# App integration severly lacking!



## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

I know, I know... Tesla isn't done with their software yet. I'm still holding out hope that many of the media features I've come to expect and/or hope for in cars will be fully functional by the time it goes out to the general public.

That being said, there are still a lot of features that would be very disappointing to be missing on a $60K car.

1) AM radio - Tunein is a good alternative, but it just doesn't offer everything plain old AM radio has. Two of the main stations I listen to during my commute is an iheartradio exclusive. Maybe just maybe they'll add that app as well!? I'm not sure if this would be possible, but ideally there would be a seamless integration where you can easily jump between channels on the steering wheel controls regardless of the input source. (ex: Jump to one AM station on tune-in, jump to a different AM station on iheartradio, jump to an FM station, jump to XM station... etc)
2) FM radio - similar to the above. I anticipate FM will actually be activated in software at some point. That would be crazy not to have it.
3) SiriusXM - I heard that it's confirmed there is no SiriusXM antenna on the Model 3. In that case, it would be really great if we could stream it over LTE!
4) Waze - Oh how this would be amazing! I use waze allll the time. I don't particularly think it's better than any other NAV, but it's necessary for the traffic/police reports! It reroutes around traffic better than anything out there! Without this, it's gonna be really annoying to look down at my phone all the time. There have been rumors for some time about tesla adding this, but so far no word. 
5) web browser for yelp and other useful tools

Hope Tesla is listening! It'd be really disappointing to not have the channels I listen to most often on my new car.


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## TrevP (Oct 20, 2015)

The main things to remember here is that they're using a new CPU for the onboard MCU on Model 3, it's an Intel x86 architecture. On Model S and X they're using an NVIDIA ARM Tegra series. Porting over software and drivers is taking some time.

Also, AM radio is not present on the Model X either due to too much interference from the AC motors. Event he BMW i3 doesn't have AM radio because of the same issue. Tesla does offer AM radio streaming however to get around that problem.

Yeah Waze would be awesome but that's owned by Google and would require significant development time and effort, maybe even licensing, to implement. Tesla has priorities and that's not one of them. AP 2 is way behind schedule so you can imagine most of their efforts are behind that getting the Model3 software finished.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

I'll be happy if I can just find a good non-window phone mount for the 3.


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## roflwaffle (Sep 25, 2017)

Switching between multiple sources (terrestrial FM, streaming FM, USB, and whatever else they have) should be relatively straightforward. There might be some delay if different sources require different players, but it's straightforward to set up.

I'm hoping for bluetooth streaming/controls, so I can just pair whatever device (eg small arm board with a bunch of songs and maybe SDR (software defined radio) that can be controlled from the steering wheel/screen.

I do like Waze for traffic routing, but the ads are getting a little ridiculous at this point. They're also lagging behind other nav apps like OsmAnd in the interface/feature department.


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## M3OC Rules (Nov 18, 2016)

TrevP said:


> The main things to remember here is that they're using a new CPU for the onboard MCU on Model 3, it's an Intel x86 architecture. On Model S and X they're using an NVIDIA ARM Tegra series. Porting over software and drivers is taking some time.


I agree that's a lot of work but don't they have the S and X on the 2.5 hardware now and isn't the Intel processor in that hardware or do we think there are two versions of the 2.5 hardware?


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## roflwaffle (Sep 25, 2017)

Isn't the MCU separate from the AP 2.5 hardware? Maybe not though.

In terms of porting the software, my experience is that x86_64 tends to be better supported than arm, but new drivers from the manufacturer (usually binary blobs) can be aggravating regardless of arch.


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## Petra (Sep 12, 2017)

ng0 said:


> I know, I know... Tesla isn't done with their software yet. I'm still holding out hope that many of the media features I've come to expect and/or hope for in cars will be fully functional by the time it goes out to the general public.
> 
> That being said, there are still a lot of features that would be very disappointing to be missing on a $60K car.
> 
> ...


Eh, meaningful phone and app integration has been on the wish list for the Model S for years now... so, I'm not holding my breath on that front.

As for your other points:
1) As Trev mentioned, there's no AM on the Model X, it doesn't work great in the S (in my limited tinkering with the radio functions), and there are other EVs lacking AM radio as well. I don't expect AM radio to make an appearance on the Model 3. Yes, there's a lot that could be done to improve the media playback experience (see my opening comment).
2) FM radio should show up via software update at some point, or so I'd expect.
3) People use Sirius? I just wish they'd stop sending me junk mail about activating Sirius in cars I sold years ago...
4) See my opening comment.
5) Oh, there's no web browser in the Model 3 yet? Interesting. I'm not sure whether that's an improvement over the S/X's dumpster fire of a browser...


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## M3OC Rules (Nov 18, 2016)

roflwaffle said:


> Isn't the MCU separate from the AP 2.5 hardware? Maybe not though.
> 
> In terms of porting the software, my experience is that x86_64 tends to be better supported than arm, but new drivers from the manufacturer (usually binary blobs) can be aggravating regardless of arch.


This from Electek shows a diagram that says they integrated for thermal management(separate electrically for security I think) but I'm not sure if anyone has verified it.


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## TesLou (Aug 20, 2016)

garsh said:


> I'll be happy if I can just find a good non-window phone mount for the 3.


Same same. I'm patiently waiting to see a video with a phone mounted in the console (the Tesla OEM mounting position) to see the visibility factor in terms of the driver perspective.


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

Petra said:


> 5) Oh, there's no web browser in the Model 3 yet? Interesting. I'm not sure whether that's an improvement over the S/X's dumpster fire of a browser...


there has been no evidence there would be a web browser in the 3. 
one theory, which seems quite likely, is that most all of the Model S/X bug bounty's have been security issues found thru the browser. Seems if they really want to ensure the cars have less chance of being hacked, eliminating the most likely path to it, that also is a dumpster fire in its own right, would be the way to go.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

I have a very different viewpoint. 

I think Tesla’s UI is fantastic and the last thing I would want is something like Waze on the screen. Also it’s the last thing Tesla would want. Now that said, I do like Waze for the audible alerts. 

My plan is to exclusively run Apple Music via Bluetooth audio and then run Waze as well. I get to keep my phone tucked away in the dock/cradle area and I get everything. 

Nice UI for Maps from Tesla. 

Audible alerts from Waze. 

Music from Apple Music. I’m positive the steering wheel controls will be functional for the iPhone and there is always “Hey Siri...” as well. 

Whether Tesla has the app you want or not, you can always run it on your phone... using iheartradio as the example. 

I would agree the car should have FM though I’ll definitely never use it


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

Personally I would've happier if they provided standard CarPlay and Android Auto which solves most of these problems. 

As of right now Tesla doesn't even offer iPod integration for music playback control. Something that has been on most cars now for approaching a decade.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

TrevP said:


> The main things to remember here is that they're using a new CPU for the onboard MCU on Model 3, it's an Intel x86 architecture. On Model S and X they're using an NVIDIA ARM Tegra series. Porting over software and drivers is taking some time.
> 
> Also, AM radio is not present on the Model X either due to too much interference from the AC motors. Event he BMW i3 doesn't have AM radio because of the same issue. Tesla does offer AM radio streaming however to get around that problem.
> 
> Yeah Waze would be awesome but that's owned by Google and would require significant development time and effort, maybe even licensing, to implement. Tesla has priorities and that's not one of them. AP 2 is way behind schedule so you can imagine most of their efforts are behind that getting the Model3 software finished.


Great points! I really hope a lot of the delay has to do with the porting over of software and drivers, but we still don't know how much functionality is missing (if any). I know companies are starting to drop AM, but if they do, I'd hope they would have something more than just tune-in as an AM streaming alternative. Like I said, they need to at least add iheartradio since many of the stations are exclusive to that.

If they're currently using google maps, I'd hope that google would let them integrate waze into their cars as well.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> I have a very different viewpoint.
> 
> I think Tesla's UI is fantastic and the last thing I would want is something like Waze on the screen. Also it's the last thing Tesla would want. Now that said, I do like Waze for the audible alerts.
> 
> ...


I agree that the waze audible alerts are most important, but it would be really awkward to have to look down to get the details about what it's alerting you to. I'd rather use one nav rather than have a useless one on my screen and the one i use every day on my phone that's down where it's not convenient to look at.


