden) air as an attempt to cut energy used in heating the cabin.


----------



## iChris93

Mike said:


> With four winters experience in my TM3, "auto" only leads to window fogging because it insists on using recirculating (moisture laden) air as an attempt to cut energy used in heating the cabin.


My experience is exactly the opposite. In auto, no window fogging. In manual, then fogging only.


----------



## lance.bailey

tencate said:


> Hmmm. I was just on the phone, called mum, and can't hang up the phone without reaching for my cell phone  and pressing the red "hang up" button. What am I missing? She hangs up and my phone stays connected. Very odd. Bug?


i've seen this reported from a couple of people. I don't know - but is there not a red hangup button in the phone app? bad if that is the case, but at least it is somewhere.


----------



## Mike

rwsimon said:


> It would be a really helpful bit of community service if someone would compile a list of all the things that have disappeared from the main screen along with instructions on how to now access those items. Without that information, it is difficult to decide whether or not to do the update since there is no turning back after it is done. Maybe somebody will be generous enough to put together such a list. Too bad Tesla didn't think it was important enough to provide it themselves.


I went and took a hit for the team and installed the update (25.2) followed by a typical (for me) 257 km drive from home to the inlaws in eastern Ottawa earlier today.

Some static observations: the auto wipers still don't work when the sky is a monochromatic grey and my trunk lights still don't work when the car is asleep and I open the trunk via the latch above the rear license plate.

The copilot was NOT pleased that the seat heater controls were buried.

I miss the trip odometer card and having to call that up on a separate file folder is very poor design.

And after the switch to V9 over three years ago removed the "estimated percentage battery SOC at nav system arrival point" icon from permanent display next the the ETA…even my "hack" that used to work to bring that icon up right away (tapping the top navigation point to display the whole route) has now turned into more steps while my focus is not out the windscreen.

The only time I saw the LTE icon was when we would lose LTE signal (semi regular experience on HWY 7 between Toronto and Ottawa).

When parked at a non-home location, the only way I could turn "off" sentry mode (or just confirm its status) was to once again go into the controls file folder instead of seeing the sentry mode status via an icon that always shows.

Voice commands to bring up trip odometer OR tire pressures no longer works, so wanting to see the tire pressures requires the extra steps of digging into menus.

The compass card no longer shows when Autosteer is used.

Gut feeling: like the elimination of "gauges" for a single "check engine light" between the early 1970s and the early 2000s, it seems that anything dealing with any physicality of a machine driving from one point to another is being relegated to the dust bin. Probably will make sense when FSD is a thing, but until then…


----------



## Mike

CATSLAMY said:


> Where did the cellular strength indicator get moved to in 2021.44.25.6?


On a trip today, it shows up only when the signal is lost, so one sees the familiar icon where there is no signal…and once a new signal is attained, the icon goes away.


----------



## Mike

iChris93 said:


> My experience is exactly the opposite. In auto, no window fogging. In manual, then fogging only.


In manual, the system will still default to recirculate until you deselect it…once recirculate has been deselected and the system is not purposely turned off, it keeps using only fresh air until such time as you turn the system off or set it into auto.


----------



## lance.bailey

Mike said:


> On a trip today, it shows up only when the signal is lost, so one sees the familiar icon where there is no signal…and once a new signal is attained, the icon goes away.


i see the LTE/WiFi/Bluetooth indicators at the top right of the control panel which you open via the car icon in the bottom left of the screen (as per usual).

I do like the homelink popping up when approaching a homelink setting. other than that I never need it, so why show it? Curious to know where the update icon (download or install) will appear. will have to get an update for those to be needed.


----------



## GDN

The seat heaters is somewhat quick to get to if you touch the up (right arrow) or down (left arrow) next to the temp number for control - it is still an extra touch, but not bad. If you touch the temp number itself it opens the whole display. I wish touching any of it would bring up the small quick menu and a longer touch would bring up the full menu. I'm not giving anything "auto" related to HVAC or seats much credit. I guess only time will tell.

Overall it seems they want anything and everything to be automatic. If you want to adjust it yourself then you have to hunt for it. Their concept just isn't working yet. When they perfect something then they can bury the option, but truly, as much as I love this car, they just haven't done anything perfect enough to make the changes they made this go round. We still need access to the profiles easily because the car still can not get which BT phone entered the drivers door, we need access to seat heaters, because they can't even get basic HVAC automated correctly and on and on.

If anything for the icons across the bottom, give me more options, like my seats and get rid of the recents section, let me choose 7 or 8 of my own and that is likely more than I need.

Just my preferences.


----------



## lance.bailey

i did not realize that touching the arrows brought up a sub menu. that will be handy. thank you.


----------



## Perscitus

tivoboy said:


> Why does it almost always seem as if it is one step forward and at least one plus step backwards with the updates. I've done software development and delivery on and off now for nearly 30 years and I get the feeling that some of this is being designed and developed in a vacuum and THEN tested out in a live setting or with real input.


Indeed. It is done in a vaccum (virtual test benches), as proven by some of the job postings from Tesla over the past few years. They detailed the tech used to build the GUIs and test their software used both in their car products and factories.

What they should do is push such form over function Holiday updates to SpaceX starships and see how that fares, TikTok and all.


----------



## JeffC

Got 2021.44.25.2 (Holiday release) on my non FSD Model 3 a couple days ago.

Wow, version 11 is a major change to the user interface.

I'm not sure I totally like it since some of the menus are deeper. Before, the flatter menus made it quicker to get to (more) commonly used things.


----------



## JeffC

rrollens said:


> Just downloaded 44.6 after a long absence of no new updates. Have not received any update that provided the remote Sentry mode viewing. Any idea what's up with that?


Remote Sentry viewing was added in an earlier update (for me at least; I don't know how Tesla rolls up/out the updates in detail).

It needs to be enabled, which was somewhat complex to do. Here's how I did it:

https://teslaownersonline.com/threa...-40-latest-2021-40-6.19102/page-2#post-325886
And note that it may not be allowed in all regions due to different privacy laws.


----------



## Greg Smith

tencate said:


> Hmmm. I was just on the phone, called mum, and can't hang up the phone without reaching for my cell phone  and pressing the red "hang up" button. What am I missing? She hangs up and my phone stays connected. Very odd. Bug?


When I called my wife (via voice command) the phone controls showed up where the cards used to be and I pressed the red hang up button when done.


----------



## lance.bailey

JeffC said:


> https://teslaownersonline.com/threa...-40-latest-2021-40-6.19102/page-2#post-325886
> And note that it may not be allowed in all regions due to different privacy laws.


up here in Canada the live sentry did not show up until v11.


----------



## Needsdecaf

lance.bailey said:


> i've seen this reported from a couple of people. I don't know - but is there not a red hangup button in the phone app? bad if that is the case, but at least it is somewhere.


Its there and it worked for me today.


----------



## dburkland

Found another V11 UI bug today while driving on the freeway w/ AutoPilot:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1475322088034553860


----------



## tencate

Greg Smith said:


> When I called my wife (via voice command) the phone controls showed up where the cards used to be and I pressed the red hang up button when done.


That sometimes happens for me, but mostly it's not there for me most times. One of the worst kind of bugs, but I live in a remote area with crap cell service, perhaps that's it. But when you don't get the hang up button, you're really stuck if YOU made the call. I'll keep exploring, perhaps a pattern will emerge and I can do a proper bug report.


----------



## tencate

I turned on the blind spot camera display today. Interesting except my cameras appear to be dirty from the salt on the roads.  But it was MORE interesting tonight. It's pretty dark where I live and the turn signal camera is overwhelmed by... the light of the turn signal flashing on and off.  So tonight it was less than useful, a bit distracting in fact. I decided I can live without it and to be honest, the car does a great job of checking the blind spots when it changes lanes. I tried to shut it off with various voice commands once I got home but nothing worked so I found it in the menu and turned it off for now.


----------



## JustTheTip

tencate said:


> I turned on the blind spot camera display today. Interesting except my cameras appear to be dirty from the salt on the roads.  But it was MORE interesting tonight. It's pretty dark where I live and the turn signal camera is overwhelmed by... the light of the turn signal flashing on and off.  So tonight it was less than useful, a bit distracting in fact. I decided I can live without it and to be honest, the car does a great job of checking the blind spots when it changes lanes. I tried to shut it off with various voice commands once I got home but nothing worked so I found it in the menu and turned it off for now.


Ugh. So much this. This feature is useless at night since the turn signal itself totally blinds the camera.


----------



## msjulie

I agree with the comment saying Tesla seems to believe everything should be automatic. Sigh, why?? Ok give auto but don't take away - a bit of a stretch but I feel like I'm in the manual vs auto trans debate.

I'm all for change but I didn't sign up for less and less control (feels like it right now) or complete rewrites of the UI such that my muscle memory is worthless. Oh and continuing to prioritize games - well I guess I'm boring cause I don't get it.. 

Like this car a lot and I think in general Tesla is far ahead in tech but every time they take away some choice or make obvious things harder, it's just a little bit easier for me to consider my next EV not to be a Tesla and that ticks me off


----------



## Kizzy

Oh, hey. The stars are back at night (in the glass roof reflection).

I finally used the car today. Complaints:

You can't turn on the rear defroster via voice command without also turning on the HVAC system
Voice commands are having errors. Is that because I have no internet service? Should I check? Oh, it worked, do I have service or not? (This is a complaint about hiding the LTE icon in the Controls pane.)
Pressing the icon for whatever media icon you select opens the media overlay in full screen.
Swiping up _anywhere_ on the bottom strip opens the climate control and turns it on. I miss those last app, and media swipe options (and half expected the mini climate control sheet to pop up).
Podcasts no longer show the date. (Though the title now scrolls so you can read the whole thing, small yay.)


----------



## JeffC

msjulie said:


> I agree with the comment saying Tesla seems to believe everything should be automatic. Sigh, why?? Ok give auto but don't take away - a bit of a stretch but I feel like I'm in the manual vs auto trans debate.
> 
> I'm all for change but I didn't sign up for less and less control (feels like it right now) or complete rewrites of the UI such that my muscle memory is worthless. Oh and continuing to prioritize games - well I guess I'm boring cause I don't get it..
> 
> Like this car a lot and I think in general Tesla is far ahead in tech but every time they take away some choice or make obvious things harder, it's just a little bit easier for me to consider my next EV not to be a Tesla and that ticks me off


Tesla/Elon seems to be fully convinced that full autonomy is possible and they're moving the user interfaces towards it.

I'm skeptical that full autonomy is possible and am not totally convinced that the user interface changes are an improvement for us human drivers.

We should probably let Tesla know we don't think the UI changes are better, after trying to use them for a while. (But really the best UI is the one that's the easiest to use, and these changes seem to make it less easy, and not just from "muscle memory" of the old interface. Deeper menus are ALWAYS harder/slower to use.)

Don't just suffer in silence; let them know.


----------



## JeanDeBarraux

lance.bailey said:


> cute.
> 
> however "cute" does not negate stupid.
> 
> the voice system recognizes "lower driver seat heater" or "decrease driver seat heater" or "turn off driver seat heater" but always responds with "driver seat heater set to maximum" and then does exactly that..
> 
> even if I ate bacon I would not think think to say that. and now that the heater icon is hidden, I don't know if i am on 1 or 2 or 3 bacon strips, I just want it lowered or raised as per my current buttometer reading.


Strange because voice control for seat heaters appear to be working perfectly fine in French (as was the case before).


----------



## SalisburySam

JeanDeBarraux said:


> Strange because voice control for seat heaters appear to be working perfectly fine in French (as was the case before).


Obviously Tesla's approach to ensuring owners speak or learn a second language. Good goal, but unlikely to happen for most 'Mericans.


----------



## msjulie

JeffC said:


> Tesla/Elon seems to be fully convinced that full autonomy is possible and they're moving the user interfaces towards it.


Yeah grrr - it's really gonna be a long time before that's true and maybe then I won't care. Since it's far from true this update continues to be a let down


JeffC said:


> Don't just suffer in silence; let them know.


Hard to do with the customer support email being seemingly a no-op so for grins (and probably not much else) I used the website to drop a note to the board of directors. Felt better for at least a couple seconds anyway.


----------



## FRC

msjulie said:


> Hard to do with the customer support email being seemingly a no-op so for grins (and probably not much else) I used the website to drop a note to the board of directors. Felt better for at least a couple seconds anyway.


Not to worry, @msjulie. I have no doubt that the suits at Tesla are, right now, poring over your missive and wringing their hands trying to figure out how to appease you.


----------



## lance.bailey

JeanDeBarraux said:


> Strange because voice control for seat heaters appear to be working perfectly fine in French (as was the case before).


merde


----------



## r-e-l

JeffC said:


> Don't just suffer in silence; let them know.


Have no idea how big the community of this site but I thought it is one of the big ones and as such ... Am hoping that Tesla itself is monitoring the discussion groups (of the larger communities) and/or they have ambassadors/insiders that can pass on the feedback ...

That makes only sense but its probably only wishful thinking ...

So where does Tesla gets its input/feedback to users? Are there specific forums?

I am not convinced they are listening to feedback but yes, as someone said earlier - it can make us feel bit better letting them know what we think ... for 3 seconds that is ...


----------



## Kizzy

r-e-l said:


> Have no idea how big the community of this site but I thought it is one of the big ones and as such ... Am hoping that Tesla itself is monitoring the discussion groups (of the larger communities) and/or they have ambassadors/insiders that can pass on the feedback ...
> 
> That makes only sense but its probably only wishful thinking ...
> 
> So where does Tesla gets its input/feedback to users? Are there specific forums?
> 
> I am not convinced they are listening to feedback but yes, as someone said earlier - it can make us feel bit better letting them know what we think ... for 3 seconds that is ...


Tweeting at Elon seems to be the official feedback mechanism.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/998079732389363714
I thought there was something more explicit/recent about having a team comb through replies to his tweets, but I can't find it. Of course, the message boards are no more.


----------



## lance.bailey

I just noticed that my app and the car disagree with the percent battery usage. the app reads about 5% higher. So if the car says 54%, the app says 59%. If I switch both to km remaining they match, but the battery percentage is consistently higher on the app. 

I'm charging now to my 80% set point, will see how the two agree to disagree after charging.


----------



## GDN

lance.bailey said:


> I just noticed that my app and the car disagree with the percent battery usage. the app reads about 5% higher. So if the car says 54%, the app says 59%. If I switch both to km remaining they match, but the battery percentage is consistently higher on the app.
> 
> I'm charging now to my 80% set point, will see how the two agree to disagree after charging.


If you haven't seen it - there is at least one bug in the iPhone App. My car and app agree on how much range I have and I can display those in % or miles. However after charging - I get a message that xxx km - have been added during the last charge. So they have mixed km and miles. There could easily be other math problems they have introduced in the app.


----------



## lance.bailey

yeah, more math problems are likely. just hope that they don't get feet and metres confused when judging proximity.


----------



## bwilson4web

So I have some favorite and wild-card YouTube videos but this one is a 'head scratcher' for me:





As I was testing today, the new User Interface (UI) reminded me of some of the head-jerking changes both MacOS and Windows went through. Without the option of preserving the previous operational scenario, I just treated each new UI as something to be figured out. I don't 'own stock' in any particular UI as long as we can figure it out. Calling in 'botched' seems a little over the top,

Bob Wilson


----------



## lance.bailey

bwilson4web said:


> I just treated each new UI as something to be figured out. I don't 'own stock' in any particular UI as long as we can figure it out.
> 
> Bob Wilson


this


----------



## lance.bailey

lance.bailey said:


> I just noticed that my app and the car disagree with the percent battery usage. the app reads about 5% higher. So if the car says 54%, the app says 59%. If I switch both to km remaining they match, but the battery percentage is consistently higher on the app.
> 
> I'm charging now to my 80% set point, will see how the two agree to disagree after charging.


so after fully charging, the app says 80%, the car says 79% and both say 273km.

however...

after i pulled out the charger, the lightning bolt on the main screen is dimmed and no longer allows me to open the port. I have to go into Controls, and then tap *that* lightning bolt to open the port. After that is opened, the main screen no longer has the lightning bolt icon dimmed but the icon does nothing when tapped. The main panel now also has the charging status bar. If I close the port (via the control sub-page the main panel lightning bolt again goes dim and the charging status bar disappears.

needs.
work.


----------



## Mike

lance.bailey said:


> I just noticed that my app and the car disagree with the percent battery usage. the app reads about 5% higher. So if the car says 54%, the app says 59%. If I switch both to km remaining they match, but the battery percentage is consistently higher on the app.
> 
> I'm charging now to my 80% set point, will see how the two agree to disagree after charging.


I've noticed the discrepancy as well, but I just assumed that the phone doesn't show the cold temperature effects that temporarily withhold a few percent of available battery SOC…and for whatever reason, the amps selected for charging are always showing one (1) amp lower on the app.


----------



## r1200gs4ok

I have a 2020 model S and still waiting for update.....I am on 2021.36.8.10....seems only 3 cars get this version.....anyone have any idea why I did not get holiday update? my wife's 2019 Model 3 got is (2021.44.25). who can I ask? thanks


----------



## JeffC

FRC said:


> Not to worry, @msjulie. I have no doubt that the suits at Tesla are, right now, poring over your missive and wringing their hands trying to figure out how to appease you.


As far as I can tell there are almost no "suits" at Tesla or SpaceX, mostly engineers and other professionals actually doing useful things in the offices at least. The companies are relatively lean and very hard working.


----------



## JeffC

msjulie said:


> Yeah grrr - it's really gonna be a long time before that's true and maybe then I won't care. Since it's far from true this update continues to be a let down
> 
> Hard to do with the customer support email being seemingly a no-op so for grins (and probably not much else) I used the website to drop a note to the board of directors. Felt better for at least a couple seconds anyway.


I believe it's possible to give Tesla feedback via voice command. Say "bug report" then describe the issue briefly, like one sentence, using the voice command button in the cars.

Tesla has very rare web surveys. I recently filled one out that was shared with the Tesla Owners of Silicon Valley (a local Tesla owners club). These are the officially recognized clubs for owners, and even then the surveys are very rare; maybe once every several years; not often enough for comments about frequent software updates or even major ones like Version 11.


----------



## Kizzy

JeffC said:


> I believe it's possible to give Tesla feedback via voice command. Say "bug report" then describe the issue briefly, like one sentence, using the voice command button in the cars.
> 
> Tesla has very rare web surveys. I recently filled one out that was shared with the Tesla Owners of Silicon Valley (a local Tesla owners club). These are the officially recognized clubs for owners, and even then the surveys are rare; maybe once every several years; not often enough for comments about software updates.


I got a survey about my car delivery once. If I recall correctly, it was one multiple choice question.


----------



## JeffC

Kizzy said:


> I got a survey about my car delivery once. If I recall correctly, it was one multiple choice question.


The survey I got had several questions: what do you like about the driving experience, what would you improve, etc. About a half dozen open response questions. Again they're very rare.

I may have gotten a survey about the car delivery experience also. I expect those may be for job evaluations of the workers.


----------



## garsh

JeffC said:


> I believe it's possible to give Tesla feedback via voice command. Say "bug report" then describe the issue briefly, like one sentence, using the voice command button in the cars.


Unfortunately, it's not as useful as you may think.

https://teslaownersonline.com/threa...ure-probably-doesnt-do-what-you-expect.18431/


----------



## SalisburySam

bwilson4web said:


> As I was testing today, the new User Interface (UI) reminded me of some of the head-jerking changes both MacOS and Windows went through. Without the option of preserving the previous operational scenario, I just treated each new UI as something to be figured out. I don't 'own stock' in any particular UI as long as we can figure it out. Calling in 'botched' seems a little over the top,


For me, the big difference in desktop operating systems and vehicular ones is the risk potential. A desktop rarely moves on its own power, rarely collides with something else, rarely causes a newsworthy blitz, and in general acts pretty genteel in its parked location regardless of the version of its OS. Searching for new and relocated functions is, frankly, annoying at the very worst. For an automobile, even one that is a computer with attached driven wheels, that thinking has to be replaced with a safety-first mentality, again for me, and that's my issue with UI's.

With the dozens of car manufacturers today and over the last century, many things have been standardized in the interests of safety. Obvious ones include (in the US) driving from the left front seat, the PRNDL gear options, a third center stop light, go pedal on the right, brake pedal to its left, and clutch left-most, etc. Mucking around with "standards" changes expectations, sometimes for the better (option of console- or steering column-mounted shifter), or the worse (anyone remember Edsel's push button shifter in the center of the steering wheel?). I'm good with some changes to vehicle operations, and can easily go from my 1964 Ford Thunderbird to my Model 3 and drive both safely. In the Tbird, no user interface ever changes so muscle memory serves quickly and well to perform any operational need. In the 3, there is little chance to develop muscle memory for anything beyond shifting, opening the windows and doors, and pressing the correct pedal. All else is on a visual, not tactile, "knob." Compound this by moving those virtual knobs around, into different menu levels, indeed anywhere but the visual equivalent of root level access, means trying to find something…in a moving vehicle. That is perhaps great UI design, but you only get a few points for design in a car interface; far more points are given (by drivers anyway) for easily-found, easily-operated, easily-understood features related to any part of driving the damn car. I know, I know, robotaxis…but that ain't my car, likely not yours either, and just as likely not any car soon. Let's deliver an interface that works today, safely, without the new software scavenger hunt and look to reduce not increase clicks/taps to do something related to operating the car. While "botched" may be a bit over the top, with minor exceptions the new UI does seem less safe. Rant over, apologies.


----------



## DocScott

Come to think of it, why the heck doesn't the UI change more when you're in park vs. when you're driving? Game and video icons are absolutely wasted space while driving. On the other hand, wipers don't have to be front-and-center while in park, and a few extra clicks to bring up the energy information that used to be on the trip cards or the heated seats is no more than mildly annoying when you're parked.

And in the hypothetical L4 future, the "parked" UI could also appear while you had L4 FSD engaged, but then revert when driving manually.


----------



## msjulie

DocScott said:


> Come to think of it, why the heck doesn't the UI change more when you're in park vs. when you're driving? Game and video icons are absolutely wasted space while driving. On the other hand, wipers don't have to be front-and-center while in park, and a few extra clicks to bring up the energy information that used to be on the trip cards or the heated seats is no more than mildly annoying when you're parked.
> 
> And in the hypothetical L4 future, the "parked" UI could also appear while you had L4 FSD engaged, but then revert when driving manually.


Good example and good points!

Yesterday my sister and I went out, her first time visiting/in my car in over 2 long COVID years. Within seconds she had reached out and turned on her heated seat (refusing to upgrade my firmware I am!) followed by seat belt.

That small thing is such a big deal I can't figure out WITF* Tesla decided that the convenience and obvious correctness of that small button was not something their cars should provide. She doesn't know the Tesla UI from an Android tablet but the visible seat icon with oh-so-obvious bacon strips was all she needed.

*Why In The Fvck


----------



## rwsimon

It seems to me that the new OS has traded ergonomics in favor of aesthetics. In many cases, it has made it more difficult to do things in order to make the screen look better. By no means not all the changes are like this. Some functions are no more difficult or complicated; they are just different. So we will just learn the new way to do things. No big deal. But there is little justification is eliminating useful functions as part of the “new look”. My pet peeve is the loss of the trip/efficiency card. Some of us like to monitor our energy use on an ongoing basis. The only way to have this information on the screen now is to cover up the nav map. And you can’t even get there with a voice command anymore. How is this an improvement? What have we gained by losing this functionality?


----------



## msjulie

@rwsimon Just a few items in the list of why-is-this-better?


can't check tire pressure with a swipe while driving
can't 1 click seat heater for driver and front passenge
can't monitor energy use with a swipe
quick directions UNDER the blind spot camera (stupid me had hoped those quick instructions upper left could be always on not just when an app was over the map)
short cuts to games while driving? 
quick glance at LTE/WiFi status gone (unless something is wrong)

ok sorry I'm just ranting from disappointment


----------



## BLK

r1200gs4ok said:


> I have a 2020 model S and still waiting for update.....I am on 2021.36.8.10....seems only 3 cars get this version.....anyone have any idea why I did not get holiday update? my wife's 2019 Model 3 got is (2021.44.25). who can I ask? thanks


Did you get it yet? I have a 2021
Model S, also still on 36.8.10 and I have not received the update still.


----------



## francoisp

I guess this is one advantage of having actual buttons and switches : they don't tend to move around with a software update.


----------



## bwilson4web

francoisp said:


> I guess this is one advantage of having actual buttons and switch: they don't tend to  *can't* move around with a software update.


Small edit.

Bob Wilson


----------



## lance.bailey

Mike said:


> I've noticed the discrepancy as well, but I just assumed that the phone doesn't show the cold temperature effects that temporarily withhold a few percent of available battery SOC…and for whatever reason, the amps selected for charging are always showing one (1) amp lower on the app.


you are right - and I considered that myself. until I noticed that the phone has a blue snowflake on it by the charge level so it knows that the car is freezing it's nibblets.


----------



## Yanquetino

I'll just say it: I *HATE* the touchscreen UI changes in v.11. It is so much more difficult to access features, buttons, especially for a passenger. My wife was absolutely furious trying to use it as we drove 750+ miles home yesterday. Can't believe how clueless the programmers must be to have come up with them. What the hell were they thinking? I want v.10 back!!!


----------



## francoisp

Yanquetino said:


> Can't believe how clueless the programmers must be to have come up with them (NR: the UI changes). What the hell were they thinking? I want v.10 back!!!


Please blame the UI designer(s), not the programmers (except for bugs). Someone at Tesla came up with the new layout, got it approved and sent it over to the programmers to get it done. That's how it usually works anyway.


----------



## Ksb466

Please explain Automatic Seat Heaters function? Is it no longer hi, med and low, but instead the temp of my cabin setting, like 70 degrees? It seems barely noticeable. Is the intent to make this another setting that is always on with no need to adjust? Wife not happy so I assume she can set it to high instead of Auto and her profile will do exactly that each time?


----------



## francoisp

Ksb466 said:


> Please explain Automatic Seat Heaters function? Is it no longer hi, med and low, but instead the temp of my cabin setting, like 70 degrees? It seems barely noticeable. Is the intent to make this another setting that is always on with no need to adjust? Wife not happy so I assume she can set it to high instead of Auto and her profile will do exactly that each time?


Here in Cleveland on a cold day, the seat heater on Auto started at 3, then went to 2 and 1. It worked pretty well I thought. On a following day, a warmer day, same thing. However the seat felt much too warm this time and I had to take it off Auto and manually turn the seat heater all the way off. I've left it in manual mode after that. I don't know if the Auto mode takes outside and cabin temperatures into consideration when selecting a seat heating level or if it's just a timer thing.


----------



## Ksb466

Did Dashcam icon move? Don’t see it on top here after update. How do we save dashcam clips now to our usb?


----------



## FRC

francoisp said:


> Please blame the UI designer(s), not the programmers (except for bugs). Someone at Tesla came up with the new layout, got it approved and sent it over to the programmers to get it done. That's how it usually works anyway.


