# First In-Depth look at the Tesla Model 3



## TrevP

*Here it is folks! The one you've been waiting for. The very first in-depth look at the Tesla Model 3.*


----------



## SoFlaModel3

TrevP said:


> *Here it is folks! The one you've been waiting for. The very first in-depth look at the Tesla Model 3.*


Gladly canceled lunch here


----------



## JWardell

Whohoo! Looks like it's popcorn for lunch and an hour of being glued three inches from this 4K monitor!


----------



## NH-Mike

Does this mean public deliveries have started?


----------



## Bokonon

_*WHHHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSSSSSHHHH!!!!!!!*_

That sound you just heard was any remaining productivity for today getting sucked out into the infinite, airless vacuum of my Model 3 daydreams...


----------



## Gunn

You had me at "Hey Trev, lets go for a ride" 

@TrevP and @Kennethbokor, big thanks guys and I haven't even watched it yet.


----------



## mtdoak

Awesome video guys. 

One quick question, did you guys notice where the fuse box was?


----------



## Mad Hungarian

You two have well and truly outdone yourselves, what an amazing score and a fabulous job on the walkthrough and drive!!
And thanks so much for taking the PCD gauge with you, so glad you were able to clear the mystery on that bit.

Now off to SEMA, hoping a 3 somehow magically appears somewhere in Vegas this week...


----------



## Kennethbokor

Mad Hungarian said:


> You two have well and truly outdone yourselves, what an amazing score and a fabulous job on the walkthrough and drive!!
> And thanks so much for taking the PCD gauge with you, so glad you were able to clear the mystery on that bit.
> 
> Now off to SEMA, hoping a 3 somehow magically appears somewhere in Vegas this week...


Thanks MH! Let us know if one does appear!!


----------



## ummgood

I really loved the video thanks for all the great info!


----------



## BluestarE3

That was definitely worth waiting for! Glad you guys spent the time crafting this video to give us real information rather than rushing it out the door just to lay claim to being first. Also appreciate the care you took masking out (or not showing) any private owner information. I've been in the Model 3 doldrums the past couple of weeks due to the paucity of new information, but watching your video is akin to Model 3 Reveal Part 4. I'm really stoked again and can't wait until I get my own! Thanks for all your work and sharing this with us.


----------



## John

Thumbs up, guys. Well done!


----------



## Rich M

Thank you so much for producing this, and for the unknown owner who let you poke around! Thorough and informative. I can't believe you both flew all the way (down the*r*e) just to make *i*t. I'm *g*uessin*g* the youtube vi*e*ws will cove*r* the flight, a few ka*j*illi*on* perhaps.


----------



## John

The*y* black*e*d out the owner'*s* info.


----------



## AugustaDriver

Always remember to carry a good supply of cones for crowd control, at least in these early days.


----------



## Mad Hungarian

Kennethbokor said:


> Thanks MH! Let us know if one does appear!!


Oh you can bet I will be Tweeting any sightings in real time - and posting here ASAP.


----------



## Groovykool

Best Car Review EVER!


----------



## BobLoblaw

Great video guys! I suspect you will be internet sensations before you know it!!


----------



## Quicksilver

Thank you guys!!! Love the little details...especially the little grocery bag hooks in the frunk (I thought those were covers for screw holes)...and even the edge/end piece of the bright work around the doors. Can't wait for my own 3!


----------



## Guest

Charge port does not glow - this is actually very important feature.
I would like somebody to verify in absolute darkness, that indicator LED does
not shine into the charging port aperture. Just a small amount is enough.

Rear window defroster with rear mirror defroster.

Pigtails happen because of possible wire failure between UMC and adapter.
Also it is cheaper that way.

Not for a moment were hands at the correct position on the wheel while driving.

Nissan Leaf missed charge port light in 2011-2012. They fixed that later on.
It is important.

Also I have a question. BMW's have automatic exterior temperature dependent
rear window defrosters (no need to activate rear window defroster, though
doing that will max out mirrors heaters). Does any Tesla do that? Keep mirrors
always clean by heating them just enough.


----------



## skygraff

This was fantastic and I echo many of the previous sentiments (agreed and liked a few)! I was also hoping this meant the first gen-pop deliveries had begun.

Really appreciate the measurements (bet you wish you'd brought a longer tape, eh?) and I tried to watch closely to read some I'm curious about. Did you happen to get a straight height of the trunk from floor to top of bottom/back opening? In other words, how deep can an 18" tall object be and still get in? It looks like about 3-4" based on the curve of your tape; reducing the relative opening to 14-15". Also, I was wondering if the 60/40 was actually that ratio of the 38" distance between wheels (22.8"/15.2") or if it was not quite a 60/40 (at least from the trunk side).

Did it look like the grocery hooks could be deployed with the frunk cover/hood closed? That would be a great place for a cargo net to hold emergency gear (especially since hood open is still a common distress signal); wonder if there's any anchor points at the bottom of that "firewall".

You mentioned the possible toll transponder location but did it seem like there may be an option in the frunk or nose?

No expectation that you guys got that far into the weeds since, despite your desire to answer checklist questions, you were there for an in-depth big-picture (not an oxymoron) opportunity. Hopefully, we'll get our own chances soon enough and you fellas will be in your own 3s before ya know it.

Thanks so much!!!


----------



## Dan Detweiler

The more I see of this car the more stupid I feel about my early concerns over the interior! Can't wait!

Thanks again guys on the fabulous review. 

One quick question. On my current Volt the UMC plug lights up when you push the button to insert it for charging so you can see the port. No lights on the port itself. Does the Tesla version do something similar? It helps on my Volt when I pull in at night and the garage is pitch black. Just curious.

Thanks again,

Dan


----------



## jpoet

I am surprised there is no SD (Secure Digital) slot, for media. You really have to use up one of the phone USB ports for a thumb-drive?


----------



## John White

Awesome video. Really looking forward to having an M3. I haven't felt this way since I was a little kid waiting for Christmas morning!


----------



## Mobocracy

Fantastic job on review. No 12 v in trunk... what is this, a hook?


----------



## Rich M

Mobocracy said:


> Fantastic job on review. No 12 v in trunk... what is this, a hook?


That is a push snap rivet thing to hold in the gray fabric trunk liner in place.
Here's another one above the light:


----------



## Mobocracy

Rich M said:


> That is a push snap rivet thing to hold in the gray fabric trunk liner in place.
> Here's another one above the light:
> View attachment 3889


thanks for finding that!


----------



## SoFlaModel3

arnis said:


> Charge port does not glow - this is actually very important feature.
> I would like somebody to verify in absolute darkness, that indicator LED does
> not shine into the charging port aperture. Just a small amount is enough.


We should be fine with the glowing "T"


----------



## 3V Pilot

Great video, just when I thought the weight couldn't get MORE unbearable.....now I have this piece of Model 3 crack to keep my junkie habit up! THANKS GUYS!....lol.

I've found that once you get your hands on this car it's like that song you can't get out of your head!


----------



## Rich M

Another Model ≡ stamped in the rear shelf


----------



## mdfraz

Tremendous job, gentlemen. Thanks so much for the VERY comprehensive review, inside and out. I can't wait to sit in one and play with every option myself.


----------



## Topher

I thought the pigtails were to make the actual plug smaller. Makes it easier to fit in a covered outlet. 

Thank you kindly.


----------



## MichelT3

Great Video. 
Hope the tow hitch will be resolved end 2018. Only fault I can find.


----------



## PTFI

TrevP said:


> *Here it is folks! The one you've been waiting for. The very first in-depth look at the Tesla Model 3.*


Awesome work guys!

I really hope that the TESLA Media Team takes notes on how a informative video is supposed to be produced,

YOU GUYS ARE MY OFFICIAL 2017 MODEL 3 MANUAL!

Thank you


----------



## TrevP

Rich M said:


> Another Model ≡ stamped in the rear shelf
> 
> View attachment 3890


Yep, we found a few of those nuggets in the car:

Under the trunk lid, child seat tethers in the trunk lid covers, front trunk grocery bag clips. We know the logo is stamped into the metal of the floor of the car and also the computer housing. I'm sure there are many many more we haven't found yet! That's just Tesla showing their pride and having fun with little easter eggs


----------



## TrevP

PTFI said:


> Awesome work guys!
> 
> I really hope that the TESLA Media Team takes notes on how a informative video is supposed to be produced,
> 
> YOU GUYS ARE MY OFFICIAL 2017 MODEL 3 MANUAL!
> 
> Thank you


Thanks! Our goal wasn't a "review" but showing the car like a delivery specialist would. Tesla will have their own videos soon enough though


----------



## Jimmy Pepe Russels

You guys weren't kidding about *in-depth*! Best car review I've seen, enjoyed all of it.

One question: Did you guys get a chance to play around with the steering sensitivity from comfort/standard/sport? And did you notice any significant or noticeable changes from how it handles turns/going straight with slight micro-movements such as when going over a bump in the different modes? I watched an Audi A8 review that had some extra-sensitive turning mode to where the power-steering felt a bit artificial, but made u-turns and the like for such a long car very easy. Granted this was an option for that car, but I'm just curious about yall's perspective on that if you changed it at all.

Cheers! :beercheers:


----------



## mservice

Great review, the best so far with two of the best reviewers for a M3. Knowing what most are looking for helps answer questions that a number of other down and dirty reviews by people who may not even own a Tesla let alone have reserved an M3 have posted raising sometimes more questions than answerwd.