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

We have known there would be no over the air AM radio since the specs were released in July. That is not going to change or be added, so get used to the idea of tunein (or other apps over your phone) for whatever you are looking for on AM broadcasts.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

voip-ninja said:


> Personally I would've happier if they provided standard CarPlay and Android Auto which solves most of these problems.
> 
> As of right now Tesla doesn't even offer iPod integration for music playback control. Something that has been on most cars now for approaching a decade.


Have you ever used CarPlay? I discontinued it in my car, I felt it was pretty poor. Similar to my first reply, I would say Tesla would be crazy to give up screen real estate to Apple or Android.



ng0 said:


> I agree that the waze audible alerts are most important, but it would be really awkward to have to look down to get the details about what it's alerting you to. I'd rather use one nav rather than have a useless one on my screen and the one i use every day on my phone that's down where it's not convenient to look at.


I hear you -- the Waze audible alerts are great, but to me the UI is clunky. The Nav UI on the Tesla with high quality images is too nice to cover up


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

ng0 said:


> If they're currently using google maps, I'd hope that google would let them integrate waze into their cars as well.


Traffic from waze is already in google maps, and expect that is the data that tesla is pulling into their nav system. What in waze are you thinking will be missing from the tesla nav/traffic?

Disclaimer, I use waze every time I get in my car (sound off). If commuting so I know when I will arrive, if going somewhere unfamiliar for the navigation. Most always for traffic. If that traffic info is ported over to the tesla nav from google maps, which is fed from waze, I have no issue dropping waze on day one of driving the Model 3.
Our distracted driver laws are very high profile right now in both OR and WA (where I mostly drive) and you can not touch a device at all while on a public street. Stopped in traffic, at a light, or 70mph are all ticketed. So I don't care about the alerts or comments in waze, just the arrival time.


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Have you ever used CarPlay? I discontinued it in my car, I felt it was pretty poor. Similar to my first reply, I would say Tesla would be crazy to give up screen real estate to Apple or Android.
> 
> I hear you -- the Waze audible alerts are great, but to me the UI is clunky. The Nav UI on the Tesla with high quality images is too nice to cover up


Yes, I have CarPlay in one of our cars and have used it on quite a few rental cars. CarPlay is pretty handy when a manufacturer fails to do proper iPhone media playback, gives you access to all of your apps like Spotify via the CarPlay interface and makes it possible to listen to and respond to text messages.

I would say it's not great, but something like 10X better than anything Tesla does currently for phone integration in their cars.

The sticking point would be giving up the full screen to the CarPlay or AA interfaces but I imagine Tesla would be able to work with Apple & Google to solve their objections on that. CarPlay already is allowed to run behind the manufacturers interface and is brought back with a single icon to the forefront.

I think this is more about Tesla not wanting to give up a source of possible revenue and cede ground in the automobile to competitors.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

MelindaV said:


> Traffic from waze is already in google maps, and expect that is the data that tesla is pulling into their nav system. What in waze are you thinking will be missing from the tesla nav/traffic?
> 
> Disclaimer, I use waze every time I get in my car (sound off). If commuting so I know when I will arrive, if going somewhere unfamiliar for the navigation. Most always for traffic. If that traffic info is ported over to the tesla nav from google maps, which is fed from waze, I have no issue dropping waze on day one of driving the Model 3.
> Our distracted driver laws are very high profile right now in both OR and WA (where I mostly drive) and you can not touch a device at all while on a public street. Stopped in traffic, at a light, or 70mph are all ticketed. So I don't care about the alerts or comments in waze, just the arrival time.


I'm with you! The Tesla (using Google) should provide the same ETA for navigation.

I want Waze audible alerts primary for police


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

voip-ninja said:


> Yes, I have CarPlay in one of our cars and have used it on quite a few rental cars. CarPlay is pretty handy when a manufacturer fails to do proper iPhone media playback, gives you access to all of your apps like Spotify via the CarPlay interface and makes it possible to listen to and respond to text messages.
> 
> I would say it's not great, but something like 10X better than anything Tesla does currently for phone integration in their cars.
> 
> ...


Your last sentence is possible true. The other way I see it though is that part of the Tesla wow factor is the 17" screen in S/X and the 15" screen in 3 literally being everything. Giving away a portion of the screen that is everything is tough.

With steering wheel controls for audio and "Hey Siri..." for everything else though you should be more than covered by Tesla's UI. I was quick to disable CarPlay in my car. It was unstable but worse yet just sloppy I thought.


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> I'm with you! The Tesla (using Google) should provide the same ETA for navigation.
> 
> I want Waze audible alerts primary for police


yeah - I have zero need for the police warning 99% of the time. except for the once a quarter or so ptld police choose to monitor the HOV lane (that I don't use) and then it's more to know I will be seeing a ton of people pulled over that day that I normally am cussing at for using the HOV when they shouldn't be.


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

I used to listen to music through my phone and Sirius, but ever since I got my Tesla, I have not and I don't miss it. Although the Slacker radio has its problems, its been more than fine for music for two years. 

You literally click the 'Talk' button on the steering wheel and say any song or artist and the car streams it on its own cellular antenna. Then it creates a station around that song or artists and streams similar songs like Pandora or Spotify does. You can search for stations by genre or type, and there's also some news and talk radio. It even plays ABC news updates every few songs, if you want that on. Additionally, as you like and unlike songs, it learns your preferences and has a "Favorites" station that plays across all genres based on what you like/don't like. I keep it on Favorites 90% of the time when I'm alone in the car, because its the music I like. If something I don't like comes on, I click next or dislike and the next song comes on. I want to hear a particular song and I just tell the car to play it. Why would I fiddle with my iPhone for music? 

If you want to listen to Howard Stern, or an audiobook, or something, you would need to do a workaround through your phone. Otherwise KISS unless you can't live without your Apple Music or Sirius.


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

danzgator said:


> I used to listen to music through my phone and Sirius, but ever since I got my Tesla, I have not and I don't miss it. Although the Slacker radio has its problems, its been more than fine for music for two years.
> 
> You literally click the 'Talk' button on the steering wheel and say any song or artist and the car streams it on its own cellular antenna. Then it creates a station around that song or artists and streams similar songs like Pandora or Spotify does. You can search for stations by genre or type, and there's also some news and talk radio. It even plays ABC news updates every few songs, if you want that on. Additionally, as you like and unlike songs, it learns your preferences and has a "Favorites" station that plays across all genres based on what you like/don't like. I keep it on Favorites 90% of the time when I'm alone in the car, because its the music I like. If something I don't like comes on, I click next or dislike and the next song comes on. I want to hear a particular song and I just tell the car to play it. Why would I fiddle with my iPhone for music?
> 
> If you want to listen to Howard Stern, or an audiobook, or something, you would need to do a workaround through your phone. Otherwise KISS unless you can't live without your Apple Music or Sirius.


That's great and all but quite a lot of us drive around quite a bit in places with no cellular reception.

I have 15GB of music on my personal device for this reason. While it's possible to skip tracks with the controls in a Tesla it is not possible to navigate playlists, browse for a song I'm hankering for, etc.

All of these things are possible in a car with CarPlay or with even rudimentary iPod navigation over BT or USB.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

danzgator said:


> I used to listen to music through my phone and Sirius, but ever since I got my Tesla, I have not and I don't miss it. Although the Slacker radio has its problems, its been more than fine for music for two years.
> 
> You literally click the 'Talk' button on the steering wheel and say any song or artist and the car streams it on its own cellular antenna. Then it creates a station around that song or artists and streams similar songs like Pandora or Spotify does. You can search for stations by genre or type, and there's also some news and talk radio. It even plays ABC news updates every few songs, if you want that on. Additionally, as you like and unlike songs, it learns your preferences and has a "Favorites" station that plays across all genres based on what you like/don't like. I keep it on Favorites 90% of the time when I'm alone in the car, because its the music I like. If something I don't like comes on, I click next or dislike and the next song comes on. I want to hear a particular song and I just tell the car to play it. Why would I fiddle with my iPhone for music?
> 
> If you want to listen to Howard Stern, or an audiobook, or something, you would need to do a workaround through your phone. Otherwise KISS unless you can't live without your Apple Music or Sirius.


I just have a preference for Apple Music and it's database, but essentially same concept -- I don't actually touch my iPhone while I'm driving. I create smart playlists and then just used next/back on the steering wheel controls. Beyond that "Hey Siri..."

Also, you don't have to worry about cell service since you can store songs locally to play without blips.