Do we really care which employee is at fault for such short-sighted "improvements"? Generally I prefer to place blame at the feet of those in charge. Here's looking at you Elon.


----------



## FRC

msjulie said:


> @rwsimon Just a few items in the list of why-is-this-better?
> 
> 
> can't check tire pressure with a swipe while driving
> can't 1 click seat heater for driver and front passenge
> can't monitor energy use with a swipe
> quick directions UNDER the blind spot camera (stupid me had hoped those quick instructions upper left could be always on not just when an app was over the map)
> short cuts to games while driving?
> quick glance at LTE/WiFi status gone (unless something is wrong)
> 
> ok sorry I'm just ranting from disappointment


No need to apologize for your well thought out and on-point rant @msjulie.


----------



## Kizzy

Ksb466 said:


> Did Dashcam icon move? Don't see it on top here after update. How do we save dashcam clips now to our usb?


DashCam icon is in Quick Controls in Settings.


----------



## Quicksilver

Kizzy said:


> DashCam icon is in Quick Controls in Settings.


Or you can move it from the ... to the customizable tray at bottom.


----------



## RickO2018

JeffC said:


> The survey I got had several questions: what do you like about the driving experience, what would you improve, etc. About a half dozen open response questions. Again they're very rare.
> 
> I may have gotten a survey about the car delivery experience also. I expect those may be for job evaluations of the workers.


I'll give my thoughts when Consumer Reports sends me one!


----------



## Kizzy

Quicksilver said:


> Or you can move it from the ... to the customizable tray at bottom.


I've heard this only works to launch the viewer. Would be thrilled if that's not the case.


----------



## Theos1

Kizzy said:


> I've heard this only works to launch the viewer. Would be thrilled if that's not the case.


Ending a phone call. Driving M3, 2018, seen lots of changes over the years, mostly good. I could live with it all, customizing to move the ones I like to the bottom tray is good and limits the clatter, HOWEVER, I don't know how to end a phone call that I initiated! Anyone? Anyway, as usual, Elon will modify as he hears what we all have to say.


----------



## tencate

Theos1 said:


> HOWEVER, I don't know how to end a phone call that I initiated! Anyone? Anyway, as usual, Elon will modify as he hears what we all have to say.


I have this problem too, the phone interface at the bottom of the left side screen gets covered by something (e.g., Homelink) and when you swipe Homelink (or whatever) down and away, the phone control box doesn't reappear sometimes. Very weird little bug.


----------



## Bigriver

Theos1 said:


> , I don't know how to end a phone call that I initiated! Anyone?


I asked this question several days ago and got no replies. There isn't even any on screen indication that a phone call is active. Have retested several times, hoping I had just overlooked something obvious. If so, I'm still missing it. Only method I know is to use your phone to disconnect.

Note: I just got the holiday update today on my vertical screen model X and the phone call implementation is fine. It is just goofed up in the 3/Y implementation.


----------



## JeffC

garsh said:


> Unfortunately, it's not as useful as you may think.
> 
> https://teslaownersonline.com/threa...ure-probably-doesnt-do-what-you-expect.18431/


Thanks for the reminder. I think your theory may be right, that the reports probably flooded Tesla with too much information and they scaled it back to saving diagnostics for service technicians to check later, if you brought the car in for it. And if so, I can kind of see their point of view on it.


----------



## Greg Smith

tencate said:


> Hmmm. I was just on the phone, called mum, and can't hang up the phone without reaching for my cell phone  and





Bigriver said:


> I asked this question several days ago and got no replies. There isn't even any on screen indication that a phone call is active. Have retested several times, hoping I had just overlooked something obvious. If so, I'm still missing it. Only method I know is to use your phone to disconnect.
> 
> Note: I just got the holiday update today on my vertical screen model X and the phone call implementation is fine. It is just goofed up in the 3/Y implementation.


On my 2018 M3 the phone function works fine. I initiate a call like usual (voice command) and phone controls show up where cards used to be (microphone , hang up and button for keypad). One difference may be that the phone is not one of my quick controls. Maybe if it was they would expect me to press that to get to the hang up.


----------



## JeffC

RickO2018 said:


> I'll give my thoughts when Consumer Reports sends me one!


Be careful about that.

We still drive one of the very few (non-Tesla) Toyota RAV4 EVs from the year 2001, i.e., first generation modern EV, ACTUALLY BUILT BY TOYOTA ITSELF.

We and other RAV4 EV drivers in the EV community provided honest feedback to Toyota about relatively VERY minor problems (the car still works perfectly for us today), and Toyota used that as a Japanese "face"-saving excuse to never make EVs for decades, when in fact the car was (and still is) nearly perfect.

I expect that Consumer Reports (and others like J.D. Power) MAY exaggerate minor problems with Teslas to convince the public that they're among the worst cars made, when in fact they're among the best ever made.

J.D. Power is definitely "pay to play" and since Tesla doesn't pay them, they get bad reviews. CR may have similar incentives or just sensationalism to drive consumer sales.


----------



## r-e-l

All those changes as if Elon stopped using his own car/product ...

Cant imagine Tesla released it without his approval so you must ask yourself "what in the world was he thinking ..." 

btw: Somone refer to those changes like changes in Windows on Mac ... 

yes, they did big changes and paid dearly for it but at least they have the courage to listen and adjust ... With Elon, I dont know is that will work.


----------



## bwilson4web

r-e-l said:


> All those changes as if Elon stopped using his own car/product ...


Or driving near sea level in Texas.

Bob Wilson


----------



## r1200gs4ok

BLK said:


> Did you get it yet? I have a 2021
> Model S, also still on 36.8.10 and I have not received the update still.


Guess what? I got it this afternoon....installed and found it was a big difference in driving experience....was a lot more smooth in right hand turns with bike lanes....I agree with others that it will take some trial an error to figure the new UI out....somethings are better and some are really frustrating...Example: with the old version, while driving with FSD and NOA , I could see the little compass in the right upper corner...I use it for orientation purposes....in the new version, while driving with FSD and NOA, the compass has disappeared,,,,to get it back, you have to touch the screen and the compass will now show up in the top left corner....but then it disappears again.....I would like to have the compass on all the time.....I like to see the road driving up the screen in the direction I am going.....but its default position is not good....


----------



## GDN

As with most things when I give it a day or two things aren't near as bad as I thought they would be. So after a couple of short drives and more poking around there are a few changes I'm very OK with.


Activating the Superchargers on the map (through the Navigation menu) actually gives me MORE information and might be an improvement. Previously I could only get the nearest 3 or 4 SC'er. Now I have a full list of all stations up to almost a 200 mile radius and it already includes the number of stations in use. All I have to do is hit Navigate and then Charging or if I've already got a route - just hit the add Waypoint/stop button, then Charging. This shows many more stations than the old way - this is a big win. Previously if I wasn't within 60 miles or so it wouldn't show me the SC'ers. I like to know when I leave the house that station 140 miles away is online and there are people charging. I'm taking this one as an improvement now.
LTE indicator. I still truly wish this would still show all the time, however my car has problems connecting to LTE on the first drive of the day. Today while I had no LTE signal the indicator was in it's spot showing me no LTE. Once the LTE connected the indicator went away. So if you have no signal you should get an indicator showing so. If you have a signal they hide it out of the way. I can live with this, but do prefer to see it at all times, it would help to know when it was a weak signal.
Phone call - I made two today - and both times I got a red "hang up" button after I initiated the call. It was very intuitive. You only get a green connect until the call is connected, then you'll get a red disconnect button. It won't be there before you need it.
Seat heaters - easily accessible by touching the < or > on either side of the temp and you have direct access. it is one more touch than previously, but easy. I do however still wish these were added to the menu of items that can be anchored. 
So all I can say is after spending just a bit of time I'm liking some of the changes. Not all, but some.

I will say again - I think Elon is driving to a GUI that a self driving car would have/need/use. If it isn't something critical or that you need to use right away it gets put behind a menu.


----------



## francoisp

JeffC said:


> Be careful about that.
> 
> I expect that Consumer Reports (and others like J.D. Power) MAY exaggerate minor problems with Teslas to convince the public that they're among the worst cars made, when in fact they're among the best ever made.


I have to disagree with that statement. I really like my Model Y but I must say that it had more issues in one year than I had with my Hyundai Genesis in 10 years. My Y has spent many hours in the shop to rectify body panel alignments, paint issues, computer ground issue, steering wheel alignment issue, bad cabin temperature sensor, unresolved creaking issue near windshield, bad rear middle seat sensor, stuck software update. Driving my model Y is a pure pleasure but Tesla needs to up its game if it wants to remain a leader in the field. The cars coming out of China are very impressive (and likely cheaper) and assuming an expanded and reliable CCS network they will challenge Tesla's lead.


----------



## GDN

Bigriver said:


> I asked this question several days ago and got no replies. There isn't even any on screen indication that a phone call is active. Have retested several times, hoping I had just overlooked something obvious. If so, I'm still missing it. Only method I know is to use your phone to disconnect.
> 
> Note: I just got the holiday update today on my vertical screen model X and the phone call implementation is fine. It is just goofed up in the 3/Y implementation.


My 3 - the phone call is fine. Once I make the call I get a display on the lower left with some options and a hang up button. No time for pictures while driving tonight - will try to get some in the next few days.


----------



## skygraff

Okay, got a chance to drive with it in the snow today and have some thoughts.

First, climate stuff: voice commands to turn on rear defroster and windshield defogger/froster are working as are the 1-3 bacon commands (doesn't understand any other seat heat terminology but bacon works flawlessly). Auto seat heat sort of works if you can put up with an overly toasty bum at the start and an unnecessarily loud HVAC fan since that also has to be in auto. Unfortunately, the described "mini" HVAC menu that's supposed to be visible by sliding up only shows if you tap one of the arrows which activates HVAC if it was off and changes the set temp (have to tap the opposite arrow after) and, instead, the full HVAC window will pop up no matter where you swipe up from the bottom of the screen.

That brings me to media: the shortcuts are okay but, unfortunately, tapping any one of the audio sources brings up the full screen for that source rather than just changing to that one (last station/channel) and tapping it again doesn't resize the window like the old one did. You can tap the three lines with the dot which look like a hamburger menu but resizing has a bit of a randomness to it. As in the past, I've settled on the medium position even though it covers more of the map than I'd like but the main reason is because I can actually change sources by tapping on the listed favorites/recents. In radio, the scroll wheel still works the same as it used to but there's no way to tell which station it will go to next because they're no longer in linear order. Yes, the song data scrolls (once) and the USB album art is visible! However, there's no way to get to the USB source in either the favorites/recents view or the sources view so you pretty much have to put USB in your shortcuts (or click on the source name to show the somewhat hidden dropdown menu). Oh, and, as mentioned in my earlier post, voice commands to pick radio/tune-in stations still don't work.

On the subject of those shortcuts, yes, the dashcam one only shows the recordings so you have to open the controls to tap that button to record (or honk the horn if you have it setup). Unfortunately, you can't open the recordings from the button in the controls so I made some mistakes my first time around which, fortunately, I could delete with one button push once I found that one (weirdly, you have to close the viewer and reopen it to remove the timestamps).

Phone call seems to work normally and, same for text messages, still just as frustrating (call/text xxx "mobile" still pops up a menu to choose from if the person has more than one phone number). Text messages were, at first, capitalizing the first sentence but that reverted later in the driving day.

Superchargers do appear on the map if you click the pin button and are at certain zoom levels.

Blind spot camera is annoying. Obviously, it would be better at the top and with some kind of shield for the repeater glare at night but, on top of that, it would be great if it only came on for lane changes rather than actual turns since, most times, there's no important traffic in that position while executing an intersection turn. The only thing it did for me (for the short time I used it) was to help me recognize a badly planned FSD lane change so I could override it a bit faster than when prompted by the signal.

Finally, yup, a bit disappointed by the inability to tap the speed limit (except in full screen) but, fortunately, half-holding the gear stalk works. Unfortunately, the speed limits are more erratic and unreliable than ever (could've been the snow) so I gave up on using AP or FSD simply because of how often I had to scroll in an override. So, on that subject, can somebody please explain to me why they keep displaying the "MAX" speed when manually driving? It just shows your most recent speed and doesn't do anything for the experience except, with that all-caps max jumping out at you, make you think it's important.

If you're like me, you haven't bothered reading this because it just looks too long (it is) but you might've skimmed it. Either way, my apologies. In way of amends, here's a non-complaint:

I really appreciate the mini-menu for light controls that pops up when you toggle the wiper/brights stalk! It still takes two steps and two hands but, now, I can more easily turn off the lights when I park or turn them on when the wipers start (couldn't test the auto lights with wipers today since it was overcast and snowy prompting lights to be on the whole time).


----------



## tencate

GDN said:


> My 3 - the phone call is fine. Once I make the call I get a display on the lower left with some options and a hang up button. No time for pictures while driving tonight - will try to get some in the next few days.


That is sometimes true for me too, it works fine. Mostly. All is usually well with the phone and I can hang up and everything. But every once in a while the phone display will vanish while on a long call for some reason and you won't be able to get it back to hang up. And horrors happen if you pull out your phone to hang up, the cabin monitor will see you.

I can't figure out how to reproduce the problem or what causes it but it's happened to me maybe 3 or 4 times since I've gotten the update. I'll keep trying to figure out why it vanishes and will let you know if I can reproduce the problem.


----------



## Bigriver

Greg Smith said:


> phone controls show up where cards used to be


This was a key piece of info I needed. I had only tested the phone use while near my house and only the homelink card is there. Here is what my screen looked like with an active phone call:










And then as I drove away, I got the phone call card to show up. I do like how it is formatted. Will be interested to see what @tencate learns with the card sometimes disappearing, if there are interferences in addition to being near homelink.

Now my question is what is the purpose of the homelink card? I still have a homelink icon in the top header and don't understand this duplicate. It's actually a triplicate, because homelink is also in the controls top row where they moved profile, Bluetooth and wifi.



GDN said:


> As with most things when I give it a day or two things aren't near as bad as I thought they would be.


I agree with this. I think it was you who said in another thread something about seeing these changes through the eyes of a new user…. Is it actually better now? I've been using that as one of the ground rules in my thinking about this update. Unfortunately I've also carried baggage from the awful updates they made a year ago where they needlessly changed things like font size and took a step back on usability. In V11 I'm still feeling like the removal of most things in the top row was an odd choice, especially when I just found today that they did not do that in the S/X vertical screen; everything is still there. That makes it feel like these are individual programmer choices at Tesla rather than team decisions based on a clear functional road map. I generally embrace change and can get behind needing to learn to do it in a slightly different way. Hopefully we will all later look back and see how these changes all worked towards a better UI, and/or we will be seeing some further tweaks to get to that Better place.


----------



## bwilson4web

The irony is if this User Interface (UI) had been in use before the previous one *AND* the order reversed, I suspect the angst shared would have been similar. We're humans who like to learn something new and then not have to relearn it, But Tesla personnel changes probably paid a part too.

_Doug Field used to work for Apple, but has been working at Tesla since 2013. Now he's returning to Apple to work on Project Titan, Apple's self-driving car, with Bob Mansfield. Field had been managing Tesla's engineering and production._​
Apple has been been a stickler for a consistent UI. Losing staff returning to Apple means the likely 'gatekeepers' are gone. I'm not surprised that the remaining staff moved toward a Tesla specific UI, a different cognitive style. Adding the ability to self-tailor the controls is a great step forward.

Hopefully the Tesla staff won't go nuts but strive for a more consistent, Tesla UI.

Bob Wilson


----------



## garsh

Ok, here's some praise for a good change in V11:

I like that the Homelink buttons for my two garage door openers now appear at the bottom left instead of covering up part of the rear camera view when I'm backing out of my garage. 

I'm a little peeved that my "Right Garage Door" is on the left and my "Left Garage Door" is on the right. :grin:


----------



## FRC

garsh said:


> I'm a little peeved that my "Right Garage Door" is on the left and my "Left Garage Door" is on the right


Back in, that'll fix it. But seriously, probably not worth deleting and reprogramming in the opposite order to get the display to look right?


----------



## garsh

FRC said:


> But seriously, probably not worth deleting and reprogramming in the opposite order to get the display to look right?


I'm OC enough that I'm going to end up doing exactly that.


----------



## GDN

garsh said:


> Ok, here's some praise for a good change in V11:
> 
> I like that the Homelink buttons for my two garage door openers now appear at the bottom left instead of covering up part of the rear camera view when I'm backing out of my garage.
> 
> I'm a little peeved that my "Right Garage Door" is on the left and my "Left Garage Door" is on the right. :grin:


This is where we need more than one emoji to respond - it needs a "Funny" emoji too. I like that @FRC has a "solution", but do truly wonder - how do they decided which goes where? If you reprogram will it just do the first one on the left or how are they named - is it doing something alphabetical? Or maybe some programmer wanting to have a little fun with you.

I also am starting to like a few things - the Homelink popup is one of them, but as @Bigriver notes, why did they leave this icon at the top without the others. Makes it seem very random.


----------



## iChris93

GDN said:


> how do they decided which goes where? If you reprogram will it just do the first one on the left or how are they named - is it doing something alphabetical?


Let us know @garsh


----------



## tencate

GDN said:


> I also am starting to like a few things


I, for one, have been quiet about the V11 update because in general I've found the update pretty good... even my wife has gotten used to the extra step to turn on her seat heater . The HVAC controls are all in one place now and an easy within-arm's-reach press for me, no more looking over to touch either the fan or temp (which I never really liked and thought a bit weird). And having all the sub menus in one place instead of a bunch of icons all around the outside of the top level display makes sense too. It's pretty easy to find the lower left corner of the screen (to bring up controls submenu) _without_ looking too. Yes, some stuff does seem harder and there are things I'd change if I were in charge but it seems overall, well, logical at least to me. I would be curious to see how the new UI works on a Model S and I do wonder how the UI team works out how to display everything on S and X versus 3/Y. Would love to be a fly on the wall during those discussions. 

There's a brand new Model 3 owner in Los Alamos, I'll be curious to see if she complains, having JUST learned how to do things on the car with the old software interface. I'm her "answers to questions" guy, we'll see what she thinks.


----------



## mrau

I like the new Homelink display in the bottom left. Often I back out of the garage without my seatbelt on (old habit) and this causes the seat belt warning to pop up over the Homelink display. Unable to use Homelink until I buckle up and the warning goes away.

I wish the pop-up windows in lower left would stack up on each other (instead of overlay) so you could see more than one at once. This would solve several issues with phone, Homelink and other info that gets obscured in the lower left window.


----------



## msjulie

GDN said:


> I will say again - I think Elon is driving to a GUI that a self driving car would have/need/use. If it isn't something critical or that you need to use right away it gets put behind a menu.


I guess my problem is I'm tired of huge wholesale UI changes that continue to take away ease and control for the driver. My bad not understanding that 'continual improvements' would really mean some small improvements saddled with a bunch of stuff I can supposedly learn to live with but why do I have to?

Makes me wish for the days of physical controls since, as someone mentioned, the way my car works couldn't suddenly be rewired at someone else's whim or notion of what is critical or important.

For me it legitimately makes the car less pleasurable to drive.


----------



## Mr. Spacely

I agree that the screen is designed more and more for 100% FSD Beta use-- like an airplane where you can fly by instrument controls and not even look out the window. But during this transition period you get a "pay attention" warning while you are trying to find a control. I think long term Elon will be right (he always is eventually). Let's give it a few weeks and see if we get used to the new locations and icons, or wish we had the old one back...


----------



## jmmdownhil

tencate said:


> Hmmm. I was just on the phone, called mum, and can't hang up the phone without reaching for my cell phone  and pressing the red "hang up" button. What am I missing? She hangs up and my phone stays connected. Very odd. Bug?


Anyone find a solution for phone hang up?


----------



## JeffC

francoisp said:


> I have to disagree with that statement. I really like my Model Y but I must say that it had more issues in one year than I had with my Hyundai Genesis in 10 years. My Y has spent many hours in the shop to rectify body panel alignments, paint issues, computer ground issue, steering wheel alignment issue, bad cabin temperature sensor, unresolved creaking issue near windshield, bad rear middle seat sensor, stuck software update. Driving my model Y is a pure pleasure but Tesla needs to up its game if it wants to remain a leader in the field. The cars coming out of China are very impressive (and likely cheaper) and assuming an expanded and reliable CCS network they will challenge Tesla's lead.


I'm sorry to hear about the problems with your Model Y. I have read about other problems with Ys, but must say that my Model 3 is mechanically and electrically perfect as far as I can tell, and I'm a highly detail-oriented and overly-analytical engineer. My panel gaps weren't perfect and my paint has a couple extremely minor flaws that 99% of people would never notice, but my September 2018 build was otherwise nearly perfect. So that's what I base my opinions on. Naturally, as someone who supports Tesla's mission, I'm disappointed if quality has taken a step or two backwards with some Model Ys.

I've also heard reports that the China cars are nearly perfect, and I expect Berlin may be similar, so this unfortunately points fingers at the Fremont workforce or practices there. While it is very hard to execute at scale consistently, if China and probably Germany can do it, then Fremont (and Texas) should be able to do it too.

Again, I'm disappointed to hear about problems. I'm glad you're getting them corrected. Tesla needs to be aware they're happening and be responsible for correcting them. And of course they should use this information to correct the practices that are causing them to happen in the first place. I'm pretty sure they're paying attention and will do so, if they haven't already.

I hope you will keep us all updated on how things go, somehow. (Probably does not belong on this thread, but elsewhere on the forum.)

P.S. Hyundai is actually a highly competent manufacturer when it wants to be, and is a giant conglomerate sort of like Toyota. So it's not surprising that their quality is now pretty good. Tesla is a very young startup in comparison. It's done pretty well, but can/should/will improve. Its engineering and development practices are incredibly good, like SpaceX's, and are borrowed from Silicon Valley.


----------



## Needsdecaf

bwilson4web said:


> Or driving near sea level in Texas.
> 
> Bob Wilson


I drive near sea level in TX...closer than Elon does, and I think many of these changes suck. So definitely not his lat / long / elevation.


----------



## Needsdecaf

jmmdownhil said:


> Anyone find a solution for phone hang up?


I have not had a problem whatsoever. Did you try rebooting?


----------



## Greg Smith

jmmdownhil said:


> Anyone find a solution for phone hang up?


Do you have some other message in the lower left corner where the active phone interface should be located? Someone else had an issue with homelink being there when they were at home.


----------



## bwilson4web

jmmdownhil said:


> Anyone find a solution for phone hang up?


It often happen when driving through hills South of the Tennessee river. So I let the other party know dropouts are possible and try to not drive out of cell phone coverage area.

Bob Wilson


----------



## Mike

My second “long drive” (257 km) with this update was today, back home from the inlaws in eastern Ottawa. 

Trip odometer rant:

Not being able to have my trip odometer up to monitor my trip energy performance via a half second look out of the corner of my eye (or my no longer functioning hack using the whole route view) really, really brings home the need for the arrival point battery % SOC icon to be permanently pinned next to the ETA (like it was in V8).

In fact, the ridiculous way that the odometers are set up also tricks me into relabelling the name of my odometer instead of zeroing it out…because the reset buttons DON’T SHOW when the page is displayed because they are hidden AT THE BOTTOM and require one to scroll the page…ugh.

So today, we are driving home on NOA, west of Ottawa, westbound on the 417…there are no cars around, it’s an empty freeway…and the NOA nag complains a few times because I’m not applying enough torque to the steering wheel…you know, the Tesla software implying I’m not paying attention to the road ahead…so I then take my eyes off the road to push the little car icon in the lower left corner to bring up the menus and then, as I’m grasping my steering wheel to maintain situational awareness, I look for and find my trip odometer page and bring that up…and then my eyes have to hunt for the one piece of data I’m looking for, the Wh/km the current leg is returning…

My eyes have been focused on the UI for the past 10 seconds, but since my left hand on the steering wheel is keeping me steady as my right hand is used to peck away at the UI, the system senses torque on that wheel…so no NOA nag.

Give me a way to view my trip odometer at all times, just like the most basic, cheap (what we called back in the 1970s “wooden powered Peoples machines”) forms of non self powered individual surface transportation devices. 

End rant on odometers.


----------



## FRC

The removal of the trip cards are likely to have a significant impact on my winter road trips. I know that my car requires an efficiency of 222 Wh/m in order to achieve the displayed range (determined after 1000's of miles of observation). So...With this handy bit of info in mind, I can do some quick math and know, definitively, what Wh/m I need to achieve in order to drive a defined # of miles on those tight legs in colder temps. So, if I need to stretch things a bit, I can slow down enough to keep my efficiency in a range that allows me to KNOW I'll make it. This is going to be much more difficult without a card constantly displaying my Wh/m since last charge. I'm sure I'll develop a work-around, but it's going to be more difficult.


----------



## lance.bailey

Greg Smith said:


> Do you have some other message in the lower left corner where the active phone interface should be located? Someone else had an issue with homelink being there when they were at home.


it seems that a lot of things are newly in that lower left corner of the screen

- homelink
- blindspot
- drivers side climate controls
- headlight controls
- phone controls during a call

some sort of priority layering is needed. or stacking or something. currently things are being hidden with other things over top of them.


----------



## FRC

lance.bailey said:


> it seems that a lot of things are newly in that lower left corner of the screen
> 
> - homelink
> - blindspot
> - drivers side climate controls
> - headlight controls
> - phone controls during a call
> 
> some sort of priority layering is needed. or stacking or something. currently things are being hidden with other things over top of them.


Agreed. As an alternative, why not use the lower map space. That space is well behind where the car is headed and would cause no issues if it wasn't visible for a limited time.


----------



## GDN

FRC said:


> my car requires an efficiency of 222 Wh/m .......


222 wh/mi - in a Performance????? I didn't know that was possible in a RWD driving down hill with a 50 MPH tail wind.


----------



## FRC

GDN said:


> 222 wh/mi - in a Performance????? I didn't know that was possible in a RWD driving down hill with a 50 MPH tail wind.


Generally, this is NOT achievable. My lifetime is 261. Perhaps a quick example will help. Let's say the displayed range is 200 miles and my next charging solution is 100 miles away. I then know that if I can keep my Wh/m under 444 (200/100x222), I'll make it to my destination. I can then manipulate my usage in many ways to achieve my goal. It works, absolutely. And it removes all doubt and any range anxiety on those close call legs.

And believe me...In the Rockies at -25F there can be MANY close call legs!


----------



## SalisburySam

FRC said:


> Agreed. As an alternative, why not use the lower map space. That space is well behind where the car is headed and would cause no issues if it wasn't visible for a limited time.


Instead of taking more map space, how about using some of the car display space? That has grown to consume all of the left panel except the lower portion.


----------



## FRC

SalisburySam said:


> Instead of taking more map space, how about using some of the car display space? That has grown to consume all of the left panel except the lower portion.


I've always thought it silly that the car is centered on the map. The instances when I care what is behind me are very few and far between. So, IMHO the space behind me on the navigation map could be much better used (as could all the white space on the left 3rd of the screen).