What did I get out of it? Well I still like the white paint, but boy was the front of the car dirty. I know I can wrap it but it will still likely get dirty fast. So, the midnight silver has moved back to first

Still want to put hands on one. While the review answered the important tech, and physical manufacturing questions that i’ve had, the low video quality still leaves me with questions as too just how does it look in person. Yea, i’ve heard everyone who sees one say how great they look, but I thought some of the interior looked a little cheap for the premium package. Now, that being said I doubt I will be cancelling my order. 

I just hope i’m Still looking at my estamated delivery window

Again great job on the review guys....


----------



## mservice

TrevP said:


> Thanks! Our goal wasn't a "review" but showing the car like a delivery specialist would. Tesla will have their own videos soon enough though


@TrevP you may not of thought it was a review, but th two of you looked like kids who just got the keys to the new candy store... I would say your smiles were review enough


----------



## KarenRei

Underside panels: are they plastic or metal? I've had a big problem with plastic panels on my Insight steadily failing under snow / ice damage until the car basically turns into a snowplow.


----------



## Dangermouse

I'll have you know, this came out on the same day as Stranger Things 2, and I watched this first. Twice.


----------



## RobR

Great work guys, a real coup, and the sort of detail I was looking for as a reservation holder, albeit for a RHD car in 2019 if I'm lucky. My only real regret is the lack of a heated steering wheel, mainly because it would be so easy to do. I would use it more than heated seats. I own a coat! (I own gloves too, but hate to wear them for driving).

Here in Scotland, the pressure is really on for the removal of polluting diesels from our cities. My own, Dundee, is expected to tax all diesels up to and including Euro IV models (made before about 2009 and including my own current 2008MY Audi) out of the city centre entirely in 2-3 years, so I really have an incentive to get my M3 on schedule. My employer, Dundee City Council, offers free all day parking and free rapid charging for EVs in the city, so its a real no-brainer.


----------



## Guest

SoFlaModel3 said:


> We should be fine with the glowing "T"


No we are not fine with just the glowing T. Optimism and inevitability is not how M3 buyers react to drawbacks.

Let me visualize you what does it mean not to have ANY light inside/around charging port at night:

















Try to plug in with optimism now

That glowing T LED can do this trick without any real pricetag:


----------



## teslamcteslaface

Great Job Guys. It looks very well made and premium - worth the $40k. 
The front seat plastic seems fairly roughed up - outdoorsy owner or just prone to prints?


----------



## giarC71

No has answered the big question on why the video was released early? I thought this was tight lipped due to the agreement with Tesla until the regular consumers were taking delivery?


----------



## SoFlaModel3

arnis said:


> No we are not fine with just the glowing T. Optimism and inevitability is not how M3 buyers react to drawbacks.
> 
> Let me visualize you what does it mean not to have ANY light inside/around charging port at night:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Try to plug in with optimism now
> 
> That glowing T LED can do this trick without any real pricetag:


Ahh I see what you're saying. Question though, how often would you be plugging in your car for charging in absolute pitch black conditions?

Just thinking of myself, I know the answer is never.

In fact the only thing I can think of is someone that charges outside of their garage. Even still I would hope there is some light on the car. As a solution to that challenge your smart phone which of course is your key could light the charge port as necessary.

I do hope I'm not missing something though.


----------



## MelindaV

teslamcteslaface said:


> Great Job Guys. It looks very well made and premium - worth the $40k.
> The front seat plastic seems fairly roughed up - outdoorsy owner or just prone to prints?


Kids in front facing car seats with shoes on the back of the front seat backs


----------



## MelindaV

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Ahh I see what you're saying. Question though, how often would you be plugging in your car for charging in absolute pitch black conditions?
> 
> Just thinking of myself, I know the answer is never.
> 
> In fact the only thing I can think of is someone that charges outside of their garage. Even still I would hope there is some light on the car. As a solution to that challenge your smart phone which of course is your key could light the charge port as necessary.
> 
> I do hope I'm not missing something though.


Agree, I can not think of anywhere I would be plugging in that is completely black


----------



## SoFlaModel3

MelindaV said:


> Kids in front facing car seats with shoes on the back of the front seat backs


This something I will be trying to solve for. If you watch the Like Tesla videos they have seat back protectors in their X, but the seat design is different.


----------



## Dan Detweiler

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Ahh I see what you're saying. Question though, how often would you be plugging in your car for charging in absolute pitch black conditions?
> 
> Just thinking of myself, I know the answer is never.
> 
> In fact the only thing I can think of is someone that charges outside of their garage. Even still I would hope there is some light on the car. As a solution to that challenge your smart phone which of course is your key could light the charge port as necessary.
> 
> I do hope I'm not missing something though.


Actually...I can say that in my case with my Volt I am plugging in probably 3-4 times per week in total darkness. The little light in the UMC plug is really helpful in these cases. It also lets me see where I am hanging the cable after unplugging. Just push the button and you have a little flashlight to see what you are doing. It really does help. Probably even more helpful than a light on the charge port of the car to be honest.

Dan


----------



## Dan Detweiler

One quick question for @TrevP . During the driving portion of your video the A pillars seem to be very thick. Did you find them obstructing your vision at stop lights or stop signs? I have almost pulled out in front of traffic coming from the side a couple of times in my Volt due to the thickness of the A pillars and not seeing the car hidden in my blind spot until it was almost too late. Just curious if that was noticeable during your drive or not.

Thanks again for this fantastic video!

Dan


----------



## MelindaV

SoFlaModel3 said:


> This something I will be trying to solve for. If you watch the Like Tesla videos they have seat back protectors in their X, but the seat design is different.


Lots of different seat back covers out there to keep the scuffs down. I'm sure there are some that will work/fit better than others, but many to pick from. Just a few in a quick search...
Plain one with a couple pockets
With a couple more pockets
With fold down "tray"


----------



## garsh

Dan Detweiler said:


> During the driving portion of your video the A pillars seem to be very thick. Did you find them obstructing you vision at stop lights or stop signs?


Unfortunately, all modern cars have A-pillars that are too thick. It's for rollover protection, and for housing additional A-pillar airbags. I've almost hit pedestrians, bikes, and even full-size vehicles because they were hidden behind the A pillar until the last minute.

It turns out that roundabouts (aka traffic circle) are especially bad for this, in my experience. The speeds of the vehicles slowing down as they approach, and the angle changes, somehow match up to keep a vehicle behind my A pillar. I almost hit a full-size truck at a roundabout. I've since learned to actually lean forward, then to the left, specifically to look around the A pillar when approaching a roundabout.


----------



## Ip Man

Fantastic video on model 3. Really! Nice job-probably better than any manual we'll see.


----------



## Russell K Smith

What a great video of the demo of the white tesla model 3 a big thanks to TrevP and Kenneth. It really answered all the questions for me right now until we seen the new white seats, and roof on the car without the premium package again thanks for all your hard work.


----------



## TrevP

Dan Detweiler said:


> One quick question for @TrevP . During the driving portion of your video the A pillars seem to be very thick. Did you find them obstructing your vision at stop lights or stop signs? I have almost pulled out in front of traffic coming from the side a couple of times in my Volt due to the thickness of the A pillars and not seeing the car hidden in my blind spot until it was almost too late. Just curious if that was noticeable during your drive or not.
> 
> Thanks again for this fantastic video!
> 
> Dan


I didn't find them particularly bad. Unlike my Kia Sportage which were like tree trunks


----------



## TesLou

Dan Detweiler said:


> View attachment 3894
> 
> Actually...I can say that in my case with my Volt I am plugging in probably 3-4 times per week in total darkness. The little light in the UMC plug is really helpful in these cases. It also lets me see where I am hanging the cable after unplugging. Just push the button and you have a little flashlight to see what you are doing. It really does help. Probably even more helpful than a light on the charge port of the car to be honest.
> 
> Dan


Perhaps the good folks at EVannex can design a little LED light that fits inside the charge port door or just inside the charge port area. Not an issue for me, however.


----------



## Dan Detweiler

TrevP said:


> I didn't find them particularly bad. Unlike my Kia Sportage which were like tree trunks


Great, thanks.

Dan


----------



## SoFlaModel3

Dan Detweiler said:


> View attachment 3894
> 
> Actually...I can say that in my case with my Volt I am plugging in probably 3-4 times per week in total darkness. The little light in the UMC plug is really helpful in these cases. It also lets me see where I am hanging the cable after unplugging. Just push the button and you have a little flashlight to see what you are doing. It really does help. Probably even more helpful than a light on the charge port of the car to be honest.
> 
> Dan


Yikes!


----------



## Scuffers

Just to echo what's already been said, great job guys.

I have one question though, could you give me your thoughts on how the 3 compares with the interior of a well spec'ed Audi A/S4?

specifically, space, quality of materials, and comfort?

from the pictures and your video, it;s looks pretty on par, but without being there to 'feel' it it's really hard to get a handle on this stuff.

Many thanks again... Keep up the good work.


----------



## Robert Pickel

Beautiful and informative video. Can't believe you only had a couple of days to make it. Thank you so much!!! I feel that I finally know something. (Much more than Tesla is telling us!)


----------



## Gizmo

Scuffers said:


> I have one question though, could you give me your thoughts on how the 3 compares with the interior of a well spec'ed Audi A/S4?
> 
> specifically, space, quality of materials, and comfort?
> 
> from the pictures and your video, it;s looks pretty on par, but without being there to 'feel' it it's really hard to get a handle on this stuff..