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

@danzgator, to @voip-ninja's point, in those 2 years of your ownership, how has the car's cellular coverage been in regards to the audio? I've have sat radio for my main audio (plus phone sources like audiobooks) for well over 10 years and have not had to think about where I am to have continuous playing audio. 
Do you end up in dead zones with zero coverage? (maybe depending on the type of driving/trips you have taken) if so, how often? does it seem the system buffers enough to at least even out the smaller dead/weak areas? what would happen in a mountain pass (I know there are not any in FL...) where there may not be cell coverage for 30 minutes?


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

MelindaV said:


> @danzgator, to @voip-ninja's point, in those 2 years of your ownership, how has the car's cellular coverage been in regards to the audio? I've have sat radio for my main audio (plus phone sources like audiobooks) for well over 10 years and have not had to think about where I am to have continuous playing audio.
> Do you end up in dead zones with zero coverage? (maybe depending on the type of driving/trips you have taken) if so, how often? does it seem the system buffers enough to at least even out the smaller dead/weak areas? what would happen in a mountain pass (I know there are not any in FL...) where there may not be cell coverage for 30 minutes?


My experience is that streaming audio is pretty worthless in the mountains where service interruptions are frequent. I don't know how much different services buffer but it doesn't appear to be a minute or two.

In the now-yanked Model 3 delivery video for Rigger you will hear the Tesla associate mystified that Slacker needs a cellular connection commenting that "it works in the parking garage where our phones don't work".... this would leave me to believe that Slacker buffers a bit, but I really doubt it's more than a few minutes.

My use case is not atypical for the area of the country I live in but is atypical for urban dwellers. I get that, but people who venture more than 30 miles from a major metro area are not space aliens. We like music too.


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

MelindaV said:


> @danzgator, to @voip-ninja's point, in those 2 years of your ownership, how has the car's cellular coverage been in regards to the audio? I've have sat radio for my main audio (plus phone sources like audiobooks) for well over 10 years and have not had to think about where I am to have continuous playing audio.
> Do you end up in dead zones with zero coverage? (maybe depending on the type of driving/trips you have taken) if so, how often? does it seem the system buffers enough to at least even out the smaller dead/weak areas? what would happen in a mountain pass (I know there are not any in FL...) where there may not be cell coverage for 30 minutes?


I think it uses AT&T coverage, so that would be its coverage area. If you have large gaps in service where you live, then that would be a problem. Florida is pretty well covered though, and I've driven to Houston and Savannah and don't remember losing service for any extended period of time. For short term coverage issues, I'm pretty sure that it buffers the songs. So, if you lost reception for a few seconds, or maybe even a couple minutes, I don't think it would be affected. I have had it hang up a few times in the middle of a song, but I'm not sure if that was a reception issue, Slacker issue, or a software glitch. Whenever that happens, I hit refresh or next and the issue has always resolved itself and it moves on to the next song.

If I was planning on camping in the middle of nowhere for some reason, I'd probably download an Audiobook to fill the void, but its been so long since I updated the music in my phone using Sirius before and Slacker now, I have no idea what's on my phone, if anything. I may be in the minority, but to me, it seems like keeping music on your phone has gone the way of the dinosaur, like CD's did, since everything is available streaming or in the cloud. I even use the Slacker radio on my phone, and on my Sonos at home because I have a free membership through Tesla. Why would I pay Pandora, Sirius, and/or Apple Music $10+/mo, when I have a descent alternative for free? I'm not saying Slacker is amazing or better than Apple, Pandora, Spotify, or Sirius, but its close enough that its not worth the hassle and expense to me when it comes to streaming music.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

MelindaV said:


> Traffic from waze is already in google maps, and expect that is the data that tesla is pulling into their nav system. What in waze are you thinking will be missing from the tesla nav/traffic?
> 
> Disclaimer, I use waze every time I get in my car (sound off). If commuting so I know when I will arrive, if going somewhere unfamiliar for the navigation. Most always for traffic. If that traffic info is ported over to the tesla nav from google maps, which is fed from waze, I have no issue dropping waze on day one of driving the Model 3.
> Our distracted driver laws are very high profile right now in both OR and WA (where I mostly drive) and you can not touch a device at all while on a public street. Stopped in traffic, at a light, or 70mph are all ticketed. So I don't care about the alerts or comments in waze, just the arrival time.


Interesting, I didn't realize that. So traffic from waze is in google maps, but google maps on the Tesla doesn't have that functionality? I guess in that case like you say, if they add it, I'd be mostly set. It would be nice to have the police notifications though as well.


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## Derik (Jul 26, 2017)

For the app integration I'd hope they get more of it figured out before the customer deliveries start. I'm just going to give tesla the benefit of the doubt here that they'll have the FM radio and bluetooth audio stuff working by that time. Really giving them slack if they are changing over from the ARM to the intel chipset. 

For AM radio, I used to listen to it all the time but then found iheartradio and started just streaming it since the quality is a lot better. My wife has a plug in prius and the AM radio on that is pretty horrible due to the interference. I'm wasn't surprised at all that it is wasn't included.

Andriod Auto / Apple Carplay would be nice, but I don't want to have it take over everything. I haven't used either myself so I don't know if it is a step in the right direction or not. Seems like apple / andriod could update them pretty quick, but then again we're talking about tesla here with OTA updates. So Tesla could just as well update any problems found in the software.

Waze / Google Maps. Google bought Waze a while ago, and I know they brought the traffic data over from the waze app into the google maps ap. They also included the accidents reports as well. I basically use waze with just some of the notifications on and don't really look at it for specific details. The directions on Waze / google maps are very similar, but google maps actually pronounces the street names more accurately and tells you lane choices now. I've been preferring google maps for directions lately if I need them.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

danzgator said:


> I even use the Slacker radio on my phone, and on my Sonos at home because I have a free membership through Tesla. Why would I pay Pandora, Sirius, and/or Apple Music $10+/mo, when I have a descent alternative for free? I'm not saying Slacker is amazing or better than Apple, Pandora, Spotify, or Sirius, but its close enough that its not worth the hassle and expense to me when it comes to streaming music.


For me this is a simple one (and sorry if I'm beating a dead horse) -- it's the full Apple ecosystem. I listen to music in the car, at home, at work, when I'm working out etc. $14.99 for Apple Music Family Plan everywhere I go. It's really just personal preference, but since I'm already using a MacBook Pro, iPhone, iPad, Apple TV, and they integrate with Sonos -- well you get where I'm at


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> For me this is a simple one (and sorry if I'm beating a dead horse) -- it's the full Apple ecosystem. I listen to music in the car, at home, at work, when I'm working out etc. $14.99 for Apple Music Family Plan everywhere I go. It's really just personal preference, but since I'm already using a MacBook Pro, iPhone, iPad, Apple TV, and they integrate with Sonos -- well you get where I'm at


A Tesla will never fit into your Apple ecosystem exactly. 
Just like trying to integrate your Apple products with other people's PC's, Androids, and your Sonos (shame on you for using this non-Apple product) things don't always work across ecosystems and you'll have to figure out a workaround. 
Maybe you should be waiting for the AppleCar. Anything less is obviously just settling for you.


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

danzgator said:


> A Tesla will never fit into your Apple ecosystem exactly.
> Just like trying to integrate your Apple products with other people's PC's, Androids, and your Sonos (shame on you for using this non-Apple product) things don't always work across ecosystems and you'll have to figure out a workaround.
> Maybe you should be waiting for the AppleCar. Anything less is obviously just settling for you.


That's kind of the point of CarPlay, which is to allow your iPhone to integrate quite well into the vehicle infotainment system with minimal effort from the vehicle vendor.

Saying you "shouldn't expect" this level of integration when it already exists with something like 30 other automakers is just being unreasonable.


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## Derik (Jul 26, 2017)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> and they integrate with Sonos


How dare you not wait for the homepod. Or are you planning on selling the Sonos when it becomes available, as that would be the only acceptable answer.:sunglasses:


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## ericbs (Sep 12, 2017)

I'm not a big fan of the Waze app. IMO It's just way to busy than it needs to be and can be a distraction to the driver...A lot of the traffic data is provided by Inrix which I believe supplies most of the traffic data for most auto manufacturers (including Tesla). The data they have is pretty accurate (i use their standalone app). 

