# The End of Software Updates As We Know Them



## littlD (Apr 17, 2016)

Looks like soon we'll be getting the ability to check if an update exists for our car and be able to see the download kickoff and proceed.










Source: https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/thr...emand-new-games-and-more.148282/#post-3546863


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

Very interesting. I like the SW on demand, however Tesla just needs to be prepared for all couple hundred thousand of us sitting in our car or on our app, wherever the button is and pressing it repeatedly until it starts to download. 

There is a lot in that release and I don't see beta on it anywhere. Timing and rollout will be nice. No one on Teslafi reporting it yet.


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## littlD (Apr 17, 2016)

GDN said:


> Very interesting. I like the SW on demand, however Tesla just needs to be prepared for all couple hundred thousand of us sitting in our car or on our app, wherever the button is and pressing it repeatedly until it starts to download.
> 
> There is a lot in that release and I don't see beta on it anywhere. Timing and rollout will be nice. No one on Teslafi reporting it yet.


Looks like a Europe first release per several sources.

And... is this the new version of [F5]? I remember pressing that A LOT when I was a 1st day Model 3 reservist!


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## JustTheTip (Jun 7, 2018)

They’re going to regret doing this. lol


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## Tesla Newbie (Aug 2, 2017)

As much as we would like this, it’s hard to understand why Tesla would make this change now. They’ve been cautious with release availability for good reason. The updates are buggy and the risks are great. Everyone on this board knows how many releases they’ve had in the last four weeks alone. Can you imagine the uproar if all of those releases were offered for download and all of the cars sold had the upgrade-related issues described on these pages? It would be a support and public relations nightmare.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

My gut tells me they may start to use their beta groups better, or at least I will suggest they should. Keep a few groups of beta testers for the new stuff that needs testing. The beta testers should abide by the rules they agreed to at sign up and not let anything out of the bag and keep it to themselves. Then once SW updates are tested, corrected if needed, and ready to hit the streets those that want it first can press the button and get it downloaded/installed. Not everyone wants to be an early adopter so they can wait a couple days or a week. When it slows down then Tesla can force it out to the remaining cars.


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## dburkland (Nov 12, 2018)

I’m fine with this as long as they have optimized use of their alpha and beta testing groups to ensure releases are getting properly vetted.


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## JasonF (Oct 26, 2018)

GDN said:


> Very interesting. I like the SW on demand, however Tesla just needs to be prepared for all couple hundred thousand of us sitting in our car or on our app, wherever the button is and pressing it repeatedly until it starts to download.


I would guess that if they do a stepped rollout, you still won't see the download until your group is assigned to it. So they can still moderate the update bandwidth that way.


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## DocScott (Mar 6, 2019)

Tesla Newbie said:


> As much as we would like this, it's hard to understand why Tesla would make this change now. They've been cautious with release availability for good reason. The updates are buggy and the risks are great. Everyone on this board knows how many releases they've had in the last four weeks alone. Can you imagine the uproar if all of those releases were offered for download and all of the cars sold had the upgrade-related issues described on these pages? It would be a support and public relations nightmare.


I know I'm in the minority on this, but I don't think the multiple releases and cautious roll-outs have been primarily an issue of bugginess, and I think a lot of the bugs that are reported after upgrades are not specific to the new firmware.

I think the following things are also going on:

1. Sometimes the process of upgrading doesn't go right, and causes bugs. This definitely happens sometimes, because it's accompanied by a warning of a failed upgrade. But see, for example, this post by sduck, where he advises everyone to do a full set of reboots after each upgrade, suggesting that it would eliminate some apparent upgrade-related bugs. Many people don't do that set of reboots, or wouldn't think of trying it, and might think the new firmware was at fault rather than the process of upgrading. And are there also cases where the reboots don't fix a problem caused by a faulty upgrade (as opposed to faulty firmware)? Maybe.

2. I think sometimes Tesla releases multiple versions of firmware to compare tweaks. Neither version is a bug per se, but should, e.g., a blindspot warning be more or less sensitive? Trying it both ways in different versions lets them see how people react in the real world. It's not beta-testing, exactly, because both are finished releases. It's more like A/B testing, except with the options not rolled out simultaneously.

Yes, there are clearly instances of bugs being found during roll out, a roll out being halted, and then a new version with a bug fix being released. That seemed to happen with some of the dog-mode/sentry-mode interactions when those features were being released, for instance. But in those cases the bugs appeared to be present for _everyone_ with the same firmware version, and weren't just random problems that popped up for some people rather than others.