There are certainly going to be several options* (that VAG offer) that are missing from the model 3 but I'm hoping the quality will be on par or better, 
I certainly will not be ordering one until I have had chance to sit in one and hopefully drive it (less important as by then there will be loads of owner reviews out) to see for myself if it will be a worthy replacement for my ICE car, _just_ losing the ICE is not enough of a reason to make me change as my car is not yet 2 years old.

* spare wheel
heated steering wheel
ventilated seats
massaging seats
auto wipers
dynamic lights
electric hatch / trunk
privacy glass
SD card slot


----------



## Spinball

Scuffers said:


> I have one question though, could you give me your thoughts on how the 3 compares with the interior of a well spec'ed Audi A/S4?


About 3,000 fewer buttons!


----------



## ummgood

TesLou said:


> Perhaps the good folks at EVannex can design a little LED light that fits inside the charge port door or just inside the charge port area. Not an issue for me, however.


I will just use the flashlight on my phone if it becomes an issue.


----------



## Gizmo

Spinball said:


> About 3,000 fewer buttons!


Not all of these 'missing' buttons will be a good thing though.... why would you not let the rear seat passengers control their own heated seat or heater controls?


----------



## TrevP

Scuffers said:


> Just to echo what's already been said, great job guys.
> 
> I have one question though, could you give me your thoughts on how the 3 compares with the interior of a well spec'ed Audi A/S4?
> 
> specifically, space, quality of materials, and comfort?
> 
> from the pictures and your video, it;s looks pretty on par, but without being there to 'feel' it it's really hard to get a handle on this stuff.
> 
> Many thanks again... Keep up the good work.


I'd say it's on par with the quality of the materials. Design of course is subjective and not everyone will say from a design angle they're equivalent. Tesla went with a simpler design, others see more doodads as a sign of luxury. Same can be said of the Model S.

For a car in this USD price range it's perfect. However our main complaint is outside the US the pricing will be high given Tesla prices things in US + exchange so this car will be touching almost $80K CAD fully loaded and that's a tough pill to to swallow when you compare it against other cars in that price range. We're stil paying a premium for electrification right @Kennethbokor ?

I'm not disappointed in the Model 3, only the pricing outside the US. If I'm spending $80K on a Model 3 why not throw in a bit more and get a bigger car like an S or X? I understand that's not achievable for many but it's within reach for me as I've had to increase my Model 3 budget 3 times since the reveal last year.


----------



## Scuffers

Gizmo said:


> There are certainly going to be several options* (that VAG offer) that are missing from the model 3 but I'm hoping the quality will be on par or better,
> I certainly will not be ordering one until I have had chance to sit in one and hopefully drive it (less important as by then there will be loads of owner reviews out) to see for myself if it will be a worthy replacement for my ICE car, _just_ losing the ICE is not enough of a reason to make me change as my car is not yet 2 years old.
> 
> * spare wheel
> heated steering wheel
> ventilated seats
> massaging seats
> auto wipers
> dynamic lights
> electric hatch / trunk
> privacy glass
> SD card slot


interestingly, none of that list bothers me! - just goes to show how we all look at stuff differently.



TrevP said:


> I'd say it's on par with the quality of the materials. Design of course is subjective and not everyone will say from a design angle they're equivalent. Tesla went with a simpler design, others see more doodads as a sign of luxury. Same can be said of the Model S.


Thanks for that, I have mates with S and X's, and the bit I like least about them is the interiors, hard to put into words why they don't do it for me, but best I can do is they are too 'American' if you get what I mean?

The pics and vid show the 3 has a much more European car look, I am just praying they are as good as they look in fit and finish.

Last point, reading that they only have 192KW motor is a bit disappointing, I guess I will be waiting for the 4WD (P?) version..

Just how 'perky' is it to drive (compared to the non-P S75/85/90/100)?


----------



## Gizmo

Scuffers said:


> interestingly, none of that list bothers me! - just goes to show how we all look at stuff differently.


Agreed, just goes to prove that '_one size does not fit all'_... this doesn't mean something or someone is wrong but we all have different expectations / requirements from a car.


----------



## RCvetter

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Ahh I see what you're saying. Question though, how often would you be plugging in your car for charging in absolute pitch black conditions?
> 
> Just thinking of myself, I know the answer is never.
> 
> In fact the only thing I can think of is someone that charges outside of their garage. Even still I would hope there is some light on the car. As a solution to that challenge your smart phone which of course is your key could light the charge port as necessary.
> 
> I do hope I'm not missing something though.


Our driveway is pretty dark at night. The first couple of nights I took a moment to find the charge port. After that it becomes second nature and I haven't had an issue since.


----------



## Famman49

Fabulous video! Very thorough. Only one of my questions unanswered. I wear polarized sunglasses to reduce glare. These are typically polarized to block any light that is horizontally polarized, like reflections from the surface of a road. All LCD displays are also polarized. I've already checked in a test drive of a model S that the display is compatible with polarized sunglasses. But with the changed orientation of the Model 3 display, I have a slight concern that my sunglasses will block me from seeing the display. I'm pretty confident the engineers at Tesla have thought of this, but it would be great to confirm this. The test is this: with a pair of polarizing sunglasses, hold them between your eyes and the display. Now rotate the glasses. At about 90 degrees rotation, the display will darken. If the display looks dark when the glasses are oriented as you would wear them, and then lightens to become visible as you rotate them, there is a problem.


----------



## MelindaV

Famman49 said:


> Fabulous video! Very thorough. Only one of my questions unanswered. I wear polarized sunglasses to reduce glare. These are typically polarized to block any light that is horizontally polarized, like reflections from the surface of a road. All LCD displays are also polarized. I've already checked in a test drive of a model S that the display is compatible with polarized sunglasses. But with the changed orientation of the Model 3 display, I have a slight concern that my sunglasses will block me from seeing the display. I'm pretty confident the engineers at Tesla have thought of this, but it would be great to confirm this. The test is this: with a pair of polarizing sunglasses, hold them between your eyes and the display. Now rotate the glasses. At about 90 degrees rotation, the display will darken. If the display looks dark when the glasses are oriented as you would wear them, and then lightens to become visible as you rotate them, there is a problem.


this has been addressed in the FAQ thread. Check for the link in post #1


----------



## Kennethbokor

mtdoak said:


> Awesome video guys.
> 
> One quick question, did you guys notice where the fuse box was?


Hi nope did not look for that.


----------



## thredge

Awesome video guys. Was curious why the timing of the release?

Also I was curious how they handle flat tires on Model 3? Is there a fill a flat or do they just rely on the Tesla service, or some other road service you are responsible for?


----------



## MelindaV

thredge said:


> Awesome video guys. Was curious why the timing of the release?
> 
> Also I was curious how they handle flat tires on Model 3? Is there a fill a flat or do they just rely on the Tesla service, or some other road service you are responsible for?


you can purchase the emergency tire air compressor thing. We've not gotten any word on what the Model 3 qualifies for as far as roadside assistance directly from Tesla yet.


----------



## Kennethbokor

Gizmo said:


> There are certainly going to be several options* (that VAG offer) that are missing from the model 3 but I'm hoping the quality will be on par or better,
> I certainly will not be ordering one until I have had chance to sit in one and hopefully drive it (less important as by then there will be loads of owner reviews out) to see for myself if it will be a worthy replacement for my ICE car, _just_ losing the ICE is not enough of a reason to make me change as my car is not yet 2 years old.
> 
> * spare wheel
> heated steering wheel
> ventilated seats
> massaging seats
> auto wipers
> dynamic lights
> electric hatch / trunk
> privacy glass
> SD card slot


Hi there, so many questions...so little time!

Look folks, I think many still miss the big picture here with BEV's in general. We can go on all day and debate features of one vehicle versus another, whether to purchase a BEV or stay with ICE, Model 3 versus BMW versus Mercedes, etc.

Right now, consumers are paying a premium in order to have a ZEV (BEV) car. That is simple fact. Whether or not a Leaf or Bolt or Model 3 or other BEV's out there is better than an A4, C-class, Honda Civic, etc. is really dependant on your needs, which have many factors. If you must have more features that are not offered on the Model 3, then don't get it!

Personally, I am willing to pay more on a BEV than for a similarly equipped ICE car today simply because I believe in sustainable transportation and having a zero emission vehicle. I want to do my small part in not contributing emissions as much as possible. Plain and simple. If one does not want to do this, then there are plenty of other vehicles from dozens of manufacturers to choose from. I also see the value in low-maintence and having the ability to "fuel" my car at home overnight! 

My advise is don't get hung up on little details and if they are that important to you, then look elsewhere. As we have stated in this video and on many shows/forum/social media, we believe the Model 3 to be the "iPhone" of Battery Electric (only) Vehicles. It's a very important car in the evolution (revolution) of pure electric vehicles for the consumer (non-commercial) marketplace. Is the Model 3 (feature-wise) worth the price tag? Well that is really based on your personal opinion but BEVs are NOT at cost parity yet versus ICE cars, so as I mentioned we are still paying a premium for them. If that means a more minimalistic interior and less features than say a comparative ICE car, then so be it.