The only helpful use I have for waze is on open road (say Las Vegas) and alerts when those CHP officers are waiting to pounce on you at their favorite spots 

Otherwise the only other apps I'd really want would be are streaming apps. Do NOT put a browser in this car. It's easily a security hole waiting to be breached. Also you don't want to 'over app' your car. Can you imagine having to update 25 apps like you do on your phone on a constant basis?


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

voip-ninja said:


> That's kind of the point of CarPlay, which is to allow your iPhone to integrate quite well into the vehicle infotainment system with minimal effort from the vehicle vendor.
> 
> Saying you "shouldn't expect" this level of integration when it already exists with something like 30 other automakers is just being unreasonable.


You can expect whatever you like, but I'll bet you a beer it doesn't happen.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

ericbs said:


> I'm not a big fan of the Waze app. IMO It's just way to busy than it needs to be and can be a distraction to the driver...


The first thing I do after installing waze on a phone is to turn off all of those useless distractions.
The only thing left are showing ads when you come to a stop.
It's much better that way.


> A lot of the traffic data is provided by Inrix which I believe supplies most of the traffic data for most auto manufacturers (including Tesla).


While I'm sure some of that info is Inrix, I'm pretty sure most of Waze's information is crowdsourced from Waze and Google Maps users (Google owns Waze). I know Google Maps (which I use more often) will often show accidents as "reported by Waze".


----------



## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

voip-ninja said:


> Saying you "shouldn't expect" this level of integration when it already exists with something like 30 other automakers is just being unreasonable.


Elon Musk has already stated that they probably would not (it was in an interview - sorry, I don't recall which one). He did say that they might look into mirroring a phone's display onto part of the car's display, but he was pretty clearly against the CarPlay and Android Auto interfaces.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

danzgator said:


> A Tesla will never fit into your Apple ecosystem exactly.
> Just like trying to integrate your Apple products with other people's PC's, Androids, and your Sonos (shame on you for using this non-Apple product) things don't always work across ecosystems and you'll have to figure out a workaround.
> Maybe you should be waiting for the AppleCar. Anything less is obviously just settling for you.


Ahh but see that's just it, I think the integration is perfect 

It's just bluetooth audio. I really shouldn't be doing anything with my phone while I'm driving other than music. I'm bad at that buy the way which is why I say I shouldn't...



voip-ninja said:


> That's kind of the point of CarPlay, which is to allow your iPhone to integrate quite well into the vehicle infotainment system with minimal effort from the vehicle vendor.
> 
> Saying you "shouldn't expect" this level of integration when it already exists with something like 30 other automakers is just being unreasonable.


I think CarPlay has a long way to go and besides if anything it's more distracting drawing your attention to the screen. Now that Apple rolled out the Do Not Disturb while driving I'm actually very happy because my attention isn't drawn to a text message.



Derik said:


> How dare you not wait for the homepod. Or are you planning on selling the Sonos when it becomes available, as that would be the only acceptable answer.:sunglasses:


I've had Sonos for a while and gasp, I have Amazon's Alexa 

HomePod is something I can't figure out. The Echo was a gift, don't see much value with it either. I only use it to turn on/off lights though.


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

danzgator said:


> You can expect whatever you like, but I'll bet you a beer it doesn't happen.


Where did I say I think it's going to happen?

I'm almost sure it won't happen.

However, unlike you and others, I think that's a bad thing and a competitive weakness for Tesla as they try to penetrate into a larger market with more offerings.

https://www.macrumors.com/2017/10/16/carplay-must-have-new-car-buyers/


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

voip-ninja said:


> Where did I say I think it's going to happen?
> 
> I'm almost sure it won't happen.
> 
> ...


Eh, I've had it in rental cars and wasn't impressed at all. It wasn't smooth, it provided too many distractions from driving, the jump back and forth from car screen to CarPlay was confusing, there just were not enough positives. I don't wish it over my Bluetooth connection on the Model S. Tesla's tech is so far ahead of everyone else there is no competition. If CarPlay is a deal breaker for someone, then its their loss.


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

danzgator said:


> Eh, I've had it in rental cars and wasn't impressed at all. It wasn't smooth, it provided too many distractions from driving, the jump back and forth from car screen to CarPlay was confusing, there just were not enough positives. I don't wish it over my Bluetooth connection on the Model S. Tesla's tech is so far ahead of everyone else there is no competition. If CarPlay is a deal breaker for someone, then its their loss.


Tesla's current integration is great for people who want to stream audio from their phone with BT and skip tracks, or use Siri to control it.

For people like myself who have dozens of playlists curated from a huge music collection built over the span of 30 years, and who frequently listen to their music in places with spotty cellular coverage it doesn't cut it.

As you say, "if you don't like it walk". Fair enough. Tesla has more customers for the Model 3 then they know what to do with currently. If they ever start producing cars in enough volume to satisfy the demand they can worry about things they aren't offering that others do offer and have for years.


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

voip-ninja said:


> Tesla's current integration is great for people who want to stream audio from their phone with BT and skip tracks, or use Siri to control it.
> 
> For people like myself who have dozens of playlists curated from a huge music collection built over the span of 30 years, and who frequently listen to their music in places with spotty cellular coverage it doesn't cut it.
> 
> As you say, "if you don't like it walk". Fair enough. Tesla has more customers for the Model 3 then they know what to do with currently. If they ever start producing cars in enough volume to satisfy the demand they can worry about things they aren't offering that others do offer and have for years.


Tesla doesn't do things "because everybody else is doing them". Just because everybody's putting big grills on their cars doesn't mean tesla is going to do it. Just because everybody's been putting an ICE back up engine in there EV's doesn't mean tesla is going to do it. Just because everybody's using lidar, doesn't mean teslas going to do it. Just because everybody's using Mobileye, doesn't mean teslas going to do it, etc. etc. If there is a real need for managing 30 years of music as you described, Tesla will figure out how to manage the problem itself by building a better mouse trap with its own programmers, not try to fit a round peg in a square hole with trying to get android and Apple +/- software to integrate with its software. Unfortunately, I don't think your problem is probably very high on their priority list.


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## voip-ninja (Sep 25, 2017)

danzgator said:


> Tesla doesn't do things "because everybody else is doing them". Just because everybody's putting big grills on their cars doesn't mean tesla is going to do it. Just because everybody's been putting an ICE back up engine in there EV's doesn't mean tesla is going to do it. Just because everybody's using lidar, doesn't mean teslas going to do it. Just because everybody's using Mobileye, doesn't mean teslas going to do it, etc. etc. If there is a real need for managing 30 years of music as you described, Tesla will figure out how to manage the problem itself by building a better mouse trap with its own programmers, not try to fit a round peg in a square hole with trying to get android and Apple +/- software to integrate with its software. Unfortunately, I don't think your problem is probably very high on their priority list.


Well, I will hand it to you that Tesla doesn't do what everyone else does.

Everyone else ships cars when they say they are going to ship them, Tesla does not.


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## OneSixtyToOne (Apr 17, 2017)

My "Plan B" is to use a Bluetooth transmitter that I can plug into a radio. I use one with my XM radio to play on my Bluetooth speaker.


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## Petra (Sep 12, 2017)

danzgator said:


> Tesla will figure out how to manage the problem itself by building a better mouse trap with its own programmers, not try to fit a round peg in a square hole with trying to get android and Apple +/- software to integrate with its software. Unfortunately, I don't think your problem is probably very high on their priority list.


I'd settle for a USB playback shuffle mode that actually works... it's been broken in one way or another since at least v7.0


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## JWardell (May 9, 2016)

garsh said:


> I'll be happy if I can just find a good non-window phone mount for the 3.


All you need is a couple of wood screws. Why else would they put a 2x4 in the dash?


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## Sandy (Jun 3, 2017)

JWardell said:


> All you need is a couple of wood screws. Why else would they put a 2x4 in the dash?


Josh! That's really funny!!!


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

Honestly, I'm not even sure where you could put a phone mount that would be comfortable to see/use. The screen really is super close and positioned perfectly next to the steering wheel to be comfortable. Doesn't seem like there'd be much room there for anything else.


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## Runt8 (May 26, 2017)

danzgator said:


> Eh, I've had it in rental cars and wasn't impressed at all. It wasn't smooth, it provided too many distractions from driving, the jump back and forth from car screen to CarPlay was confusing, there just were not enough positives. I don't wish it over my Bluetooth connection on the Model S. Tesla's tech is so far ahead of everyone else there is no competition. If CarPlay is a deal breaker for someone, then its their loss.