----------



## Mike

FRC said:


> Generally, this is NOT achievable. My lifetime is 261. Perhaps a quick example will help. Let's say the displayed range is 200 miles and my next charging solution is 100 miles away. I then know that if I can keep my Wh/m under 444 (200/100x222), I'll make it to my destination. I can then manipulate my usage in many ways to achieve my goal. It works, absolutely. And it removes all doubt and any range anxiety on those close call legs.
> 
> And believe me...In the Rockies at -25F there can be MANY close call legs!


If only we could get the estimated % SOC at destination pegged next to the ETA…


----------



## FRC

Mike said:


> If only we could get the estimated % SOC at destination pegged next to the ETA…


Dream on...


----------



## jmmdownhil

Greg Smith said:


> Do you have some other message in the lower left corner where the active phone interface should be located? Someone else had an issue with homelink being there when they were at home.


Maybe that's the problem. I was in my driveway, and the homelike options where in lower left. I will try a call when away from home.


----------



## rrollens

Is there a page on TOO for sharing custom light show files? I see some folks on You Tube posting their work and offering to share what they have done.


----------



## FRC

rrollens said:


> Is there a page on TOO for sharing custom light show files? I see some folks on You Tube posting their work and offering to share what they have done.


Don't think so, but a great idea for someone's new thread.


----------



## GDN

rrollens said:


> Is there a page on TOO for sharing custom light show files? I see some folks on You Tube posting their work and offering to share what they have done.


Great idea - try this: https://teslaownersonline.com/threa...-here-no-commenting-allowed.19960/post-328432


----------



## JWardell

Perscitus said:


> @JWardell did the initial v11 releases change around CAN message addressing some more? Render ScanMyTesla and homebrew logger, HUD and dash display definitions obsolete again?
> 
> Seeing some conflicting reports about aftermarket auto-frunk/trunk and self-presenting doors actuating during default and script-edited Christmas light show demos.


Not that I know of or heard of. I'm sure something changed somewhere


----------



## jmart38

In right hand drive model 3s you can't see the blindspot cam past your hand as the indicator stalk is on the screen side of the wheel... it would be nice if the blind spot cam appeared at the top rather than the bottom.


----------



## AaronE

2015 model s owner here with the Info2 upgrade. updated to 2021.44.25.2 and there are some pretty glaring issues.

1 - there is no way to change supercharging limit -- the entire new charging screen is now largely empty

2 - streaming music no longer has song duration, position, or the slider

3 - so far the reverse camera failed to show up once

anyone else seen these?


----------



## lance.bailey

FRC said:


> Agreed. As an alternative, why not use the lower map space. That space is well behind where the car is headed and would cause no issues if it wasn't visible for a limited time.


i have my map pointing north, so sometimes where I have been is to the left, the right, or above my car pointer. Only when I am heading north is the "been there done that" below my car pointer.


----------



## lance.bailey

AaronE said:


> 2015 model s owner here with the Info2 upgrade. updated to 2021.44.25.2 and there are some pretty glaring issues.
> 
> 1 - there is no way to change supercharging limit -- the entire new charging screen is now largely empty
> 
> 2 - streaming music no longer has song duration, position, or the slider
> 
> 3 - so far the reverse camera failed to show up once
> 
> anyone else seen these?


2018 model 3 with v11 and yes the time of the streaming song is gone, but the slider (not that you can do anything with it) indicating the amount of time left is still there. it is a VERY slim line going across the entire music panel just under the artist/album name. all songs have this same length of slider, shorter songs travers the slider faster than longer songs.

on the up side, the title of the song scrolls to show the entire title a few seconds after the song starts. and if you tap the title you can get it to scroll again.


----------



## Mike

lance.bailey said:


> i have my map pointing north, so sometimes where I have been is to the left, the right, or above my car pointer. Only when I am heading north is the "been there done that" below my car pointer.


Acknowledging everyone has a personal preference: having a map with your current heading (direction of travel) at the top makes situational awareness easier.

Signed,

Old fart retired navigator


----------



## Park2670

How do we petition that we want the efficiency card back? I used that every day.


----------



## Mike

Park2670 said:


> How do we petition that we want the efficiency card back? I used that every day.


Someone with a Twitter account communicates with Elon.


----------



## bwilson4web

I have an inverse desire to read a long post in this thread. Brevity bespeaks brilliance.

BTW, NOA does not suffer the aborts that with FSD occurs on ‘new’ roads.

Bob Wilson


----------



## garsh

lance.bailey said:


> i have my map pointing north, so sometimes where I have been is to the left, the right, or above my car pointer. Only when I am heading north is the "been there done that" below my car pointer.


----------



## TrevP

BREAKING:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1476656306610216960


----------



## FRC

TrevP said:


> BREAKING:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1476656306610216960


Possibly the most non-committed statement ever by Elon. Of course UI improvements are coming; as are FSD, the CT, the Roadster, and improved customer service. As usual, Elon, your words mean very little.


----------



## GDN

FRC said:


> Possibly the most non-committed statement ever by Elon. Of course UI improvements are coming; as are FSD, the CT, the Roadster, and improved customer service. As usual, Elon, your words mean very little.


He did not say "Who" considered them improvements. The "Changes" that may come, may still not be "Improvements" to us.


----------



## cook_diesel

Does anyone know if there's a way to still view the Watt hours per mile similar to the previous updates? I found this info. super helpful when it was located below the car illustration.


----------



## iChris93

cook_diesel said:


> Does anyone know if there's a way to still view the Watt hours per mile similar to the previous updates? I found this info. super helpful when it was located below the car illustration.
> 
> View attachment 40871


Under the trips menu.


----------



## Mike

FRC said:


> Possibly the most non-committed statement ever by Elon. Of course UI improvements are coming; as are FSD, the CT, the Roadster, and improved customer service. As usual, Elon, your words mean very little.


Or, to give him the benefit of the doubt, the music source issue that was highlighted will be solved…but things like the odometer card won't.


----------



## lance.bailey

garsh said:


>


yeah yeah yeah, forgive this old fart navigator for actually knowing how to read a map with the compass rose pointing up for north 

although in Roman and into medieval times there are extant examples of maps with the top of the map as East, or South, or North or even West. Old school cartography is interesting.


----------



## lance.bailey

Mike said:


> Acknowledging everyone has a personal preference: having a map with your current heading (direction of travel) at the top makes situational awareness easier.
> 
> Signed,
> 
> Old fart retired navigator


you and I really need to socially distance a cold beverage when I can travel the Toronto Kingston corridor again...


----------



## WonkoTheSane

Did they recently explode FSD to people? I DEFINITELY do not have a 100 but my car says it is d/Ling 44.25.6


----------



## jmmdownhil

jmmdownhil said:


> Maybe that's the problem. I was in my driveway, and the homelike options where in lower left. I will try a call when away from home.


Dilemma solved. When near the garage the Homelink buttons appear in the bottom left corner of the screen, covering up the call/hangup buttons. When the car is away from the garage the Homelink buttons dissappear allowing the call/hangup buttons to be seen. And of course there us no way to turn off the Homelink buttons.
So making a call in the car while in the driveway requires hangup from the phone.


----------



## SalisburySam

FRC said:


> I've always thought it silly that the car is centered on the map. The instances when I care what is behind me are very few and far between. So, IMHO the space behind me on the navigation map could be much better used (as could all the white space on the left 3rd of the screen).


For my 3 on v44.25.2 the car is not map centered but actually about 25% up from the bottom and centered left-to-right. That's with the map showing travel direction up. Shows lots of map above (ahead) of me and just a little below (behind) me.


----------



## Needsdecaf

lance.bailey said:


> it seems that a lot of things are newly in that lower left corner of the screen
> 
> - homelink
> - blindspot
> - drivers side climate controls
> - headlight controls
> - phone controls during a call
> 
> some sort of priority layering is needed. or stacking or something. currently things are being hidden with other things over top of them.


Yeah. It's TERRIBLE. And, just too small.


----------



## tencate

jmmdownhil said:


> So making a call in the car while in the driveway requires hangup from the phone.


You can just swipe the homelink window pane down off the screen and uncover the phone menu like magic... by the way, when navigating and you touch the quick menu? Yup, the navigate pane moves down to the lower left and covers up the phone pane (and sometimes the phone pane doesn't come back!). Wipers too. Wonder what the hierarchy is? Homelink seems to be pretty high up in importance


----------



## Needsdecaf

TrevP said:


> BREAKING:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1476656306610216960


He said the same thing this time last year, if I recall. So it took a year for these "improvements".


----------



## Perscitus

2021.44.30 slowly creeping out.


----------



## iChris93

Perscitus said:


> 2021.44.30 slowly creeping out.


Rumor has it this adds track mode to the plaid.


----------



## Mike

Perscitus said:


> 2021.44.30 slowly creeping out.


Wonder what else will become busted /s


----------



## jmmdownhil

tencate said:


> You can just swipe the homelink window pane down off the screen and uncover the phone menu like magic... by the way, when navigating and you touch the quick menu? Yup, the navigate pane moves down to the lower left and covers up the phone pane (and sometimes the phone pane doesn't come back!). Wipers too. Wonder what the hierarchy is? Homelink seems to be pretty high up in importance


So how many buttons do I have to push/swipe to get something that should be more intuitive?


----------



## lance.bailey

tencate said:


> You can just swipe the homelink window pane down off the screen and uncover the phone menu like magic... by the way, when navigating and you touch the quick menu? Yup, the navigate pane moves down to the lower left and covers up the phone pane (and sometimes the phone pane doesn't come back!). Wipers too. Wonder what the hierarchy is? Homelink seems to be pretty high up in importance


I did that the other day. then I ended the call and wanted Homelink back. that was harder and beyond me ....


----------



## RonAz

FRC said:


> The removal of the trip cards are likely to have a significant impact on my winter road trips. I know that my car requires an efficiency of 222 Wh/m in order to achieve the displayed range (determined after 1000's of miles of observation). So...With this handy bit of info in mind, I can do some quick math and know, definitively, what Wh/m I need to achieve in order to drive a defined # of miles on those tight legs in colder temps. So, if I need to stretch things a bit, I can slow down enough to keep my efficiency in a range that allows me to KNOW I'll make it. This is going to be much more difficult without a card constantly displaying my Wh/m since last charge. I'm sure I'll develop a work-around, but it's going to be more difficult.


My long term milage is 222. AWD long range. I believe the Arizona climate helps


----------



## iChris93

RonAz said:


> My long term milage is 222. AWD long range. I believe the Arizona climate helps


What's the altitude where you are? I think that helps in ABQ too.


----------



## SimonMatthews

Did I just notice a really bad change, or misunderstand?

I went to look at the changes to the UI and noticed that, in the charging tab, the current limit was set to 48A in this location. Since I charge off a dryer outlet via the UMXC, with a 30A breaker, this is not good. Perhaps there is something else that limits the current?


----------



## GDN

lance.bailey said:


> I did that the other day. then I ended the call and wanted Homelink back. that was harder and beyond me ....


This is one of the simple ones they've left. If the homelink option in the lower left disappears the Green Homelink button is one of the few left at the top, one quick tap.


----------



## GDN

SimonMatthews said:


> Did I just notice a really bad change, or misunderstand?
> 
> I went to look at the changes to the UI and noticed that, in the charging tab, the current limit was set to 48A in this location. Since I charge off a dryer outlet via the UMXC, with a 30A breaker, this is not good. Perhaps there is something else that limits the current?


The car always knows and will dial down to only what it can get.


----------



## SimonMatthews

GDN said:


> The car always knows and will dial down to only what it can get.


It didn't when I got my car in 2018. It wanted to pull 30A and I had to dial it back to 24.


----------



## iChris93

SimonMatthews said:


> It didn't when I got my car in 2018. It wanted to pull 30A and I had to dial it back to 24.


Do you have the correct connector for your UMC for the circuit? The UMC will limit the current based on the connector.


----------



## SimonMatthews

iChris93 said:


> Do you have the correct connector for your UMC for the circuit? The UMC will limit the current based on the connector.


Yes, I think so. I have a very heavy extension cord in between the UMC and the wall socket. I will have to check.


----------



## SimonMatthews

iChris93 said:


> Do you have the correct connector for your UMC for the circuit? The UMC will limit the current based on the connector.


I don't really recall what I have, but a quick glance shows that I have some kind of adapter between the wall socket and my extension cord, so probably not really the correct connector for the UMC. I don't think that a UMC plug-in was available that matched the dryer socket was available when we first got the car.


----------



## iChris93

SimonMatthews said:


> I don't really recall what I have, but a quick glance shows that I have some kind of adapter between the wall socket and my extension cord, so probably not really the correct connector for the UMC. I don't think that a UMC plug-in was available that matched the dryer socket was available when we first got the car.


Gotcha, so you have to manually crank the current down. Looks like with the update it may have forgotten that setting.


----------



## JustTheTip

TrevP said:


> BREAKING:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1476656306610216960


Well. He thought v11 itself was, and I quote, "🔥 🔥 🔥 ". Who knew he forgot to mention the dumpster wherein said fire would be burning.


----------



## r1200gs4ok

with new new update I have lost the ability to get text message alerts or to respond....anyone know how to get this function back....iPhone 13 pro max


----------



## slotti

I am still stuck at 36.8.5. Shouldn't all cars be on the holiday update by now? April 2018 M3 LR RWD.


----------



## jmart38

slotti said:


> I am still stuck at 36.8.5. Shouldn't all cars be on the holiday update by now? April 2018 M3 LR RWD.


Supposedly if you submit a service request it should push the current build pretty soon after, I have no idea how true that is though.


----------



## WonkoTheSane

While FSD testing yesterday the headlight panel popped up and disappeared many times, but I don't know how I did it.


----------



## iChris93

WonkoTheSane said:


> While FSD testing yesterday the headlight panel popped up and disappeared many times, but I don't know how I did it.


FSD forces auto high beam so every time you engage/disengage FSD it will put up the panel showing auto high beam engagement/disengagement.


----------



## skygraff

r1200gs4ok said:


> with new new update I have lost the ability to get text message alerts or to respond....anyone know how to get this function back....iPhone 13 pro max


Not having that problem here but, before going on first drive, I double checked my Bluetooth settings. I'd suggest checking that and, possibly toggling them off/back on even if it says your phone is set up. Worst case, you might try removing your phone and redoing the pairing process.

For what it's worth, the messages are now smaller and don't seem to stay up as long. Plus, unchanged, they still don't work properly for group threads (only the person who last texted will get your response) and voice commands still can't decipher the specific number you want to use when somebody has multiples attached to their contact info ("text xxx's mobile" still pops up a list you have to read and select - not hands free).


----------



## Needsdecaf

r1200gs4ok said:


> with new new update I have lost the ability to get text message alerts or to respond....anyone know how to get this function back....iPhone 13 pro max


Re-enable messages in settings.


----------



## ATechGuy

tencate said:


> You can just swipe the homelink window pane down off the screen and uncover the phone menu like magic... by the way, when navigating and you touch the quick menu? Yup, the navigate pane moves down to the lower left and covers up the phone pane (and sometimes the phone pane doesn't come back!). Wipers too. Wonder what the hierarchy is? Homelink seems to be pretty high up in importance


Now if we can only swap the two homelink buttons. The left one is from the "top" one (in the green display) and the right one is the next one in your list, applicable to the location. My problem is that my "top" entry is 'Right Bay' and my bottom is 'Left Bay'. The end result is my 'Right' door is now located on the left… of course if I completely reprogram then I can work around this and if the car were new I would have read how they get displayed.


----------



## garsh

garsh said:


> I'm a little peeved that my "Right Garage Door" is on the left and my "Left Garage Door" is on the right. :grin:





ATechGuy said:


> Now if we can only swap the two homelink buttons. The left one is from the "top" one (in the green display) and the right one is the next one in your list, applicable to the location. My problem is that my "top" entry is 'Right Bay' and my bottom is 'Left Bay'. The end result is my 'Right' door is now located on the left… of course if I completely reprogram then I can work around this and if the car were new I would have read how they get displayed.





FRC said:


> But seriously, probably not worth deleting and reprogramming in the opposite order to get the display to look right?





garsh said:


> I'm OC enough that I'm going to end up doing exactly that.


I wasted a half hour reprogramming my homelink buttons.

1. I see that "Home Right" is the first one in the list. So I decide to delete that one and reprogram it, assuming it will go to the end of the list and therefore show up on the right side. Well, nope. It's still showing up on the left side.

2. So then I decide to delete and reprogram "Home Left". Guess what? It still shows up on the right.

I have no idea how Tesla is deciding to order the homelink entries. Are they enforcing "reverse alphabetical order"??? I know this is a pretty minor thing, but boy this is frustrating.

I think I'll try simply renaming one of them to "AAA" or "ZZZ" and see if that changes the order at all.


----------



## iChris93

garsh said:


> I wasted a half hour reprogramming my homelink buttons.
> 
> 1. I see that "Home Right" is the first one in the list. So I decide to delete that one and reprogram it, assuming it will go to the end of the list and therefore show up on the right side. Well, nope. It's still showing up on the left side.
> 
> 2. So then I decide to delete and reprogram "Home Left". Guess what? It still shows up on the right.
> 
> I have no idea how Tesla is deciding to order the homelink entries. Are they enforcing "reverse alphabetical order"??? I know this is a pretty minor thing, but boy this is frustrating.
> 
> I think I'll try simply renaming one of them to "AAA" or "ZZZ" and see if that changes the order at all.


Thank you for being the guinea pig


----------



## ATechGuy

Please do let us know once you figure out the sort order. Two good football games just started and that’s far more important than opening the wrong garage door. 😆


----------



## garsh

ATechGuy said:


> Please do let us know once you figure out the sort order. Two good football games just started and that's far more important than opening the wrong garage door. 😆


AHA! I figured out what's going on.

In a traditional Homelink system, you have three physical buttons.
Even though a Tesla doesn't have physical buttons, the Homelink module is organized in this same "three buttons" way.
When you program an opener, you're picking which "button" is being programmed - the first, second, or third.










So what happened is that I already had all three buttons programmed.

Home Right
Home Left
My mom's house 
Button 1 is always displayed to the left of the other two. This is why "Home Right" was on the left, and "Home Left" was on the right.

To fix this is, I did the following:

Rename button #1 from "Home Right" to something else (so that names don't conflict), like "AAA".
Delete button #2, "Home Left". Then add a new entry for "Home Right". This reprograms button #2 to be "Home Right" instead of "Home Left".
Delete button #1, "AAA". Then add a new entry for "Home Left". This reprograms my button #1 to be "Home Left".
And now all is perfect in the world.


----------



## ATechGuy

Wow! Fantastic write-up. And it’s half-time so I can reprogram my buttons without missing the second half.


----------



## SalisburySam

Wow! Glad that's behind us!


----------



## ATechGuy

Now we just need to figure out how to put the seat heaters back onto the task bar.


----------



## msjulie

ATechGuy said:


> Now we just need to figure out how to put the seat heaters back onto the task bar.


 and the LTE signal in the top row and the swipe card for those that prefer it and defrost etc


----------



## iChris93

msjulie said:


> LTE signal in the top row


I miss this the most when I'm on a call and not sure if my call is breaking up because of signal. Both my phone and car are AT&T, so the car would usually show what my phone did as long as my phone wasn't on 5G.


----------



## lance.bailey

msjulie said:


> and the LTE signal in the top row and the swipe card for those that prefer it and defrost etc


today listening to a streaming station via TuneIn the music crapped out. my reflex was to check the LTE strength to see if I was in a weak spot or if LTE was otherwise weak.

but of course that isn't possible anymore. That row of status icons was a good thing (tm)


----------



## lance.bailey

one thing on which I have not see comments is the replacement of a single music button with a button for each type of music. why? 

each source of music (Tidal, Spotify, FM, TuneIn, Streaming ...) has (at least in full screen display) a pull selector just under the album art allowing you to switch between all the sources. This selector removes any need for an individual app/icon cluttering up the selection of apps/icons

all we need is a single "music" app/icon


----------



## iChris93

lance.bailey said:


> one thing on which I have not see comments is the replacement of a single music button with a button for each type of music. why?
> 
> each source of music (Tidal, Spotify, FM, TuneIn, Streaming ...) has (at least in full screen display) a pull selector just under the album art allowing you to switch between all the sources. This selector removes any need for an individual app/icon cluttering up the selection of apps/icons
> 
> all we need is a single "music" app/icon


I'm on board with this. I use both Spotify and Tune-in, but I'd rather select them from inside the "music" app. I don't need two icons on my bar.


----------



## ATechGuy

It seems we may need a winter and a summer diving mode. Key heating features without physical buttons seems to force the requirement for a soft button as before. Sure, it’s not needed in So. Cal, but we all don’t live there…

I certainly hope Tesla is getting an earful on all the feedback. Anyone figure out how to sync the front temps? Seems a waste of real estate to have two temps when it’s synced ( and likewise silly to have the vent pump warm air to an empty passenger seat).


----------



## Bigriver

lance.bailey said:


> but of course that isn't possible anymore. That row of status icons was a good thing (tm)


So much has been said about change in controls, but loss of indications and passive info is equally troublesome.



lance.bailey said:


> replacement of a single music button with a button for each type of music. why?


I'm guessing they are trying to give people more immediate access to the one they use most. Im betting that a very high percentage of people use the same music source most of the time. I know I do. And then for the few times I'm using something else, there is that pull down menu you mentioned.

I am wishing I could delete the options I never use. If it needs a subscription that I don't have, let me delete it. That was previously an option.



ATechGuy said:


> Anyone figure out how to sync the front temps?


Hit the < or > next to the temp, and the little submenu pops up that has sync/split option on it.


----------



## bwilson4web

This is as close as I could achieve:









minimum fan speed
lowest temperature tolerable

upper vent for defrost control
seat heater control
I agree the seat heaters should be independent so the fan is not needed.

Bob Wilson


----------



## Kizzy

lance.bailey said:


> one thing on which I have not see comments is the replacement of a single music button with a button for each type of music. why?
> 
> each source of music (Tidal, Spotify, FM, TuneIn, Streaming ...) has (at least in full screen display) a pull selector just under the album art allowing you to switch between all the sources. This selector removes any need for an individual app/icon cluttering up the selection of apps/icons
> 
> all we need is a single "music" app/icon


I only have Bluetooth listed in my dock/tray for music. I had a friend in my car and needed to leave with my phone which was playing music, so I switched to streaming music. At some point, the music player disappeared, so I pressed my set music button (Bluetooth) and the music stopped. 😐

I've been giving some more thought to this change. I've calmed down on having things change, but I'm still perturbed about missing features.

One feature I'm okay with losing is the cards. Hold on, hear me out. This interface element is problematic and became even more so with the 2020.25+ update at the end of 2020. It's hard to use intuitively (the swipe gesture takes a lot of practice to get right) and (in later v10 releases especially) it keeps disappearing when other cards/notifications are brought up.

That said, cards played a useful function (and some of them live on as responses to physical buttons), but the information you could display on them with a quick glance and possibly a swipe made it easy to keep tabs on the cars vitals without a lot of menu diving.

Maybe they want to discourage constantly looking at things (I doubt it since they were cool with letting passengers play video games on the main screen while driving was in progress) but it also pushes people to spend more time looking at the screen rooting through menus.

I would love to see the addition of some kind of customizable dashboard that can hold a few widgets or figures that can be docked somewhere-the car information screen (not everyone wants all those vitals, and it's cool to temporarily cover them with the blind spot video) or as a sociable element above/below the music player. Because it's customizable, it is optional and does not clutter up the UI. I really want to bring that little widget support from S/X to 3/Y.

Also, on Mac computers, you have the option to show or hide those little status icons at the top.

Tesla, let us customize. 🙂


----------



## lance.bailey

Bigriver said:


> So much has been said about change in controls, but loss of indications and passive info is equally troublesome.


exactly. a quick eye glance is a lot more convenient and down right safer than fumbling through menus.



Bigriver said:


> I'm guessing they are trying to give people more immediate access to the one they use most. Im betting that a very high percentage of people use the same music source most of the time. I know I do. And then for the few times I'm using something else, there is that pull down menu you mentioned.


fair point, and there is an easy solution - when the "music" icon/app is pressed, return to the previously selected source. So if you were listening to spotify it returns to spotify. Truth be told, this is not my idea - it is the old pre-v11 behaviour of the music app.


----------



## Mike

ATechGuy said:


> Now we just need to figure out how to put the seat heaters back onto the task bar.


Don't forget the trip odometers


----------



## ATechGuy

bwilson4web said:


> This is as close as I could achieve:
> View attachment 40892
> 
> 
> minimum fan speed
> lowest temperature tolerable
> 
> upper vent for defrost control
> seat heater control
> I agree the seat heaters should be independent so the fan is not needed.
> 
> Bob Wilson


Wait! You mean we can't run the seat heaters without turning on the heater? That's a DISTINCT CONFLICT with what Elon had suggested a few years ago. I'm sure I'm not alone in saying that when possible, and when I'm trying to extend my range, I opt to leave the heater off and go "solo" with the seat heater. Before the new heater was available, the old heater is a serious energy sucker!


----------



## msjulie

ATechGuy said:


> It seems we may need a winter and a summer diving mode. Key heating features without physical buttons seems to force the requirement for a soft button as before. Sure, it's not needed in So. Cal, but we all don't live there…


Perhaps but my daughter likes her seat heated 365 a year go figure; her seat heater is on and my window is open. What we need is less automation design that removes options, especially when we used to have them 



ATechGuy said:


> I certainly hope Tesla is getting an earful on all the feedback. Anyone figure out how to sync the front temps? Seems a waste of real estate to have two temps when it's synced ( and likewise silly to have the vent pump warm air to an empty passenger seat).


Yup


----------



## ATechGuy

Kizzy said:


> I only have Bluetooth listed in my dock/tray for music. I had a friend in my car and needed to leave with my phone which was playing music, so I switched to streaming music. At some point, the music player disappeared, so I pressed my set music button (Bluetooth) and the music stopped. 😐
> 
> I've been giving some more thought to this change. I've calmed down on having things change, but I'm still perturbed about missing features.
> 
> One feature I'm okay with losing is the cards. Hold on, hear me out. This interface element is problematic and became even more so with the 2020.25+ update at the end of 2020. It's hard to use intuitively (the swipe gesture takes a lot of practice to get right) and (in later v10 releases especially) it keeps disappearing when other cards/notifications are brought up.
> 
> That said, cards played a useful function (and some of them live on as responses to physical buttons), but the information you could display on them with a quick glance and possibly a swipe made it easy to keep tabs on the cars vitals without a lot of menu diving.
> 
> Maybe they want to discourage constantly looking at things (I doubt it since they were cool with letting passengers play video games on the main screen while driving was in progress) but it also pushes people to spend more time looking at the screen rooting through menus.
> 
> I would love to see the addition of some kind of customizable dashboard that can hold a few widgets or figures that can be docked somewhere-the car information screen (not everyone wants all those vitals, and it's cool to temporarily cover them with the blind spot video) or as a sociable element above/below the music player. Because it's customizable, it is optional and does not clutter up the UI. I really want to bring that little widget support from S/X to 3/Y.
> 
> Also, on Mac computers, you have the option to show or hide those little status icons at the top.
> 
> Tesla, let us customize. 🙂


Sound like Android or Apple Auto. Lock the regular UI and offer about 8-10 LARGE Icons in two rows that a blind bat could hit going 90.


