# Silly Subject of the Weekend: Why is 3rd row seating the most important car feature now?



## JasonF

I've been watching a few car reviews on youtube lately, and noticed that with the SUV segment, all of the reviews now spend an unusual amount of time talking about _3rd row seating_. They're spending more time on it than the entertainment system, engine, or even driving experience. Just a short time ago it used to be reviewed kind of like "you can order an optional 3rd row, don't bother, it sucks".

So if anyone knows, why did 3rd row seating become the absolute required feature for any car review/car purchase? Of all the ridiculous "required features"...


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## FRC

I've gotta agree with you @JasonF. For me, even second row seating is unimportant.


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## shareef777

Personally, I've been waiting for the 3rd row Y to replace our current Pilot (Model X is way out of our price range). We tried a small SUV (CR-V) for a year (after having a minivan as a 2nd car for a decade), but found it far too inconvenient to have to take two cars on the occasion we have kids sleep over or want to carry an extra person after we get to a destination (and the 2nd car isn't with us). Or a parent calls and asks us to pickup their kids from school because they're caught up at work/traffic. Essentially SUVs are replacing the minivan, but they need the 3rd row to completely do that.


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## JasonF

shareef777 said:


> Personally, I've been waiting for the 3rd row Y to replace our current Pilot (Model X is way out of our price range). We tried a small SUV (CR-V) for a year (after having a minivan as a 2nd car for a decade), but found it far too inconvenient to have to take two cars on the occasion we have kids sleep over or want to carry an extra person after we get to a destination (and the 2nd car isn't with us). Or a parent calls and asks us to pickup their kids from school because they're caught up at work/traffic. Essentially SUVs are replacing the minivan, but they need the 3rd row to completely do that.


Unless I'm in the wrong area of the country to notice, though, I don't _think_ that kind of situation is extremely common. Most of the SUV's with third rows I see in the wild here are driven by exactly one person. It could be that's just in Florida, maybe a majority of people in the rest of the country have 4-6 kids and carpool more of them regularly.


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## shareef777

JasonF said:


> Unless I'm in the wrong area of the country to notice, though, I don't _think_ that kind of situation is extremely common. Most of the SUV's with third rows I see in the wild here are driven by exactly one person. It could be that's just in Florida, maybe a majority of people in the rest of the country have 4-6 kids and carpool more of them regularly.


We didn't buy the Pilot because we routinely haul 5+ people around, we bought it because we occasionally HAVE to haul 5+ people around. Of the 10k+ miles on it, I'd say less than 1k had more than 5 passengers. But those situations did exist so a non 3rd tow vehicle wouldn't have worked.


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## Garlan Garner

Well.....

The Model Y third row is just about big enough for a small dog. ( so I hear ).


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## shareef777

Garlan Garner said:


> Well.....
> 
> The Model Y third row is just about big enough for a small dog. ( so I hear ).


Like Jason said, a lot of people rarely need that third row. So even though it's small and uncomfortable, as long as it allows someone to safely/legally carry an extra couple people, it'd get the job done. So yeah, I'd sacrifice the comfort of people sitting in the 3rd row so that our second vehicle is a Tesla 😂.


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## JasonF

shareef777 said:


> We didn't buy the Pilot because we routinely haul 5+ people around, we bought it because we occasionally HAVE to haul 5+ people around. Of the 10k+ miles on it, I'd say less than 1k had more than 5 passengers. But those situations did exist so a non 3rd tow vehicle wouldn't have worked.


What I mean is, you knew it was probably going to happen because you _do_ carpool kids occasionally. Like if you buy a car specifically for Uber Black, a third row might be a requirement, even though taking 6 people somewhere might only happen occasionally.

Still though, I would think those two situations would be a rarity, yet enough people demand a 3rd row that car reviews have started covering it extensively. Which means either the two situations above are way more common than I thought, or this is a fashion thing I don't understand?


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## FRC

I suspect it's a "better to have it and not need it" kind of thing.


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## TomT

Yep, we have no need for a third row and generally only use the second row for coats and packages and the like. Don't need it, don't want it.



FRC said:


> I've gotta agree with you @JasonF. For me, even second row seating is unimportant.


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## Bigriver

This conversation is clearly between people who have kids and those who don’t have kids. If you have kids, that 3rd row is awfully close to a necessity, no matter how many kids you have. That carpooling thing isn’t an occasional thing, it is a very frequent part of life if your kid(s) are involved with any sort of team or group. Could you possibly get by without the 3rd row? Yes. But does it have a substantial impact on your functionality? Yes. Furthermore, it is unbelievably valuable to be the parent driving, as you learn all kinds of things from the kids chatting (since they somehow, magically forget an adult with ears is present). That alone is worth seeking out a car with ample seating.