Before I settled on the Model 3, CarPlay was a must have for me. Not so much for the functionality it currently provides (although the integration in my mostly Apple ecosystem is nice), but because it allows for upgrades to a system that would more than likely never get them otherwise. Fortunately that's not an issue in a Tesla so it became much less important.


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## Michael Russo (Oct 15, 2016)

Late to this party and not your average geek at 60 today () yet I don’t get why there’s talk of a phone mount when Model 3 dash has these two charge ports for Smartphones?


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

Michael Russo said:


> Late to this party and not your average geek at 60 today () yet I don't get why there's talk of a phone mount when Model 3 dash has these two charge ports for Smartphones?


Mostly because people don't want to be looking down at their phones to do stuff on em. Going back to my original point, with additional app integration, potentially you could put your phone in the trunk and no one would care. As of now, simple tasks like listening to AM talk radio on my way to work will require my phone and Bluetooth audio enabled. Switching between channels will require easy access to my phone and eyes off the road.


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## favo (Jun 7, 2017)

See 10:42 for phone dock.


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## Michael Russo (Oct 15, 2016)

ng0 said:


> Mostly because people don't want to be looking down at their phones to do stuff on em. (...) easy access to my phone and eyes off the road.


Gotcha. Thanks. This is why I expect a Navdy option may come in handy...


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

ng0 said:


> Honestly, I'm not even sure where you could put a phone mount that would be comfortable to see/use. The screen really is super close and positioned perfectly next to the steering wheel to be comfortable. Doesn't seem like there'd be much room there for anything else.


I was thinking right where the speedo would usually be. Perfect for waze, but probably not great for getting at the phone.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

ng0 said:


> Honestly, I'm not even sure where you could put a phone mount that would be comfortable to see/use. The screen really is super close and positioned perfectly next to the steering wheel to be comfortable. Doesn't seem like there'd be much room there for anything else.


Something extending from the bottom of the screen might work. Maybe even something hung off to the right of the screen, although that will probably interfere with airbag deployment. Or try going to the other side of the steering wheel - a mount low on the A pillar? Again, you'd have to think about interference with airbag deployment.

I kind of like @danzgator's idea of mounting it above the steering column. Then I could just run a speedometer app on my phone. 



Michael Russo said:


> Late to this party and not your average geek at 60 today () yet I don't get why there's talk of a phone mount when Model 3 dash has these two charge ports for Smartphones?


That location is not good for viewing information (Navigation, Waze) or for input to the phone (skip song, change playlist).


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

ng0 said:


> As of now, simple tasks like listening to AM talk radio on my way to work will require my phone and Bluetooth audio enabled.


Is the am channel not one on tunein? Have you checked?


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

garsh said:


> I kind of like @danzgator's idea of mounting it above the steering column. Then I could just run a speedometer app on my phone.


I don't remember if you like Waze or not, but you'd have the speed limit and your current speed on there, if you were using Waze.


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## Brokedoc (May 28, 2017)

So I just got an new software update on my MX today. I can now set the climate control to stay on even if I leave the car with the key (because my teenager is too cool to go into the store with me to do errands). I can also set the Homelink to automatically open or close the garage door when the car reaches a specific GPS location.

My point is that Teslas do not come with a fixed set of features that never changes after you buy the car. When I bought my 2004 Toyota Sienna, it had an annoying design bug that if a kid in the back left their light on, it would stay on all night and drain the battery. They fixed that in the 2005 model year but I was stuck with that design flaw. Tesla fixes those with software updates...

And about some of those fixed features choices on the Model 3 that are annoying like lack of AM and lack of XM and lack of standard air vents... progress sometimes takes getting used to. AM reception doesn't work well in Teslas due to electrical interference and the AM that I've heard in the MS (which is the only Tesla to offer AM reception) definitely suffers from pops and hisses. MS and MX owners complain about their XM reception due to the lack of the external receiver so Elon decided to omit it completely in the M3. Some people complain about buying new shoes because their old ones are comfortable despite the holes and excess wear but quickly forget about it after they switch.


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

Brokedoc said:


> So I just got an new software update on my MX today. I can now set the climate control to stay on even if I leave the car with the key (because my teenager is too cool to go into the store with me to do errands). I can also set the Homelink to automatically open or close the garage door when the car reaches a specific GPS location.
> 
> My point is that Teslas do not come with a fixed set of features that never changes after you buy the car. When I bought my 2004 Toyota Sienna, it had an annoying design bug that if a kid in the back left their light on, it would stay on all night and drain the battery. They fixed that in the 2005 model year but I was stuck with that design flaw. Tesla fixes those with software updates...
> 
> And about some of those fixed features choices on the Model 3 that are annoying like lack of AM and lack of XM and lack of standard air vents... progress sometimes takes getting used to. AM reception doesn't work well in Teslas due to electrical interference and the AM that I've heard in the MS (which is the only Tesla to offer AM reception) definitely suffers from pops and hisses. MS and MX owners complain about their XM reception due to the lack of the external receiver so Elon decided to omit it completely in the M3. Some people complain about buying new shoes because their old ones are comfortable despite the holes and excess wear but quickly forget about it after they switch.


I got the update on my Model S as well. AND we have a 2013 Sienna with the same issue. We have to keep the door/light switch off all the time because the kids constantly turn the back lights on. They stay on if you have the door/light option on. Seems like they reintroduced the issue...


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

MelindaV said:


> Is the am channel not one on tunein? Have you checked?


yea, sadly a few of the channels I listen to show up on tunein but when you try to listen it just tells you that the channel is no longer available. All the channels under the very large iHeartMedia umbrella have bailed on tunein and are only available on iHeartRadio. I haven't checked a ton of stations, but 2 out of 3 that I checked weren't available. Unless they add this app, I'll have to fumble around with my phone to listen to these channels.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

Brokedoc said:


> So I just got an new software update on my MX today. I can now set the climate control to stay on even if I leave the car with the key (because my teenager is too cool to go into the store with me to do errands). I can also set the Homelink to automatically open or close the garage door when the car reaches a specific GPS location.
> 
> My point is that Teslas do not come with a fixed set of features that never changes after you buy the car. When I bought my 2004 Toyota Sienna, it had an annoying design bug that if a kid in the back left their light on, it would stay on all night and drain the battery. They fixed that in the 2005 model year but I was stuck with that design flaw. Tesla fixes those with software updates...
> 
> And about some of those fixed features choices on the Model 3 that are annoying like lack of AM and lack of XM and lack of standard air vents... progress sometimes takes getting used to. AM reception doesn't work well in Teslas due to electrical interference and the AM that I've heard in the MS (which is the only Tesla to offer AM reception) definitely suffers from pops and hisses. MS and MX owners complain about their XM reception due to the lack of the external receiver so Elon decided to omit it completely in the M3. Some people complain about buying new shoes because their old ones are comfortable despite the holes and excess wear but quickly forget about it after they switch.


Very cool! It definitely makes me get a warm and fuzzy when I read about the updates Tesla is rolling out. I completely understand about the AM interference, but they really need to have the app support for alternatives (both tunein and iheartradio). An XM app would make a ton of sense as well since most luxury cars have XM standard. I haven't heard anyone complain yet about the non-standard air vents. I think the lack of air vents is one of the coolest new features!


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## Rich M (Jul 28, 2017)

ng0 said:


> yea, sadly a few of the channels I listen to show up on tunein but when you try to listen it just tells you that the channel is no longer available. All the channels under the very large iHeartMedia umbrella have bailed on tunein and are only available on iHeartRadio. I haven't checked a ton of stations, but 2 out of 3 that I checked weren't available. Unless they add this app, I'll have to fumble around with my phone to listen to these channels.


Yes I'll second this, @MelindaV . I've been playing with TuneIn since hearing that it's built into the Tesla UI, and getting more "no longer available" messages lately. Between Waze and needing iHeartRadio, I will also be bolting my phone to the dash or next to the screen somewhere.
Doesn't matter how nice the Tesla Maps are, Waze alerts are instantaneous. It also shows you exact time to be stuck in traffic with a progress bar, shows my colleagues progress as we drive to the office, lets me share my trip with friends and family so they can track my arrival, and most importantly it lets you contribute by reporting police, crashes, road hazards. By just being open, the app reports your speed to the servers which update road speeds for everyone else running Google or Waze. As far as I know the Tesla nav doesn't send any data back to Google's server in order to contribute, but I may be wrong there.