----------



## ATechGuy

Bigriver said:


> So much has been said about change in controls, but loss of indications and passive info is equally troublesome.
> 
> I'm guessing they are trying to give people more immediate access to the one they use most. Im betting that a very high percentage of people use the same music source most of the time. I know I do. And then for the few times I'm using something else, there is that pull down menu you mentioned.
> 
> I am wishing I could delete the options I never use. If it needs a subscription that I don't have, let me delete it. That was previously an option.
> 
> Hit the < or > next to the temp, and the little submenu pops up that has sync/split option on it.
> View attachment 40891


Thank you for that. I hadn't enough time yet to start adjusting and the temp I had was OK with me, so I hadn't tried adjusting the temp as before to see about the split. I was surprised to see the "split" when before the firmware upgrade, it was in "sync" mode.


----------



## msjulie

Apologies if already seen https://apple.news/Ap18Dgre8QDSb13yJbDwFOw


----------



## Klaus-rf

ATechGuy said:


> Wait! You mean we can't run the seat heaters without turning on the heater? That's a DISTINCT CONFLICT with what Elon had suggested a few years ago. I'm sure I'm not alone in saying that when possible, and when I'm trying to extend my range, I opt to leave the heater off and go "solo" with the seat heater. Before the new heater was available, the old heater is a serious energy sucker!


Well, Yes and No.

You can't GET TO the seat heater settings without turning on the cabin AC/Heater BUT you can set the seat heater(s) to your desired liking then turn off the cabin AC/Heater. So it's five steps to engage a seat heater, then another five steps to disengage.

 Obviously this is much simpler than having those seat heater thingies right on the bottom menu where it, occasionally, got activated accidentally.


----------



## Mike

msjulie said:


> Apologies if already seen https://apple.news/Ap18Dgre8QDSb13yJbDwFOw


Unavailable in Canada. Can you provide executive summary please? Thanks.


----------



## Kizzy

Mike said:


> Unavailable in Canada. Can you provide executive summary please? Thanks.


Title: Tesla Is Selling More Cars than Ever, but Keeps Making Them Worse to Drive

Criticism on safety of removing controls. FSD future, but cars crashing now.


----------



## skygraff

Klaus-rf said:


> Well, Yes and No.
> 
> You can't GET TO the seat heater settings without turning on the cabin AC/Heater BUT you can set the seat heater(s) to your desired liking then turn off the cabin AC/Heater. So it's five steps to engage a seat heater, then another five steps to disengage.
> 
> Obviously this is much simpler than having those seat heater thingies right on the bottom menu where it, occasionally, got activated accidentally.


I see what you did there.

Anyway, the fact is, with voice commands, you can turn on/off the seat heat without enabling HVAC. Unfortunately, they're inconsistent (even with the holy bacon code) and there's no way to assess the status without turning on HVAC. Same thing goes for rear defrost.

Definitely an poorly thought out UI change from the standpoint of energy management. If auto anything or voice commands were reliable, this may have been a logical modification.


----------



## Klaus-rf

skygraff said:


> I see what you did there.
> 
> Anyway, the fact is, with voice commands, you can turn on/off the seat heat without enabling HVAC. Unfortunately, they're inconsistent (even with the holy bacon code) and there's no way to assess the status without turning on HVAC. Same thing goes for rear defrost.


I have NEVER gotten a voice command to work with my seat heater. Ever. "inconsistent" to the point of 100% failure == totally non-functional.

The new UI just makes extreme frustration to driving the car. This is now NOT the car I bought. If I wanted all the critical controls moved around and made much harder to use, I'd just buy a different car every three months. The word redonculous repeatedly comes to mind.


----------



## ATechGuy

Klaus-rf said:


> Well, Yes and No.
> 
> You can't GET TO the seat heater settings without turning on the cabin AC/Heater BUT you can set the seat heater(s) to your desired liking then turn off the cabin AC/Heater. So it's five steps to engage a seat heater, then another five steps to disengage.
> 
> Obviously this is much simpler than having those seat heater thingies right on the bottom menu where it, occasionally, got activated accidentally.


Might have to try the voice command, but back to my question on the "Split" heat controls, my display seems a tad different from the image posted. But that said, it does offer split or "split" in BLUE, apparently meaning NOT split. And, it doesn't join the two temp sections back together as with the V10 UI--it simply adjusts the "other" when you control the temp from either side. So, even with it (not) split (as opposed to "Synced") it still consumes the real estate on the task bar. Sigh.


----------



## jmmdownhil

Just downloaded 2021.44.30. Release notes look the same and I don't see any obvious changes/corrections from 44.25.2...yet. Other reports indicate Track Mode added to Plaid.


----------



## skygraff

ATechGuy said:


> Might have to try the voice command, but back to my question on the "Split" heat controls, my display seems a tad different from the image posted. But that said, it does offer split or "split" in BLUE, apparently meaning NOT split. And, it doesn't join the two temp sections back together as with the V10 UI--it simply adjusts the "other" when you control the temp from either side. So, even with it (not) split (as opposed to "Synced") it still consumes the real estate on the task bar. Sigh.


I was forced to drive a rental Chevy Malibu the other day and noticed the "UI" also featured driver and passenger side temp control knobs with a not-so-obvious split button. Just as stupid as how it's managed in this firmware but, with the physical buttons, a few glances let me sync them up even on an unfamiliar (they've definitely changed it since last time I drove one) panel.

If Tesla is going for a familiar layout that newbies and renters will recognize, I get it but, with the limitations imposed by a single screen and their desire to keep it uncluttered, it fails. I certainly didn't have to turn on the HVAC to ascertain it's status in the Malibu; nor my Tesla two months ago.

Remaining cautiously optimistic that more customization will be introduced soon.


----------



## JeffC

FRC said:


> The removal of the trip cards are likely to have a significant impact on my winter road trips. I know that my car requires an efficiency of 222 Wh/m in order to achieve the displayed range (determined after 1000's of miles of observation). So...With this handy bit of info in mind, I can do some quick math and know, definitively, what Wh/m I need to achieve in order to drive a defined # of miles on those tight legs in colder temps. So, if I need to stretch things a bit, I can slow down enough to keep my efficiency in a range that allows me to KNOW I'll make it. This is going to be much more difficult without a card constantly displaying my Wh/m since last charge. I'm sure I'll develop a work-around, but it's going to be more difficult.


The trip cards are something extremely useful for human drivers, especially on long road trips. Maybe not so useful for city robotaxis, which BTW MAY NEVER EXIST.


----------



## GDN

jmmdownhil said:


> Just downloaded 2021.44.30. Release notes look the same and I don't see any obvious changes/corrections from 44.25.2...yet. Other reports indicate Track Mode added to Plaid.


The interesting part about the update noting Track mode for Plaid - there are no S's that have the release yet, one or two waiting. About 20% of the Teslafi represented fleet has the update or is waiting on the update.


----------



## AaronE

lance.bailey said:


> 2018 model 3 with v11 and yes the time of the streaming song is gone, but the slider (not that you can do anything with it) indicating the amount of time left is still there. it is a VERY slim line going across the entire music panel just under the artist/album name. all songs have this same length of slider, shorter songs travers the slider faster than longer songs.
> 
> on the up side, the title of the song scrolls to show the entire title a few seconds after the song starts. and if you tap the title you can get it to scroll again.


you have good eyes! unfortunately, on an S scrolling isn't needed (it's the whole width) but wow is that line TINY! literally one pixel high. the dust on my screen is bigger 😂

ps. for seat heaters, I was laughing so hard at the slices of bacon. I found a good shortcut though: 1, 2 and 3 is the way to do it. DON'T say "to" anything, because it'll think you said 21, 22, or 23, all of which are "high". also, don't say "on two" because that'll be "onto" which is also high. do the following:

"set seats at 1" or "set front seats at 2" or "set rear left seat at 3", etc.

actually, no. it's still a mess. "set front/rear/passenger/rear right/() seat heaters at 1/2/3" works best, but still has certain issues

back seats at 2 -> increased
front seats at 2 -> decreased
back seats increased -> temp up by 3°, but nothing happens
seats 1 -> temp to LO

I'm still trying to figure out a reliable lexicon...


----------



## Klaus-rf

JeffC said:


> The trip cards are something extremely useful for human drivers, especially on long road trips. Maybe not so useful for city robotaxis, which BTW MAY NEVER EXIST.


Which also cannot charge themselves as there are exactly zero hands-free, automated charging stations. Curiously my 5-year old roomba can still easily find it's charger when needed, charge itself , and then resume it's tasks where it left off.


----------



## bwilson4web

I had a successful emergency stop and wanted to save the dashcam but the regular icon was not there. I briefly thought of the horn trigger but everything was over. Did I miss the memo?

I did strike the FSD icon but it does not make a dashcam video last time I checked.

Also, the far right lower volume control often starts each trip too high. Is there a way to set and keep a lower volume?

Bob Wilson


----------



## jmart38

New hotfix has screwed up my driving visualisation/parked controls, half of it's off the screen and stretched. Wish I'd remembered to grab a photo.

Edit: Soft reset fixed it, managed to grab a pic though


----------



## slotti

jmart38 said:


> Supposedly if you submit a service request it should push the current build pretty soon after, I have no idea how true that is though.


Service "We cannot push any newer software update. You already have the most up to date version for your car".
I guess they think my car is not worthy any updates anymore...


----------



## styleruk

bwilson4web said:


> I had a successful emergency stop and wanted to save the dashcam but the regular icon was not there. I briefly thought of the horn trigger but everything was over. Did I miss the memo?
> 
> I did strike the FSD icon but it does not make a dashcam video last time I checked.
> 
> Also, the far right lower volume control often starts each trip too high. Is there a way to set and keep a lower volume?
> 
> Bob Wilson


I had a similar thing, a car backed into another behind me and sodded off, when I looked at footage, none of my drive was captured like before. I had to reboot, then re-insert stick to get it to show up in the 'new' place (rather than visibly on screen). Sentry is working fine, but the active dashcam is not so good now and does not always work like before, coupled with the fact that I cannot see if it's working without pressing the 'quick settings' icon, it's a little wobbly. But of all the times to find this out it was when it was actually needed and I could have helped the woman who was left with a large dent and no information on who did it.


----------



## ATechGuy

Is there a resolution to finding a "Save the dashcam" without hitting the horn? I had a drunk step off the curb to cross the street, against the lights and with normal traffic flowing. I was going about 15 and he couldn't have been more then four feet in front of me when he stepped off. Honking the horn would have been after the fact and he just kept on walk while I slammed on the brakes. Car alerts never sounded. Not sure if the FSD cam button would still capture and send to Tesla or not unless I'm on FSD. I really would like that camera button back!


----------



## lance.bailey

bwilson4web said:


> I had a successful emergency stop and wanted to save the dashcam but the regular icon was not there. I briefly thought of the horn trigger but everything was over. Did I miss the memo?
> 
> I did strike the FSD icon but it does not make a dashcam video last time I checked.
> 
> Also, the far right lower volume control often starts each trip too high. Is there a way to set and keep a lower volume?
> 
> Bob Wilson


hey Bob.

If you had honked, then the current dashcam would have been saved. I believe that "current dashcam" is about 10 minutes into the past. So if you had honked then the "everything was over" would have been saved.

I think that the only thing that burying the save dashcam button will achieve is getting onto other people's dashcam as they capture incidents caused from people searching for that dang button.


----------



## Mr. Spacely

I saved the button as a favorite on the bottom...


----------



## PaulK

Anyone work at Apple? Someone needs to push an update to Elon’s iPhone, put the clock display and signal strength icon into a settings folder and when a call is active put up a fake banner displaying heat seater icons and an odometer covering his end button.


----------



## Kernal7

ATechGuy said:


> Is there a resolution to finding a "Save the dashcam" without hitting the horn? I had a drunk step off the curb to cross the street, against the lights and with normal traffic flowing. I was going about 15 and he couldn't have been more then four feet in front of me when he stepped off. Honking the horn would have been after the fact and he just kept on walk while I slammed on the brakes. Car alerts never sounded. Not sure if the FSD cam button would still capture and send to Tesla or not unless I'm on FSD. I really would like that camera button back!


The "save the dashcam" is still available, but it has moved and changed names.

If you press the "control button" (lower left corner of the screen, looks like a car) then the "Recording Button" (assuming you have dashcam function running it will have a red dot, it is on the right side of menu and about 2/3 of way down) the last 10 mins of dashcam will be saved to the normal place.

Agreed that sucks that it has moved and now requires an extra button press, but it is still available.


----------



## Mike

Mr. Spacely said:


> I saved the button as a favorite on the bottom...


If you did that, does it show a little red dot or some other visual cue that it is, in fact, live and recording?

In other news, drove the copilot crazy this morning as I had to stop the car, search out the trip odometers and then reset "todays trip" prior to running around today…sure miss having my trip odometer card always showing…

edit: grammar


----------



## bwilson4web

lance.bailey said:


> If you had honked, then the current dashcam would have been saved. I believe that "current dashcam" is about 10 minutes into the past. So if you had honked then the "everything was over" would have been saved.


I'll test it this afternoon. Switching between "Manual" and "Automatic" showed recording but *NOT* the icon. If 'horn' is the only way . . . d*mn.

Bob Wilson


----------



## mjm155

Klaus-rf said:


> Well, Yes and No.
> 
> You can't GET TO the seat heater settings without turning on the cabin AC/Heater BUT you can set the seat heater(s) to your desired liking then turn off the cabin AC/Heater. So it's five steps to engage a seat heater, then another five steps to disengage.
> 
> Obviously this is much simpler than having those seat heater thingies right on the bottom menu where it, occasionally, got activated accidentally.


What they did to the environmental controls on this update suck. They already had it right as it was. They need to add back the buttons for the seat heaters and the window defoggers back to the bottom of the screen as they were. To access either of these first takes finding them and then takes multiple button pushes to activate; where before they were already displayed and with one push activation.


----------



## lance.bailey

i have found that if i press the < or > arrow to pop up the mini environment panel to access the seat heater the temperature is also adjusted. I found my temperature a bunch of degrees lower that expected due to my tapping the < arrow over time to access the seat heater setting.

sigh.

now i tap the < arrow, tap the > arrow to undo the change, and then adjust the seat heater. no, those extra two taps will not cause me great pain or grief, but two extra taps is more time with my eyes off the road.


----------



## garsh

lance.bailey said:


> now i tap the < arrow, tap the > arrow to undo the change, and then adjust the seat heater. no, those extra two taps will not cause me great pain or grief, but two extra taps in more time with my eyes off the road.


Have you tried just tapping the number between the arrows?
Works for me.


----------



## lance.bailey

i think i tried that, but it didn't do it. i'll check again, i might have missed


----------



## Mike

lance.bailey said:


> i have found that if i press the < or > arrow to pop up the mini environment panel to access the seat heater the temperature is also adjusted. I found my temperature a bunch of degrees lower that expected due to my tapping the < arrow over time to access the seat heater setting.
> 
> sigh.
> 
> now i tap the < arrow, tap the > arrow to undo the change, and then adjust the seat heater. no, those extra two taps will not cause me great pain or grief, but two extra taps in more time with my eyes off the road.


…and while vacuuming my car interior tonight, I turned off the HVAC (as a matter of routine when parked at home) but alas, after a few minutes I realized the seats were still ON…NO visual cue, only the seats getting hot…and pushing the lower area of the UI to bring up the HVAC turns the HCAV back on…this is a mess!!!

Uploading 44.30 right now, wonder what else will be FUBAR'd.


----------



## FRC

garsh said:


> Have you tried just tapping the number between the arrows?
> Works for me.


Me too.


----------



## FRC

I hated this update originally. Now I'm getting adjusted to the point that I only long for the "good old days". My gut feeling is that if Tesla had changed from the current format to the previous format, we would be just as disappointed in the change. Humans don't like change. And we have never before had to deal with our cars changing from one day to the next. I suppose that the obvious solution would be to refuse all updates and always drive the car we bought. Are you willing to do that? I'm not.


----------



## GDN

garsh said:


> Have you tried just tapping the number between the arrows?
> Works for me.


Tapping the number brings up the full HVAC interface. There is quick access to just the seat heaters if you tap the left or right arrow.


----------



## Mike

FRC said:


> I hated this update originally. Now I'm getting adjusted to the point that I only long for the "good old days". My gut feeling is that if Tesla had changed from the current format to the previous format, we would be just as disappointed in the change. Humans don't like change. And we have never before had to deal with our cars changing from one day to the next. I suppose that the obvious solution would be to refuse all updates and always drive the car we bought. Are you willing to do that? I'm not.


Sorry, but hate the loss of the odometers.


----------



## Mike

GDN said:


> Tapping the number brings up the full HVAC interface. There is quick access to just the seat heaters if you tap the left or right arrow.


…which also adjusts the temperature up or down based on which arrow you tap (at least that is how it is working in my car).


----------



## undergrove

garsh said:


> How do I save dashcam footage in v11?
> 
> I used to tap on the dashcam icon while driving, but that appears to be gone now.


Open the main control window. On the lower right there is the old camera icon that says "Recording" when the camera is active. The only quick way now is to honk the horn.


----------



## undergrove

Mike said:


> Sorry, but hate the loss of the odometers.


Having all the odometers displayed on one screen is useful, but not when it covers up the map display while I am driving. They could have added this and kept the odometer, tire pressure, and wiper cards in the usual place. That would have been an improvement.

You can get the wiper card up by pushing the left stalk button, but it doesn't stay up long enough to use it safely when you are driving.

Bleah!


----------



## RonAz

iChris93 said:


> What's the altitude where you are? I think that helps in ABQ too.


2,000 feet


----------



## undergrove

lance.bailey said:


> i did not realize that touching the arrows brought up a sub menu. that will be handy. thank you.


Yes, but it changes the temperature, so you have to change it back if you want it to stay the same.


----------



## RonAz

I would like to have the side camera stay on longer when signaling. If I look to see if a vehicle is beside me and THEN turn on the signal for three blinks, by the time I look at the display the camera is going away. Your signal is what you are going to do, once you are crossing lanes there is no reason to announce that you are crossing lanes. What would be nice is to be able to glance at the screen to see if someone else is changing lanes into the spot you are moving into. If the camera stayed on twice as long it would be more helpful and safer, because we all know that people don't ignore your signal and cut you off. It just needs to stay on longer.


----------



## undergrove

SalisburySam said:


> Obviously Tesla's approach to ensuring owners speak or learn a second language. Good goal, but unlikely to happen for most 'Mericans.


But can your Tesla understand more than one language without changing the settings?


----------



## jmart38

RonAz said:


> I would like to have the side camera stay on longer when signaling. If I look to see if a vehicle is beside me and THEN turn on the signal for three blinks, by the time I look at the display the camera is going away. Your signal is what you are going to do, once you are crossing lanes there is no reason to announce that you are crossing lanes. What would be nice is to be able to glance at the screen to see if someone else is changing lanes into the spot you are moving into. If the camera stayed on twice as long it would be more helpful and safer, because we all know that people don't ignore your signal and cut you off. It just needs to stay on longer.


Tap for 3 blinks to move into an exit lane or similar where nobody else could be in the lane (letting people behind you know what you're doing). For lane changes engage full indicator and cancel it once you've completed the maneuver, this also helps people in the lane across spot you easier and prevents the thing you're concerned about. My 2 cents anyway.


----------



## undergrove

Quicksilver said:


> Or you can move it from the ... to the customizable tray at bottom.


The Dashcam icon in the tray just opens the Dashcam browser.


----------



## RonAz

Good point. Would change the three blinks to five if I could. Three seems to be the standard though. My Ford pickup is three and changes to five if towing which is nice.


----------



## iChris93

undergrove said:


> The Dashcam icon in the tray just opens the Dashcam browser.


Probably not if you're driving.


----------



## lance.bailey

iChris93 said:


> Probably not if you're driving.


yeah, when driving you just get a big grey box the size of (and covering) the map with a message in the middle saying that you cannot view the recordings while driving.

why not have a contextual button that records if you are in gear and launches the viewer if in park? makes sense to me.


----------



## iChris93

lance.bailey said:


> yeah, when driving you just get a big grey box the size of (and covering) the map with a message in the middle saying that you cannot view the recordings while driving.
> 
> why not have a contextual button that records if you are in gear and launches the viewer if in park? makes sense to me.


That's how I assumed it would have worked. The old button was like that.


----------



## lance.bailey

lance.bailey said:


> i think i tried that, but it didn't do it. i'll check again, i might have missed


nope. center number pops up the whole climate control. I just want the mini menu with defrosters and seat heaters.


----------



## jmart38

RonAz said:


> Good point. Would change the three blinks to five if I could. Three seems to be the standard though. My Ford pickup is three and changes to five if towing which is nice.


My fiesta st was customisable could choose 3 or 5, I agree that'd be a nice option.


----------



## DocScott

FRC said:


> I hated this update originally. Now I'm getting adjusted to the point that I only long for the "good old days". My gut feeling is that if Tesla had changed from the current format to the previous format, we would be just as disappointed in the change. Humans don't like change. And we have never before had to deal with our cars changing from one day to the next. I suppose that the obvious solution would be to refuse all updates and always drive the car we bought. Are you willing to do that? I'm not.


From what I've read/seen I disagree, although I haven't accepted the new update yet so I don't have first-hand experience.

Yes, changes always feel disruptive, and if the versions had been presented in reverse some of the changes would still be jarring.

Also, the recent updates add _functionality_--but that's not what people are objecting to. It's the changes to the UI for features that were already there.

So what if the UI changes had gone the other way?

I could see people being annoyed by the cards--they were a little wonky, appeared in an odd place on the screen, and took a little practice to get to use correctly. And even after years of ownership, I could never remember which direction swiped in the tire pressure and which the trip odometer.

But moving the dashcam to be a single tap? And allowing the front seat heaters to be controlled independently with a single tap? And single tap access to the rear defroster? People would have _loved_ those changes if the UI change had been in the other direction.


----------



## styleruk

Mr. Spacely said:


> I saved the button as a favorite on the bottom...


I looked for that, but there was not an option to drag it down from the available options. Seems there is the camera button but no dashcam button to drag to bottom. Unless there is something else I need to learn about this new update.


----------



## styleruk

Something I've noticed about this latest major update and that's the cameras when put into reverse, it's all a bit slower. Is this a thing that we may have to get used to with Tesla cars or any cars that are playing catch up for that matter, (Volvo just announced streaming in the car). It's more a tech thing in that software improves and the hardware starts to struggle. I've heard that the latest model 3 may be or already is using a much faster entertainment chip (AMD), but does that carry over to the function like reverse camera? (hopefully not), I've had the car 2.5years now and have noticed things slowing down, eg, when I first got her, I could jump in, tap in my number, put seatbelt on and select drive relatively quick. But now it all takes a bit longer.
I don't want to use the phrase 'software obsolescence', as that could not happen, but it does beg the question as we get these major updates as to how it affects the smooth running of the vehicle. You don't get that problem with cars up to what Tesla have done, it is what it is permanently, and I'm not against it as I love the tech. However, is this something people will have to accept with all cars moving into the future?
I work in Automotive in car entertainment as a design engineer and we are developing a future proof system, but that's not so easy is it? 
Suffice to say, my 1965 classic car can get off the drive 10x quicker than my Tesla now. I seem to be waiting for things in my Tesla.  
(I won't go into my rant about the digital age again......bring on the quantum age, I miss the analogue age)


----------



## SalisburySam

styleruk said:


> Something I've noticed about this latest major update and that's the cameras when put into reverse, it's all a bit slower. Is this a thing that we may have to get used to with Tesla cars or any cars that are playing catch up for that matter, (Volvo just announced streaming in the car). It's more a tech thing in that software improves and the hardware starts to struggle. I've heard that the latest model 3 may be or already is using a much faster entertainment chip (AMD), but does that carry over to the function like reverse camera? (hopefully not), I've had the car 2.5years now and have noticed things slowing down, eg, when I first got her, I could jump in, tap in my number, put seatbelt on and select drive relatively quick. But now it all takes a bit longer.
> I don't want to use the phrase 'software obsolescence', as that could not happen, but it does beg the question as we get these major updates as to how it affects the smooth running of the vehicle. You don't get that problem with cars up to what Tesla have done, it is what it is permanently, and I'm not against it as I love the tech. However, is this something people will have to accept with all cars moving into the future?
> I work in Automotive in car entertainment as a design engineer and we are developing a future proof system, but that's not so easy is it?
> Suffice to say, my 1965 classic car can get off the drive 10x quicker than my Tesla now. I seem to be waiting for things in my Tesla.
> (I won't go into my rant about the digital age again......bring on the quantum age, I miss the analogue age)


Agree. Of my three vehicles, the Tesla is by far the slowest to "get in and go." Worse, after every single software update it requires time to see what changed and is it something that affects my driving, as v44.25.2 did in significant ways. That reflects the degree of computerization to my mind. My 2012 Nissan LEAF takes about 2 seconds (measured, not guessing) to turn on and driving is then immediate. The fastest, of course like your experience, is my 1964 Ford Thunderbird with little-to-no automation of any kind. Pretty much it is turn the key to start the engine, shift, and go.

This is just me, but I find I like and appreciate more the stalks, buttons, and knobs in the LEAF and T-Bird now that I've owned my Model 3 for 3½ years and the gee whiz factor of the touchscreen interface has long ago worn off. The LEAF and T-Bird controls are just so easy to find, use, and they are always in the same physical position. I don't think that's a bad thing for driving a car.


----------



## lance.bailey

i have to wonder if moving the seat heater and defrost buttons would have been better accepted in a summer release


----------



## lance.bailey

installed 44.30 overnight. still have the charge port automatically unlock by opening the app when charging is done.


----------



## msjulie

Mr. Spacely said:


> And as FSD progresses we will spend more time using the screen than actually looking out of the windshield-- just like a pilot flying in fog on instruments only.


Well I don't expect to be alive when that happens and so in the meanwhile, making the car less safe is a _Bad Idea _in my view. Also autopilot in an aircraft is so different to a car on the street dealing with uncontrolled access of other vehicles or pedestrians or dogs etc. If every single car on the road had ATC monitoring them or ACAS (https://skybrary.aero/articles/airborne-collision-avoidance-system-acas) and no road would ever have a bike, a child or another uncontrolled vehicle/obstacle in the way, well maybe.

Still doesn't explain making me dive into a menu for seat heaters, or worse, my front seat passenger bumbling around in there for same. Voice command bandaid not a good response here.



FRC said:


> I hated this update originally. Now I'm getting adjusted to the point that I only long for the "good old days". My gut feeling is that if Tesla had changed from the current format to the previous format, we would be just as disappointed in the change. Humans don't like change. And we have never before had to deal with our cars changing from one day to the next. I suppose that the obvious solution would be to refuse all updates and always drive the car we bought. Are you willing to do that? I'm not.


This update sucks for many reasons and so yeah I will not update as long as is possible or until some update brings back useful controls in a safe way.