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## JasonF

Bigriver said:


> That carpooling thing isn't an occasional thing, it is a very frequent part of life if your kid(s) are involved with any sort of team or group.


Is it possible, though, that you get chosen for carpool duty _because_ you have a huge SUV with 3rd row seating? If you had no third row, or a smaller SUV, would they not bother even asking you to transport kids? Or would they scold you for not having a large enough vehicle, and browbeat you into getting one?

That explanation makes more sense, but what's strange about it is the heavy 3rd row coverage in car videos/reviews just started sometime in 2020. I understand that people with kids, especially ones who join group things, find 3 rows invaluable, but I would guess that they _always have_. Could it be as simple as that the car companies had that need right under their nose and decided to finally embrace it? Or is it some kind of peer pressure/car fashion trend that's occuring this year?


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## GDN

I would agree it is likely between those with and those without kids. There were 4 kids in our family and in 1973 we ended up with a station wagon - so classy, all 3 seats. I'll say though we had some leg room back there. Other than the two or three largest SUV's it is hard to see how these 3rd row seats are useful today, I understand if you truly need them, but they almost seem dangerous there is so little leg room. For young ones though 4 to 8 or so maybe they are worth it.


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## TomT

When I was growing up there was me and my brother and my parents. We got along great with only two rows of seats. Never had a need for more. Still don't.



Bigriver said:


> Could you possibly get by without the 3rd row?


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## FRC

As @JasonF's thread title states, this is a silly argument. If you need(or think you need) 3rd row seating; then it's important. If you don't need(or think you don't need) it; then it's unimportant.


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## shareef777

JasonF said:


> Is it possible, though, that you get chosen for carpool duty _because_ you have a huge SUV with 3rd row seating? If you had no third row, or a smaller SUV, would they not bother even asking you to transport kids? Or would they scold you for not having a large enough vehicle, and browbeat you into getting one?
> 
> That explanation makes more sense, but what's strange about it is the heavy 3rd row coverage in car videos/reviews just started sometime in 2020. I understand that people with kids, especially ones who join group things, find 3 rows invaluable, but I would guess that they _always have_. Could it be as simple as that the car companies had that need right under their nose and decided to finally embrace it? Or is it some kind of peer pressure/car fashion trend that's occuring this year?


I think this is because the industry as a whole has been moving away from sedans and towards SUVs. It's the reason Ford is shuttering all non-SUV vehicles (outside the Mustang) and moving to crossovers and SUVs only.

As that trending continues reviewers are looking at a greater number of "features" of the different types of SUVs. And as FRC stated, people are likely going the "I'd rather have it and not need it, vs not have it and need it" and so looking for reviews of that feature when deciding on a vehicle.


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## Garlan Garner

shareef777 said:


> Like Jason said, a lot of people rarely need that third row. So even though it's small and uncomfortable, as long as it allows someone to safely/legally carry an extra couple people, it'd get the job done. So yeah, I'd sacrifice the comfort of people sitting in the 3rd row so that our second vehicle is a Tesla 😂.


Comfort?










That's a prescription for claustrophobia - unless you have no legs and no neck.


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## shareef777

Garlan Garner said:


> Comfort?
> 
> View attachment 36447
> 
> 
> That's a prescription for claustrophobia - unless you have no legs and no neck.


Honestly, that doesn't look as bad as I'd of thought. With the Y I'd be able to put my 7/11 year old boys in the third row, my parents and 15yo daughter in the middle, and my wife and I up front. We're talking about local trips taking under an hour. Odds are that the 3rd row won't see anyone over 100lbs and taller than 5ft, with a majority of the trips taking 15-20min. Which is a huge added versatility for the $3k Tesla is asking. At worst, you fold it down and go back to being a regular Y.


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## Ob1clyde

New to the group here, model Y with 3rd row ordered. We have young kids, 10-11 and with the rotation of friends and option to carpool it just makes sense. We often have 5-6 people in a car, my 10 year old fit nicely in the back seat and even if it’s just our two kids, on a long road trip they could each have their own space. And then utilize a roof rack for additional cargo.


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## gary in NY

I wonder how we, a family of six, survived the '60s with one 2-door car (not a station wagon) and no third row seating?


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## JCE

gary in NY said:


> I wonder how we, a family of six, survived the '60s with one 2-door car (not a station wagon) and no third row seating?