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## Vistan (Mar 28, 2017)

ngO:

I listen to San Diego AM station KOGO all the time on my Model S. Just select STAR-FM (94.1) on the radio and KOGO is transmitted on the HD2 channel of FM 94.1. Comes in fine except for occasional dropouts when you're changing direction.

Vistan


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

Vistan said:


> ngO:
> 
> I listen to San Diego AM station KOGO all the time on my Model S. Just select STAR-FM (94.1) on the radio and KOGO is transmitted on the HD2 channel of FM 94.1. Comes in fine except for occasional dropouts when you're changing direction.
> 
> Vistan


Great news, thanks for the heads up! Is there any FM2 equivalent for KFI as well? Thanks!!

I just looked it up and seems KFI is on: 103.5-2. Are you able to get that signal down where you live? It's an LA station, but I get the AM equivalent all the way down here in the center of San Diego. Thanks!


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## Brokedoc (May 28, 2017)

Rich M said:


> Yes I'll second this, @MelindaV . I've been playing with TuneIn since hearing that it's built into the Tesla UI, and getting more "no longer available" messages lately. Between Waze and needing iHeartRadio, I will also be bolting my phone to the dash or next to the screen somewhere.
> Doesn't matter how nice the Tesla Maps are, Waze alerts are instantaneous. It also shows you exact time to be stuck in traffic with a progress bar, shows my colleagues progress as we drive to the office, lets me share my trip with friends and family so they can track my arrival, and most importantly it lets you contribute by reporting police, crashes, road hazards. By just being open, the app reports your speed to the servers which update road speeds for everyone else running Google or Waze. As far as I know the Tesla nav doesn't send any data back to Google's server in order to contribute, but I may be wrong there.


I used to be a huge Waze user but then my brother pointed out that the navigation aspect isn't as good as Google Maps. Many times it wouldn't give me the fastest route when the same destination is entered. So then I kept Waze open while using the Tesla Nav and then it became a pain and now I stopped using Waze. Waze is owned by Google and Tesla Nav is also Google based but clearly they are not all the same nor do they use the same algorithms when calculating routes or traffic. One of my biggest annoyances about the Tesla Nav is the inability to select alternate routes when a destination is entered. It is available on Google Maps but is not an option for Tesla Nav....yet


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## Rich M (Jul 28, 2017)

Brokedoc said:


> ...the navigation aspect isn't as good as Google Maps. Many times it wouldn't give me the fastest route when the same destination is entered...


I'll give you that. I think that Waze just forgets to keep checking alternate routes. On my way home, if I notice it's giving me a weird route I have to hit 'route' every minute to make it re-think until it makes sense. But this only happens once a week or so. I think they have server load issues. Google seems to be using some data from Waze but hasn't done any actual integration.


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

Rich M said:


> Doesn't matter how nice the Tesla Maps are, Waze alerts are instantaneous. It also shows you exact time to be stuck in traffic with a progress bar, shows my colleagues progress as we drive to the office, lets me share my trip with friends and family so they can track my arrival, and most importantly it lets you contribute by reporting police, crashes, road hazards. By just being open, the app reports your speed to the servers which update road speeds for everyone else running Google or Waze. As far as I know the Tesla nav doesn't send any data back to Google's server in order to contribute, but I may be wrong there.


I'm going to go out on a limb and say I've logged more miles on waze than most here. I am well aware of what it does and how it works.


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## Derik (Jul 26, 2017)

MelindaV said:


> more miles on waze than most here


All that makes me want to say is I've got 558,157 points. which puts me at spot 13718.

I use waze pretty much daily, and I'll most likely still run it on my phone for alerts only once I get in the model 3. I've just had better directions / lane guidance with google maps vs waze lately. Which is kind of scary since they are both owned by the same company.


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## Vistan (Mar 28, 2017)

ng0 said:


> Great news, thanks for the heads up! Is there any FM2 equivalent for KFI as well? Thanks!!
> 
> I just looked it up and seems KFI is on: 103.5-2. Are you able to get that signal down where you live? It's an LA station, but I get the AM equivalent all the way down here in the center of San Diego. Thanks!


Just tried 103.5 in the garage, and don't get the FM signal nor any indication of HD sigs. I do get KOGO strong in the garage.


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## Rich M (Jul 28, 2017)

MelindaV said:


> I'm going to go out on a limb and say I've logged more miles on waze than most here. I am well aware of what it does and how it works.


I was mostly quoting you about the TuneIn issues.
Pretend the Waze statement was a properly indented new paragraph.


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## JWardell (May 9, 2016)

Derik said:


> All that makes me want to say is I've got 558,157 points. which puts me at spot 13718.
> 
> I use waze pretty much daily, and I'll most likely still run it on my phone for alerts only once I get in the model 3. I've just had better directions / lane guidance with google maps vs waze lately. Which is kind of scary since they are both owned by the same company.


Darn. I only have 307,000. Probably because I stopped driving to work 5 years ago. Still, I've been a member over 8 years.
I can't stand google map's interface. I can't see what roads and alerts are around me. I keep Waze in 2D mode. Waze always runs whenever I am driving anywhere.

There might not be a need for a phone dash mount with the 3. I bet we can figure out how to clip it next to the center display. Right next to the speedo. Perfect.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

Vistan said:


> Just tried 103.5 in the garage, and don't get the FM signal nor any indication of HD sigs. I do get KOGO strong in the garage.


Thanks for checking! I'm sorry to hear that station didn't work. Hopefully it'll work outside of your garage. You're much farther north than I am, so it definitely won't work for me if it doesn't for you.


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## Rich M (Jul 28, 2017)

ng0 said:


> Great news, thanks for the heads up! Is there any FM2 equivalent for KFI as well? Thanks!!
> 
> I just looked it up and seems KFI is on: 103.5-2. Are you able to get that signal down where you live? It's an LA station, but I get the AM equivalent all the way down here in the center of San Diego. Thanks!





Vistan said:


> Just tried 103.5 in the garage, and don't get the FM signal nor any indication of HD sigs. I do get KOGO strong in the garage.





ng0 said:


> Thanks for checking! I'm sorry to hear that station didn't work. Hopefully it'll work outside of your garage. You're much farther north than I am, so it definitely won't work for me if it doesn't for you.


You can check radio coverage areas on radio-locator.com
Here is KOST FM (which carries KFI on HD2): 
https://radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/patg?id=KOST-FM


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

Brokedoc said:


> I used to be a huge Waze user but then my brother pointed out that the navigation aspect isn't as good as Google Maps. Many times it wouldn't give me the fastest route when the same destination is entered. So then I kept Waze open while using the Tesla Nav and then it became a pain and now I stopped using Waze. Waze is owned by Google and Tesla Nav is also Google based but clearly they are not all the same nor do they use the same algorithms when calculating routes or traffic. One of my biggest annoyances about the Tesla Nav is the inability to select alternate routes when a destination is entered. It is available on Google Maps but is not an option for Tesla Nav....yet


It seems to me that the Tesla nav algorithms select the route based on efficiency and not duration of travel like the other Nav options. Whenever I plug go home from work in the Nav it takes me off the highway route through the back roads all the way home. That way is shorter and consumes less energy, but it takes longer. I rarely use the nav locally, only for road trips. This is just what I think based on my experience, I don't have any other support for this theory.


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## dogfood (Jun 9, 2017)

Up here at the foot of the Cascades, using T-Mobile, I've had zero trouble streaming music anywhere I've gone. But when we had satellite radio, it would routinely cut out all over the place; freeways, primary roads, back roads. Everywhere.


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## Brokedoc (May 28, 2017)

danzgator said:


> It seems to me that the Tesla nav algorithms select the route based on efficiency and not duration of travel like the other Nav options. Whenever I plug go home from work in the Nav it takes me off the highway route through the back roads all the way home. That way is shorter and consumes less energy, but it takes longer. I rarely use the nav locally, only for road trips. This is just what I think based on my experience, I don't have any other support for this theory.


You can improve this a little by changing your settings - The default Tesla Nav settings are not really ideal.