It's not about not liking change, it's about change for the worse. It's about making things less safe, destroying acquired muscle memory, Tesla just deciding to wholesale change *my* car at what seems a whim. Trading glanceable information for what, whitespace? Giving me a cartoon car I can spin because why? (Sorry that was the last 'hot' update). Combining functions so each is harder to use (heated seats + cabin temp). Providing access to things I literally never use - games - while making it literal 2 or 3 times harder to get to what I do care about. I very much don't want a computer or tablet interface (menus that need to be navigated) in a moving vehicle.

It's not just change, it's disappointedly so much *less* useful than it was before.


----------



## Mike

Mike said:


> …and while vacuuming my car interior tonight, I turned off the HVAC (as a matter of routine when parked at home) but alas, after a few minutes I realized the seats were still ON…NO visual cue, only the seats getting hot…and pushing the lower area of the UI to bring up the HVAC turns the HCAV back on…this is a mess!!!
> 
> Uploading 44.30 right now, wonder what else will be FUBAR'd.


FWIW: it may be beneficial to check the operation of your dash cam setup after downloading 44.30.

Mine would not show the little red icon (in its control icon) or did it respond to a long push to turn it on.

I tried reformatting my dash cam hard drive and it failed to reformat.

I disconnected and reconnected the hard drive and then had a successful reformatting experience, but the dash cam would not turn on.

Finally after a reset, the dash cam control icon showed a red dot.

YMMV


----------



## rrollens

Voice command for seat heaters works for me everytime.. "driver seat heater 3 (or 2 or 1) or" passenger seat 3 (or 2 or 1)" . Works like a charm.


----------



## Needsdecaf

So is 44.30 just bug fixes to 44.25
?


----------



## lance.bailey

any of our bugs?


----------



## undergrove

garsh said:


> Have you tried just tapping the number between the arrows?
> Works for me.


This just opens the full HVAC window for me. Is this different between versions with the new UI. I'm on 44.25.6.


----------



## Kimmo57

rrollens said:


> Voice command for seat heaters works for me everytime.. "driver seat heater 3 (or 2 or 1) or" passenger seat 3 (or 2 or 1)" . Works like a charm.


Voice commands for anything rarely work for me, because English is not my first language. Also they are super slow compared to a button and I just don't want to talk to my car. It's fine to have them as an option, but I would hope that they wouldn't aim for an UI that depends on them.


----------



## Kizzy

Kimmo57 said:


> Voice commands for anything rarely work for me, because English is not my first language. Also they are super slow compared to a button and I just don't want to talk to my car. It's fine to have them as an option, but I would hope that they wouldn't aim for an UI that depends on them.


Also, not everybody speaks out loud. More options makes it more accessible.


----------



## John Di Cecco

pretty funny.... UIs objective is to be so bad it forces you to learn the voice commands. approach is a success for me


----------



## Kizzy

Who else is mistaking the blue Autosteer icon with the cold battery icon?

They’re in different spots, yes, but visually in the periphery, they have some similarity.


----------



## msjulie

Just noticed - of all the things to leave in the lower bar, they left volume there which I guess means Tesla cares that the passenger can adjust the volume (driver uses the physical button on the steering wheel) but not give the passenger access to their own heated seat control. Sigh


----------



## GDN

msjulie said:


> Just noticed - of all the things to leave in the lower bar, they left volume there which I guess means Tesla cares that the passenger can adjust the volume (driver uses the physical button on the steering wheel) but not give the passenger access to their own heated seat control. Sigh


This is their ever relentless thinking they can automate for us. Where they continue to show every day they are more and more clueless.


----------



## Bigriver

msjulie said:


> the passenger can adjust the volume (driver uses the physical button on the steering wheel) but not give the passenger access to their own heated seat control.


The passenger can have as much access to their heated seat as the driver has. Just have to have the temp control in split mode.


----------



## msjulie

Yeah I know - worse than before. Just surprised at the priority of volume over other things such that it still gets a front row (sorta speak) position


----------



## Mike

Bigriver said:


> The passenger can have as much access to their heated seat as the driver has. Just have to have the temp control in split mode.
> 
> View attachment 40946


My understanding is that to show the controls as seen in this shot requires one to change the current temperature set point.


----------



## Bigriver

Mike said:


> My understanding is that to show the controls as seen in this shot requires one to change the current temperature set point.


Yes, and then you can change the temp setpoint back. My point was just that the passenger can have the same accessibility to their heat seater (edit: seat heater; example of why this would be difficult for me as a voice command) as the driver.

I really like that mini climate card that pops up, as it has the climate items that I need the most. I would wish that we could have a user-changeable, always present, row of cards above the bottom tray. I would choose seat heater/defrost and 2 trip meters. I would ban light gray from the font color pallet anywhere on the screen. 😬


----------



## SalisburySam

Bigriver said:


> I would ban light gray from the font color pallet anywhere on the screen. 😬


…and just anywhere against a white background. This "motif" has become fashionable over the last decade or so and I find it awful. Even here on this forum it is hard to read signatures, the text at the bottom of each post, the post number, and on and on. In a vehicle, the bit of "fashion" is functionally pointless and inexcusable to me. Thanks for the opportunity to vent first thing this morning.


----------



## mrau

The Temp display now shows on the driver AND passenger side of the screen. Does not matter if in Split Mode. 
Probably did this so the passenger could still access the seat heater/temps no matter the mode.

I still want the seat heater icons back on main screen.


----------



## SimonMatthews

FRC said:


> I hated this update originally. Now I'm getting adjusted to the point that I only long for the "good old days". My gut feeling is that if Tesla had changed from the current format to the previous format, we would be just as disappointed in the change. Humans don't like change. And we have never before had to deal with our cars changing from one day to the next. I suppose that the obvious solution would be to refuse all updates and always drive the car we bought. Are you willing to do that? I'm not.


I disagree.

Many functions that you might use when driving now take multiple touches when they were available with a single touch. That's not an improvement.


----------



## msjulie

> I suppose that the obvious solution would be to refuse all updates and always drive the car we bought. Are you willing to do that? I'm not.


YES! I will not update to a downgrade, one that makes my car less safe and less convenient to use.


----------



## lance.bailey

SalisburySam said:


> …and just anywhere against a white background. This "motif" has become fashionable over the last decade or so and I find it awful. Even here on this forum it is hard to read signatures, the text at the bottom of each post, the post number, and on and on. In a vehicle, the bit of "fashion" is functionally pointless and inexcusable to me. Thanks for the opportunity to vent first thing this morning.


yep. and while some may mock my reference to colour design from 700 years ago (or so)
here is post I made about why certain tinctures combinations work and why they sometimes don't


----------



## Mike

Not only are the hidden odometers grinding my gears, but not having an instant visual cue showing Sentry Mode status when the car is parked is also proving, for my use cases, to require me to remember to pull it up on the controls menu.

I should have an option on how my UI is populated when the car is in “park”.

If Elon wants all relevant operational information hidden while in ”drive” for the sake of aesthetics, then give the owner/operator control of thier own vehicles UI presentation while in “park” (like my “desktop” on my old vacuum tube/steam driven Windows 7 laptop.


----------



## Kimmo57

Kizzy said:


> Who else is mistaking the blue Autosteer icon with the cold battery icon?
> 
> They're in different spots, yes, but visually in the periphery, they have some similarity.


I haven't, but it's even smaller than before and I think this information is so important that it should be clearly understandable to all drivers, even new and random ones, which a tiny symbol changing color is not.


----------



## skygraff

So, today, it was so cold that my SSD wouldn’t connect until I preheated but the car wouldn’t connect to network until I did a thumb reboot.

What I learned from that experience was that the USB icon I put in the shortcuts (as my catch-all audio media button) disappeared while the SSD wouldn’t work which was a clear indication that dashcam and onboard sentry was offline.

Obviously, that wouldn’t work as a dashcam status tell if your drive isn’t partitioned nor is it foolproof since dashcam could be disabled separate from the USB media. That said, if yours is set up like mine, that would be a sure sign of no onboard storage connected.


----------



## GDN

44.30.5 downloading now. Will be the next FSD release. No registrations on Teslafi yet. Go check your apps/cars if you're ready to move on to the next version.


----------



## SimonMatthews

SalisburySam said:


> My 2012 Nissan LEAF takes about 2 seconds (measured, not guessing) to turn on and driving is then immediate.


It takes 4 seconds for my 2016 Leaf to turn on and go through it's startup procedure. You can put it in drive mode before this process has finished, but if you are too quick, it will reject your attempt. So, in practice, it's 4 seconds.


----------



## Kizzy

Hey! Pressing and holding the temperature in the car still turns off Climate Control. 😁


----------



## Jpgtucson

2020 M3, dash am icon gone. Replaced usb with pure Tesla unit and sentry is recording to the disk but the dash cam icon is still missing. Help.


----------



## bwilson4web

Just loaded 2021.44.30.5 at 1:30 AM in Huntsville, AL. Will drive test in the morning. Initial impressions:

The initial screen did not have that hated, orange wheel WARNING. Instead:







The upper left shows current charging status. There was a notice about cold weather that brought up that section in the Owner's manual
Cold weather tips:








Better organized release notes:








Sorry about the crappy images but at 36 F in Dixie, it was what I could easily do.

Bob Wilson

ps. My apologies to moderators if my post of installation and location is 'redundant.'


----------



## styleruk

Hate to moan, but every time I unplug or plug in my cable I get a hint pop up on my app that I have to swipe away saying that if I press the button on my plug it will open the charge flap...although this is useful for the first 100 times maybe, but it would be more helpful if I had a plug with a button. Both of the plugs I use don't have the tesla plug and button. But even if I did, why constantly tell me this. it is just another button press I have to do every time I want to use the car...along with turning off the emergency lane departure stupid dinging thing that pings me several times when I drive down the roads near my house.
Does anyone know a hack in the app software to stop this irritating 'tip'?


----------



## bwilson4web

styleruk said:


> Hate to moan, but every time I unplug or plug in my cable I get a hint pop up on my app that I have to swipe away saying that if I press the button on my plug it will open the charge flap...although this is useful for the first 100 times maybe, but it would be more helpful if I had a plug with a button. Both of the plugs I use don't have the tesla plug and button. But even if I did, why constantly tell me this. it is just another button press I have to do every time I want to use the car...along with turning off the emergency lane departure stupid dinging thing that pings me several times when I drive down the roads near my house.
> Does anyone know a hack in the app software to stop this irritating 'tip'?


This is the redundant message shown on the App:









I've been thinking of passing the image on Twitter to Elon each time it shows up.

Bob Wilson


----------



## garsh

Jpgtucson said:


> 2020 M3, dash am icon gone. Replaced usb with pure Tesla unit and sentry is recording to the disk but the dash cam icon is still missing. Help.


Tesla moved that and other icons to only be visible under the Controls menu.



Dick Blonov said:


> Under controls. This is going to take some getting used to...
> 
> View attachment 40825


----------



## bwilson4web

garsh said:


> Tesla moved that and other icons to only be visible under the Controls menu.


I moved mine to the bottom, Apps bar. Hold the icon unit it moves and then drag over to App bar on the bottom.

Bob Wilson


----------



## JeanDeBarraux

Upgraded to 44.30 last Wednesday evening. Upgrade never completed (at least I never received a notification). 12V battery died a few hours later (high voltage battery was at 52%). Car was bricked.

On the following day, mobile service came on-site to replace the battery, but car would remain locked (other than the charge port). After ~4 hours, he managed to get 44.30 re-installed.

Glad the car is still under warranty...


----------



## lance.bailey

oh goody. another item in the lower left. this one is for cold weather hints. tapping brings up the release notes for cold weather which I swipe down to remove. 

so when backing out of the garage, i lose homelink (covered up by cold weather notice) so if I need to close the garage with an extra homelink tap the homelink controls are buried. when I tap on the cold weather hints I lose the map (and I believe the backup cameras, but I will need to confirm that).

sigh. I need xray vision for V11 so I can see through the layers.


----------



## garsh

lance.bailey said:


> so when backing out of the garage, i lose homelink (covered up by cold weather notice) so if I need to close the garage with an extra homelink tap the homelink controls are buried.


Swipe down on any notifications in that area to make them go away.
I've successfully swiped down on that annoying "cold weather tips" notification in order to access my homelink.


----------



## lance.bailey

garsh said:


> Swipe down on any notifications in that area to make them go away.
> I've successfully swiped down on that annoying "cold weather tips" notification in order to access my homelink.


i tried that, but with less success than i had with cards. my swipe either does nothing or is interpreted as a tap, bringing up the full release notes. Again.


----------



## foo

Frankly I'm actually stunned at how bad the UI in V11 is; they have gone and moved everything off the main screen and buried it in menus, which is ridiculous really... Why are we freeing up all this real estate for the driving simulation!? Why do I have to menu dive for all the tools/information I need to drive the car? It's almost as if the design team doesn't actually drive these car on a daily basis... the trip/odo, wipers, tire pressures cassette was critical driving information. Access to bluetooth, sentry, wifi, homelink? These are useful tools. In fact, I would argue the old UI's only failing was that the Fog Lights weren't on the main screen somewhere. We need the old UI back!!!


----------



## styleruk

foo said:


> Frankly I'm actually stunned at how bad the UI in V11 is; they have gone and moved everything off the main screen and buried it in menus, which is ridiculous really... Why are we freeing up all this real estate for the driving simulation!? Why do I have to menu dive for all the tools/information I need to drive the car? It's almost as if the design team doesn't actually drive these car on a daily basis... the trip/odo, wipers, tire pressures cassette was critical driving information. Access to bluetooth, sentry, wifi, homelink? These are useful tools. In fact, I would argue the old UI's only failing was that the Fog Lights weren't on the main screen somewhere. We need the old UI back!!!


I totally agree with the tyre pressure swipe, that was very useful and I used it every day. On a cold morning I'd watch them as they would warm up before giving it full beans, now you have to cover up the map to watch them in a service menu. That and the two presses to save a dashcam event are my only 2 gripes with this UI...ATM.


----------



## lance.bailey

i played with "save dashcam" voice command and it seem to work. however that is english-centric


----------



## lance.bailey

foo said:


> It's almost as if the design team doesn't actually drive these car on a daily basis...


this


----------



## tivoboy

I went ahead and did the install, it had downloaded when I was away back in December… all I can say is UGH!.. first of all, it is VERY laggy, map screen, pop ups. The media UI for things like TuneIN is worse, favorites aren’t show anymore in a nice line of most recents.

REALLY missing easy access to the tire pressure card. Frankly, I can’t even FIND it in the setting list. The old voice command for “show me tire pressure” doesn’t work anymore, why on earth would that be?

REALLY miss easy access to the trip odometers and current WH/MI usage, etc. I really don’t know why these too had to be relegated to some deep menu in settings? Just pulling it up is most likely going to trigger the in car FSD nasty cam alert.. Two steps backwards for sure.

* Also should note, I am NOT A fan of the new forum layout, font, tiny font, etc.. why do people always think change is necessary or an improvement?


----------



## John Di Cecco

Tesla UI team... do you read forums for customer feedback? if you do... then get over yourselves and recognize you are knuckleheads. Maybe drive the car and use some common sense. you actually have a pretty easy job... stop making it hard


----------



## VFRMike

Installed 2021.44.30.5 last night and took a first drive today. Seemed almost useless while driving in town as the car would occasionally drive towards the back of cars parked on the right side of the road. After the third time of this occurrence, I decided not to use FSD Beta in town. Will be interesting to see if the phantom braking has decreased as the release notes indicated they would (by 50%). We just got back from a 5-day trip (on 2021.44.25.6) and the number of phantom breaking experiences has increased tremendously.

Edit: Just took it for a highway drive and had two (minor) phantom breaking experiences in less than four miles. It also did not move right when another car was approaching me on a non-marked residential road. On a positive note, it did take a couple of turns a little smoother.


----------



## Jpgtucson

garsh said:


> Tesla moved that and other icons to only be visible under the Controls menu.


Thanks


----------



## msjulie

garsh said:


> Swipe down on any notifications in that area to make them go away.
> I've successfully swiped down on that annoying "cold weather tips" notification in order to access my homelink.


The $64k question is - why? Why make all this stuff so hard??


----------



## RonAz

Probably been covered, but where did the cell phone signal strength bars go? Driving???Haha


----------



## Kizzy

RonAz said:


> Probably been covered, but where did the cell phone signal strength bars go? Driving???Haha


It's in the settings screen at the top. You only see it in the previous area when you don't have any cellular coverage.


----------



## RonAz

Seems backwards, but thanks. I’ll look tomorrow


----------



## lance.bailey

being in Canada, I don't have FSD beta - just the FSD version that I'm allowed. 

however yesterday, when talking with a friend, I came to a realization - the FSD that I do have is now mostly used by me when I'm trying to navigate the new UI. 

"Okay car - you take over, I want to figure out how to check the tire pressure."


----------



## SalisburySam

lance.bailey said:


> being in Canada, I don't have FSD beta - just the FSD version that I'm allowed.
> 
> however yesterday, when talking with a friend, I came to a realization - the FSD that I do have is now mostly used by me when I'm trying to navigate the new UI.
> 
> "Okay car - you take over, I want to figure out how to check the tire pressure."


Yup, agree. Unintended consequences?


----------



## SalisburySam

New update: v44.30.2. In progress, no idea about notes.


----------



## bwilson4web

Just curious why there are two









2021.44.30.5 with different FSDs?

Bob Wilson


----------



## tivoboy

bwilson4web said:


> Just curious why there are two
> View attachment 40986
> 
> 
> 2021.44.30.5 with different FSDs?
> 
> Bob Wilson


one is probably general V11 update, building on the holiday update and the other is for true FSD beta tester builds?


----------



## skygraff

tivoboy said:


> one is probably general V11 update, building on the holiday update and the other is for true FSD beta tester builds?


Looks to me like two people may be moderating the pole and double posted that version since it first rolled out before .1 but that might've eluded notice since .5 is higher/newer than .1.


----------



## Mike

Yesterday, for the first time, I tried the seat/steering wheel calibration.

It seems the 3.5 years of me occasionally having to get my seat back back to my saved position (via moving it a little and hitting the restore option) got all caught up.

After the calibration, when I selected my saved profile (without sitting in the seat), the seat-back continued to move forward such that it was beyond the vertical and within a foot of the steering wheel.

I had to move the seatback back and sit in the seat and trim my seating position to the correct position before saving the setting.


----------



## GDN

Mike said:


> Yesterday, for the first time, I tried the seat/steering wheel calibration.
> 
> It seems the 3.5 years of me occasionally having to get my seat back back to my saved position (via moving it a little and hitting the restore option) got all caught up.
> 
> After the calibration, when I selected my saved profile (without sitting in the seat), the seat-back continued to move forward such that it was beyond the vertical and within a foot of the steering wheel.
> 
> I had to move the seatback back and sit in the seat and trim my seating position to the correct position before saving the setting.


It is a crazy process and it definitely loses your original setting, but mine has been so much better at recalls and tweaks/saves I make to it vs what it used to do.


----------



## Mike

GDN said:


> It is a crazy process and it definitely loses your original setting, but mine has been so much better at recalls and tweaks/saves I make to it vs what it used to do.


I just found it a coincidence that the problematic (for me) seat back position was the only thing out of my original settings after using the recalibrate option.

Glad to hear in your experience it is working better.

Edit: spelling.


----------



## iChris93

skygraff said:


> Looks to me like two people may be moderating the pole and double posted that version since it first rolled out before .1 but that might've eluded notice since .5 is higher/newer than .1.


I'm guessing that's what happened too. Sorry about that everyone!


----------



## bwilson4web

Now I think I understand:

2021.44.30.5 81562c9c7b28 (2022-01-07) (FSD Beta 10.8.1)
. . .
2021.44.30.5 81562c9c7b28 (2022-01-08)
The second survey response for "2021.44.30.5" is without FSD Beta. The misleading "(FSD Beta)" probably should be removed. Regardless, now it makes sense.

Bob Wilson


----------



## FRC

Just finished an 1800 mile trip on 44.30 (GO DAWGS). Just a couple of minor observations.

The display is freezing up every couple of hundred miles. At times it will appear normal (you can see the tires rolling), but it will accept no commands, e.g. turn signals or AP inputs. A moving double scroll wheel adjustment is an easy fix, but the Tesla logo no longer comes up to indicate that the reboot is complete. After 2 minutes, I release the scroll wheels and all is normal about a minute later.

On a positive side (this may be old news, but I've never noticed or heard about it); When at home, I leave the navigation voice muted but find it helpful on the road. Previously, getting the volumes of nav and music in sync was a PIA. Now, if you adjust volume via the left scroll wheel when the nav is speaking, it will adjust the nav volume. If you adjust while music is playing, it will adjust music only. I find this very handy, and applaud the change.

I personally have no major issue with the new UI with one exception: the compass no longer stays displayed. Granted, a single tap anywhere brings it back; but come on Tesla, we're navigating, give us a compass.


----------



## Mr. Spacely

FRC said:


> I personally have no major issue with the new UI with one exception: the compass no longer stays displayed. Granted, a single tap anywhere brings it back; but come on Tesla, we're navigating, give us a compass.


This.


----------



## msjulie

FRC said:


> The display is freezing up every couple of hundred miles. At times it will appear normal (you can see the tires rolling), but it will accept no commands, e.g. turn signals or AP inputs. A moving double scroll wheel adjustment is an easy fix, but the Tesla logo no longer comes up to indicate that the reboot is complete. After 2 minutes, I release the scroll wheels and all is normal about a minute later.


How is it that the QA team released software that locks up - it's a car, people do use them for more than a few minutes at a time.


----------



## garsh

https://driveteslacanada.ca/model-3...fixes-coming-in-2021-44-30-6-software-update/


----------



## Tsettle

TESLA recently upgraded my screen with it's cutsie new icons on the bottom. I can no longer access "Set charging Screen", Doesn't work from my phone either.Got awhole load s---pile games I'll never use.


----------



## lance.bailey

this is likely the s/w fix Trev mentioned in another thread. the HP lock up in very cold weather and the software will now keep them operating instead of shutting down when a blast of cold air is being maintained.


----------



## Klaus-rf

Where did they hide the View Cameras button? The one that used to be on the lower left bar area???


----------



## msjulie

garsh said:


> https://driveteslacanada.ca/model-3...fixes-coming-in-2021-44-30-6-software-update/


This is good except now you have to get the new UI to get an unrelated fix; small happiness here that I have the inefficient heater


----------



## lance.bailey

Klaus-rf said:


> Where did they hide the View Cameras button? The one that used to be on the lower left bar area???


in the app box. drag it down to the bottom tray I did. Useful it is.


----------



## FRC

msjulie said:


> This is good except now you have to get the new UI to get an unrelated fix; small happiness here that I have the inefficient heater


I have been perfectly happy with my old-fashioned resistive heater for over 105K miles now. And before you say "Yeah, but you live in the South"; consider that fully 2/3 of my miles are trips to cold weather climes. Mostly wintertime trips to the American and Canadian Rockies.


----------



## mrau

FRC said:


> On a positive side (this may be old news, but I've never noticed or heard about it); When at home, I leave the navigation voice muted but find it helpful on the road. Previously, getting the volumes of nav and music in sync was a PIA. Now, if you adjust volume via the left scroll wheel when the nav is speaking, it will adjust the nav volume. If you adjust while music is playing, it will adjust music only. I find this very handy, and applaud the change.
> 
> I personally have no major issue with the new UI with one exception: the compass no longer stays displayed. Granted, a single tap anywhere brings it back; but come on Tesla, we're navigating, give us a compass.


The "Adjusting Nav volume only" while she is talking has been present for a long time..... at least 3 years. Glad you are using it now.

My Compass still stays on the screen. It is now in the upper left side of map. Sometimes it is hard to see because the compass background blends in with the map colors.


----------



## VFRMike

I am really having issues with 2021.44.30.5 but am not reading about anyone else having issues. The driving on FSD is terrible like it's never been on any previous update. Many times, when FSD is engaged, it's but a few seconds (maybe 1-5 seconds) and I get the "Take over immediately" alert with the red steering wheel. This is on roads with nobody around and clearly marked. The car is wandering while it drives and, many times, heads right for the parked cars on the right side of the road. Once it reaches the cars that it swerves at it then tries to drive around them on their left side. Tried Summon and it wanted to back up into the car that was parked behind it. I don't usually have much trouble with summon. Anyone else having any issues with 2021.44.30.5? I've done a soft and a hard reset.


----------



## Mike

Just got 44.30.2 yesterday and did a 2.5 hour freeway trip with NOA today.

Still no trunk lights when the car is asleep and automatic wipers still are ineffective with no contrast.

On the plus side, in three lane scenarios, after passing trucks in the middle lane whilst the right lane also had a large truck, NOA was no longer spooked by the large trucks in the very right lane and had many successful switches from the passing lane to the middle lane. Conditions were overcast for these successful manoeuvres.


----------



## styleruk

Mike said:


> Just got 44.30.2 yesterday and did a 2.5 hour freeway trip with NOA today.
> 
> Still no trunk lights when the car is asleep and automatic wipers still are ineffective with no contrast.
> 
> On the plus side, in three lane scenarios, after passing trucks in the middle lane whilst the right lane also had a large truck, NOA was no longer spooked by the large trucks in the very right lane and had many successful switches from the passing lane to the middle lane. Conditions were overcast for these successful manoeuvres.


I'm finding the wipers so much worse on this update. I'm using the button on the end of the stalk every trip to bring up the menu and select an option and keep them on, simply does not wipe correctly in this UK weather. We have grit on the roads and the screen mists over with crud very quickly to the point that you simply cannot see out, yet the auto wipers do nothing! I tried leaving it for a while, but it's simply dangerous, therefore, I'm manually selecting wipers myself. (similar to my 1965 classic car really).
Tesla do need to do something with the wipers in the future, the method of spotting rain on the screen with a camera simply does not work and they need to fit a sensor like everyone else does. (unless they already do and mine is just rubbish).


----------



## Kimmo57

styleruk said:


> I'm finding the wipers so much worse on this update. I'm using the button on the end of the stalk every trip to bring up the menu and select an option and keep them on, simply does not wipe correctly in this UK weather. We have grit on the roads and the screen mists over with crud very quickly to the point that you simply cannot see out, yet the auto wipers do nothing! I tried leaving it for a while, but it's simply dangerous, therefore, I'm manually selecting wipers myself. (similar to my 1965 classic car really).
> Tesla do need to do something with the wipers in the future, the method of spotting rain on the screen with a camera simply does not work and they need to fit a sensor like everyone else does. (unless they already do and mine is just rubbish).


I think there should be an option to pin the wiper controls on the screen. Adjusting wipers should never be a two hand, two step operation (yes, on the menu it's just a one hand, two step operation and still bad design).


----------



## Kimmo57

On a positive note, the phone controls work well again on 30.2.


