# Learn from the mistakes of others... you will look smarter!



## Paul Spiers (Apr 11, 2016)

Okay, so I usually think of myself as not dumb, okay I think I’m smart. However, after taking my son to the orthodontist we returned home to be treated by a heavy downpour due to thunder storms. While we were sitting in my month old Model 3 “Darkshines”, waiting for a break in the rain, we listened to some music by Muse. I was hoping my son would like the sounds of Matt Bellamy and company.
I have tickets to see Muse, the Drones world tour and I hoped my son would like to come after hearing some tracks. While sitting there listening to Hysteria, I opened the trunk lid as I had bought some groceries. My son asked quizzically, whether I should have opened the trunk. I said, “Well son, I think that the trunk lid is still covering the opening and the water should just run around the weather stripping.” Famous last words of an idiot, as the saying goes “It is better to be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.” After spending some more father and son time listening to the melodic sounds of Endlessly, I called my wife to let her know we were sitting in the car on the driveway and could use her assistance to get in the house dry. She dutifully came out with our big umbrella and escorted my son to the front door and came back for me. I went to the back and lifted the trunk lid to find a large puddle on the lower truck cover and in the lower trunk area. My heart sank and, I realized that my son is a lot smarter than me.
Once the rain stopped and after many towels and cussing and cursing myself, I removed the liner. The bottom of the trunk was soaking wet. It took a dozen small towels to dry the bottom and the material. I’m fairly confident that the damage is minimal, just some minor damage to the liner and my ego.


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## Dr. J (Sep 1, 2017)

Paul Spiers said:


> I realized that my son is a lot smarter than me.


At least your wife has given us (the human race) that. 

Sounds like something I would have done, BTW.


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

Paul Spiers said:


> we returned home to be treated by a heavy downpour due to thunder storms. While we were sitting there waiting for a break in the rain, we listened to some music by Muse.
> While sitting there listening to Hysteria, I opened the trunk lid as I had bought some groceries


Declare this an emergency
Come on and spread a sense of urgency



Paul Spiers said:


> My son asked quizzically, whether I should have opened the trunk. I said, "Well son, I think that the trunk lid is still covering the opening and the water should just run around the weather stripping."


And pull us through...



Paul Spiers said:


> After spending some more father and son time listening to the melodic sounds of Endlessly, I called my wife to let her know we were sitting in the car on the driveway and could use her assistance to get in the house dry.


And pull us through...



Paul Spiers said:


> I went to the back and lifted the trunk lid to find a large puddle on the lower truck cover and in the lower trunk area. My heart sank and, I realized that my son is a lot smarter than me.


And this is the end
This is the end
Of the wwwoooooorrrrrrrlllllddd!

(Kidding... kidding... )

Truthfully, as someone with no driveway or car port, I guarantee you that this will happen to me multiple times. Glad the damage to your Model 3 was minimal, though.

Oh, and more importantly... enjoy the Drones World Tour showing!! I was just about to ask in the Muse Fan Club thread whether anyone here had tickets. Definitely let us know how it goes! (I attended the Boston show on that tour, which bathed my brain in levels of dopamine that I have not experienced since then... though I suspect taking delivery of my Model 3 will change that. )


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## Paul Spiers (Apr 11, 2016)

Bokonon,

That reply is legendary!

My oldest son and I attended the 2016 tour when they were in Toronto. That concert was an awesome experience, I hope to recapture some of that experience with my younger son, if he’ll come.


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## PNWmisty (Aug 19, 2017)

While my Model 3 has been completely reliable and wonderful to drive, this is a real design flaw. And the only one I've found worth mentioning. The water runs off the rear sloping glass into the open trunk. It runs right over the weather-stripping while using it like a ski jump.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

PNWmisty said:


> While my Model 3 has been completely reliable and wonderful to drive, this is a real design flaw. And the only one I've found worth mentioning. The water runs off the rear sloping glass into the open trunk. It runs right over the weather-stripping while using it like a ski jump.