Trust us in the fact that Tesla has a track record of innovation and improving on their technologies and products. Many features that can be incorporated into OTA Software Updates will most likely occur over time. Part of the unique value-add that Tesla brings is their cars get better with age - feature wise. They are more software than hardware and no-one else today offers this - especially in the BEV market. However, other manufacturers are working on adopting this similar value-add as they see the benefits, so over time Tesla will not be the only player offering this.

Hope all this info helps in your decision to either keep your reservation or not and move to something else. That's what Trevor and I try to do - inform EV enthusiasts as much as possible so you can make your own decisions and opinions. Yes we are Tesla "fans", however we don't hesitate to discuss our opinions and call out Tesla or other manufacturers.


----------



## Skione65

Kennethbokor said:


> Hi there, so many questions...so little time!
> 
> Look folks, I think many still miss the big picture here with BEV's in general. We can go on all day and debate features of one vehicle versus another, whether to purchase a BEV or stay with ICE, Model 3 versus BMW versus Mercedes, etc.
> 
> Right now, consumers are paying a premium in order to have a ZEV (BEV) car. That is simple fact. Whether or not a Leaf or Bolt or Model 3 or other BEV's out there is better than an A4, C-class, Honda Civic, etc. is really dependant on your needs, which have many factors. If you must have more features that are not offered on the Model 3, then don't get it!
> 
> Personally, I am willing to pay more on a BEV than for a similarly equipped ICE car today simply because I believe in sustainable transportation and having a zero emission vehicle. I want to do my small part in not contributing emissions as much as possible. Plain and simple. If one does not want to do this, then there are plenty of other vehicles from dozens of manufacturers to choose from. I also see the value in low-maintence and having the ability to "fuel" my car at home overnight!
> 
> My advise is don't get hung up on little details and if they are that important to you, then look elsewhere. As we have stated in this video and on many shows/forum/social media, we believe the Model 3 to be the "iPhone" of Battery Electric (only) Vehicles. It's a very important car in the evolution (revolution) of pure electric vehicles for the consumer (non-commercial) marketplace. Is the Model 3 (feature-wise) worth the price tag? Well that is really based on your personal opinion but BEVs are NOT at cost parity yet versus ICE cars, so as I mentioned we are still paying a premium for them. If that means a more minimalistic interior and less features than say a comparative ICE car, then so be it.
> 
> Trust us in the fact that Tesla has a track record of innovation and improving on their technologies and products. Many features that can be incorporated into OTA Software Updates will most likely occur over time. Part of the unique value-add that Tesla brings is their cars get better with age - feature wise. They are more software than hardware and no-one else today offers this - especially in the BEV market. However, other manufacturers are working on adopting this similar value-add as they see the benefits, so over time Tesla will not be the only player offering this.
> 
> Hope all this info helps in your decision to either keep your reservation or not and move to something else. That's what Trevor and I try to do - inform EV enthusiasts as much as possible so you can make your own decisions and opinions. Yes we are Tesla "fans", however we don't hesitate to discuss our opinions and call out Tesla or other manufacturers.


@Kennethbokor,

Well said Ken. I agree wholeheartedly. All this comparison to this, comparison to that. Better quality, less quality. Better material, lower quality material. Please. If you like what Tesla stands for and like (Or LOVE the vehicle in my case) buy it! If not move on to another choice.

Ski


----------



## 3V Pilot

Kennethbokor said:


> Hi there, so many questions...so little time!
> 
> Look folks, I think many still miss the big picture here with BEV's in general. We can go on all day and debate features of one vehicle versus another, whether to purchase a BEV or stay with ICE, Model 3 versus BMW versus Mercedes, etc.
> 
> Right now, consumers are paying a premium in order to have a ZEV (BEV) car. That is simple fact. Whether or not a Leaf or Bolt or Model 3 or other BEV's out there is better than an A4, C-class, Honda Civic, etc. is really dependant on your needs, which have many factors. If you must have more features that are not offered on the Model 3, then don't get it!
> 
> Personally, I am willing to pay more on a BEV than for a similarly equipped ICE car today simply because I believe in sustainable transportation and having a zero emission vehicle. I want to do my small part in not contributing emissions as much as possible. Plain and simple. If one does not want to do this, then there are plenty of other vehicles from dozens of manufacturers to choose from. I also see the value in low-maintence and having the ability to "fuel" my car at home overnight!
> 
> My advise is don't get hung up on little details and if they are that important to you, then look elsewhere. As we have stated in this video and on many shows/forum/social media, we believe the Model 3 to be the "iPhone" of Battery Electric (only) Vehicles. It's a very important car in the evolution (revolution) of pure electric vehicles for the consumer (non-commercial) marketplace. Is the Model 3 (feature-wise) worth the price tag? Well that is really based on your personal opinion but BEVs are NOT at cost parity yet versus ICE cars, so as I mentioned we are still paying a premium for them. If that means a more minimalistic interior and less features than say a comparative ICE car, then so be it.
> 
> Trust us in the fact that Tesla has a track record of innovation and improving on their technologies and products. Many features that can be incorporated into OTA Software Updates will most likely occur over time. Part of the unique value-add that Tesla brings is their cars get better with age - feature wise. They are more software than hardware and no-one else today offers this - especially in the BEV market. However, other manufacturers are working on adopting this similar value-add as they see the benefits, so over time Tesla will not be the only player offering this.
> 
> Hope all this info helps in your decision to either keep your reservation or not and move to something else. That's what Trevor and I try to do - inform EV enthusiasts as much as possible so you can make your own decisions and opinions. Yes we are Tesla "fans", however we don't hesitate to discuss our opinions and call out Tesla or other manufacturers.


Ken makes some great points there but speaking from the perspective of purely a "car guy" I'll still take the Model 3 over the Audi or other similar cars. Here's part of something I posted in another thread:

If the Audi is your yardstick, the Tesla is MILES ahead. Audi felt like an old world car company desperately attempting to integrate "flashy" new tech into an old package. Even though it's a nice car and would be my choice if Model 3 did not exist, after being in both I'd have to say (and borrow a little quote from our friend Mr. Musk) the Model 3 felt like a spaceship!

This also applies to the feeling of the interior, not just the tech. I had an A5 on order but canceled it and I'm glad I did after being in both. I'm not out to save the planet and I'd burn the gas in a heartbeat if I thought the Audi was better. I do like the lower maintenance and the look and feel of the Tesla over the Audi but that is my personal opinion. The Tesla feels like what the auto industry SHOULD be doing but nobody else is. I'd say the interior felt more premium than the Audi or the Model S or X for that matter.......just my 2 cents worth.


----------



## TrevP

Robert Pickel said:


> Beautiful and informative video. Can't believe you only had a couple of days to make it. Thank you so much!!! I feel that I finally know something. (Much more than Tesla is telling us!)


2 days of filming, over a month to edit it and 6 months in preparation for when it would happen


----------



## TrevP

Scuffers said:


> interestingly, none of that list bothers me! - just goes to show how we all look at stuff differently.
> 
> Thanks for that, I have mates with S and X's, and the bit I like least about them is the interiors, hard to put into words why they don't do it for me, but best I can do is they are too 'American' if you get what I mean?
> 
> The pics and vid show the 3 has a much more European car look, I am just praying they are as good as they look in fit and finish.
> 
> Last point, reading that they only have 192KW motor is a bit disappointing, I guess I will be waiting for the 4WD (P?) version..
> 
> Just how 'perky' is it to drive (compared to the non-P S75/85/90/100)?


I'd say you're right in your assessment that the Model 3 interior fells more "European". I've owned a few German cars so I tend to agree. You'll be happy with the fit and finish however Tesla still needs to tighten up in the seat department, some of the corners exhibit wrinkles (all of their cars have this problem). It's not generally something I see with BMW or Mercedes.

As for the performance it's on par in acceleration with a base Model S 85 non-performance. Feels plenty quick, even with 4 adults in the car!

The performance model will come down the road... have you seen this?


----------



## Skione65

@TrevP,

I'm still confused on one point. Is it possible to 'start' the car WITHOUT placing the key card on the rear center console? (i.e. leaving the card in your wallet)? That just seems like an unnecessary step. I know the doors can be programmed to 'unlock' when you approach the car. I'd like to NOT have to remove the keycard every time and place it on the console (press the brake) to start the vehicle. What's the difference between pulling keys out and pulling a card out. I was excited when they got rid of the keys.

Ski


----------



## Guest

It is but only within a certain period of time. After unlock, driver door be opened during a set time period, driver must sit into the seat during set time period, must push brake pedal within specific time period.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

Skione65 said:


> @TrevP,
> 
> I'm still confused on one point. Is it possible to 'start' the car WITHOUT placing the key card on the rear center console? (i.e. leaving the card in your wallet)? That just seems like an unnecessary step. I know the doors can be programmed to 'unlock' when you approach the car. I'd like to NOT have to remove the keycard every time and place it on the console (press the brake) to start the vehicle. What's the difference between pulling keys out and pulling a card out. I was excited when they got rid of the keys.
> 
> Ski


Ski, the key "card" is intended to be the backup and it's my understanding it must be placed on the rear center console to start the car whereas if you unlock with your phone (the intended primary key) you will not need to remove that from your pocket to start the car.


----------



## Dan Detweiler

arnis said:


> It is but only within a certain period of time. After unlock, driver door be opened during a set time period, driver must sit into the seat during set time period, must push brake pedal within specific time period.


My understanding is that if you are using the card solely as your key you must put it on the console in order to operate the vehicle. Of course with a paired phone this is a moot point.