----------



## garsh

Release notes for 2021.44.30.6 have been added.
I've only added the entries that didn't exist previously.
Note that some of these are still repeats, but they've been added for additional vehicles and/or regions.


iChris93 said:


> *2021.44.30.6 Release Notes:*
> *Track Mode* (Model S 2021+ Plaid)​Optimize your Plaid configuration for dynamic driving exclusively on closed courses and experience the unmatched performance at many different venues. To enable, tap Controls > Pedals & Steering > Track Mode.​
> Thermals: The heat pump system cools more aggressively, maximizing powertrain endurance and performance. Enable post-drive cooling to shorten wait times between sessions.
> Drive Systems: Torque vectoring authority is increased across the three motors, elevating the vehicle's agility and cornering capability. The accelerator pedal allows more precise torque control, and regenerative braking power is strengthened to recover more energy.
> Suspension: Adaptive damping reduces vehicle motions, improving handling and promoting driver confidence. Ride height is automatically set to 'Low' upon drive off.
> Display: A track-focused interface includes a lap timer, G-meter (real-time accelerometer), vehicle thermals monitor, Dashcam video capture, vehicle telemetry capture, and offers customization options.
> *Boombox Megaphone *(requires PWS)​Project your voice with additional authority using the new Megaphone function. Tap Toybox > Boombox > Megaphone.​Note: Your car must be in park to use Megaphone.​
> *Subwoofer* (Premium Audio, MCU 2)​You can now adjust your subwoofer by bringing up your Media Player, and tapping the settings icon > Tone.​​*Use Comfort Damping Suspension in Autopilot* (S & X, Adaptive Suspension)​Your vehicle will now automatically transition to Comfort Suspension Damping when Autopilot is engaged. This setting is enabled by default. To disable, tap Controls > Suspension > Use Comfort Damping in Autopilot.​​*Car Wash Mode* (Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+)​Car Wash Mode closes all windows, locks the charge port and disables windshield wipers, Sentry Mode, Walk-Away Door Locks and parking sensor chimes. For automatic car washes with conveyor belts, the Free Roll option shifts to Neutral and prevents the parking brake from automatically applying if you leave. To access, tap Controls > Service > Car Wash Mode.​​*Sentry Mode Live Camera Access* (Model X 2021+ Model S 2021+ Model 3 Model Y, MCU2, Available in new regions)​You can now view your car's surroundings from the Tesla app when parked to confirm the safety of your environment before returning to your car. Live Camera is end-to-end encrypted and cannot be accessed by Tesla. To enable or disable, tap Controls > Safety > 'View Live Camera via Mobile App' from the vehicle touchscreen display.​​Note: This feature requires mobile app version 4.2.1 or higher, and Premium Connectivity.​


----------



## Perscitus

Same release notes with 2021.44.30.7 which pushed to my car yesterday/today.

Still same v11 GUI without the ability to further customize screen-space or drag any function or widget to the frequently used area.

Still same old 2020 nav data.


----------



## EpsilonKore

Perscitus said:


> Same release notes with 2021.44.30.7 which pushed to my car yesterday/today.
> 
> Still same v11 GUI without the ability to further customize screen-space or drag any function or widget to the frequently used area.
> 
> Still same old 2020 nav data.


Received 44.30.7 this morning, was initially excited since I've had a 99+ Safety Score for 2 weeks (and 205 miles of driving)… but no… just another bug fix. I feel like I'm on a ban list for FSD. Months I drove around with a 98 score, then reset it all and now I have a 99… still I get standard software. What gives?!


----------



## styleruk

A silly question coming up and I apologies if it's in the wrong thread. But I'm in the UK and cannot see anyway of reading my score, can somone enlighten me as to how I can see this, it's certainly not on the app and I have the beta options selected in my car for FSD. Up to now I have assumed you get selected to have the option to display your safety score.
On another note, I assume my score would be very bad because the loud beep happens often as I drive to and from my house every time I forget to turn off the lane departure crap thing. I live in England where the roads get tight and you have to straddle the solid white lines on most corners on village lanes or lose a door mirror, so that beeping often will tell the safety score that I'm a bad driver. Also often get the beep as I approach parked cars down my lane, you have to zig-zag between them and sometimes it thinks I'm going to do a head on with another car. So my score is going to be bad, but it would be interesting to know how far away I am from actually getting any kind of useful FSD feature (in UK), any time soon. 3 years this year and I have nothing to show for the upgrade.

It would appear that it is not available in the UK yet. Typical, we have pretty much nothing to show for the FSD extra, I cannot imagine why anyone in the UK would buy this option now at it's higher price than when I ordered it 3 years ago.
(I apologies for my slight bitterness on this.)


----------



## Perscitus

New Nav Maps finally rolling out soon:
USA: NA-2021.44-13555
China: CN-2021.44-13668
Europe, Other Regions: TBD

Credit to @ greentheonly (just like all the recent chatter about heat pumps on 2020+ 3/Ys failing, seizing left and right in colder regions of the globe).


----------



## garsh

iChris93 said:


> *2021.44.30.10 Release Notes*
> *FSD Beta 10.9*​
> Improved intersection extents and right of way assignment by updating modeling of intersection areas from dense rasters ("bag of points") to sparse instances. Increased intersection region IOU by 4.2%. The sparse intersection network is the first model deployed with an auto-regressive architecture that runs natively with low latency on the TRIP Al accelerator chip, through innovations in the Al compiler stack.
> Upgraded generalized static object network to use 10-bit photon count streams rather than 8-bit ISP tonemapped images by adding 10-bit inference support in the Al compiler stack. Improved overall recall by 3.9% and precision by 1.7%.
> Made unprotected left turns across oncoming lanes more natural by proceeding straight into intersection while yielding, before initiating the turn.
> Improved lane preference and topology estimation by 1.2% with a network update and a new format for navigation clues.
> Improved short deadline lane changes with better modeling of necessary deceleration for maneuvers beyond the lane change.
> Improved future paths for objects not confined to lane geometry by better modelling of their kinematics.
> Made launches from stop more calm when there is an imminent slowdown nearby.
> Improved gap selection when yielding to a stream of oncoming cars on narrow roads.


----------



## Madmolecule

how is the battle of 9's going, I don't recall?

Photon counting, really, I think Elon just liked the word
Improved overall recall by 3.9% and precision by 1.7%, come on betas, train better

% increases mean nothing without a base

I still believe the most AI learning will be from us bad drivers, I can find the corner cases on a regular bases.


----------



## lance.bailey

I have been giving blind spot cameras a bit of a work out, trying to like them.


I think that they are essential for lane changes. A few times they have alerted me to a car that was not on the visualization half of the screen. But, they take 1 or 2 blinks before they show up and they disappear immediately after the third blink. that gives me only 1 - 2 seconds to see and analyze the image. the image has to hang about for another second or two or an option for 5 blinks for a lane change tap needs to be available
get the blind spot image out of the lower left of the screen there is WAY too much there with v11 and moving the image to the top (i don't need to know my speed or gear during a lane change) or over where the map lives (the same place the side cameras are placed when backing up or when you activate the camera view)
some kind of indication or placement that hints at you looking at the left or the right side camera. Again, placing the image where the side cameras live during backup would have a consistency of "left side camera here" and "right side camera there"
the blind spot view is near useless for left or right turns. - If I am turning left I am in the left most lane and all I see in the blind spot camera are the back end of cars travelling the opposite direction away from me. This is useless. Similarly when turning right the blind spot camera sees the sidewalk and that's about it. 
we need to have a "blind spot camera for taps" and one for lane changes.


----------



## msjulie

lance.bailey said:


> I have been giving blind spot cameras a bit of a work out, trying to like them.


Is it just me or does this seem like another way to try and catch up to the ubiquitous light-in-mirror warning that it seems every other car has?

Every car I passed on my recent Monterey to San Diego trip had some little orange/yellow glow in the driver's mirror as we passed by; literally I can not recall one that did not (outside Tesla) and I was looking for them

Sorry for tangent


----------



## lance.bailey

msjulie said:


> Is it just me or does this seem like another way to try and catch up to the ubiquitous light-in-mirror warning that it seems every other car has?
> 
> Every car I passed on my recent Monterey to San Diego trip had some little orange/yellow glow in the driver's mirror as we passed by; literally I can not recall one that did not (outside Tesla) and I was looking for them
> 
> Sorry for tangent


the light in the mirror is "old school" blind spot warning. Volvo, for example, has had this (called BLIS - Blind Spot Indicator System or sumsuch) for a few years.

A couple of companies now replace part of the display with a camera image when you are turning. Hyundai has had this for a while.

So Tesla isn't catching up to Volvo, they are catching up to Hyundai. Volvo has to catch up as well


----------



## msjulie

lance.bailey said:


> the light in the mirror is "old school" blind spot warning. Volvo, for example, has had this (called BLIS - Blind Spot Indicator System or sumsuch) for a few years.


Fair enough, it sure seems to work just fine . You could argue not broken, no fix needed.

It comforts me to see that little light, I like to pretend that driver might actually notice me next to them


----------



## lance.bailey

msjulie said:


> Fair enough, it sure seems to work just fine . You could argue not broken, no fix needed.
> 
> It comforts me to see that little light, I like to pretend that driver might actually notice me next to them


on boring commutes i;ve been known to pop in and out of the spot to see if I can make someone's mirror light go on and off purposefully.


----------



## M3OC Rules

lance.bailey said:


> the blind spot view is near useless for left or right turns. - If I am turning left I am in the left most lane and all I see in the blind spot camera are the back end of cars travelling the opposite direction away from me.


Do you have bike lanes? Does seem like they could be smart about when they turn them on though.


----------



## lance.bailey

M3OC Rules said:


> Do you have bike lanes? Does seem like they could be smart about when they turn them on though.


or even kids on the sidewalk. but yes the Vancouver area has bike lanes throughout.

I wonder if the Tesla computer is smart enough to understand that when turning, and in the rightmost lane for a right turn and stopped, show the camera. That way a bike zipping up the side of your stopped car just as you start the turn won't get smooshed. As a cyclist, knowing that the light was about to turn green, I've zipped up beside the stopped cars to enter when the light turns green. That may have scared a driver or two. Sorry.


----------



## ltphoto

EpsilonKore said:


> Received 44.30.7 this morning, was initially excited since I've had a 99+ Safety Score for 2 weeks (and 205 miles of driving)… but no… just another bug fix. I feel like I'm on a ban list for FSD. Months I drove around with a 98 score, then reset it all and now I have a 99… still I get standard software. What gives?!


Same with me. I had a 99 score and over 8,000 miles with no updates. Did a reset and at least got the latest non-FSD update. Then opted back in. Over 400 miles with 100 score and no updates again. Seems if I am opted in for FSD beta it blocks me from getting any updates.


----------



## harrison987

ltphoto said:


> Same with me. I had a 99 score and over 8,000 miles with no updates. Did a reset and at least got the latest non-FSD update. Then opted back in. Over 400 miles with 100 score and no updates again. Seems if I am opted in for FSD beta it blocks me from getting any updates.


I had to reset mine a few times, and opt out. The key is to opting out...see the score get removed from the APP...and then re-apply.

I got angry as the CPU was screwing me...not my driving habits. Every time I was on a bend, and a pedestrian on the sidewalk ahead of me on the bend....the car would give me a mega warning like I was going to hit them. There were also other errors that were CPU issues, not me driving. I just said "screw it", and made sure I was at 100% at all times...if it dropped below 99%, I would reset everything again,

What is silly is that the car in FSD takes turns WELL ABOVE the limit they penalize you on...and also brakes much harder.

I do not use FSD a lot right now, as I find it too aggressive in many situations that i would not be aggressive in.


----------



## Mike

Been a while since this has been an issue...I'm currently on 44.30.2 and the app cannot connect to the car today.


----------



## harrison987

I am curious...

Is anyone else getting intermittent flashing of the "please place hand on wheel" warning? 

Regardless of my hands being on the wheel...it flashes on the screen for a mega spit second. Comes up like every 2 minutes or so...


----------



## garsh

harrison987 said:


> Is anyone else getting intermittent flashing of the "please place hand on wheel" warning?
> 
> Regardless of my hands being on the wheel...it flashes on the screen for a mega spit second. Comes up like every 2 minutes or so...


It's not enough to have your hands on the wheel. You must actually be exerting a small turning torque on the wheel in order for the car to detect your presence.


----------



## harrison987

garsh said:


> It's not enough to have your hands on the wheel. You must actually be exerting a small turning torque on the wheel in order for the car to detect your presence.


no no...

That is not what I am referring to. I have had my car for almost 4 years, so I know torque is needed. 

I use autopilot every day...and this issue started a few updates ago.

I have constant downward left or right pressure/torque on the wheel. But...regardless of this...I get a quick millisecond "flash" of this warning on the screen. It is quick and and off, regardless of how much torque on the wheel.


----------



## DocScott

harrison987 said:


> no no...
> 
> That is not what I am referring to. I have had my car for almost 4 years, so I know torque is needed.
> 
> I use autopilot every day...and this issue started a few updates ago.
> 
> I have constant downward left or right pressure/torque on the wheel. But...regardless of this...I get a quick millisecond "flash" of this warning on the screen. It is quick and and off, regardless of how much torque on the wheel.


And it's the red warning, not the blue one, right? I'm not positive this is happening more--I usually attribute it to the car being "nervous" about something in the environment, such as construction or weird lane markings. But now that you mention it, it may be happening more often. I'll keep an eye out.


----------



## harrison987

DocScott said:


> And it's the red warning, not the blue one, right? I'm not positive this is happening more--I usually attribute it to the car being "nervous" about something in the environment, such as construction or weird lane markings. But now that you mention it, it may be happening more often. I'll keep an eye out.


yup...the red one (not the blue faded in and out that happens when no pressure is applied for an extended period). It flashes intermittently for no reason...


----------



## VFRMike

harrison987 said:


> I am curious...
> 
> Is anyone else getting intermittent flashing of the "please place hand on wheel" warning?
> 
> Regardless of my hands being on the wheel...it flashes on the screen for a mega spit second. Comes up like every 2 minutes or so...


Yes, this is part of what I was experiencing the other day. The car was driving very poorly as described in post #480, including the "Place hand on wheel" warning every few seconds without any noticeable reason. And, just as oddly, it has performed just fine the day after that experience and since has had no problems.


----------



## harrison987

Here's the thing though... 

I've had this issue for a couple months. 

Car has had no issues at all on autopilot. I'm driving in clear weather on the 101 with little traffic in the morning.

No problems, no issues, nothing that would throw the car off....


----------



## JustTheTip

Has this been mentioned? What a stupid oversight. Tapping on one of the arrows next to the temp to bring up the heated seats etc… now (as of 30.2) it adjusts the temperature up or down 1 degree depending which one you press, as well as brings up the heated seats page. It’s little things like this that are so aggravating. 

Has this at least been fixed in the newer updates?


----------



## lance.bailey

yeah, it has been noticed. the whole issue of the hidden seat icons (among others) needs a good rethink.


----------



## lance.bailey

the removal of the profile name nearly caused a bad thing (tm) the other day.

My wife's profile does not have traffic light awareness, or auto-brake/hold set. She and I are similar height and weight so our seat/mirrors are about the same so I usually wouldn't notice if her profile is running until my eyes spot her name over the map. It's a good quick check that often I don't even think about. Profile to phone linkage is spotty so it happens more than zero times. 

The other night I was coming down a hill to a set of lights, travelling under the speed limit but with no one between me and the lights. When the lights turned yellow I threw on autopilot to let it detect the lights but instead the car accellerated toward the now red lights. 

I stopped (because I always remain in control of the car ;-) ) but when the car didn't go into hold when I stopped I fired up the menus to see that the car was on my wife's profile.

grrr.

different profiles have different settings that can drastically affect the behaviour of the car. Hiding the profile name hides the behaviour of the car.


----------



## rrollens

So, I have had AP/FSD on my car since 2018. BTW, I paid $2000.00 for FSD during one of Tesla's famous fire sales. I have not opted in to the Beta program because I have no intention of using FSD until it is ready for prime time. My question is, are there any benefits for me to opt in to the FSD Beta program even though I do not intend to use it until it is safe and proven? Is the Beta UI better then the normal UI? Are there any additional features I am missing that I could have if I opt into the FSD Beta program? Thx.


----------



## FRC

rrollens said:


> So, I have had AP/FSD on my car since 2018. BTW, I paid $2000.00 for FSD during one of Tesla's famous fire sales. I have not opted in to the Beta program because I have no intention of using FSD until it is ready for prime time. My question is, are there any benefits for me to opt in to the FSD Beta program even though I do not intend to use it until it is safe and proven? Is the Beta UI better then the normal UI? Are there any additional features I am missing that I could have if I opt into the FSD Beta program? Thx.


My Model 3 is enrolled in the beta program, my wife's Model Y is not. Differences in the UI that are not directly related to FSDbeta are either non-existent, or so subtle as to be unnoticed.


----------



## FRC

JustTheTip said:


> Has this been mentioned? What a stupid oversight. Tapping on one of the arrows next to the temp to bring up the heated seats etc… now (as of 30.2) it adjusts the temperature up or down 1 degree depending which one you press, as well as brings up the heated seats page. It's little things like this that are so aggravating.
> 
> Has this at least been fixed in the newer updates?


Try tapping the number instead of the arrow. Works for me.


----------



## bwilson4web

rrollens said:


> are there any benefits for me to opt in to the FSD Beta program


Every change imposes a handling 'style' on the car that the driver needs to learn or adapt. The beta introduces a new style.

Bob Wilson


----------



## gary in NY

Anyone have a problem viewing sentry clips? All I get is a black screen. It's been like this since 10.8. And now 10.9.


----------



## lance.bailey

I get a black screen, but then it goes to the clip. I never used to see a black screen event before v11, but now every time before the clip.


----------



## gary in NY

lance.bailey said:


> I get a black screen, but then it goes to the clip. I never used to see a black screen event before v11, but now every time before the clip.


I've let it go for several minutes, but does not go to the clip. Seems like it did progress to the clip from the black screen within 10 or 20 seconds several versions ago.


----------



## bwilson4web

DocScott said:


> And it's the red warning, not the blue one, right? I'm not positive this is happening more--I usually attribute it to the car being "nervous" about something in the environment, such as construction or weird lane markings. But now that you mention it, it may be happening more often. I'll keep an eye out.


I can reliably get the 'red warning' when driving Navigate on Autopilot (NoA) while testing FSD. If I only use dynamic cruise control, I don't get the 'red warning.'

Could you try this approach, not using NoA over the route?

Thanks,
Bob Wilson


----------



## bwilson4web

I sent the following to '[email protected]' and will follow-up with a call to support on Monday:

_Hi,_​​_VIN: 5Y..._​_Software: 2021.44.30.5_​​_I can rename "Segment" to anything but there is no RESET button to clear the earlier metrics._​
*Update:*


Mike said:


> In fact, the ridiculous way that the odometers are set up also tricks me into relabelling the name of my odometer instead of zeroing it out…because the reset buttons DON'T SHOW when the page is displayed because they are hidden AT THE BOTTOM and require one to scroll the page…ugh.


So the rule of thumb is try to scroll each page to see if there are 'hidden' controls.

Bob Wilson


----------



## Madmolecule

I have no idea why they can't stitch the cameras together for and augmented reality view.










tesla AI depicting bike rack with a bike


----------



## lance.bailey

there have been hints of a stitched together 360 overhead view. lots of people (myself included) stitched together the side and rear cameras in the days before the in-car viewer. Tesla can hire me - i only need watts and scotch.


----------



## JeanDeBarraux

gary in NY said:


> Anyone have a problem viewing sentry clips? All I get is a black screen. It's been like this since 10.8. And now 10.9.


Sentry viewing now takes a *very* long time to start up. Black screen for 30-60s, then a still image for another 30-60s, and then viewing starts as before.


----------



## Madmolecule

The system I am installing in my motorhome comes with targets for calibrating the system. I think Tesla should have calibration bays at supercharger stations, and Tesla tape we can put on our garages. Also, I wonder why only pillar cameras ever get blinded?

360 birdseye


----------



## Kimmo57

Madmolecule said:


> Also, I wonder why only pillar cameras ever get blinded?


Someone figured out the answer: 




In short: holes in the circuit board, which have been taped shut in later camera versions.


----------



## lance.bailey

had a lot of condensation on the windscreen and got the notice that the front camera was blinded. it unfogged/de-blinded (no notification, but it cleared up) but it made me wonder.

If Tesla is relying more on cameras for guidance/collision/AP - what happens for condensation, ice, and snow?


----------



## pweady

Are people still getting software update notifications on their phones? I used to get them and the settings in the app are correct but I only found out about the past few updates after getting in the car and seeing the prompt. I think it started with V11.


----------



## FRC

pweady said:


> Are people still getting software update notifications on their phones? I used to get them and the settings in the app are correct but I only found out about the past few updates after getting in the car and seeing the prompt. I think it started with V11.


I am still getting notification on my iphone.


----------



## Kizzy

Madmolecule said:


> The system I am installing in my motorhome comes with targets for calibrating the system. I think Tesla should have calibration bays at supercharger stations, and Tesla tape we can put on our garages. Also, I wonder why only pillar cameras ever get blinded?
> 
> 360 birdseye


My left fender cam gets "blocked or blinded" at night in very dark situations.


pweady said:


> Are people still getting software update notifications on their phones? I used to get them and the settings in the app are correct but I only found out about the past few updates after getting in the car and seeing the prompt. I think it started with V11.


I also didn't get the "Software update completed" message.


----------



## Greg Smith

pweady said:


> Are people still getting software update notifications on their phones? I used to get them and the settings in the app are correct but I only found out about the past few updates after getting in the car and seeing the prompt. I think it started with V11.


I'm not getting them anymore on Android. Probably the last 2 or 3 updates. Only notice when I go into the app.


----------



## Mike

lance.bailey said:


> had a lot of condensation on the windscreen and got the notice that the front camera was blinded. it unfogged/de-blinded (no notification, but it cleared up) but it made me wonder.
> 
> If Tesla is relying more on cameras for guidance/collision/AP - what happens for condensation, ice, and snow?


…or when it's winter, the car is driven at a (relatively) high latitude, and the low sun blinds the "B" pillar camera?

This happened to me last Friday while using NOA on a clear/dry road with sun shine.

The NOA became a simple lane keeping system for a portion of my trip until the mid morning sun was high enough in the sky…it refused to do (commanded) autosteer lane changes into the sun lit side during this event.


----------



## JustTheTip

2022.4 is live.


----------



## SalisburySam

pweady said:


> Are people still getting software update notifications on their phones? I used to get them and the settings in the app are correct but I only found out about the past few updates after getting in the car and seeing the prompt. I think it started with V11.


I only get them from TesliFi, not Tesla nor my car.


----------



## jmart38

I get them in the tesla app


----------



## lance.bailey

i get alerts on the phone when one is ready and after it is installed. but then, i also initiate the install from my phone before the scheduled 9:30pm installs.


----------



## Avid

So, can anyone point me to where the tire pressure page resides now? It seem to have disappeared after my last update to 30.8.


----------



## styleruk

Anyone else notice that in the phone app, if you turn off the pre conditioning, the car ignores that and goes ahead pre-conditioning all weekend regardless. Have now turned it off in the car and will have to do that every time I get in the car after setting it up on the app. Guess it's a bug.


----------



## garsh

Avid said:


> So, can anyone point me to where the tire pressure page resides now? It seem to have disappeared after my last update to 30.8.


It's described in the release notes for v11 builds:



iChris93 said:


> *Simplified Controls* (Model 3 Model Y)
> The display has been simplified to focus on navigation, media and the most common primary controls.​
> For windshield wipers and status bar information, tap Controls
> For charging controls tap Controls > Charging
> For trip and odometer information tap Controls > Trips
> For tire pressure information tap Controls > Service


----------



## Avid

garsh said:


> It's described in the release notes for v11 builds:


Thanks @garsh, but you will see in the photo that it isn't there. I have rebooted several times and no bueno.


----------



## garsh

Avid said:


> Thanks @garsh, but you will see in the photo that it isn't there. I have rebooted several times and no bueno.


In general, TPMS sensors only work when the vehicle is moving. This wakes up the sensors. They'll usually only start reporting pressures after the car has been moving for several seconds.

I haven't checked this yet, but my guess would be that Tesla is only showing tire pressures when the vehicle has been moving.


----------



## tivoboy

gary in NY said:


> Anyone have a problem viewing sentry clips? All I get is a black screen. It's been like this since 10.8. And now 10.9.


I found this too.. sadly one has to tap around or move the screen down and up to get it to display properly.. frankly, I think the new CODE is taxing the CPU/GPU more than before.. my rear view camera is jerky, not smooth anymore. I think the Sentry Mode interface now, not being able to get to it easily from the main screen is a step backwards.


----------



## PiperPaul

Avid said:


> Thanks @garsh, but you will see in the photo that it isn't there. I have rebooted several times and no bueno.


What I see in your picture is only the bottom part of the Service screen. Is it possible that it had scrolled down so you missed the Tire Pressure graphic at the top?
As @garsh said the pressures aren't displayed until the car has been moving for some minutes. However the graphic still shows; it just doesn't have any pressure figures.


----------



## Kizzy

One one mentioned their app unlocked the charge port when they opened the app.

I noticed yesterday that the chargeport was unlocked when my car was unlocked (didn’t need to press the button on the handle to initiate an unlock), and if I’m not mistaken, the charge port remained unlocked when I plugged in the car for scheduled charging (indicator light remained white). This is different. I don’t know if I like it.


----------



## tivoboy

PiperPaul said:


> What I see in your picture is only the bottom part of the Service screen. Is it possible that it had scrolled down so you missed the Tire Pressure graphic at the top?
> As @garsh said the pressures aren't displayed until the car has been moving for some minutes. However the graphic still shows; it just doesn't have any pressure figures.


This is the way it's always been, just in a different place (ARGH!!)… one could have the Tire Pressure tile up on the lower left screen in the past, and the TPMS wouldn't get a read for ~ .5 mile of driving..ALTHOUGH, I DO Think the car actually HAS A read that isn't currently displayed, as sometimes when it's very cold (relatively speaking) and the actual tire pressure goes down, I will get an alert for low tire pressure even BEFORE the TMPS or the in car display indicates any values - which are then usually one tire is ONE bar below the others ~ 42 ish. So, somehow the car has the value but isn't displaying it for some minute or half mile.


----------



## tivoboy

Kizzy said:


> One one mentioned their app unlocked the charge port when they opened the app.
> 
> I noticed yesterday that the chargeport was unlocked when my car was unlocked (didn't need to press the button on the handle to initiate an unlock), and if I'm not mistaken, the charge port remained unlocked when I plugged in the car for scheduled charging (indicator light remained white). This is different. I don't know if I like it.


Ive seen this happen to many people since the new IOS or ANDROID update.. the app lightning bolt which is usually one of the four menu items displayed in the middle of the app, really only opens the charge port… to see the range / or charging status of the car, that is up at the top of the app. I've talked with drivers who say they've been hitting this lightning bolt - like we used to do to see the battery status, current range, adjust max charging level, etc.. but they are hitting the bolt and opening the port.