Different laws and expectations? I imagine back then you could cram people into bench like seats and not worry about seat belts.

I would never consider driving someone today without their own seat/seat belt.


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## Bigriver

gary in NY said:


> I wonder how we, a family of six, survived the '60s with one 2-door car (not a station wagon) and no third row seating?


One contributing factor would be that seat belts were only a vague suggestion back then. Also child seats and booster seats weren't required and I don't think often used.


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## garsh

gary in NY said:


> I wonder how we, a family of six, survived the '60s with one 2-door car (not a station wagon) and no third row seating?


Heh. Back in the 70s, my dad drove us across Pennsylvania in our pickup truck. My sister and I sat in the bed with a couple of sleeping bags and my dad's stern warning to "stay towards the front".

Yes, I too wonder how in the world we survived under those conditions.


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## Madmolecule

Who needs airbags when you can just use your arm to keep your kids head from hitting the metal dash, all while smoking a cigarette, after knocking back a few.

I think this topic is why the Y and the 3 wI’ll head in different directions in the future. I do believe in 2022 they will release a performance model 3 coupe. It will only have two seats with a space for a dog or large purse in the back. An entry-level roadster.


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## iChris93

gary in NY said:


> I wonder how we, a family of six, survived the '60s with one 2-door car (not a station wagon) and no third row seating?


I'll guess that less did.


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## TomT

I love all the third row SUVs I see driving around with only one or two people in them! What a waste of resources!


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## gary in NY

JCE said:


> Different laws and expectations? I imagine back then you could cram people into bench like seats and not worry about seat belts.
> 
> I would never consider driving someone today without their own seat/seat belt.


True, different laws, but we had seat belts. My father was strict about that. He was in field service and had a huge territory and drove many thousands of miles a year, and the seat belt saved his life in the only collision I recall him having. But there were no child seats, booster seats, air bags, anti-lock brakes, crumple zones, etc. Cars seemed bigger, and we were smaller. When we went somewhere, we didn't take half our possessions, but we hardly ever went anywhere.

We are much safer today, which is why I really do wonder how we survived such unsafe practices (and yes, some did not).


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## JasonF

TomT said:


> I love all the third row SUVs I see driving around with only one or two people in them! What a waste of resources!


That's what prompted me to start this topic in the first place - noticing all of these huge 3-row SUV's driving around empty, and also hearing from both American customers and manufacturers that 3 rows is absolutely essential when buying a vehicle. Before that, I used to think the huge SUV trend was because people were trying to get the maximum amount of cubic feet of space for the money, but now I know that wasn't it.


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## garsh

TomT said:


> I love all the third row SUVs I see driving around with only one or two people in them! What a waste of resources!


Do you only buy features that you'll use on the majority of drives, or do you sometimes pay for features that you only need a few times per year?

I had bought a minivan with 7 seats, not because my wife and I haul around 5 kids regularly, but because sometimes we're taking their friends or their grandparents along with us. But often there will be just a single person in the big minivan because I can't see any reason not to use the 7-passenger vehicle for other purposes once I own it.


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## JCE

garsh said:


> Do you only buy features that you'll use on the majority of drives, or do you sometimes pay for features that you only need a few times per year?
> 
> I had bought a minivan with 7 seats, not because my wife and I haul around 5 kids regularly, but because sometimes we're taking their friends or their grandparents along with us. But often there will be just a single person in the big minivan because I can't see any reason not to use the 7-passenger vehicle for other purposes once I own it.


I recently picked up my AWD 7-seat Y and love it. Most of the time I'm driving myself to and from work but got the 7-seater for the odd occasion. The specific situation I had in mind when I ordered the car was being able to take me, my wife, the 2 kids, my sister and her husband around in 1 car when they visit.

So don't really plan on using it much but handy when I need it. Don't really see how this is a "waste of resources".


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## JasonF

JCE said:


> I recently picked up my AWD 7-seat Y and love it. Most of the time I'm driving myself to and from work but got the 7-seater for the odd occasion. The specific situation I had in mind when I ordered the car was being able to take me, my wife, the 2 kids, my sister and her husband around in 1 car when they visit.
> 
> So don't really plan on using it much but handy when I need it. Don't really see how this is a "waste of resources".


If you actually use it, I wouldn't consider it a waste of resources. The ones that _are_ a waste of resources are the people who buy an 8 passenger Suburban because maybe someday they might start a carpool, or take the whole extended family on a driving trip, or maybe they might need to bring home wallboard from Lowes. But then they fly to every vacation, and drive to work in it daily alone.


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