Dan


----------



## Maevra

Dan Detweiler said:


> My understanding is that if you are using the card solely as your key you must put it on the console in order to operate the vehicle. Of course with a paired phone this is a moot point.
> 
> Dan


Dan is correct. Also, once you place the key card in the console and press the brake/start driving, you can put the key card away. It does not have to stay on the console after you start driving.


----------



## Skione65

Thanks Guys!!! That clears things up.

Ski


----------



## 3V Pilot

Skione65 said:


> @TrevP,
> 
> I'm still confused on one point. Is it possible to 'start' the car WITHOUT placing the key card on the rear center console? (i.e. leaving the card in your wallet)? That just seems like an unnecessary step. I know the doors can be programmed to 'unlock' when you approach the car. I'd like to NOT have to remove the keycard every time and place it on the console (press the brake) to start the vehicle. What's the difference between pulling keys out and pulling a card out. I was excited when they got rid of the keys.
> 
> Ski


The car is unlocked and "started" when you approach with your phone. No key card needed, that is only a backup.


----------



## Guest

Maevra said:


> Dan is correct. Also, once you place the key card in the console and press the brake/start driving, you can put the key card away.


No. If there is no Authenticated Bluetooth device in range, swiping at the pillar allows to start the vehicle within 15 second period without swiping again at the center console. Swipe has 15 second Authentication session. No matter pillar or cupholder receiver.

As of now, started vehicle will never go to sleep (backup keycard mode). I would suggest Tesla to add functionality: vehicle would not exit Park mode without re-authentication swipe after driver left the vehicle (seat belt unbuckled , seat unoccupied, door opened, 15 seconds pass). Seems reasonable and no risk to accidentally lock yourself out as vehicle doesn't lock. Just an idea.


----------



## mjm155

TrevP said:


> *Here it is folks! The one you've been waiting for. The very first in-depth look at the Tesla Model 3.*


Nice review. Two things that I was disappointed in however. You did not talk about the all glass roof, at all. I would have liked to see it from the back seat looking forward and up and also from the front seat looking back and up. I have heard that it really makes the car seem very spacious and looks incredible. And you did not talk about the car's acceleration. I test drove a Model S 70 and when I floored it, I was very impressed with how the G-forces pushed me back into the seat. Did you not floor the Model 3? Does it push you back into the seat like the Model S does? Or do you not know.


----------



## Dan Detweiler

mjm155 said:


> Nice review. Two things that I was disappointed in however. You did not talk about the all glass roof, at all. I would have liked to see it from the back seat looking forward and up and also from the front seat looking back and up. I have heard that it really makes the car seem very spacious and looks incredible. And you did not talk about the car's acceleration. I test drove a Model S 70 and when I floored it, I was very impressed with how the G-forces pushed me back into the seat. Did you not floor the Model 3? Does it push you back into the seat like the Model S does? Or do you not know.


0-60 in 5.1 seconds...

Same acceleration as an S75...

Yes, it will pin you to your seat.

Dan


----------



## Maevra

arnis said:


> No. If there is no Authenticated Bluetooth device in range, swiping at the pillar allows to start the vehicle within 15 second period without swiping again at the center console. Swipe has 15 second Authentication session. No matter pillar or cupholder receiver.
> 
> As of now, started vehicle will never go to sleep (backup keycard mode). I would suggest Tesla to add functionality: vehicle would not exit Park mode without re-authentication swipe after driver left the vehicle (seat belt unbuckled , seat unoccupied, door opened, 15 seconds pass). Seems reasonable and no risk to accidentally lock yourself out as vehicle doesn't lock. Just an idea.


Just want to clear up any confusion here Arnis in case folks get confused by my response to Dan vs. what you said here. I was confirming specifically that, yes, one has to authenticate the card on the console in certain cases, but you are also right about the 15 second period and the B pillar, so this is to clarify those two points:

Scenario 1: Driver swipes the key card on the B pillar. If they press the brake pedal within 15 seconds of swiping on the B pillar, the car will be able to drive. You do NOT need to place key card on the console in this case.

Scenario 2: Driver swipes the key card on B pillar but waits MORE than 15 seconds to press brake pedal. Car will not drive and instead asks for re-authentication. Driver then needs to re-authenticate by placing key card on console and pressing brake pedal.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

mjm155 said:


> Nice review. Two things that I was disappointed in however. You did not talk about the all glass roof, at all. I would have liked to see it from the back seat looking forward and up and also from the front seat looking back and up. I have heard that it really makes the car seem very spacious and looks incredible. And you did not talk about the car's acceleration. I test drove a Model S 70 and when I floored it, I was very impressed with how the G-forces pushed me back into the seat. Did you not floor the Model 3? Does it push you back into the seat like the Model S does? Or do you not know.


Seems like they did get on it. Trev compared it to an S85 in the video.


----------



## ölbrenner

mjm155 said:


> Two things that I was disappointed in however. You did not talk about the all glass roof, at all. I would have liked to see it from the back seat looking forward and up and also from the front seat looking back and up. I have heard that it really makes the car seem very spacious and looks incredible. And you did not talk about the car's acceleration.


The spaciousness of the glass roof is as you have described (I have sat in one), but my tall torso and bald head would be just as happy with metal replacing the short section of glass the PUP option provides. The acceleration numbers have been published, and while watching the video I could almost "feel" it (watch and time the acceleration sequences).


----------



## TesLou

@Trev: Hard to tell without another phone to compare it to but is your phone a “Plus” or a regular size iPhone? Curious if my 7 Plus will fit in console.


----------



## thredge

So just curious how the child seat top tethers work with the rear headrests? Is it intended to put the teather over the top or around the side? It didn't look like the headrest moved up that the tether could go under it. I'll have 2 kids seats in mine if I go through with this.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

TesLou said:


> @Trev: Hard to tell without another phone to compare it to but is your phone a "Plus" or a regular size iPhone? Curious if my 7 Plus will fit in console.


@MelindaV confirmed the "plus" fits in another thread which is great news as that confirms the standard size and X are also going to fit just fine!



thredge said:


> So just curious how the child seat top tethers work with the rear headrests? Is it intended to put the teather over the top or around the side? It didn't look like the headrest moved up that the tether could go under it. I'll have 2 kids seats in mine if I go through with this.


This is a great question! I don't know the answer, but will say for sure I am not putting the strap over the headrest as it will most assuredly leave a permanent intentation upon removal.


----------



## Michael Russo

TesLou said:


> @Trev: Hard to tell without another phone to compare it to but is your phone a "Plus" or a regular size iPhone? Curious if my 7 Plus will fit in console.


Pretty sure @TrevP has a 'Plus'...


----------



## Kennethbokor

TesLou said:


> @Trev: Hard to tell without another phone to compare it to but is your phone a "Plus" or a regular size iPhone? Curious if my 7 Plus will fit in console.


Was my iPhone 6 Plus in the console shots.


----------



## Runt8

thredge said:


> So just curious how the child seat top tethers work with the rear headrests? Is it intended to put the teather over the top or around the side? It didn't look like the headrest moved up that the tether could go under it. I'll have 2 kids seats in mine if I go through with this.


You can do it either way, as long as it's tight and can't loosen on its own (ie, if you go over the top of the headrest you need to make sure that it can't slide down the side).


----------



## Topher

Gizmo said:


> Not all of these 'missing' buttons will be a good thing though.... why would you not let the rear seat passengers control their own heated seat or heater controls?


You've never had kids, I see.

Thank you kindly.


----------



## Gizmo

Topher said:


> You've never had kids, I see.




Actually I do.

They can control the rear windows, door locks heater controls and heated rear seats (which can also be overridden / turned off from someone in the front)

Why would you want _just_ someone in the front to be able to control these? (granted with the ability to disable them all to prevent small kids from messing with them)


----------



## Dr. J

TesLou said:


> @Trev: Hard to tell without another phone to compare it to but is your phone a "Plus" or a regular size iPhone? Curious if my 7 Plus will fit in console.


Dude, I don't think that thing's going to fit.


----------



## PeterPlt

I echo so many others in appreciation of your efforts to lead us through these early days!

The magazine writer/reviewer commented on the handling of the Model 3 as being Porche-esque (not his words). You mentioned the car handled "crisply", if memory serves. Can you expand on that? Compared to sports cars or BMW 3 series cars, how does it handle?

BTW, I traded an Audi S4 in for my S85D. I cannot fathom EVER going back to an ICE car simply for the improved driving experience (throttle response, no gear shifts, smoothness, regen braking, etc....).

Thank you!

PeterPlt


----------



## Wooloomooloo

Great thread and conversation, especially on the quality question. For me, build quality (soft interior, solid clunks when you close the doors etc) are far more important than out and out features. 

From the video it seems as though the Model 3 is very well put together and feels high quality. I have no issue with the plain interior (in fact I really like it).


----------



## Topher

Gizmo said:


> Why would you want _just_ someone in the front to be able to control these?


Can't think of a reason offhand. They should be controllable from the front (not just locking out control from the back); There will always be someone in front to control them; I am on speaking terms with all my passengers/drivers. So, if it makes the car more affordable, I am fine with that.

Thank you kindly.


----------



## Kbm3

Kennethbokor said:


> Was my iPhone 6 Plus in the console shots.


Great video.

Do you have any additional subjective comments on ride, handling, NVH or stereo quality that were not already included in the video?