Not saying that is what is going on here, but it could be. To help ME from stopping this happening, I just moved the lightning bolt to the LEFT side of the app (I'm left handed but use my right hand on the phone) and moved LOCK/UNLOCK to the right side. Which frankly is more necessary these days since half the time the car is still asleep when I go to use it in the morning - this too is another unappreciated change in this release.


----------



## gary in NY

I actual was able to view sentry clips yesterday. Very slow, but they did come up.


----------



## DocScott

garsh said:


> In general, TPMS sensors only work when the vehicle is moving. This wakes up the sensors. They'll usually only start reporting pressures after the car has been moving for several seconds.
> 
> I haven't checked this yet, but my guess would be that Tesla is only showing tire pressures when the vehicle has been moving.


I have intentionally not accepted the update that would take me to v11, but this sounds like madness. Tire pressure is now buried in a menu, but (as was also true before), you can't access when in park? So to see your tire pressure you have to access a menu while driving?? That's not the safest of designs...


----------



## lance.bailey

Kizzy said:


> One one mentioned their app unlocked the charge port when they opened the app.
> 
> I noticed yesterday that the chargeport was unlocked when my car was unlocked (didn't need to press the button on the handle to initiate an unlock), and if I'm not mistaken, the charge port remained unlocked when I plugged in the car for scheduled charging (indicator light remained white). This is different. I don't know if I like it.


you might be referring to a quote I made (and a seperate thread I'm too lazy to find) where I found if I opened the iOS app and the car was finished charging the port went from dark to light blue unlocked making J1772 adapter theft an issue. This is a v11 issue that happened regardless of app version until app v4.4 which seems to send a message "charge!" to the car as I now see it blink light blue and then go to green.

oh, and the unlock button (which disappeared, reappeared with v4.4


----------



## Numbersix

Kimmo57 said:


> Someone figured out the answer:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In short: holes in the circuit board, which have been taped shut in later camera versions.


So it's a design flaw. My 2018 Model 3 has major repeater camera glare with blinker. I never noticed it until v11 and the blindspot popup. I guess I never had the camera view up at night before. Seems like something Tesla needs to fix/replace for free.


----------



## RonAz

Probably why they waited to have the pop up screen. The older cars that have the glare problem are going to be out of warranty. I also have a 2018 and the cameras are not usable at night with turn signal.


----------



## Kizzy

RonAz said:


> Probably why they waited to have the pop up screen. The older cars that have the glare problem are going to be out of warranty. I also have a 2018 and the cameras are not usable at night with turn signal.


The backup camera failing is a safety issue and subject to a recall. Though the side cameras are not failing (this is a design flaw), it could be argued that this impacts safety.


----------



## iChris93

Kizzy said:


> I noticed yesterday that the chargeport was unlocked when my car was unlocked (didn't need to press the button on the handle to initiate an unlock), and if I'm not mistaken, the charge port remained unlocked when I plugged in the car for scheduled charging (indicator light remained white). This is different. I don't know if I like it.


Were freezing temps, by chance, possible? Sub, say, 50°F?


----------



## Avid

PiperPaul said:


> What I see in your picture is only the bottom part of the Service screen. Is it possible that it had scrolled down so you missed the Tire Pressure graphic at the top?
> As @garsh said the pressures aren't displayed until the car has been moving for some minutes. However the graphic still shows; it just doesn't have any pressure figures.


I've swipe up and down, and no, the page doesn't have it hidden in the upper or lower portion of the window.

As @garsh mentioned, the TP normally would only show when the car is in drive, I could not remember if I had tried it while in motion so off I went. Well, in drive/motion it shows the same page, no overhead view of car or psi. In fact fyi, in the below picture, the only things that will be allowed to access while in drive is the owners manual and notifications. The car wash mode is only available when the car is not in motion, so when I start to move again the car wash mode button is grayed out. It seems I am the only one affected by this anomaly, I suppose I should feel special. :unamused:


----------



## skygraff

Kizzy said:


> The backup camera failing is a safety issue and subject to a recall. Though the side cameras are not failing (this is a design flaw), it could be argued that this impacts safety.


Maybe they impact safety but it could definitely be argued that they undermine FSD capability. For anyone who paid for that, necessary hardware updates should be included under that package price (IMHO).


----------



## garsh

I don't know why your car is different.

Take it in for service.


Avid said:


> I've swipe up and down, and no, the page doesn't have it hidden in the upper or lower portion of the window.


----------



## Kizzy

iChris93 said:


> Were freezing temps, by chance, possible? Sub, say, 50°F?


It's quite possible it was under 50° F. Freezing wasn't likely, but not impossible.


----------



## tivoboy

Numbersix said:


> So it's a design flaw. My 2018 Model 3 has major repeater camera glare with blinker. I never noticed it until v11 and the blindspot popup. I guess I never had the camera view up at night before. Seems like something Tesla needs to fix/replace for free.


I've really only started to see this issue with the latest release. Just the other day, heading north on 280 about 2:00 PM PST (with the Sun to my LEFT), I got an alert that the LEFT side cameras were "obstructed or covered" and therefore couldn't be used and AP would be crippled... then about 15 minutes later, I was heading SOUTH on 280 (with Sun to the RIGHT) and I got the SAME warning, but now for the RIGHT side camera. So, clearly the cameras ability to filter out direct sunlight or even low overhead sunlight is a problem.


----------



## tivoboy

RonAz said:


> Probably why they waited to have the pop up screen. The older cars that have the glare problem are going to be out of warranty. I also have a 2018 and the cameras are not usable at night with turn signal.


yes, I have a 2018, warranty probably comes up June 1 2022.. you can be sure I'm going to hard press for a fix.


----------



## Mike

tivoboy said:


> yes, I have a 2018, warranty probably comes up June 1 2022.. you can be sure I'm going to hard press for a fix.


Why do I feel I'll just end up employing the shade tree mechanic hack after my warranty is up…


----------



## BrianC

This tire pressure only displaying while you're in motion is seriously just dumb. I own an air compressor. I want to be able to hop in my car in the garage, check the pressures and adjust accordingly. You know, the thing I have been able to do with other cars since TPMS was available. Pretty sure my 1990 Chevy Cavalier Z24 let me do that. The monitors don't get a new value unless they're moving? Cool, give me the last known value. 

Yes I also own a tire pressure gauge... but why have the display at all if its not available when the wheels aren't moving.


----------



## tivoboy

BrianC said:


> This tire pressure only displaying while you're in motion is seriously just dumb. I own an air compressor. I want to be able to hop in my car in the garage, check the pressures and adjust accordingly. You know, the thing I have been able to do with other cars since TPMS was available. Pretty sure my 1990 Chevy Cavalier Z24 let me do that. The monitors don't get a new value unless they're moving? Cool, give me the last known value.
> 
> Yes I also own a tire pressure gauge... but why have the display at all if its not available when the wheels aren't moving.


So, the way it is working now on the Tesla is pretty much the way it works on all other cars too.. it's not putting a reading out while sitting and at start.. it might give a reading after many minutes while sitting, but my Mercedes, Porsche, Ford, GM, Jeep, smart, among others don't give the TPMS reading till the cars moves and pressure gets leveled. Most OEM are getting the TPMS sensors from a few sources, not sure about the receiver electronics, but of course their OBC and central omputers are going to work with that data and the sensor differently.

I'm surprised that a 1990 GM entry model would have had true TPMS sensor back that far.. when introduced in the late 80's, like 87-88, it was very high end vehicles only and even in the GM line, I think the first car to actually get them was the Corvette. And that wasn't till 1992? Can't recall exactly, the pages of Road and Track, Car and Driver from that far back are fading a bit from my photo recall ability.


----------



## msjulie

I could easily believe the TPS sensors aren't active when the car is stable; I could see that causing a shortening of the battery life (they still have batteries right?)


----------



## BrianC

tivoboy said:


> So, the way it is working now on the Tesla is pretty much the way it works on all other cars too.. it's not putting a reading out while sitting and at start.. it might give a reading after many minutes while sitting, but my Mercedes, Porsche, Ford, GM, Jeep, smart, among others don't give the TPMS reading till the cars moves and pressure gets leveled. Most OEM are getting the TPMS sensors from a few sources, not sure about the receiver electronics, but of course their OBC and central omputers are going to work with that data and the sensor differently.
> 
> I'm surprised that a 1990 GM entry model would have had true TPMS sensor back that far.. when introduced in the late 80's, like 87-88, it was very high end vehicles only and even in the GM line, I think the first car to actually get them was the Corvette. And that wasn't till 1992? Can't recall exactly, the pages of Road and Track, Car and Driver from that far back are fading a bit from my photo recall ability.


 So did a little Googling and you are correct, my memory back that far is faulty. Article I looked at said the TPMS came first on the 91 'Vette. I can tell you for certain newer GM cars including our recently sold 2015 Traverse displayed tire pressure while sitting in the driveway, whenever I wanted to check. I still contend it would be a simple thing to display the last measured value.


----------



## Mike

(On 30.11)

My trunk lights still don’t come on when the car is asleep and the trunk is opened via the latch over the license plate.

New item: very subtle but definite “transformer noise” (reminds me of an old radio or tv with a faint high pitched noise) when HVAC fan speed is on “2”, but goes away when HVAC fan speed down to “1”.

I don’t know if other HVAC fan speeds produce this noise, or if the higher fan speeds simply mask it.


----------



## bwilson4web

If it would do any good, I would complain about being one version behind. I really want the new map as I have a reproducible problem with FSD.


----------



## bwilson4web

Perhaps a ‘tire inflation mode’ that audio announces the tire and pressure every ‘n’ seconds.

Bob Wilson


----------



## iChris93

bwilson4web said:


> If it would do any good, I would complain about being one version behind. I really want the new map as I have a reproducible problem with FSD.


I have the new map and have FSD beta.


----------



## garsh

BrianC said:


> I can tell you for certain newer GM cars including our recently sold 2015 Traverse displayed tire pressure while sitting in the driveway, whenever I wanted to check.


Interesting:

https://www.tirereview.com/wireless-signal/


> How often is a sensor transmitting information?
> 
> This varies among manufacturers, but generally sensors have different settings while parked and while in motion. In rolling mode, sensors transmit, on average, once every 60 seconds to 180 seconds. These transmissions both aid in the relearn process and check in with the system.
> 
> While parked or in stationary mode, depending on the manufacturer, sensors may transmit periodically or when a pressure change is detected. If there is a slow leak, it will be ready to display on the dash when the car is started.
> 
> In the event of rapid air loss, most sensors go into an alert mode that ramps up the transmissions to deliver a swifter warning.


----------



## undergrove

JeanDeBarraux said:


> Sentry viewing now takes a *very* long time to start up. Black screen for 30-60s, then a still image for another 30-60s, and then viewing starts as before.


Sentry viewing has never worked for me. I get the circling arrow for20-30 seconds, then it says "error...try again." Refresh gets same result.


----------



## PiperPaul

Mike said:


> (On 30.11)
> 
> My trunk lights still don't come on when the car is asleep and the trunk is opened via the latch over the license plate.
> 
> New item: very subtle but definite "transformer noise" (reminds me of an old radio or tv with a faint high pitched noise) when HVAC fan speed is on "2", but goes away when HVAC fan speed down to "1".
> 
> I don't know if other HVAC fan speeds produce this noise, or if the higher fan speeds simply mask it.


@Mike .... I'm thinking you'll have to give up on this obsession with the non trunk-light and keep a flashlight handy for reading in the trunk. I'm sure lying in there can't be good for your back and probably cool too this time of year.

I can't comment on the HVAC fan sound. My fan on Auto normally runs too fast and loudly to hear much at all. My guess is the software dudes in Freemont are driven towards instant gratification: instantly hot or instantly cold. Auto = fan speed 4 or higher no matter what.

(Yeah, this post is a little whimsical. We're deep into a major snowstorm here. That's my excuse and I'm sticking to it.)


----------



## Mike

PiperPaul said:


> @Mike .... I'm thinking you'll have to give up on this obsession with the non trunk-light and keep a flashlight handy for reading in the trunk. I'm sure lying in there can't be good for your back and probably cool too this time of year.
> 
> I can't comment on the HVAC fan sound. My fan on Auto normally runs too fast and loudly to hear much at all. My guess is the software dudes in Freemont are driven towards instant gratification: instantly hot or instantly cold. Auto = fan speed 4 or higher no matter what.
> 
> (Yeah, this post is a little whimsical. We're deep into a major snowstorm here. That's my excuse and I'm sticking to it.)




When they finally figure out my trunk lights, that will be my signal that they have also figured out full self driving.

I run the HVAC in manual mode year round for a few reasons, one of them being the fan speed is just too high in auto regardless of heating or cooling.


----------



## lance.bailey

Mike said:


> (On 30.11)
> 
> My trunk lights still don't come on when the car is asleep and the trunk is opened via the latch over the license plate.
> 
> New item: very subtle but definite "transformer noise" (reminds me of an old radio or tv with a faint high pitched noise) when HVAC fan speed is on "2", but goes away when HVAC fan speed down to "1".
> 
> I don't know if other HVAC fan speeds produce this noise, or if the higher fan speeds simply mask it.


when you open the trunk in sleep mode via the latch over the plate, do the head lights go on? They do for me, as well as the interior trunk light. Just wondering if none of the lights go on for you.


----------



## Mike

lance.bailey said:


> when you open the trunk in sleep mode via the latch over the plate, do the head lights go on? They do for me, as well as the interior trunk light. Just wondering if none of the lights go on for you.


Never paid attention…honestly don't know.

Next time, I'll try it in a dark garage versus the normal bright setup.

If my headlamps don't come on when I pop the trunk, I guess I'll have something to talk about when my mobile repair chap comes over to inspect my rear camera cable (the recall) at some point in the future.


----------



## bwilson4web

Did 2021.44.30.10 stall?

Bob Wilson


----------



## SalisburySam

Mike said:


> …when my mobile repair chap comes over to inspect my rear camera cable (the recall) at some point in the future.


I tried to schedule this, but was cancelled due to, supposedly, parts issue. Tesla said: "don't call us, we'll call you." Waiting.


----------



## FRC

SalisburySam said:


> I tried to schedule this, but was cancelled due to, supposedly, parts issue. Tesla said: "don't call us, we'll call you." Waiting.


Phantom recall?


----------



## SalisburySam

FRC said:


> Phantom recall?


Correct. And in keeping with the braking behavior on my M3.


----------



## Ksb466

bwilson4web said:


> Did 2021.44.30.10 stall?
> 
> Bob Wilson


looks that way. I'm starting to think they like 2 versions of FSD active at the same time to compare results, because clearly their progress is not linear. I'm apparently in the lower group. That's ok.


----------



## evannole

BrianC said:


> I still contend it would be a simple thing to display the last measured value.


The last measured value would almost certainly have been from when the tires were warm or even hot, and therefore inaccurate. This could even be somewhat dangerous: if the reading you saw were in the low end of what's considered safe, the cold reading - what's you're actually supposed to use - would likely be well below that.


----------



## Mike

evannole said:


> The last measured value would almost certainly have been from when the tires were warm or even hot, and therefore inaccurate. This could even be somewhat dangerous: if the reading you saw were in the low end of what's considered safe, the cold reading - what's you're actually supposed to use - would likely be well below that.


Playing devil' advocate: if the Tesla software team can "show off" by somehow having the car able to determine when the tread wear on the tires is at a point where a warning will be made, they should be able to get the last "hot" tire pressure reading to be massaged with the vehicles current "cold" temperature and determine a suitable proxy for the tire pressure when cold.


----------



## Kimmo57

It was a bit snowy today, so I wanted to turn on the rear fog light on my drive. The way to do it is Menu->lights-> rear fog light. All this while driving and of course the AP doesn't work on snowy roads.
If "any input is an error", then surely 3 inputs is a design disaster.


----------



## tivoboy

BrianC said:


> So did a little Googling and you are correct, my memory back that far is faulty. Article I looked at said the TPMS came first on the 91 'Vette. I can tell you for certain newer GM cars including our recently sold 2015 Traverse displayed tire pressure while sitting in the driveway, whenever I wanted to check. I still contend it would be a simple thing to display the last measured value.


While sitting, I guess I would wonder if it is just showing the most recent reading prior to shut down. I could probably test that out pretty easily but assuring I have my tire inflator handy. ;-)


----------



## JeanDeBarraux

Kimmo57 said:


> It was a bit snowy today, so I wanted to turn on the rear fog light on my drive. The way to do it is Menu->lights-> rear fog light. All this while driving and of course the AP doesn't work on snowy roads.
> If "any input is an error", then surely 3 inputs is a design disaster.


Yep they sure made it more complicated and I doubt there's any voice command for the rear fog lights (the few commands I 've tried to turn on the front fog lights didn't work either)


----------



## Klaus-rf

tivoboy said:


> TPMS sensor back that far.. when introduced in the late 80's, like 87-88, it was very high end vehicles only and even in the GM line, I think the first car to actually get them was the Corvette. And that wasn't till 1992? Can't recall exactly, the pages of Road and Track, Car and Driver from that far back are fading a bit from my photo recall ability.


1984 Corvette was the first GM vehicle to come with TPMS. A fairly primitive system compared to 2020 versions. had a simple dash display (multi-function) in that era of medium green LED that had a tire pressure display. Don't recall if it was static or only after some driving.


----------



## rrollens

Mike said:


> Playing devil' advocate: if the Tesla software team can "show off" by somehow having the car able to determine when the tread wear on the tires is at a point where a warning will be made, they should be able to get the last "hot" tire pressure reading to be massaged with the vehicles current "cold" temperature and determine a suitable proxy for the tire pressure when cold.


Got one of those tire wear warnings on a brand new rear tire! What gives? Can't get rid of the warning either.


----------



## jmart38

WIth 44.30.11 now every time I get in the car I have to manually slide down the charging menu... I want to get in and drive I don't need to see this screen every time.

Does it just pop up and stay up every time you've charged the car?


----------



## garsh

rrollens said:


> Got one of those tire wear warnings on a brand new rear tire! What gives? Can't get rid of the warning either.


Inspect the tread to see if it's actually worn.
Check the air pressure in case it's a little low.

Otherwise, make a service appointment and see what they say. Well, if you're under warranty. If not, I'm not sure what the next course of action would be.


----------



## iChris93

rrollens said:


> Got one of those tire wear warnings on a brand new rear tire! What gives? Can't get rid of the warning either.


Did you replace all 4 tires?


----------



## rrollens

garsh said:


> Inspect the tread to see if it's actually worn.
> Check the air pressure in case it's a little low.
> 
> Otherwise, make a service appointment and see what they say. Well, if you're under warranty. If not, I'm not sure what the next course of action would be.


Thanks for the advise. It was also suggested to me to reset the TPMS. I will do that as well tomorrow. Thx. 


garsh said:


> Inspect the tread to see if it's actually worn.
> Check the air pressure in case it's a little low.
> 
> Otherwise, make a service appointment and see what they say. Well, if you're under warranty. If not, I'm not sure what the next course of action would be.


----------



## rrollens

iChris93 said:


> Did you replace all 4 tires?


All four tires were replaced about a month ago. All were brand new, with about no more then 500-800 miles on them.


----------



## garsh

rrollens said:


> All four tires were replaced about a month ago. All were brand new, with about no more then 500-800 miles on them.


Same size tire as OEM?
What brand/model?
Perhaps these new tires have a slightly smaller diameter than the OEM ones.


----------



## tivoboy

Klaus-rf said:


> 1984 Corvette was the first GM vehicle to come with TPMS. A fairly primitive system compared to 2020 versions. had a simple dash display (multi-function) in that era of medium green LED that had a tire pressure display. Don't recall if it was static or only after some driving.


I'd be interested in more info about that..thanks


----------



## rrollens

garsh said:


> Same size tire as OEM?
> What brand/model?
> Perhaps these new tires have a slightly smaller diameter than the OEM ones.


OEM top of the line Michelin Sport 4S tires. Staggered set up. Been running this same set up since 2018. Gonna reset TPMS today and see what happens.


----------



## EpsilonKore

rrollens said:


> OEM top of the line Michelin Sport 4S tires. Staggered set up. Been running this same set up since 2018. Gonna reset TPMS today and see what happens.


Pre Tread Warning software update, having a staggered setup (I am guessing by staggered you mean wider in back than front but "close" in diameter) would only be noticed through false TPMS readings by less than a PSI... and maybe some traction control glitches. But the tread warning software judges off rotational rate, looking for the tiniest of variances and then checks it against PSI in tires to then throw a code if wear is detected. If you had different brands (messy or temporary replacement setup), or in your case diameter (through staggered setup) you might see this code all the time.


----------



## garsh

rrollens said:


> OEM top of the line Michelin Sport 4S tires. Staggered set up.


Tesla doesn't offer a staggered setup, so this is not OEM. I guess you mean "the same brand and model tire as OEM"?
What size rear tires?


----------



## rrollens

garsh said:


> Tesla doesn't offer a staggered setup, so this is not OEM. I guess you mean "the same brand and model tire as OEM"?
> What size rear tires?


You are correct that Tesla does not offer a staggered set up option, but they do recommend if you do go staggered you do it this way (which I have done):

Front: 19x8.5 with 235/40 ZR19 tires (Stock Set Up)

Rear: 19x9.5 with 265/35 ZR19 tires (Tesla Recommended Staggered Set Up)


----------



## rrollens

EpsilonKore said:


> Pre Tread Warning software update, having a staggered setup (I am guessing by staggered you mean wider in back than front but "close" in diameter) would only be noticed through false TPMS readings by less than a PSI... and maybe some traction control glitches. But the tread warning software judges off rotational rate, looking for the tiniest of variances and then checks it against PSI in tires to then throw a code if wear is detected. If you had different brands (messy or temporary replacement setup), or in your case diameter (through staggered setup) you might see this code all the time.


Thank you for your thoughtful input. I am going to reset TPMS. If that isn't a long term fix, then I'll increase my PSI from 42lbs all the way around to 42lbs front, and 44lbs rear and see what happens. 🤞🤞


----------



## FRC

Encountered an odd quirk today. Running 44.30.5. Returning home from eye doctor on a road I travel often; NOA engaged. About every 2 miles I was getting the blaring red wheel-"Take over immediately" for no reason that I could determine. I've encountered these before, but rarely. After about the fourth such warning, I realized that I was wearing the dark temporary, just been dilated glasses. I presume the car didn't like the inability to see my eyeballs?


----------



## alanisrox69

Having major problems with regen braking in my 2020 M3P and 2021.44.30.11. I can drive on the highway for 10-15 mins and still not have full regen braking. Or drive clear across town for 20mins in stop and go traffic and I have to fully use the brake pedal to stop! Something is seriously wrong. I am in a cold climate (currently 32° F) but it was not like this on previous firmwares what-so-ever. Maybe a mile or two of driving and then the regen would kick in. This is crazy!


----------



## DocScott

alanisrox69 said:


> Having major problems with regen braking in my 2020 M3P and 2021.44.30.11. I can drive on the highway for 10-15 mins and still not have full regen braking. Or drive clear across town for 20mins in stop and go traffic and I have to fully use the brake pedal to stop! Something is seriously wrong. I am in a cold climate (currently 32° F) but it was not like this on previous firmwares what-so-ever. Maybe a mile or two of driving and then the regen would kick in. This is crazy!


You probably checked this--but did your regen setting change somehow? Occasionally settings seem to change without me changing them.


----------



## garsh

alanisrox69 said:


> I am in a cold climate (currently 32° F) but it was not like this on previous firmwares what-so-ever.


It's the temperature.

My older car has gone back-and-forth a couple times with how much regen is available at lower temperatures.
I thought Tesla's last batch of "cold weather improvements" had given us stronger regen in colder temperatures again, but it sounds like they've weakened it yet again.

@JWardell , have you been able to measure any recent changes to regen in cold weather?


----------



## PiperPaul

Mike said:


> Never paid attention…honestly don't know.
> 
> Next time, I'll try it in a dark garage versus the normal bright setup.
> 
> If my headlamps don't come on when I pop the trunk, I guess I'll have something to talk about when my mobile repair chap comes over to inspect my rear camera cable (the recall) at some point in the future.


For what it's worth: Just checked and I get trunk lights and parking lights (same ones as when I open the door to get in) when I use the trunk latch.


----------



## Mike

PiperPaul said:


> For what it's worth: Just checked and I get trunk lights and parking lights (same ones as when I open the door to get in) when I use the trunk latch.


In my moderately dark garage (if I put it in gear the headlamps would come on) while sound asleep: no headlamps and no trunk lights.


----------



## BrianC

garsh said:


> Interesting:
> 
> https://www.tirereview.com/wireless-signal/


That's good info and mirrors my experience with Chevrolet cars. I could view the reading sitting in the driveway, add air to top them off if they were low, and get back in the car and see the adjusted values. This required no driving to accomplish. It was the cold reading, not a stored values, because the pressure readings were always within


----------



## garsh

> *2021.44.30.15 Release Notes*
> *FSD Beta 10.10*​
> Smoother fork maneuvers and turn-lane selection using high fidelity trajectory primitives.
> Disabled rolling-stop functionality in all FSD Profiles. This behavior used to allow the vehicle to roll through all-way-stop intersections, but only when several conditions were met, including: vehicle speed less than 5.6 mph, no relevant objects/pedestrians/bicyclists detected, sufficient visibility and all entering roads at the intersection have speed limits below 30mph.
> Improved generalized static object network by 4% using improved ground truth trajectories.
> Improved smoothness when stopping for crossing objects at intersections by modeling soft and hard constraints to better represent urgency of the slowdown.
> Enabled lane changing into an oncoming lane to maneuver around static obstacles, when safe to do so.
> Improved smoothness for merge handling by enforcing more consistency with previous cycle's speed control decisions.
> Improved handling of flashing red light traffic controls by adding more caution for events where crossing vehicles may not stop.
> Improved right of way understanding at intersections with better modeling of intersection extents.


----------



## DocScott

Enabled lane changing into an oncoming lane to maneuver around static obstacles, when safe to do so.
How is that new? Maybe by "static objects" it means things like debris, rather than stopped cars?


----------



## bwilson4web

Per the poll, I'm the first to change my vote. 








Even though a little chilly out, guess I need to start my regression testing. <GRINS>

Finished my first regression testing at 4:30 AM February 4 and the car now comes to a complete stop for the required by law delay. Then it proceeds through the intersection. Also one reproducible phantom brake site is fixed. Previous problem spots remain fixed.

Bob Wilson


----------



## RichEV

based on teslafi data:
44.30.15 was released to about 10,000 vehicles yesterday and has since been paused, probably waiting on feedback from the first wave. Interestingly over half of the updates have been to cars on 44.30.5 which never got the 10.9 upgrade. So some randomization in the order of upgrades.


----------



## bwilson4web

RichEV said:


> based on teslafi data:
> 44.30.15 was released to about 10,000 vehicles yesterday and has since been paused, probably waiting on feedback from the first wave. Interestingly over half of the updates have been to cars on 44.30.5 which never got the 10.9 upgrade. So some randomization in the order of upgrades.


Speculation but I did not hear seatbelt alert on my first drive. Need to replicate but others may want to test.

