# Three years later...



## Scubastevo80

It's been 3 years since the model 3 has been announced and now we get the Y - a bigger, less efficient version of the 3 with a tiny 3rd row. What improvements/advances has Tesla made since this car (arguably the 3 in a slightly different form factor) has been introduced outside of software updates? 

Perhaps I'm a bit unimpressed here, but I was expecting Tesla to remain ahead of the competition and include certain things on a $60k car - for example, 300 mi of range, a power trunk/liftgate, and a hitch. The headlights, taillights, seats, steering wheel, touchscreen, wheels, etc all appear the same.


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## mswlogo

I’m glad to see they had restraint and didn’t come up with something to different that would have to go through teething pains. 

They also can’t afford to risk the other product lines. 

They are their best competitor. 

P.S. It does have 300 mile range.


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## Scubastevo80

Fair point but 300 is for rear wheel drive only, 280 for dual motor. Elon was true to his word with his 10% less range.


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## panpanbebe

Model Y has Power trunk lifegate?


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## RoadToLevel5

Tesla claims weekly improvements to the car/production, unlike other manufacturers. This includes improving fit and finish, among other production related improvements.

However, on the car itself, there isn't a lot of hardware improvements to show over the years. I know they improved suspension, changed headliner, improved seat design, and maybe another couple of improvements.

They seem to be more focused on quantity at this point.

I'm sure their backlog of things they can improve based on customer and expert feedback has grown quite long.


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## Scubastevo80

I'm hopeful that once all the demand is cleared, Tesla will start offering more options. I would like more interior color choices, perhaps different wheel options. I don't think Tesla needs 10 exterior colors and 5 interior colors, but it would be nice for people who want to personalize their car a bit more from directly from the manufacturer.


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## Palm Beach Paul

The Y is exactly as promised, 10% bigger, 10% more expensive and 10% less range. I’m a bit disappointed with the range loss but I’m pleased to see a vehicle with a high part-share with the Model 3 so it comes out of the gate sooner and with fewer problems. Tesla can’t take the financial risk or added technical challenges inherent in a ground up design. 

I’m planning to trade my Mercedes GLC for the Y once it is available assuming it has reasonable towing capacity. I’m also hopeful Tesla can squeeze a few more miles of range out of the batteries by the time it is released. A lot can happen in 18 months.


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## garsh

This is the vehicle for all those people who wanted a Model 3 to be a hatchback.

This* IS* the Model 3 hatchback.


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## GDN

Half tempted to merge this thread with the Y Megathread because the talk is really the same, but will let it live for now. Reference this post from just a few minutes ago, I kind of missed the point as well, I thought we'd see a little bigger, etc. but they have a target I believe and it isn't a Model 3 owner, it's other SUV owners. I don't know that the Y goes far enough to really capture this crowd, but it may - https://teslaownersonline.com/threads/model-y-unveil-event-megathread.11564/post-215443


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## RoadToLevel5

Eighteen months is long ways off and yet the interior specs of Y are virtually identical to the current 3. If 18 months from now, Model 3 and Y are shipping with current specs, it wouldn't be much of a hardware improvement.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1054812318096216064


> Model Y
> 
> Includes:
> 
> 
> 12-way power adjustable front and rear heated seats
> Three independently folding 2nd row seats
> Premium audio - 14 speakers, 1 subwoofer, 2 amps, and immersive sound
> Satellite-view maps with live traffic visualization and navigation
> In-car internet streaming music & media
> Internet browser
> Location aware automatic garage door opener
> LED fog lamps
> Tinted glass roof with ultraviolet and infrared protection
> Auto dimming, power folding, heated side mirrors
> Music and media over Bluetooth®
> Custom driver profiles
> Center console with storage, 4 USB ports and docking for 2 smartphones


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## mswlogo

Car manufacturers often run a platform a good 8-10 years. You can’t change things up every 3-4 years after tooling up and designing a platform for probably 3-4 years. 

I’ll bet by the time Y hits production there will be 100’s of refinements over the 3. They don’t have to be visible either.


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## Artdept

I think I would rather have a model 3 with a hatch back.Similar to the volt.


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## garsh

Artdept said:


> I think I would rather have a model 3 with a hatch back.


You can have that. That's called the Model Y.


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## VoltageDrop

garsh said:


> You can have that. That's called the Model Y.


....well kind-of sort-of a "taller" weirder looking Model 3 hatchback......interestingly....some angles definitely look better than others.......I am sure it will sell well regardless.....likely will win over RAV-4 or CRV owners (and the like) looking to get into all-electric propulsion......would I be trading in my 3 or Forester for it? Well....... no.


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## Steve S.

This Model Y on the stage is a safe play. I couldn't agree more that it is the right thing to do to simplify manufacturing by using 75% of the same parts from Model 3. 

My biggest concern is with its range for the AWD and Performance model. I feel like a 300-mile range should be kept as the minimum for higher-trim level Tesla, regardless of what type of vehicle it is. If customers are paying the top dollar for an electric car, they shouldn't compromise on the range at all.