----------



## skygraff

Topher said:


> Can't think of a reason offhand. They should be controllable from the front (not just locking out control from the back); There will always be someone in front to control them; I am on speaking terms with all my passengers/drivers. So, if it makes the car more affordable, I am fine with that.
> 
> Thank you kindly.


Not that it will matter to me but you raise an interesting point: for those who may participate in the Tesla Network (or use the 3 for other ride share programs), there may be back seat occupants not on common speaking terms with the front seater(s) if there are any. In fact, with ride sharing and apps, they may not speak the same language.

It's likely the app associated with the Tesla Network will include HVAC preferences and, maybe, even the ability to control the back fans independently (when permitted by the primary account holder) but that hardens back to the question of how many devices can be recognized at the same time and other similar questions regarding the extended UI within or without the TN.


----------



## Topher

skygraff said:


> but that har*k*ens back to the question of how many devices can be recognized at the same time and other similar questions regarding the extended UI within or without the TN.


It would seem a basic part of Tesla Network, that it would allow devices of riders to address the car. How else are they going to give their destination. Once you can do that, adjusting HVAC would seem simple.

Thank you kindly.


----------



## Love

Man... back from vacation and found this gem waiting for me. Amazing!! Thank you! 

Time to watch it again!


----------



## TrevP

Again, if your phone is synced to the car that’s all you need. The keycard is a BACKUP to the phone.

If you only have the keycard you need to place it in that spot to activate the car to put it into drive. After that you can move the card or your wallet


----------



## Michel Legolfeur

Thanks a lot for the info. At 1:04:40 in the video about the regen green when deceleration and black when acceleration it is OK that way. Tesla thought about it for the color blind person like me.


----------



## vita10gy

So maybe this is a known thing, but it looks like the car knows if there are people in the back or not. At 50:17 it pops up a warning that the rear seat belts aren't buckled. Presumably we don't have to drive with those buckled 100% of the time, but it's sensing the off camera people. 

Maybe minor, but interesting.


----------



## Maevra

vita10gy said:


> So maybe this is a known thing, but it looks like the car knows if there are people in the back or not. At 50:17 it pops up a warning that the rear seat belts aren't buckled. Presumably we don't have to drive with those buckled 100% of the time, but it's sensing the off camera people.
> 
> Maybe minor, but interesting.


Yes if there's a certain amount of weight in the back and the seatbelt is not buckled the warnings go off.


----------



## Guest

vita10gy said:


> if there are people in the back or not.


EU vehicle safety test organisation Euro NCAP gives safety points for rear seat belt reminder. Without this,
getting 5 stars will be harder.


----------



## Matthias Fritz

arnis said:


> EU vehicle safety test organisation Euro NCAP gives safety points for rear seat belt reminder. Without this,
> getting 5 stars will be harder.


so if you have a dog on the rearseats laying the alarm goes off all the time? not very well reasoned.


----------



## KarenRei

TrevP said:


> Again, if your phone is synced to the car that's all you need. The keycard is a BACKUP to the phone.
> 
> If you only have the keycard you need to place it in that spot to activate the car to put it into drive. After that you can move the card or your wallet


Hey, since I think you missed the question earlier - what are the underside panels made out of, plastic or metal? Because my experience with plastic panels around here is that they tend to take snow/ice damage and eventually turn into underside snowplows.


----------



## KarenRei

Dr. J said:


> View attachment 3900
> View attachment 3901
> 
> Dude, I don't think that thing's going to fit.


Hahaha, I loved Trigger Happy TV; that show was brilliant. Too bad it got cancelled


----------



## garsh

Matthias Fritz said:


> so if you have a dog on the rearseats laying the alarm goes off all the time? not very well reasoned.


That unrestrained dog becomes a missile in a collision. Get a car harness and belt it in.
https://www.kurgo.com/dog-car-restraints/
https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/category/dog/dog-vehicle-accessories/dog-seat-belts


----------



## Guest

Matthias Fritz said:


> so if you have a dog on the rearseats laying the alarm goes off all the time? not very well reasoned.


Dog or grocery bags - nothing can be left on the rear seat without restraining. Styrofoam block would be exception, though it doesn't trigger the seat sensor.

Bags should be kept in the frunk/trunk behind the seats or cargo net (not available for Tesla), or, alternatively, on the floor.
PS: in case of moderate crash, unrestrained dog will likely be heavily insured/killed. Cargo net would work (not available, as always).


----------



## Maevra

Matthias Fritz said:


> so if you have a dog on the rearseats laying the alarm goes off all the time? not very well reasoned.


It depends on the weight threshold (don't know what that threshold is though). For reference we have a 20+ lbs. dog and he doesn't trigger the sensors.



garsh said:


> That unrestrained dog becomes a missile in a collision. Get a car harness and belt it in.
> https://www.kurgo.com/dog-car-restraints/
> https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/category/dog/dog-vehicle-accessories/dog-seat-belts


+1000 agree.


----------



## RCvetter

garsh said:


> That unrestrained dog becomes a missile in a collision. Get a car harness and belt it in.
> https://www.kurgo.com/dog-car-restraints/
> https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/category/dog/dog-vehicle-accessories/dog-seat-belts


However, some dog seat belts don't require them to actually be buckled in -
https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petco...at-belts/solvit-pup-zip-zipline-dog-seat-belt
So we just need to make sure to take the extra step and make sure the belt is actually buckled.


----------



## Michael Russo

Matthias Fritz said:


> so if you have a dog on the rearseats laying the alarm goes off all the time? not very well reasoned.


Just buckle the mutt up!


----------



## JWardell

Seat occupancy sensors annoy the *&#^$*&^ out of me. Not happy to hear they are putting them in the back now!
Mine often goes off with just a few things on the passenger seat. In fact, just an ipad sets it off--I complained to service and they said it is known that the wireless interferes with it and suggest putting ipad in airplane mode just to place it on your seat!
I can't imagine how many times I put things on my rear seats.

Of course the one upside with Tesla is they can always fix, disable, or adjust sensitivity on those kind of things with a simple software update. After so many cars with quirks that I am stuck with, OTA update is one of the best hidden features of a Tesla. It boggles me that everyone else isn't doing that yet.


----------



## MichelT3

Maevra said:


> Yes if there's a certain amount of weight in the back and the seatbelt is not buckled the warnings go off.


What a lot of noise about this sentence! If you put something heavy on a seat it's safer to put a belt over it. Whether groceries, dog or human. That's all.
Luggage should be in the trunk / frunk. If you don't do that and don't want the warnings to go off, just buckle the belts, whether there is anything / anyone or not.


----------



## MichelT3

All in all I'm very satisfied about the video and the car as a whole. Thank you @TrevP and @Kennethbokor !


----------



## KarenRei

JWardell said:


> Of course the one upside with Tesla is they can always fix, disable, or adjust sensitivity on those kind of things with a simple software update. After so many cars with quirks that I am stuck with, OTA update is one of the best hidden features of a Tesla. It boggles me that everyone else isn't doing that yet.


The problem is how most cars are built; all pieces of functionality are generally built into a series of separate "boxes" provided by OEMs, each with their own inputs and outputs that need to be connected to other elements on the car. The vehicle isn't designed as an integrated whole with a common computation platform that has a full hardware suite on it.

IMHO, it's getting to be a huge problem, the more that gets added onto vehicles, and kudos to Tesla for tackling the issue head-on. Ever wonder why alternators keep getting bigger and bigger? That's the main reason, you keep having to add more "boxes" into vehicles. And each time you grow that expensive, heavy wiring harness and create more places for potential failures....

They simply have to take the Tesla approach eventually, there's no other alternative. But it means changing how things have always been done, and there's a lot of resistance from various quarters.


----------



## Russell K Smith

I have been reviewing the video over and over and I noticed that the top door hinges are painted white and the bottom hinges are black


----------



## JWardell

I just realized my post praising both the producers and thanking the owner for donating the car was deleted simply because I generalized the state.

Strange considering the state is revealed multiple times while driving in the video, and the VIN is clearly shown too.

So I will reiterate that the the owner, who is located somewhere on earth or maybe not, deserves many beers from us enthusiasts for making this video possible.


----------



## Dan Detweiler

Russell K Smith said:


> I have been reviewing the video over and over and I noticed that the top door hinges are painted white and the bottom hinges are black


Even Tesla has to be politically correct. LOL!

Dan


----------



## KarenRei

JWardell said:


> I just realized my post praising both the producers and thanking the owner for donating the car was deleted simply because I generalized the state.
> 
> Strange considering the state is revealed multiple times while driving in the video, and the VIN is clearly shown too.
> 
> So I will reiterate that the the owner, who is located somewhere on earth or maybe not, deserves many beers from us enthusiasts for making this video possible.


Heck, I outright geolocated the vehicle  But I was kind enough to not point out where it was, just that it was neither in Canada (like one annoying poster kept angrily insisting) nor California.


----------



## teslaliving

Thanks for the video. I have a Model S with generation 1 seats. They're currently on generation 3 seats. Can you compare the Model 3 seat comfort to any of the Model S seats? I'm assuming they must be better than the generation 1's I have in my car, but how do they compare to the current generation Model S seats for comfort?


----------



## Maevra

teslaliving said:


> Thanks for the video. I have a Model S with generation 1 seats. They're currently on generation 3 seats. Can you compare the Model 3 seat comfort to any of the Model S seats? I'm assuming they must be better than the generation 1's I have in my car, but how do they compare to the current generation Model S seats for comfort?