Bob Wilson


----------



## chinokie

After 44.30.15 installed I lost lots of functionality:
- No gong on green light
- no regen braking
- no Autosteer or FSD
- no lane visualizations but cars are showing up.

I rebooted a couple times and tried hitting the Power Off but nothing corrected the issues.

Anybody else have any issues?


----------



## tivoboy

chinokie said:


> After 44.30.15 installed I lost lots of functionality:
> - No gong on green light
> - no regen braking
> - no Autosteer or FSD
> - no lane visualizations but cars are showing up.
> 
> I rebooted a couple times and tried hitting the Power Off but nothing corrected the issues.
> 
> Anybody else have any issues?


okay, that's just bonkers bad


----------



## chinokie

tivoboy said:


> okay, that's just bonkers bad


Well, just went for another drive and it was all working okay. All of those problems were gone. Not sure what happened but reboot didn't fix it.


----------



## FRC

chinokie said:


> Well, just went for another drive and it was all working okay. All of those problems were gone. Not sure what happened but reboot didn't fix it.


Sometimes a good sleep will correct things (for both the car and you!).


----------



## tivoboy

chinokie said:


> Well, just went for another drive and it was all working okay. All of those problems were gone. Not sure what happened but reboot didn't fix it.


Frankly, thats even MORE bonkers bad… if it's BAD, it should be at least RELIABLY bad… it shouldn't be bad one moment or one drive and then GOOD the next moment or drive.. RELIABILITY is the key here, the objective is to get it to GOOD RELIABILITY. Could it have BEEN that maybe you were FSD and NOT NOA? Or something like that.?


----------



## JWardell

garsh said:


> It's the temperature.
> 
> My older car has gone back-and-forth a couple times with how much regen is available at lower temperatures.
> I thought Tesla's last batch of "cold weather improvements" had given us stronger regen in colder temperatures again, but it sounds like they've weakened it yet again.
> 
> @JWardell , have you been able to measure any recent changes to regen in cold weather?


Tesla has definitely been making "cold weather improvements" with a lot of updates the last several months, and it seems they are all backward...

Preconditioning your HVAC no longer warms up the battery as it used to, so now it's back to 2018 with no regen on most of my nearby drives despite being sure to turn on precondition before I leave.

I'm not sure it's any worse while driving, back then I would go sometimes weeks without regen.

The solution is to trigger charging before you leave, and when you are driving just navigate to the nearest supercharger. That's what I have been doing most days, so force powertrain heating and get regen back.

At least last year's regen bumps are present...none below 31.5F, but as soon as it rounds up to 32 you get a good 11kW.

It seems a ton of tesla's recent software updates have all hurt the driving experience. Look at their new V11 development video, not a single person driving the car.


----------



## Madmolecule

It has been clear that very few humans have tested the software before sending it to customers for final testing. I even think they should use dos to test dog mode. I feel the just use a simulated crated 15lb dog in the simulator. If they had used real dogs they would have realized the seatbelt design is poor as it mainly cleans the dirt out of my dogs paws, then makes it very difficult for humans to use. 66 is lowest temperature setpoint. Dogs can roll down windows. No music for dogs. No boom box interface ( I don’t have it but I haven’t heard people using it). Can’t disable front seatbelt when dog is riding up front. Rear AC does not automatically turn on when dogs are in rear seat. Some of the gimmick features could be made so much better if Tesla cared about feedback as much as stock price


----------



## msjulie

I've been watching Munroe Live as they tear down a Model S plaid. Nothing but high praise for structure and engineering designs so far; it seems the teams that do the engineering of physical components are top notch but something seems amiss with the teams responsible for the software. 

At first I thought the V11 mess was more about removing drivers from driving, reflecting Elon's dream that their smarter cars would render us all into media consumers, but it seems they didn't just ruin the UI. Deeper changes happened which, while presumably designed to make things better, were not well thought out, badly implemented or both. More reasons to stay on V10


----------



## Mike

And with the more mundane...it's official, 30.11 is making my native Spotify subject to not continuing to play my (saved) playlist songs after the car has been in deep sleep (seems to happen once every four drives or so).

My hack (after the current song and next song play and then it stops) is to open up Spotify and scroll down to where I left off, then it works as it should.


----------



## Avid

garsh said:


> In general, TPMS sensors only work when the vehicle is moving. This wakes up the sensors. They'll usually only start reporting pressures after the car has been moving for several seconds.
> 
> I haven't checked this yet, but my guess would be that Tesla is only showing tire pressures when the vehicle has been moving.


A follow-up, my tire pressure information never showed up while driving, the car image never showed up, essentially tp information was not accessible. This has been corrected by updating to 2022.4. The tp info is now back to where it is normally in the new UI.


----------



## Greg Smith

2021.44.30.14 incoming.


----------



## GDN

Greg Smith said:


> 2021.44.30.14 incoming.


Lets just say this is one weird version number to just appear today. Several installs just showing up.

Edit - added to poll and looking back there are still several versions of this branch active. I thought we'd move forward to 2022 for current versions.


----------



## bwilson4web

Are there release notes for these new versions?

Bob Wilson


----------



## jmart38

bwilson4web said:


> Are there release notes for these new versions?
> 
> Bob Wilson


If it's only the last digits that change it's normally a hot fix with no patch notes… as far I've seen so far anyway


----------



## jmart38

Man 2021.44.30.14 with follow distance 3 pogos so much at low speeds behind other cars stabbing the throttle and then hitting the regen... had to increase to distance 4 so people didn't think I was having a seizure or brake checking them.

edit: even at max follow distance it's now driving like a learner and aggressively accelerating and braking behind a car that is moving a constant speed... might have to figure out how to roll back an update


----------



## garsh

> *2021.44.30.21 Release Notes*
> *FSD Beta v10.10.2 Release Notes*​
> Smoother fork maneuvers and turn-lane selection using high fidelity trajectory primitives.
> Disabled rolling-stop functionality in all FSD Profiles. This behavior used to allow the vehicle to roll through all-way-stop intersections, but only when several conditions were met, including: vehicle speed less than 5.6 mph, no relevant objects/pedestrians/bicyclists detected, sufficient visibility and all entering roads at the intersection have speed limits below 30mph.
> Improved generalized static object network by 4% using improved ground truth trajectories.
> Improved smoothness when stopping for crossing objects at intersections by modeling soft and hard constraints to better represent urgency of the slowdown.
> Enabled lane changing into an oncoming lane to maneuver around static obstacles, when safe to do so.
> Improved smoothness for merge handling by enforcing more consistency with previous cycle's speed control decisions.
> Improved handling of flashing red light traffic controls by adding more caution for events where crossing vehicles may not stop.
> Improved right of way understanding at intersections with better modeling of intersection extents.


----------



## iChris93

I’m instilling 2021.44.30.21, but I haven’t been receiving update notifications since V11. The settings in the app are right.


----------



## tivoboy

2021.44.30.21 why on earth would this be downloading now? Is this the latest FSD Beta build? So many different builds in the wild at the moment it’s getting pretty hard to keep track.


----------



## tivoboy

iChris93 said:


> I'm instilling 2021.44.30.21, but I haven't been receiving update notifications since V11. The settings in the app are right.


Me too, no update from the Tesla app, only got the software downloading update via Tezlab software…not really sure why I'm using that anymore regardless, it's been so deprecated lately.


----------



## undergrove

tivoboy said:


> 2021.44.30.21 why on earth would this be downloading now? Is this the latest FSD Beta build? So many different builds in the wild at the moment it's getting pretty hard to keep track.


We got a notice today on the screen that we needed a firmware upgrade, because ATT would be eliminating 3G service on Feb 22, and without the upgrade we would lose any cell connection. We looked in the Software section and this version was ready for download.


----------



## SysConsultant

Kimmo57 said:


> It was a bit snowy today, so I wanted to turn on the rear fog light on my drive. The way to do it is Menu->lights-> rear fog light. All this while driving and of course the AP doesn't work on snowy roads.
> If "any input is an error", then surely 3 inputs is a design disaster.


I followed your instructions but don't see an option for "rear fog light" on my Dec 2018 M3P. I'm on firmware 2021.44.30.21. I'm not even sure what that would be. In my state, MN, I think displaying a bright white light rearward while driving might not even be legal.

I do have the option to enable the forward facing fog lights. Perhaps that's what you meant to type?


FRC said:


> Encountered an odd quirk today. Running 44.30.5. Returning home from eye doctor on a road I travel often; NOA engaged. About every 2 miles I was getting the blaring red wheel-"Take over immediately" for no reason that I could determine. I've encountered these before, but rarely. After about the fourth such warning, I realized that I was wearing the dark temporary, just been dilated glasses. I presume the car didn't like the inability to see my eyeballs?


I've never had that warning while wearing dark sunglasses in my Dec 2018 M3. Not sure why it's picking on you? I'm also running FSD Beta which is reportedly even more picky about driver attention.


----------



## SysConsultant

tivoboy said:


> 2021.44.30.21 why on earth would this be downloading now? Is this the latest FSD Beta build? So many different builds in the wild at the moment it's getting pretty hard to keep track.


2021.44.30.21 is FSD Beta 10.10.2


----------



## Kizzy

SysConsultant said:


> I followed your instructions but don't see an option for "rear fog light" on my Dec 2018 M3P. I'm on firmware 2021.44.30.21. I'm not even sure what that would be. In my state, MN, I think displaying a bright white light rearward while driving might not even be legal.
> 
> I do have the option to enable the forward facing fog lights. Perhaps that's what you meant to type?
> 
> I've never had that warning while wearing dark sunglasses in my Dec 2018 M3. Not sure why it's picking on you? I'm also running FSD Beta which is reportedly even more picky about driver attention.


It's my understanding that rear fog lights are a not North America thing.


----------



## garsh

SysConsultant said:


> I followed your instructions but don't see an option for "rear fog light" on my Dec 2018 M3P.





Kizzy said:


> It's my understanding that rear fog lights are a not North America thing.


Yep, it's a European car feature.

https://www.cars.com/articles/how-do-rear-fog-lights-work-1420684806751/


----------



## iChris93

SysConsultant said:


> In my state, MN, I think displaying a bright white light rearward while driving might not even be legal.


As others have covered, it's not a NA thing. Additionally, it's not a white light. It's basically having a brake light on but only on one side of the vehicle. I've had German vehicles that had the feature.


----------



## msjulie

undergrove said:


> We got a notice today on the screen that we needed a firmware upgrade, because ATT would be eliminating 3G service on Feb 22, and without the upgrade we would lose any cell connection. We looked in the Software section and this version was ready for download.


Are you speaking about a an S or X?


----------



## undergrove

msjulie said:


> Are you speaking about a an S or X?


Model 3 AWD LR


----------



## tivoboy

undergrove said:


> We got a notice today on the screen that we needed a firmware upgrade, because ATT would be eliminating 3G service on Feb 22, and without the upgrade we would lose any cell connection. We looked in the Software section and this version was ready for download.


oh snap, that's right.. I often have 3G only when in some areas of CA on the western side of the Sierras.. I guess we'll just go to having NO connectivity in those areas.. bummer.


----------



## msjulie

undergrove said:


> Model 3 AWD LR


Hmm I do not have show a notice, I didn't think the 3's had 3G vs LTE antenna.


----------



## Kizzy

tivoboy said:


> oh snap, that's right.. I often have 3G only when in some areas of CA on the western side of the Sierras.. I guess we'll just go to having NO connectivity in those areas.. bummer.


I assume these will be converted for use as LTE?


----------



## undergrove

msjulie said:


> Hmm I do not have show a notice, I didn't think the 3's had 3G vs LTE antenna.


The notice refers to "This LTE-equipped vehicle…" which will need an update to continue working after AT&T changes their service. ATT specifically says that they are phasing out 3G and only 4G capable devices will work after the phase-out. I think LTE will continue. It is a version of 4G. The 3G frequencies are going to be reassigned for 5G use.


----------



## msjulie

undergrove said:


> The notice refers to "This LTE-equipped vehicle…" which will need an update to continue working after AT&T changes their service. ATT specifically says that they are phasing out 3G and only 4G capable devices will work after the phase-out. I think LTE will continue. It is a version of 4G. The 3G frequencies are going to be reassigned for 5G use.


Gotcha, no such detail for mine yet. Guess I'll see


----------



## Kernal7

undergrove said:


> The notice refers to "This LTE-equipped vehicle…" which will need an update to continue working after AT&T changes their service. ATT specifically says that they are phasing out 3G and only 4G capable devices will work after the phase-out. I think LTE will continue. It is a version of 4G. The 3G frequencies are going to be reassigned for 5G use.


3G (aka WCDMA for AT&T, although other cellular carriers had other versions of CDMA for 3G) uses three frequency bands in the US - 850 MHz (aka Band 5), 1700 MHz (aka Band 4) and 1900 MHz (aka Band 2). All of these are already used for 4G (aka LTE) and have been for a few years. Technically there was another type of 4G that was not LTE (it was WiMAX) but I am not aware of it being used anymore and certainly was used in different frequency bands. So 4G-LTE has been using the 3G frequencies for years.

BTW, B2 & B5 are also used for 5G (aka 5GNR n2 and n5). Most 4G-LTE frequency bands have associated 5GNR bands in the US.


----------



## garsh

More info on the whole "software update needed to maintain LTE connection" issue.

Yes, this is due to AT&T sunsetting their 3G service.
Yes, this is affecting cars that were delivered with 4G LTE modems.
It sounds like the issue is that when the cars first connect to the network, they identify to the network using 3G by default. When this identification fails, then you are left with no data connectivity.
More details available here:
https://iotdevices.att.com/att-iot/3GSunset.aspx
Here's the message that shows up on the car's screen:


----------



## bwilson4web

This goes a long way to explaining why voice navigate commands can fail. I get a warning message stating no communication connection.

Speculation, I can enable my iPhone as a hotspot and have connected the car via WiFi. Just I don't have a repeatable place to see the communication error for testing my iPhone as a hotspot.

Bob Wilson


----------



## msjulie

I see that notice now under the nag to update screen. Planning a little wait and see on this since will be out of town anyway this week (not with the Tesla)


----------



## garsh

bwilson4web said:


> This goes a long way to explaining why voice navigate commands can fail. I get a warning message stating no communication connection.


The decommissioning doesn't happen until tomorrow, Feb 22.


----------



## Perscitus

We talked about all this a few years ago (maybe mid 2019?) when ATT and other US-based GSM cell tower operators announced their schedules of dropping 2G/3G this year. 

3/Ys shouldnt be impacted much, unlike old S/Xs with their older pre-4G GSM hardware. AP2.5/2/3.5 equipped vehicles should be ok.


----------



## M3OC Rules

Perscitus said:


> We talked about all this a few years ago (maybe mid 2019?) when ATT and other US-based GSM cell tower operators announced their schedules of dropping 2G/3G this year.
> 
> 3/Ys shouldnt be impacted much, unlike old S/Xs with their older pre-4G GSM hardware. AP2.5/2/3.5 equipped vehicles should be ok.


It sounds like it will affect 3/Ys. Read @garsh post below. I got the notice on my Model 3.



garsh said:


> More info on the whole "software update needed to maintain LTE connection" issue.
> 
> Yes, this is due to AT&T sunsetting their 3G service.
> Yes, this is affecting cars that were delivered with 4G LTE modems.
> It sounds like the issue is that when the cars first connect to the network, they identify to the network using 3G by default. When this identification fails, then you are left with no data connectivity.
> More details available here:
> https://iotdevices.att.com/att-iot/3GSunset.aspx
> Here's the message that shows up on the car's screen:


----------



## msjulie

I just read that some companies (alarm and emergency support) are (just now?) pushing back on the shutdown of 3G. Seems kinda late

Agree Tesla should have implemented this change in newer cars earlier than the V11 branch; the notice on my car does only say 'may' for some reason

Luckily there is fallback of using your phone as hotspot, sigh


----------



## garsh

msjulie said:


> I just read that some companies (alarm and emergency support) are (just now?) pushing back on the shutdown of 3G. Seems kinda late


In fairness, if your device uses 4G, you may not have realized that shutting down 3G would affect it.


----------



## bwilson4web

Hummmm, is anyone making a G3-to-G4/G5 router? … yet.

Bob Wilson


----------



## DocScott

Although I received the notice and pay for premium connectivity, I'm going to try not updating and see what happens. Like @msjulie, I'd rather not get v11 until they fix some of the UI problems.


----------



## DocScott

DocScott said:


> Although I received the notice and pay for premium connectivity, I'm going to try not updating and see what happens. Like @msjulie, I'd rather not get v11 until they fix some of the UI problems.


And so far...I still have connectivity! Streaming music, traffic, voice commands, etc. all worked normally on my drive today, in the suburbs north of New York City. My car is a late-2018 M3.


----------



## Perscitus

Good to know. Plenty of 2G/3G GSM towers in the Tri-State that were put up by others than Bell/Cingular/AT&T, so its likely that your car is catching a signal it needs on one of the shared network towers and then proceeds to a 4G/LTE handshake once registering at a AT&T cell tower hop. 

Will be interesting to see how all this crumbles and if Tesla offers a Connectivity board and/or next AP upgrade to the trailblazer fleet. Like its doing now with the first Model Ss. 

In all likelihood, the UI problems in v11 are unlikely to be fixed, and given the departures from the UI team and recent design decisions, will further degrade with the eventual v11.x or v12.


----------



## M3OC Rules

Perscitus said:


> Good to know. Plenty of 2G/3G GSM towers in the Tri-State that were put up by others than Bell/Cingular/AT&T, so its likely that your car is catching a signal it needs on one of the shared network towers and then proceeds to a 4G/LTE handshake once registering at a AT&T cell tower hop.
> 
> Will be interesting to see how all this crumbles and if Tesla offers a Connectivity board and/or next AP upgrade to the trailblazer fleet. Like its doing now with the first Model Ss.
> 
> In all likelihood, the UI problems in v11 are unlikely to be fixed, and given the departures from the UI team and recent design decisions, will further degrade with the eventual v11.x or v12.


Not sure but could also be because I don't think they are all being shut down at the same time.


----------



## garsh

Perscitus said:


> Will be interesting to see how all this crumbles and if Tesla offers a Connectivity board and/or next AP upgrade to the trailblazer fleet. Like its doing now with the first Model Ss.


What do you mean by "trailblazer fleet"?
It looks like any Tesla vehicle equipped with LTE just requires a software update to 2022.4 or later to function correctly again.


----------



## msjulie

garsh said:


> What do you mean by "trailblazer fleet"?
> It looks like any Tesla vehicle equipped with LTE just requires a software update to 2022.4 or later to function correctly again.


Which sucks cause they've know about this for literal years


----------



## Roci

DocScott said:


> And so far...I still have connectivity! Streaming music, traffic, voice commands, etc. all worked normally on my drive today, in the suburbs north of New York City. My car is a late-2018 M3.


Same here, a full two days later. Either it is able to automatically go to 4G if it fails 3G, or AT&T hasn't actually killed it yet in my area. Knock on wood! 🤜🌴


----------



## tivoboy

Anyone else having issues with voice commands? Everytime I try and use it, I get "connection error"... 2018 M3 LR, TuneIN works fine for radio (about as good as usual which is near crap) but VC not at all.


----------



## msjulie

Well it's Sunday 2/27 and according to the US Fed government website, AT&T 3G is officially shut down. However, my 2018 V10-equipped Model 3 is connecting to what it still labels as LTE just fine

Just got back from a 1200 road trip (not with the Tesla) and the 'duh' of using Apple CarPlay from my phone to the 'old tech' 2017 ICE car we used reminds me I don't have to put V11 on the car anytime soon anyway; V10 allows use of WiFi hotspot so a reprieve from V11 granted

While on this trip, read articles about yet more games coming to Tesla cars (Steam platform). Woo wee, software resources spent on gadgets for what I think must be a minority (though perhaps vocal) vs just plain delivering quality software for *all* drivers.

Sigh. Bad UI decisions followed up by lackluster quality (the V11 bug threads number at least as many as the UI disappointment threads) and Tesla focuses on new game support. I feel like Tesla should start acting a little more grown up; their physical tech is pretty good but ... wow


----------



## SimonMatthews

msjulie said:


> Well it's Sunday 2/27 and according to the US Fed government website, AT&T 3G is officially shut down. However, my 2018 V10-equipped Model 3 is connecting to what it still labels as LTE just fine


Service providers label LTE as 4G (even if it isn't really 4G) -- so it isn't affected by the shutdowns.


----------



## lance.bailey

time for Tesla to start wearing the "big boy pants", @msjulie?


----------



## msjulie

SimonMatthews said:


> Service providers label LTE as 4G (even if it isn't really 4G) -- so it isn't affected by the shutdowns.


Yeah I know, my phone often presents me 5Ge cause AT&T but really, what does it mean about requiring a V11 update? I'd like to know if this is short lived or not


----------



## FRC

msjulie said:


> Yeah I know, my phone often presents me 5Ge cause AT&T but really, what does it mean about requiring a V11 update? I'd like to know if this is short lived or not


Why don't you give Tesla a call? I'm sure they will be more than happy to answer all your questions. Cause, customer service, ya know?

Ha, ha, friggin' ha!!


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## SimonMatthews

msjulie said:


> Yeah I know, my phone often presents me 5Ge cause AT&T but really, what does it mean about requiring a V11 update? I'd like to know if this is short lived or not


The update was required because there was a stage in the connection negotiation that used a 3G connection. The update removed that.


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## msjulie

SimonMatthews said:


> The update was required because there was a stage in the connection negotiation that used a 3G connection. The update removed that.


Interesting. What then explains why it works for me now? Honestly though it's super lame if they really waited till literal days before the shutdown to implement the fix so you could say I'm skeptical, a bit, of this update requirement.


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## msjulie

garsh said:


> It looks like any Tesla vehicle equipped with LTE just requires a software update to 2022.4 or later to function correctly again.


Well still on V10 and still perfectly fine working connectivity here. It makes much more sense to me that Tesla had long ago prepped the modem to operate as we might expect and the warning was a way to try and coerce folks to V11

More time will tell more I guess


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## Kizzy

msjulie said:


> Well still on V10 and still perfectly fine working connectivity here. It makes much more sense to me that Tesla had long ago prepped the modem to operate as we might expect and the warning was a way to try and coerce folks to V11
> 
> More time will tell more I guess


Stay strong. Give Tesla that not upgrading finger-I mean data point.


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## bwilson4web

I noticed that crossing traffic at intersections say turning, in the past would trigger a strong braking action. But lately, turning or crossing traffic is less likely to trigger those previous, strong braking events. It is not perfect as sometimes closer crossing traffic can lead to a strong braking event but not the previous, 50-75 yards we had seen in the past.

Bob Wilson


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## lance.bailey

I thought that I had a car cross the street at a distance that I expected to trigger a strong brake, but one did not happen. I shrugged it off, but perhaps this is new behaviour.


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## msjulie

Kizzy said:


> Stay strong. Give Tesla that not upgrading finger-I mean data point.


. As of today LTE still works, some combo of AT&T not shut down and/or Tesla 'underestimated' the software's ability to do the right thing.


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## ig0p0g0

Super scary today, traveling fsd about 60 mph in moderate traffic and I got take control immediately, fsd and all tacc shut down instantly with a message “autopilot cameras unavailable.” I have no idea what happened but thankfully I had hands on the wheel. Could have been very bad.


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## bwilson4web

Any evidence of a new release this weekend?

Bob Wilson


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## garsh

Over 16% of the fleet is still on a version of 2021.44.


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## Rick Rollens

Ever since a few software updates ago, and continuing today, I do not receive ANY Notifications from my car through the App. Any suggestions for a fix?


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## iChris93

Rick Rollens said:


> Ever since a few software updates ago, and continuing today, I do not receive ANY Notifications from my car through the App. Any suggestions for a fix?


I believe this is a widespread bug on teslas end.


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## bwilson4web

Any credible 'rumors' about the next FSD?

I turned FSD off because of the last 'Tesla threat' message. Regression testing reveals FSD solves some Navigate On AutoPilot (NOA) problems. I like even this FSD beta but I don't want to get sent to FSD Siberia.

Bob Wilson


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## Madmolecule

On a clear night this past weekend on four lane rural highways in good condition I was not having phantom braking like before but I was having a lot of random smooth slowdowns below my speed setpoint for no apparent reason. It was like it was slowing down to think.

I think I also experienced twice after receiving a phone call, my navigation destination was not still active and had to be selected again. This might be user error and I upgraded my software yesterday


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## Ksb466

Madmolecule said:


> On a clear night this past weekend on four lane rural highways in good condition I was not having phantom braking like before but I was having a lot of random smooth slowdowns below my speed setpoint for no apparent reason. It was like it was slowing down to think.
> 
> I think I also experienced twice after receiving a phone call, my navigation destination was not still active and had to be selected again. This might be user error and I upgraded my software yesterday


I get same random slow downs on completely open roads. Not hard stops, but controlled slow for no reason. I have not tested if it will go to 0 yet. At least 20 mph slower though.
I hit pedel and it returns to normal. Noticed it maybe once every couple drives on this version. Was not related to phone calls for me.


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## Ksb466

Sorry, but where on the map do we pull up all local charging option? Used to be a lightning bolt, but no longer see it. 
And if we click the pre- cond bat for supercharging, the message disappears. Does that also mean the pre-cond is suspended? It tries to precondition 2 hrs before arrival on a warm day and I feel like I’m better off stopping it because it makes the efficiency suck for next 2 hrs of driving


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## FRC

Ksb466 said:


> Sorry, but where on the map do we pull up all local charging option? Used to be a lightning bolt, but no longer see it.
> And if we click the pre- cond bat for supercharging, the message disappears. Does that also mean the pre-cond is suspended? It tries to precondition 2 hrs before arrival on a warm day and I feel like I'm better off stopping it because it makes the efficiency suck for next 2 hrs of driving


Tap navigation, then the charging option next to favorites and recents.


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## Kizzy

Ksb466 said:


> Sorry, but where on the map do we pull up all local charging option? Used to be a lightning bolt, but no longer see it.
> And if we click the pre- cond bat for supercharging, the message disappears. Does that also mean the pre-cond is suspended? It tries to precondition 2 hrs before arrival on a warm day and I feel like I'm better off stopping it because it makes the efficiency suck for next 2 hrs of driving


Dismissing the preconditioning message does not stop preconditioning.

I've tested dismissing the message and the motor whine/feel is the same and the power usage remains elevated.


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## garsh

FRC said:


> Tap navigation, then the charging option next to favorites and recents.


@Ksb466, expounding on this a little: If you tap anywhere on the navigation portion of the screen, a menu will appear along the right-hand side of the navigation display. This menu will include the little lightning bolt that you can now press to bring up the charging stations menu.

That menu now includes options to display superchargers and destination chargers.


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## bwilson4web

One trick should be to expand the destination and identify a near address. Cancel the SuperCharger destination and re-enter the adjacent address. However, this maybe less battery friendly.

My understanding is a low SOC, somewhere below 10%, the BMS will turn off the preconditioning load…but I have not studied it.

Bob Wilson


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## garsh

Less than 0.5% of the fleet is still on a version of 2021.44, according to TeslaFi.

Unpinning this thread.


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