Can somebody record a short video to demonstrate this?

I just can't picture it from the written descriptions.


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## PNWmisty (Aug 19, 2017)

garsh said:


> Can somebody record a short video to demonstrate this?
> 
> I just can't picture it from the written descriptions.


Garsh, picture a bead of water on the very top center of the roof. Now picture it travelling directly rearward as it rolls down the center of the rear glass. Now picture it continuing into the open trunk.


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## KarenRei (Jul 27, 2017)

Paul Spiers said:


> Okay, so I usually think of myself as not dumb, okay I think I'm smart. However, after taking my son to the orthodontist we returned home to be treated by a heavy downpour due to thunder storms. While we were sitting in my month old Model 3 "Darkshines", waiting for a break in the rain, we listened to some music by Muse. I was hoping my son would like the sounds of Matt Bellamy and company.
> I have tickets to see Muse, the Drones world tour and I hoped my son would like to come after hearing some tracks. While sitting there listening to Hysteria, I opened the trunk lid as I had bought some groceries. My son asked quizzically, whether I should have opened the trunk. I said, "Well son, I think that the trunk lid is still covering the opening and the water should just run around the weather stripping." Famous last words of an idiot, as the saying goes "It is better to be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt." After spending some more father and son time listening to the melodic sounds of Endlessly, I called my wife to let her know we were sitting in the car on the driveway and could use her assistance to get in the house dry. She dutifully came out with our big umbrella and escorted my son to the front door and came back for me. I went to the back and lifted the trunk lid to find a large puddle on the lower truck cover and in the lower trunk area. My heart sank and, I realized that my son is a lot smarter than me.
> Once the rain stopped and after many towels and cussing and cursing myself, I removed the liner. The bottom of the trunk was soaking wet. It took a dozen small towels to dry the bottom and the material. I'm fairly confident that the damage is minimal, just some minor damage to the liner and my ego.


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## Paul Spiers (Apr 11, 2016)

PNWmisty said:


> Garsh, picture a bead of water on the very top center of the roof. Now picture it travelling directly rearward as it rolls down the center of the rear glass. Now picture it continuing into the open trunk.


The trunk lid was unlocked, not fully open. But yeah that's basically what happened.


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## PaulK (Oct 2, 2017)

Somebody already took a video, posted on TMC.

It's not a downpour but you can see what happens.

I'm concerned about this but not sure what can be done about it.

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/water-dripping-into-the-trunk-from-the-rear-glass.112811/

-Paul


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

PaulK said:


> Somebody already took a video, posted on TMC.


Thank you!
Here's a direct link to the YouTube video:






These are the types of problems you end up with when your car is designed in California. 

Hopefully some change to the rubber gasket around the trunk will be all that's required to fix this. If not, this is a great opportunity for a third party to save the day and make a little money.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

Yep the problem is that gap is so small the water flows right over it. I don't know if you made the gasket taller to stop it, would the trunk then close properly I figure this little design flaw alone will keep the trunk rubber mat manufactures in business for a long time. That is really the only solution that is going to do any good, just catch the water in the trunk properly so it can be cleaned up. That gap around the trunk just isn't big enough to let the water drop into it.

From all accounts I've seen the gasket seals the trunk and it does not leak with normal driving or with the trunk closed, it is simply when the trunk is opened.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

I wonder if putting a hydrophilic (opposite of hydrophobic) coating on the bottom edge of the rear window would help prevent the drops from jumping that gap?


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

garsh said:


> I wonder if putting a hydrophilic (opposite of hydrophobic) coating on the bottom edge of the rear window would help prevent the drops from jumping that gap?


I don't know - as much as I like that long sleek window, that gives the water some good distance to pick up steam, it's going to take quite a bit to stop it or slow it down so that it will fall into that very tiny gap around the trunk and not into the trunk itself. Plus opening the trunk itself doesn't help because any water standing on that rolls off on to the window and then straight down and right into the trunk as well.