Sorry can't help with Gen1, but I've experienced both MS Gen 2 and 3 seats. Gen 3 MS seats are better IMO than Gen 2 (as one would expect). Comparing MS to M3 though is a tough call. Both are really comfy. MS has the adjustable headrests which is not an option on the 3.


----------



## teslaliving

Maevra said:


> Sorry can't help with Gen1, but I've experienced both MS Gen 2 and 3 seats. Gen 3 MS seats are better IMO than Gen 2 (as one would expect). Comparing MS to M3 though is a tough call. Both are really comfy. MS has the adjustable headrests which is not an option on the 3.


Thanks. My Gen1 Model S seats don't have adjustable headrests. The early Model S's were pretty bare (but I had the pleasure of driving it for longer).


----------



## TrevP

Doug DeMuro got his hands on a Model 3!! Check it out!


----------



## Maevra

TrevP said:


> Doug DeMuro got his hands on a Model 3!! Check it out!


I love this guy! Very fair review especially coming from a non-Tesla fanboy.


----------



## Derik

I came here just to post this. I guess I'm slow today. haha


----------



## Love

Each awesome video or picture posted is like a Jenga piece being pulled from the base of my patience puzzle as I wait for this car.... 

(loud crash noise in background) JENGA!!!!


----------



## Gizmo

TrevP said:


> Doug DeMuro got his hands on a Model 3!! Check it out!




How annoying is he, does he even pause for breath? 

However it is refreshing to see a 'warts and all' video - including things he thinks are not great, even if we may disagree... it's good to see an unbiased view of the car.


----------



## Maevra

I do have to say, I actually prefer the speedometer and all the info on the center screen now because I love the increased visibility the lower dash gives. Whenever I get into another car now it feels like this:










Granted, I'm very petite so... YMMV.


----------



## RCvetter

teslaliving said:


> Thanks for the video. I have a Model S with generation 1 seats. They're currently on generation 3 seats. Can you compare the Model 3 seat comfort to any of the Model S seats? I'm assuming they must be better than the generation 1's I have in my car, but how do they compare to the current generation Model S seats for comfort?


My vote would be "more comfortable." Especially for shorter individuals. I was really worried because I have had some trouble getting comfortable in S seats in the past.

Also, Doug's video made my day.


----------



## Brett

Maevra said:


> I do have to say, I actually prefer the speedometer and all the info on the center screen


I agree, but for a different reason. I'm 6'2" and on my current car (Mazda 6) and a Model X I test drove I couldn't see the speedometer because the steering wheel was in the way. I prefer a low steering wheel for arm comfort and on my Mazda it blocks the top half of the speedometer (~30 to 130 MPH). On the Model X it was worse, the entire speed readout was blocked and I couldn't see the autopilot status icons.

I drove a Prius for 10 years and I loved it's off center display. I believe the speedometer on the screen complaints will mostly disappear as people get to drive the Model 3 and and get used to it like I did on the Prius.

Doug did have a good point abut the turn indicators though, they might be easy to miss where where they are on the screen. Do we know if they make a noise inside the car?


----------



## RCvetter

Brett said:


> Doug did have a good point abut the turn indicators though, they might be easy to miss where where they are on the screen. Do we know if they make a noise inside the car?


Yes, they do make a noise. I haven't had an issue with missing them - once you become accustomed to the screen it's easy to keep track.


----------



## mdfraz

RC, I saw that the stalk doesn't stay up or down when you engage the turn signal, but does the signal keep flashing until the wheel turns sufficiently back in the opposite direction of the turn? In other words, will it automatically turn off after the turn is complete, or do you need to turn the signal off yourself?


----------



## RCvetter

mdfraz said:


> RC, I saw that the stalk doesn't stay up or down when you engage the turn signal, but does the signal keep flashing until the wheel turns sufficiently back in the opposite direction of the turn? In other words, will it automatically turn off after the turn is complete, or do you need to turn the signal off yourself?


Two settings - one where you hit it lightly and it blinks 3x then stops, one where you hit it and it stays on, in which case it disengages a)when you complete a turn or b)when you turn it off (i.e. Lane change). It has been a big adjustment for me.
The benefit of the stalk not locking is that in Model 3, the turn signal turns itself off after completing a lane change on Autopilot. Such a simple, beautiful thing.


----------



## mdfraz

Thanks for the response. I think my fiance's Highlander does the 3x blink thing, which I believe is meant to be for lane changes. Sounds similar anyway.


----------



## Maevra

Brett said:


> I agree, but for a different reason. I'm 6'2" and on my current car (Mazda 6) and a Model X I test drove I couldn't see the speedometer because the steering wheel was in the way. I prefer a low steering wheel for arm comfort and on my Mazda it blocks the top half of the speedometer (~30 to 130 MPH). On the Model X it was worse, the entire speed readout was blocked and I couldn't see the autopilot status icons.
> 
> I drove a Prius for 10 years and I loved it's off center display. I believe the speedometer on the screen complaints will mostly disappear as people get to drive the Model 3 and and get used to it like I did on the Prius.
> 
> Doug did have a good point abut the turn indicators though, they might be easy to miss where where they are on the screen. Do we know if they make a noise inside the car?


My husband's around your height and has the same issues with the steering wheel/speedo visibility, so yeah the center displays are good in that way.

Yes the turn signal indicators have an audible "clicking" sound in the car.


----------



## garsh

Brett said:


> Doug did have a good point abut the turn indicators though, they might be easy to miss where where they are on the screen.


Yeah, it's hard to notice the blinking. The green circle stays on for the duration, with just a small white arrow inside the circle blinking. Perhaps they'll make the blinking part larger in a future software update.


----------



## JWardell

Personally, I hate the 3x lane-change-blink from momentary press. But my wife insists on it.
On our last BMW and MINI, the 1x and 3x blink was a choice in the settings, and followed the profile in each key, so we were both happy.
Our new Mazda does not have profiles in the keys, so I am constantly annoyed by too many blinks!
Let's hope Tesla eventually makes that a setting and assignable to driver profile as well.


----------



## Rich M

JWardell said:


> Personally, I hate the 3x lane-change-blink from momentary press. But my wife insists on it.
> On our last BMW and MINI, the 1x and 3x blink was a choice in the settings, and followed the profile in each key, so we were both happy.
> Our new Mazda does not have profiles in the keys, so I am constantly annoyed by too many blinks!
> Let's hope Tesla eventually makes that a setting and assignable to driver profile as well.


----------



## MichelT3

One blink is insufficient


----------



## Dr. J

MichelT3 said:


> One blink is insufficient


OT Rant/ The issue (I have) with three blinks is making a mistake/changing my mind--and the darn blinker is still blinking. Sometimes people change their minds/make mistakes and don't want a residual erroneous signal.

Don't get me started on cars/trucks that unlock and leave the backup lights on--very annoying in a parking garage where you're trying to avoid people backing out as you drive past. I don't know what's the matter with automotive engineers. Somebody's idea of "safety" I suppose. /OT rant


----------



## garsh

Dr. J said:


> Don't get me started on cars/trucks that unlock and leave the backup lights on


YES! A thousand times yes!

Also, my car has a "safety feature", where if you slam on the brakes suddenly, but then let off of the brake pedal, it assumes that your foot slipped off, and continues until it executes a full panic-stop. There have been several times that I thought someone was going to rear-end me because of this.


----------



## Dr. J

garsh said:


> YES! A thousand times yes!
> 
> Also, my car has a "safety feature", where if you slam on the brakes suddenly, but then let off of the brake pedal, it assumes that your foot slipped off, and continues until it executes a full panic-stop. There have been several times that I thought someone was going to rear-end me because of this.


Let's hope it's the smart engineers that are working on FSD.


----------



## Guest

ardell said:


> Our new Mazda does not have profiles in the keys, so I am constantly annoyed by too many blinks!





MichelT3 said:


> One blink is insufficient


Law says that anything less than 3 blinks is equal to no blinks. EU.
I absolutely agree - anything less than 3 is not acceptable. Also no maneuver can be done
within 1 blink. Having only one blink pretty much guarantees some other drivers will not notice it.
It's not debatable. Some will miss it. We are not robots.

Just a question - who visually looks at turn indicator light(s) at the instrument cluster?
PS: some vehicles have one light for both indicator sides. That wasn't a problem until Model3 ?!?
I would conclude that Model 3's solution as being "unsafe, etc" is totally made up.
Also, back to question. Who looks at the blinking light on the dash?
If you don't know which indicator you just switched on, you are not fit for driving


----------



## Topher

arnis said:


> Also, back to question. Who looks at the blinking light on the dash?


I do, when the blinker is on when I don't expect it to be, I usually look to see which way to flip the lever. Under normal circumstances, I don't think I ever do.

Thank you kindly.


----------



## Dr. J

arnis said:


> Law says that anything less than 3 blinks is equal to no blinks. EU.
> I absolutely agree - anything less than 3 is not acceptable. Also no maneuver can be done
> within 1 blink. Having only one blink pretty much guarantees some other drivers will not notice it.
> It's not debatable. Some will miss it. We are not robots.


You can hold the thing down, you realize--you're not limited to one blink. I understand some lazy people will hit the stalk once, but if they're that lazy and untrained in proper driving, they're probably not going to signal at all. This is the nanny state  deciding for us on a thing any moderately trained bird, dog or ape could easily accomplish (i.e., holding down the stalk long enough to signal your intention). Get off my lawn, you darn kids! (that's a joke. but not the other part.)