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## Artdept

> If customers are paying the top dollar for an electric car, they shouldn't compromise on the range at all.


I'm not sure if I would say that the y or 3 is top dollar priced. The pricing seems very reasonable to me. Before I bought my volt I test drove a Mercedes, Lexus, and porche. I decided on the volt because it drive the best.

Now, the taycan is a top dollar priced car, As well as a fully speced tesla s or x


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## Steve S.

Artdept said:


> I'm not sure if I would say that the y or 3 is top dollar priced. The pricing seems very reasonable to me. Before I bought my volt I test drove a Mercedes, Lexus, and porche. I decided on the volt because it drive the best.
> 
> Now, the taycan is a top dollar priced car, As well as a fully speced tesla s or x


Sorry, When I say 'top dollar', I mean to compare among the different trim levels of the same vehicle model. I admit that this experience might be based on the traditional automobile manufacturing and selling, in which the more that people are willing to spend on a particular model of car the better trims or more features they would receive with an impression of improving the overall ownership experience. However, that's not the case when comparing LR RWD of Model 3/Y with AWD and Performance of Model 3/Y. Even though the price goes up for AWD and Performance trim and the car arguably drives better with quicker acceleration and top speed, the effective range is compromised.


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## EvanLin

garsh said:


> This is the vehicle for all those people who wanted a Model 3 to be a hatchback.
> 
> This* IS* the Model 3 hatchback.


Hatchback is usually shorter than its sedan cousin.
I think MY is more like "an SUV based on the chassis of M3."

Civic 4D is a sedan. Civic 5D is a hatchback.
CR-V is an SUV with 5 & 5+2 seat configurations. (different chassis tho)
MY is also quite taller than M3. More like an SUV with fastback.


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## Scubastevo80

Responding to my original post - it seems like the Y will come with a hitch and power liftgate, based on youtubers feedback and some photos taken. Will any changes to the cameras be needed to reflect the faster autopilot computer? 

I think, and want, the battery tech to be addressed. While Tesla still has the lead on miles of range per kw, I believe it soon won't matter when the masses begin to adopt EVs. The max "range" figure will be all that counts. If Tesla is only advertising 300 miles, and the competition begins to offer more (irrespective of battery size) - then they will arugably need to make a change to stay ahead of the curve. We see this now even in their own marketing of the cars... gone is the 75d / 100d nomenclature, and replacing it is standard range, mid range and long range. 

I'd also be curious to know if any of the 30% of parts not shared with the 3 are milestones in development for Tesla, or just changes to accomodate the larger form factor.


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## garsh

Scubastevo80 said:


> Responding to my original post - it seems like the Y will come with a hitch and power liftgate


Clarification: The Y appears to include a cutout in the lower bumper so that a hitch can be easily added.

Additionally, Franz has stated that a hitch will be available for the Y and 3.

But I would _not_ assume that a hitch will come standard. Plan on having to pay to add it after delivery.


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## Steve S.

Scubastevo80 said:


> Responding to my original post - it seems like the Y will come with a hitch and power liftgate, based on youtubers feedback and some photos taken. Will any changes to the cameras be needed to reflect the faster autopilot computer?
> 
> I'd also be curious to know if any of the 30% of parts not shared with the 3 are milestones in development for Tesla, or just changes to accomodate the larger form factor.


glad that someone else wants a bigger battery pack or longer range out of the Model Y in about 1-1/2 or 2 years. That being said, I recently watched youtube video by Mr. Nyland in which he put Model X head to head again I-PACE and e-tron on a road test to compare their efficiency (Video link is here: 



). The conclusion is that Tesla wins on highway driving, but not quite in the city comparing with I-PACE and e-tron, because of its aerodynamics. Unlike Model X, I-PACE and e-tron are built on existing vehicle platform and exterior design. So they don't have the advantage like Model X on the aerodynamics as it was designed from scratch. This finding is actually very revealing on how traditional automakers can quickly catch up on power efficiency.

As for the 25% or 30% of parts that are not shared with Model 3, most of them are cosmetic body parts. If we look and think closely, Model Y and Model 3 do not share many common body parts despite the close resemblance. Other than the hood, I actually could not think of another body panel that could be the same.


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## 11thIndian

panpanbebe said:


> Model Y has Power trunk lifegate?


Its a bit fuzzy... but when Elon was getting peppered with questions, I believe the one he answers "Yes" to is about a powered hatch. Go back and watch the livestream again. But I'm pretty sure that's what he's responding to.


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## Scubastevo80

11thIndian said:


> Its a bit fuzzy... but when Elon was getting peppered with questions, I believe the one he answers "Yes" to is about a powered hatch. Go back and watch the livestream again. But I'm pretty sure that's what he's responding to.


I thought I heard that as well. The other thing I looked at was the "introducing the model Y video" and its hard to tell, but the shocks on the hatch look model 3 thing as opposed to what we see on the S and X. I guess we'll find out as we get closer to delivery. This feature, on a $50k car, is a deal breaker for my wife. She's in and out of the trunk with our two small kids so much, she'd go nuts if she had to manually open and close it like we do on the 3.


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