I didn't notice it at delivery, but I could see an area that had obviously been wet at one time, I'm sure it came from cleanup pre-delivery washing the car and then they opened the trunk to clean. You'd think those guys would know by now, but alas, I'm sure it happens to most every one they wash and clean up.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

GDN said:


> I don't know - as much as I like that long sleek window, that gives the water some good distance to pick up steam, it's going to take quite a bit to stop it or slow it down so that it will fall into that very tiny gap...


A hydrophilic coating would neither slow it down nor stop it - it would instead *attract* it down into that gap instead of allowing it to fly off.

That's my theory anyhow. I think it's worth a shot.


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## JWardell (May 9, 2016)

garsh said:


> These are the types of problems you end up with when your car is designed in California.
> 
> Hopefully some change to the rubber gasket around the trunk will be all that's required to fix this. If not, this is a great opportunity for a third party to save the day and make a little money.


Unfortunately that designed in California hits the nail on the head!

I would think some simple plastic edging or weatherstripping applied to the bottom edge of the glass might be enough to slow it or encourage the water to curve downwards into the gutter.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

I could see s strip of plastic being added in front of the trunk seal - close the trunk it is hidden, open the trunk that plastic pops up to stop the water. That gap is pretty small, looks bigger in that video and you can see the speed at which the water runs. I'm not a chemist, so I won't dismiss the hydrophilic coating, but that will have to be some serious "attraction" to get that water down in that small gap to run around the trunk.


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## Brokedoc (May 28, 2017)

Unfortunately, this is the EXACT same problem that Model X owners have on the Falcon Wing Doors. The gap is simply not wide enough for water to fall into the channel and drain away. Tesla engineers need to learn from their own past mistakes...


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## Dr. J (Sep 1, 2017)

Brokedoc said:


> Tesla engineers need to learn from their own past mistakes...


Tesla engineers are having trouble getting to Step 1 of a 12-Step process: You admit you have a problem....


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

So as in most products we buy these days I just spent more money, because big purchases always just seem to have you spend more money on accessories. I just purchased the trunk mat from Tesla. Not cheap, but reported to be made by Weathertec, some of the better products out there. I don't plan on a fix from Tesla anytime soon, or really ever, so the only thing is to spend more money to protect it and at least catch the water.


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## PNWmisty (Aug 19, 2017)

GDN said:


> Yep the problem is that gap is so small the water flows right over it.


Yep. And if you put Rain-X on the glass the speed of the rolling water would be even higher. That little plastic blade seal right by the glass acts like a ski jump to keep the water from falling. If the seal rose up slightly higher before curling down into the gutter, the water would probably follow it.

Alternatively, if there was a substance that was the opposite of Rain-X, that reduced the surface tension of the water near the bottom of the glass, the water might spread out, slow down and fall into the gutter.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

PNWmisty said:


> Alternatively, if there was a substance that was the opposite of Rain-X, that reduced the surface tension of the water near the bottom of the glass, the water might spread out, slow down and fall into the gutter.


Hydrophilic. It's the opposite of hydrophobic. Water is attracted to it.

When I search Amazon for that term, I get mostly medical stuff. And the few automotive results makes me wonder if they're truly hydrophilic, or just abusing the term ("Imparts a balance of hydrophobic and hydrophilic characteristics" - WTH is that supposed to mean?)


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## Vendacious (Aug 3, 2017)

garsh said:


> ("Imparts a balance of hydrophobic and hydrophilic characteristics" - WTH is that supposed to mean?)


It probably means "doesn't actually do anything at all".


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## Archaebald (Dec 13, 2017)

garsh said:


> WTH is that supposed to mean?)


The molecules of the active ingredients in common household detergents have a hydrophilic and a hydrophobic part. The hydrophobic (i.e. lipophilic) part dissolves in the "dirt" (fat) while the hydrophilic part remains on the outside of the dirt particle. Hence, the surface of the dirt particle becomes increasingly hydrophilic as more and more detergent molecules "attaches" to it, allowing it to be flushed away with water.


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