If I'm right, then there will always be some people with their cars doing iffy things after these upgrades. But allowing everyone at once access to public releases (i.e. not alpha or beta) won't actually be exposing people to firmware that is buggier than what we're getting now.


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## Frully (Aug 30, 2018)

Something that jumps out to me is the last few SC visits I had the techs noted that many many many of their phone calls were requests for new firmware. This could be saving SC/call center/roadside lines from dozens of bajillions of calls.


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## Midnit3 (Oct 8, 2017)

What update version is that?


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## dburkland (Nov 12, 2018)

Midnit3 said:


> What update version is that?


2019.12


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## Ed Woodrick (May 26, 2018)

Or, it's going to be exactly the way it is, except that you will now be able to check, which is helpful if you have to go somewhere for WiFi or using mobile phone


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## Flashgj (Oct 11, 2018)

I think @Ed Woodrick is right, they will roll out pretty much the same way they do now. The only difference is you will see that an update is available before it downloads. This will make it so much easier for those that have poor or no Wi-Fi where they generally park at night. Those in that situation can schedule it and then make sure they are connected to Wi-Fi at the time they have scheduled.


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## Mayhem (May 25, 2018)

It is minority of owners who live on these boards. It is a minority of owners who feverishly want the most bleeding edge update. I would HOPE that this feature would be targeted to those types of owners. The majority of owners could get the normal rolled out GA releases, but those who want the more incremental updates could get them with a request feature... maybe even with a disclaimer that it's not extensively fleet validated or whatever. The only hope I have for this comes from these two Elon tweets:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/981975289403076610

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1095951337664270336


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## $ Trillion Musk (Nov 5, 2016)

This is one of the most underrated aspects of Tesla... the only car company with update-like capabilities of iOS or Android smartphones. 

Can you picture any other automaker operating like an Apple or Google? And on top of that, it manufactures its own “devices”. And you won’t see smartphones driving themselves around traffic anytime soon. Crazy.


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

Looks like 2019.12 just started rolling out here in the U.S., including to some who downloaded 2019.8.5 only a few days ago.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

GDN said:


> Very interesting. I like the SW on demand, however Tesla just needs to be prepared for all couple hundred thousand of us sitting in our car or on our app, wherever the button is and pressing it repeatedly until it starts to download.
> 
> There is a lot in that release and I don't see beta on it anywhere. Timing and rollout will be nice. No one on Teslafi reporting it yet.


I wonder if this does what we all hope and I'm thinking no. Basically the update still has to be staged for your car before you can grab it. All this will really tell you is that the update is staged and give you a monitor for its progress.


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## Tesla Newbie (Aug 2, 2017)

It would be cool if we could configure our tolerance for software change and risk, and Tesla would stage the releases based on our choices. Most of us here would self-classify as Mad Max, but customers like my sister who break into a cold sweat every time their iPhone advises them of a pending update, would choose a far more conservative setting.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

The release notes show that you'll know when a release is available. You can then request it and watch it's progress as it downloads, then install immediately (or delay til later). This is a big step forward and what I was hoping for.


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## DocScott (Mar 6, 2019)

Being able to know which update is available before installing it is huge. (And should have been there all along--it's the way OS updates work for smart phones, for example.) That way, if there's an update that has reported bugs that are unacceptable to a given user, that user can wait.

I did that with the first cold-weather updates last fall, delaying my OK for the update until the newer versions came out, but I just had to guess each time which update I had actually received.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

GDN said:


> The release notes show that you'll know when a release is available. You can then request it and watch it's progress as it downloads, then install immediately (or delay til later). This is a big step forward and what I was hoping for.


I agree but I think we were all hoping that as soon as a release was available (in general) we could push a button and request it rather than waiting for it to make its way to our VIN


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## Mayhem (May 25, 2018)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> I agree but I think we were all hoping that as soon as a release was available (in general) we could push a button and request it rather than waiting for it to make its way to our VIN


Well if nothing else this may be an incremental step to that. Elon has tweeted that software update request was a feature that as coming...


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## Avid (Nov 26, 2018)

This will be a nice feature, but I'm not too worried about it. Since participating in the polls, I have found that when the update gets to me, I'm always in the lower third to get them. I've found that this is just the sweet spot, because I see all you folks get bugs and issues that have to be fixed. I rather not have to deal with that if that means me getting the update later in the cycle or getting one that has been fixed. Even when I got 8.5, after only two days on 8.4, when I updated I was still in the lower third of the group here. 