Go to Settings -> Apps -> Maps and Navigation -> Change the "RE-ROUTE IF IT SAVES MORE THAN" to a shorter time (default is ridiculously long 10 mins. I set it to 2 mins). Also, you can adjust the "avoid tolls" depending on your preferences and I always leave on the "estimated round trip energy" feature.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

Rich M said:


> You can check radio coverage areas on radio-locator.com
> Here is KOST FM (which carries KFI on HD2):
> https://radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/patg?id=KOST-FM


Thanks for the info, that's really helpful! Sadly, it doesn't reach all the way out to San Diego like their AM station does. I guess I still need to hold out some hope that iheartradio will be added to the Model 3 software.


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

Brokedoc said:


> You can improve this a little by changing your settings - The default Tesla Nav settings are not really ideal.
> 
> Go to Settings -> Apps -> Maps and Navigation -> Change the "RE-ROUTE IF IT SAVES MORE THAN" to a shorter time (default is ridiculously long 10 mins. I set it to 2 mins). Also, you can adjust the "avoid tolls" depending on your preferences and I always leave on the "estimated round trip energy" feature.
> View attachment 3840


It's amazing that I can still be learning features after two years. Thanks!


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## EMP40 (Jun 13, 2017)

It really is ridiculous that Tesla has not created the containers necessary for Android Auto and Carplay integration.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

EMP40 said:


> It really is ridiculous that Tesla has not created the containers necessary for Android Auto and Carplay integration.


I ever so slightly disagree. The premise behind Android Auto and Apple CarPlay is to improve what is otherwise a clunky UI from traditional auto makers. I would suggest that doesn't include Tesla. Further to that point, and especially in Model 3, the screen is literally everything and giving away real estate on it is probably not that great of an idea.

My desire would be to see the car have Apple Music support as a for instance, in lieu of Apple CarPlay.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

EMP40 said:


> It really is ridiculous that Tesla has not created the containers necessary for Android Auto and Carplay integration.


Elon was specifically asked about including these for Tesla cars in the future, and he rejected the idea. He's not a fan of either system. He did say that it might make sense to provide a window where your phone's display could be mirrored, but I don't believe he ever committed to that either.

I'm reserving judgement until I get my Tesla. Waze and Google Maps are 10x better than any car's built-in navigation, but it sounds like Tesla's navigation is based on Google Maps, so I'll probably be happy enough with it. And if I can stream music from my phone over bluetooth, with a decent UI to control it, and if hands-free calls just work, then I'll probably not care about any additional phone integration.


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## Runt8 (May 26, 2017)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> I ever so slightly disagree. The premise behind Android Auto and Apple CarPlay is to improve what is otherwise a clunky UI from traditional auto makers. I would suggest that doesn't include Tesla. Further to that point, and especially in Model 3, the screen is literally everything and giving away real estate on it is probably not that great of an idea.
> 
> My desire would be to see the car have Apple Music support as a for instance, in lieu of Apple CarPlay.


On one hand I agree with this - I feel like Android Auto and CarPlay are at best clunky solutions to the problem of phone integration and I don't think they would fit well in a Tesla (since Tesla has actually put some serious effort into their MMI system and provides routine updates).

On the other hand, I'm slightly discouraged that Tesla doesn't even provide simple iPod control, which to me means the likelihood of them supporting something like Apple Music is pretty slim.

Although at least for music you have Bluetooth. I'm more concerned about giving up Waze, but I'm willing to give Tesla's navigation system a chance (and, in terms of this topic, CarPlay doesn't give me Waze either).


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

garsh said:


> it sounds like Tesla's navigation is based on Google Maps


It doesn't just sound like it, it literally says Google on the nav map.

I have a Tesla and have used CarPlay on a rental. To me, CarPlay is garbage compared to the Tesla interface and isn't needed.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

SoFlaModel3 said:


> I ever so slightly disagree. The premise behind Android Auto and Apple CarPlay is to improve what is otherwise a clunky UI from traditional auto makers. I would suggest that doesn't include Tesla. Further to that point, and especially in Model 3, the screen is literally everything and giving away real estate on it is probably not that great of an idea.
> 
> My desire would be to see the car have Apple Music support as a for instance, in lieu of Apple CarPlay.


Maybe Android auto and Apple car play could be a stop gap until tesla creates their own app integration? There's only a few apps that I feel would completely fix all the gaps right now. 1) I heart radio. There are quite a few channels that aren't on tune in, so this would pretty much encompass the rest. 2) XM radio. Many people are used to having this in their cars and would really miss not having it. 3) waze. Traffic alerts and all the other alerts that Google maps doesn't have would be an amazing addition.

Anyone else have any ideas?


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

ng0 said:


> Maybe Android auto and Apple car play could be a stop gap until tesla creates their own app integration? There's only a few apps that I feel would completely fix all the gaps right now. 1) I heart radio. There are quite a few channels that aren't on tune in, so this would pretty much encompass the rest. 2) XM radio. Many people are used to having this in their cars and would really miss not having it. 3) waze. Traffic alerts and all the other alerts that Google maps doesn't have would be an amazing addition.
> 
> Anyone else have any ideas?


I mean, you can say "Play ?????" and the car plays it. I don't know what else you need. I understand the argument that if you have no cell service you can't do that so need a back-up, but unless you live in the woods, this is only a problem 1% of the time.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

danzgator said:


> I mean, you can say "Play ?????" and the car plays it. I don't know what else you need. I understand the argument that if you have no cell service you can't do that so need a back-up, but unless you live in the woods, this is only a problem 1% of the time.


I'm not sure if I understand your response. I wasn't talking about any concern about not having cell service. The lack of those 3 items could be fixed by adding apps that stream. iHeartRadio, XMRadio, and Waze are all apps. Having to stream that stuff from your phone and connecting through bluetooth is tedious and can be addressed very easily.


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

ng0 said:


> I'm not sure if I understand your response. I wasn't talking about any concern about not having cell service. The lack of those 3 items could be fixed by adding apps that stream. iHeartRadio, XMRadio, and Waze are all apps. Having to stream that stuff from your phone and connecting through bluetooth is tedious and can be addressed very easily.


What I'm saying is that Tesla uses Slacker radio. You have a free account tied to your car. You can literally tell the car to play any song, piece, or an artist, and it will play it. I know you're used to those other things, as I was used to using my iPhone and Sirius radio before I got my Tesla, but I have not missed them.

As far as Waze goes, I agree it's the best Nav app out there, and I pull it up on my phone every day. It'd be nice to have, but it's not a deal breaker for me. If Waze gets an app where do you stop it? Apple Maps gets an app too? The Google maps in the car works as well as google maps works on your computer of phone, and it knows your state of charge and if you're going to need to charge before getting to your destination. It is the second best Nav software out there to me, so it's fine. On road trips, there's no other way to navigate, because it tells you where to charge and for how long. Does it show me where the cops are? No, but I have Waze running on my phone for that.

Edit: and I meant the car's cell phone service for streaming, not my phone's service.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

danzgator said:


> What I'm saying is that Tesla uses Slacker radio. You have a free account tied to your car. You can literally tell the car to play any song, piece, or an artist, and it will play it. I know you're used to those other things, as I was used to using my iPhone and Sirius radio before I got my Tesla, but I have not missed them.
> 
> As far as Waze goes, I agree it's the best Nav app out there, and I pull it up on my phone every day. It'd be nice to have, but it's not a deal breaker for me. If Waze gets an app where do you stop it? Apple Maps gets an app too? The Google maps in the car works as well as google maps works on your computer of phone, and it knows your state of charge and if you're going to need to charge before getting to your destination. It is the second best Nav software out there to me, so it's fine. On road trips, there's no other way to navigate, because it tells you where to charge and for how long. Does it show me where the cops are? No, but I have Waze running on my phone for that.
> 
> Edit: and I meant the car's cell phone service for streaming, not my phone's service.


ah, I see what you mean, but like I mentioned in an earlier post, I really would like to be able to listen to some AM/FM radio stations I like. It's not just about being able to play a specific song or genre of music. I like slacker and tunein, but I don't think they fulfill everyone's music/radio needs. iheartRadio and SiriusXM apps (and possibly spotify) would really support a majority of people's needs/wants. I agree with you that Waze is not a deal breaker for me, but it would be so ridiculously awesome if we did have it. Like you said, you have it running on your phone. That just makes things way more distracting for the driver.