To all of us lower thirds,


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## littlD (Apr 17, 2016)

Some people love to have the latest. Unfortunately, some of these are the most vocal when bugs are encountered. Goes with the territory.

But it's nice to have the option. And I like having those folks go first and help make the "point releases" better for me.

And sometimes, I'm willing to be that person.

Example: I have some road trips soon, if I can get an update including the supercharging update to speed up V2 to 145 kW, I'd update right away and take the chance on some nasty bug.


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## adam m (Feb 1, 2019)

I definitely agree there should be a maturity level selection for the updates. Some people want the experience to be flawless and some of us will tolerate a little pain. I wish there was also an option for a complete systems power down reboot via a button on the touch screen.


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## ehendrix23 (Jan 30, 2019)

Frully said:


> Something that jumps out to me is the last few SC visits I had the techs noted that many many many of their phone calls were requests for new firmware. This could be saving SC/call center/roadside lines from dozens of bajillions of calls.


On the phone with them right now to get 2019.12. 

Kidding ...


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## millsdmb (Aug 21, 2019)

why did they waste time making this button that does nothing? where is my 28.3.1? it's been 26 days since my last update. advanced idiocy.


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## Frully (Aug 30, 2018)

millsdmb said:


> why did they waste time making this button that does nothing? where is my 28.3.1? it's been 26 days since my last update. advanced idiocy.


28.3.1....the update centered on model S? I can think of a few reasons your model 3 didn't get it.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

millsdmb said:


> why did they waste time making this button that does nothing? where is my 28.3.1? it's been 26 days since my last update. advanced idiocy.


Do you have Full Self Drive? If no, it looks like the new normal is FSD equipped cars get the updates first now.

My wife is still on 24.4 (no AP/ no EAP/ no FSD) while I got 28.2 on 8/5, 28.3 on 8/19 and 28.3.1 on 8/20.


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## msjulie (Feb 6, 2018)

Frully said:


> 28.3.1....the update centered on model S? I can think of a few reasons your model 3 didn't get it.


My 3 got this yesterday FWIW

I have to say, I have not noticed a difference in behavior with the 'advanced' switch but no big deal really


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## ehendrix23 (Jan 30, 2019)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Do you have Full Self Drive? If no, it looks like the new normal is FSD equipped cars get the updates first now.
> 
> My wife is still on 24.4 (no AP/ no EAP/ no FSD) while I got 28.2 on 8/5, 28.3 on 8/19 and 28.3.1 on 8/20.


I have FSD (purchased before March) and got my update to Advanced. Here is my update history:
6/7/19: 2019.20.1
6/19/19: 2019.20.2.1
6/23/19: 2019.20.4.1
6/25/19: 2019.20.4.2

So far updates came in early. Then it stopped. 2019.24.x was being rolled out and never got it. Ended up reaching out to customer service without resolve, only thing they mentioned that nothing was "scheduled" for my car. 
Went to SC on 8/15 and they then pushed 2019.24.4. Now 2019.28.x has been rolling out and still nothing.

I would say something is wrong on Tesla's end with certain cars for the updates. My car is on WiFi every night etc..


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## shareef777 (Mar 10, 2019)

ehendrix23 said:


> I have FSD (purchased before March) and got my update to Advanced. Here is my update history:
> 6/7/19: 2019.20.1
> 6/19/19: 2019.20.2.1
> 6/23/19: 2019.20.4.1
> ...


I'm assuming they're keeping minimum changes before v10 comes out and are focusing on any major bug fixes at this point for v9. Though we had the same dates/versions, but you seemed to have stopped after 6/25. I've also got a software update going on at this moments (assuming it's 2019.28.3, wish Tesla told you the version you're upgrading to BEFORE the actual upgrade).

6/12:2019.20.1
6/19:2019.20.2.1
6/23:2019.20.4.1
6/25:2019.20.4.2
7/10:2019.20.4.4
7/23:2019.24.4


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## ehendrix23 (Jan 30, 2019)

shareef777 said:


> I'm assuming they're keeping minimum changes before v10 comes out and are focusing on any major bug fixes at this point for v9. Though we had the same dates/versions, but you seemed to have stopped after 6/25. I've also got a software update going on at this moments (assuming it's 2019.28.3, wish Tesla told you the version you're upgrading to BEFORE the actual upgrade).
> 
> 6/12:2019.20.1
> 6/19:2019.20.2.1
> ...


Yep, mine indeed just stopped. Interesting how both ours were pretty much spot on same dates.  Did you purchase FSD before March? Do you have FSD? Got software update preference to Advanced? Just wondering.