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## danzgator (May 17, 2017)

ng0 said:


> ah, I see what you mean, but like I mentioned in an earlier post, I really would like to be able to listen to some AM/FM radio stations I like. It's not just about being able to play a specific song or genre of music. I like slacker and tunein, but I don't think they fulfill everyone's music/radio needs. iheartRadio and SiriusXM apps (and possibly spotify) would really support a majority of people's needs/wants. I agree with you that Waze is not a deal breaker for me, but it would be so ridiculously awesome if we did have it. Like you said, you have it running on your phone. That just makes things way more distracting for the driver.


As you like and unlike songs on stations that you select, or create, Tesla added a station called 'Like'. It basically custom creates a station based on all your likes and dislikes across all genres. I never, and I mean never listen to FM anymore unless I'm in my wife's Sienna. And it's painful when I do with the same 10 songs playing over and over again, and the commercials. Plus the stupid morning shows on every station with celebrity gossip and prank phone calls. Sorry, rant over.

Regardless of my opinions on FM radio, I thought that was resolved in an update and now there is FM radio, no? 
https://www.engadget.com/2017/12/06/tesla-model-3-fm-radio-tripometer-update/

Tesla also has TuneIn radio, which has some streaming stations, but I've never messed with that too much. I've clicked on it and it looks like it is a ton of national and local broadcast shows streamed over the internet. 
https://tunein.com/
https://www.teslarati.com/tunein-radio-tesla-model-s/


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

danzgator said:


> As you like and unlike songs on stations that you select, or create, Tesla added a station called 'Like'. It basically custom creates a station based on all your likes and dislikes across all genres. I never, and I mean never listen to FM anymore unless I'm in my wife's Sienna. And it's painful when I do with the same 10 songs playing over and over again, and the commercials. Plus the stupid morning shows on every station with celebrity gossip and prank phone calls. Sorry, rant over.
> 
> Regardless of my opinions on FM radio, I thought that was resolved in an update and now there is FM radio, no?
> https://www.engadget.com/2017/12/06/tesla-model-3-fm-radio-tripometer-update/
> ...


I definitely get what you mean, but there are some AM talk stations that I really like to listen to. Unfortunately the FM2 equivalent of it won't work in my area and tunein doesn't have the stations because they're iheartradio exclusives.

Thanks for the link to the FM radio article! That's exciting news, though it still won't help me get all the AM stations I want. I just checked with my friend that has a Model 3 and he confirmed that FM radio and trip meter was added in the last update, so that's great!


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## Insaneoctane (May 10, 2017)

I think that there will always be a few "killer" apps that drive people to wanting CarPlay or better integration. For me, that app is WAZE. I put over 450 miles a week and use WAZE for every mile. My trip is the same, but it is riddled with heavy traffic and I have several major options to route (ie PCH or 405). Because I have a long commute with many options, WAZE is instrumental to evaluating the best route. Right before a route changing decision point, I frequently ask WAZE like 3 times (sometimes using waypoints to force an option) to evaluate my decision before committing to it. This works well for me. I doubt Tesla has any plans to integrate WAZE. But, it will always be some app for someone. Therefore, giving us an optional window to support CarPlay or Android Auto or? Would be a nice gesture.


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## Runt8 (May 26, 2017)

Insaneoctane said:


> I think that there will always be a few "killer" apps that drive people to wanting CarPlay or better integration. For me, that app is WAZE. I put over 450 miles a week and use WAZE for every mile. My trip is the same, but it is riddled with heavy traffic and I have several major options to route (ie PCH or 405). Because I have a long commute with many options, WAZE is instrumental to evaluating the best route. Right before a route changing decision point, I frequently ask WAZE like 3 times (sometimes using waypoints to force an option) to evaluate my decision before committing to it. This works well for me. I doubt Tesla has any plans to integrate WAZE. But, it will always be some app for someone. Therefore, giving us an optional window to support CarPlay or Android Auto or? Would be a nice gesture.


One problem with this scenario is that Waze doesn't work with CarPlay either.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

Runt8 said:


> One problem with this scenario is that Waze doesn't work with CarPlay either.


Then get an android phone. ;-)


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## Runt8 (May 26, 2017)

ng0 said:


> Then get an android phone. ;-)


Yeah, that's never an option


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## John (Apr 16, 2016)

Google Maps has already started adopting some Waze-reported data (Google bought Waze). Maybe that will increase?


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## Rich M (Jul 28, 2017)

John said:


> Google Maps has already started adopting some Waze-reported data (Google bought Waze). Maybe that will increase?


I sure hope so. Google bought Waze a while ago, and the only benefit I see from it is Waze-reported accidents showing up on Google Maps. There seems to be no collaboration in routing algorithms, and Waze's routing servers still lag or time out occasionally during busy travel times.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

I like Waze for the traffic alerts and police reports, etc, but I personally greatly dislike their interface. For me the solution is simple —

1) Get in car
2) Select Playlist on iPhone 
3) Open Waze
4) Dock phone in charger and close lid
5) Use steering wheel for next, back, play, pause, etc. 

Now I get my music and Waze “alerts” over Bluetooth audio seamlessly. 

I think the navigation on the Tesla is powerful and much better looking, so I don’t want to see Waze, I really just want the audible alerts. 

This strategy is what I do in my ICE car daily.


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## Rich M (Jul 28, 2017)

Wouldn't this only work if the Tesla nav and Waze choose the exact same route every time?


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## Maevra (Oct 24, 2017)

danzgator said:


> View attachment 4397
> 
> It doesn't just sound like it, it literally says Google on the nav map.
> 
> I have a Tesla and have used CarPlay on a rental. To me, CarPlay is garbage compared to the Tesla interface and isn't needed.


Tesla uses its own navigation logic on a Google maps overlay. The navigation has gotten better but still not as good as straight up Google maps so I still double check with my phone if Tesla is indeed choosing the best route esp. for unfamiliar roads.


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## SoFlaModel3 (Apr 15, 2017)

Rich M said:


> Wouldn't this only work if the Tesla nav and Waze choose the exact same route every time?


Sorry I should have clarified. I don't use Waze for navigation, I just have Waze open for the alerts (police ahead in .5 miles, object in road, etc.)

Maybe that makes my case a bit unique but on my daily commute I can basically take 1 of 2 routes and once I select 1 the other can't be selected. Taking back roads is never a better option so highway 1 or highway 2 and that's it. Also Tesla's navigation is great at showing live traffic, see picture below that I took showing Austin's downtown. You have a enough info to make a decision based on the visualization I think.

Alternatively when I was in Los Angeles for business and landed in rush hour, it was amazing how Waze had us repeatedly on and off the highways missing essentially all of the traffic.


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## teslaliving (Apr 2, 2016)

I'm not a fan of Carplay etc being added, but I do have to say that the Slacker integration is nice when it works but it's been very unstable since 8.0 shipped (over a year). Often it will start playing a song, be far along in buffering then just move to the next song. Does that many times in a row. Only way to get out of that behavior is a car reboot. Some days it works all day, others it does this. Super frustrating and Tesla, when you ask them, just says there's an update coming without having any idea if it addresses the issue or not. 

I don't know if it's slacker or Tesla or the combination but Amazon Music from my iPhone streamed over bluetooth is MUCH more reliable than the built in slacker in the car. It wasn't this way for the first few years I owned the car which is the most disappointing part.


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## JWardell (May 9, 2016)

I also run whenever I drive anywhere, not just the few times I actually need navigation. It is always displaying and warning of upcoming accidents, hazards, police, and traffic.

Very important in busy areas with bad traffic and many possible routes like here in Boston. Google maps may have the same routine but it is not a driver’s companion, does not display nearly as much useful information. 

I always get a dashboard mount for my phone so the screen is right in the corner of my view and don’t need to take eyes off the road. 

I have also used Slacker for six years and I think it is better than any other streaming service. Much better music selection than even Sirius/XM. Well worth my $3 a month and still almost no one had heard of it. Awesome that Tesla has it built in. 

As always, remember that unlike other cars, Tesla’s software is constantly upgraded and features are regularly added. Email Tesla your thoughts and eventually they could add the apps you want.


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## ng0 (Apr 11, 2017)

I was doing some google searches about App integration for Tesla cars and happened to come across this article from two years ago...

https://www.theverge.com/2016/1/28/10862540/tesla-touchscreen-mirror-apps-android-iphone

It's interesting. It seems they had planned to allow screen mirroring at some point. I'm hoping that this is still on their plate to implement! I'm sure native app integration would be better, but I'm perfectly fine with mirroring if there isn't another option.


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