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## M3OC Rules (Nov 18, 2016)

ehendrix23 said:


> I have FSD (purchased before March) and got my update to Advanced. Here is my update history:
> 6/7/19: 2019.20.1
> 6/19/19: 2019.20.2.1
> 6/23/19: 2019.20.4.1
> ...


If you look on TeslaFi more than 30% of the people are at 2019.24.4 or below. They just don't update everyone all at once. It's not obvious how they decide who gets it. The new advanced update option hasn't obviously changed anything. It's probably nothing to do with your car but just how they roll out the updates.


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## ehendrix23 (Jan 30, 2019)

M3OC Rules said:


> If you look on TeslaFi more than 30% of the people are at 2019.24.4 or below. They just don't update everyone all at once. It's not obvious how they decide who gets it. The new advanced update option hasn't obviously changed anything. It's probably nothing to do with your car but just how they roll out the updates.


Except, I never got 2019.24.4 until I went to SC either. In the past I've always been within the 2-3 days when you see the mass roll-out occurring until June when I ended up always early on. And then it stopped completely. Even when TeslaFi for example was showing only about 5% on 2019.20.x I was still part of that 5% and based on Tesla nothing scheduled for my VIN.

Reached back out to them and we'll see. It sounds like besides the VIN there is another ID associated with the car and in July that ID changed for my car. Wondering if this is related.


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## shareef777 (Mar 10, 2019)

ehendrix23 said:


> Yep, mine indeed just stopped. Interesting how both ours were pretty much spot on same dates.  Did you purchase FSD before March? Do you have FSD? Got software update preference to Advanced? Just wondering.


I ordered mine on 3/8 and received it 3/25 (purchased FSD as part of the original order). Today's update was 2019.28.3.1


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## Needsdecaf (Dec 27, 2018)

msjulie said:


> My 3 got this yesterday FWIW
> 
> I have to say, I have not noticed a difference in behavior with the 'advanced' switch but no big deal really


Yeah, that hasn't done squat. Sometimes I get them on the early part of the curve, sometimes the later part.


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## M3OC Rules (Nov 18, 2016)

ehendrix23 said:


> Except, I never got 2019.24.4 until I went to SC either. In the past I've always been within the 2-3 days when you see the mass roll-out occurring until June when I ended up always early on. And then it stopped completely. Even when TeslaFi for example was showing only about 5% on 2019.20.x I was still part of that 5% and based on Tesla nothing scheduled for my VIN.
> 
> Reached back out to them and we'll see. It sounds like besides the VIN there is another ID associated with the car and in July that ID changed for my car. Wondering if this is related.


It's hard to tell what's going on but how do you know you would have never gotten 2019.24.4? Or maybe you would have just skipped that one and got the next one. It seems like they have big pushes where large groups get pushed an update after its been out for a while like they are now with 2019.28.3.1 but not everyone gets each update. I've been early, late, and skipped. If it was me I would wait a bit and it will probably update eventually unless there is something specific in there you really want. Like you play a lot of chess. But if you find something out I'm curious how it works. I've heard lots of people contact service and get updates but that doesn't mean anything was wrong necessarily. And I sort of get the impression that the service people know how to force the update but don't know the methodology of the rollouts.


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## Ed Woodrick (May 26, 2018)

millsdmb said:


> why did they waste time making this button that does nothing? where is my 28.3.1? it's been 26 days since my last update. advanced idiocy.


Just because it doesn't do anything for you, doesn't mean that it doesn't do something for others and that it may not do anything for you in the future.

Haven't gotten anything in 26 days, OMG, the world is ending. 26 days is actually a pretty short time-frame when you look back at the updates for at least the last year that I've had my car. There are commonly spurts and dry spells, some being months long.


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

ehendrix23 said:


> I would say something is wrong on Tesla's end with certain cars for the updates. My car is on WiFi every night etc..


Agreed. I was in the same boat (stuck on 20.4.2 despite abundant wifi) until today, when a Tesla service rep manually pushed 28.3.1 to my car.

Following the advice of others here, all I did was schedule a service appointment and select "software update" as the issue type, and explain the situation. I did this last night, and the rep texted me this morning. Quick and painless.

I suspect this avenue will work if you're at least a couple of major updates behind, but not as a means of downloading the latest update a few days before you would have gotten it anyway.

Side note: one curiosity I noted was that my car became unreachable via the app and API a few hours after scheduling service. When I unlocked my car the next morning to power it on, the software update started downloading immediately.


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