----------



## Guest

Topher said:


> I do, when the blinker is on when I don't expect it to be, I usually look to see which way to flip the lever.


In case of dual stage stalks (Model 3), flipping both ways halfway will stop endless blinking. In case of flipping same direction, it will blink 3 more times, in case of opposite direction, it will stop immediately.


Dr. J said:


> You can hold the thing down, you realize--you're not limited to one blink. I understand some lazy people will hit the stalk once, but if they're that lazy and untrained in proper driving, they're probably not going to signal at all.


Well, holding is hard/dangerous in some situations. Comfort(triple)-blinker is helping with that. And with situations blinker will not come out as well. Holding blinker while turning means turning with one hand.


----------



## Dr. J

arnis said:


> Well, holding is hard/dangerous in some situations. Comfort(triple)-blinker is helping with that. And with situations blinker will not come out as well. Holding blinker while turning means turning with one hand.


Not while turning, while changing lanes. While turning, you pull it down so that it sticks. This is a bizarre conversation to me. I thought it was obvious how a turn signal is supposed to work. Apparently not.


----------



## pjfw8

Trev, Spent an hour driving a model X. Very impressed. I especially like the higher seating position and view from the drivers position. Actually considered canceling my model three reservation for an X. You’re the only guy I know who has driven a model 3. How would you rate the driving experience (assuming you have sat in an X)? I especially like the seating position of an SUV.


----------



## Matthias Fritz

@TrevP there is some german guy using content from your In-depth-review. just wanted to let you know so you can react or not if you want. at least it is still your property. in the description he said he was asking you for allowance.

Part1:





Part2:


----------



## 3V Pilot

pjfw8 said:


> Trev, Spent an hour driving a model X. Very impressed. I especially like the higher seating position and view from the drivers position. Actually considered canceling my model three reservation for an X. You're the only guy I know who has driven a model 3. How would you rate the driving experience (assuming you have sat in an X)? I especially like the seating position of an SUV.


I have driven both so maybe I'll share my thoughts here. Yes, the Model X is much higher and gives you that SUV view of the road, it's a great car but there was one thing I just personally could not get over. The view from drivers seat of the Model X, especially where the windshield meets the dash and A pillar, and it makes me cringe every time I say these words.....reminded me of the Pontiac Aztec! Possibly the all time winner of ugly cars horrible design in my book! It just had a cheap appearance to me, even though I know it's not a cheap car. Now, I do love the Model X for many reason but that one aspect was really a turn off for me personally.

In the Model 3 by comparison you sit much lower and have an amazing view of the road in front of you. The hood line and low dash give it a very sporty and high quality feel. If you really like the SUV feel the Model 3 might not be for you. I'd say without having a Model 3 available you should test drive a similar size BMW or Audi and compare those to the Model X, it will at least give you a reasonable data point to compare. That being said however I'd put the 3 up against anything from BMW or Audi and without exception the Model 3 would be the clear winner in overall design and driving experience. Especially the view from behind the wheel!!


----------



## KarenRei

Extremely different vehicles

* Price
* Cargo
* Performance
* Ride height
* Clearance
* Towing (at present)
* Weight
* Ease of parking
* Supercharging speed (mph/kph)
* Interior arrangement options
* Warranty coverage for high-mileage drivers
* "Flashiness"
* More conventional vs. more spartan interior and interface

Etc, etc, etc. What are your actual wants / needs?


----------



## pjfw8

Mike Land said:


> I have driven both so maybe I'll share my thoughts here. Yes, the Model X is much higher and gives you that SUV view of the road, it's a great car but there was one thing I just personally could not get over. The view from drivers seat of the Model X, especially where the windshield meets the dash and A pillar, and it makes me cringe every time I say these words.....reminded me of the Pontiac Aztec! Possibly the all time winner of ugly cars horrible design in my book! It just had a cheap appearance to me, even though I know it's not a cheap car. Now, I do love the Model X for many reason but that one aspect was really a turn off for me personally.
> 
> In the Model 3 by comparison you sit much lower and have an amazing view of the road in front of you. The hood line and low dash give it a very sporty and high quality feel. If you really like the SUV feel the Model 3 might not be for you. I'd say without having a Model 3 available you should test drive a similar size BMW or Audi and compare those to the Model X, it will at least give you a reasonable data point to compare. That being said however I'd put the 3 up against anything from BMW or Audi and without exception the Model 3 would be the clear winner in overall design and driving experience. Especially the view from behind the wheel!!


Thanks!


----------



## TrevP

pjfw8 said:


> Trev, Spent an hour driving a model X. Very impressed. I especially like the higher seating position and view from the drivers position. Actually considered canceling my model three reservation for an X. You're the only guy I know who has driven a model 3. How would you rate the driving experience (assuming you have sat in an X)? I especially like the seating position of an SUV.


I've driven an X, S and 3. I'd put the 3 in the middle of the S and X in terms of drivers point of view. The S feels claustrophobic in my opinion given the high dash and low seating position. The X has the best view being higher off the ground and the pano windshield. The 3 fells better than the S in my opinion because it has a better view and its more nimble. Doesn't feel as large or heavy as the S or X. I think for a lot of people it's going to be the perfect compromise.


----------



## pjfw8

TrevP said:


> I've driven an X, S and 3. I'd put the 3 in the middle of the S and X in terms of drivers point of view. The S feels claustrophobic in my opinion given the high dash and low seating position. The X has the best view being higher off the ground and the pano windshield. The 3 fells better than the S in my opinion because it has a better view and its more nimble. Doesn't feel as large or heavy as the S or X. I think for a lot of people it's going to be the perfect compromise.


Excellent. Thank you


----------



## JWardell

arnis said:


> Law says that anything less than 3 blinks is equal to no blinks. EU.
> I absolutely agree - anything less than 3 is not acceptable. Also no maneuver can be done
> within 1 blink. Having only one blink pretty much guarantees some other drivers will not notice it.
> It's not debatable. Some will miss it. We are not robots.
> 
> Just a question - who visually looks at turn indicator light(s) at the instrument cluster?
> PS: some vehicles have one light for both indicator sides. That wasn't a problem until Model3 ?!?
> I would conclude that Model 3's solution as being "unsafe, etc" is totally made up.
> Also, back to question. Who looks at the blinking light on the dash?
> If you don't know which indicator you just switched on, you are not fit for driving


The law in the US does not specify number of blinks. And the majority of drivers use precisely zero blinks.

Furthermore the whole point is to signal your _intention_...that is, ahead of time. Once you are half in the other lane you don't need blinkers to know what is going on.

There are many situations such as multilane splits where several blinks will make drivers in a neighboring lane think you are coming in to their lane, but one blink says hey I'm staying in my lane but taking the right split. There are other times where there is no one around (if a tree falls...) and one blink is fine. Other times I might want 4 or 5 blinks. I don't like the car to decide the duration for me.
But it is informative to know this is a law in the EU and explains why it is the default in many vehicles.


----------



## Guest

JWardell said:


> the whole point is to signal your _intention_...that is, ahead of time.


This is true in EU as well. First you blink, at least 3 times so everybody who is looking actually sees that, then you move your wheel.



JWardell said:


> situations such as multilane splits where several blinks will make drivers in a neighboring lane think you are coming in to their lane, but one blink says hey I'm staying in my lane but taking the right split.


Lane splits. One who is on that lane has the right of way for both ways and is not switching lanes. No signalling is used. If one is changing lanes (or has the intent of changing lane soon) at/after the split then normal* signalling is used.
Other drivers don't count blinks. It's a binary system. Either HIGH (intent registered) or LOW. This is how EAP will also work. This is how blind spot monitoring system works today. If car registers intent (HIGH), aka you touched stalk, it will beep as a warning that lane change is not acceptable at the moment. Though split is not lane change. No warning when choosing any direction even if there is a vehicle in a blindspot.



JWardell said:


> there is no one around (if a tree falls...) and one blink is fine. Other times I might want 4 or 5 blinks. I don't like the car to decide the duration for me.


If there is an emergency then indicators should not be used. Crash should be avoided. In case of emergency maneuver, vehicle (modern) will turn on hazards for you.
If you see an obstacle far away and want to change lanes, you do the normal* procedure. The fact that "there is nobody around" has absolutely nothing to do with turn indicator usage**. It's just common mistake not to use them when there is little traffic. My brother got a warning for not using blinker while exiting roundabout. Of course police said the most appropriate thing: "blinkers are not for those who you see, they are for those who you don't see".

*normal - blink at least 3 times before maneuver.
If maneuver takes longer then blinking should not end at least until maneuver has started, better until it has been finished (AFAIK in driving school indicator should be on until you have finished lane change, or turn etc). So if one wants to change lanes and there is no space, then blinker should be hard-pushed (will stay on forever) for at least to the moment when lane change is in process. It's not ok to show 3 blinks and shortly after start lane change.

In conclusion, 3 blinks is bare minimum in absolutely any scenario. Anything longer and you either have to soft-hold or hard-press (and return manually when needed). Triple-blink will not prevent you from doing 4-xx blinks.

** It is very important not to asses the need to use blinker in normal traffic before signalling. It is a very bad habit for any driver. It steals brain power for a process that is worth absolutely nothing. It should be a reflex, not a decision. I'm good at it. This is why I indicate when I maneuvers on my driveway and have accidentally indicated in evasive maneuver situation. I don't think when I do it. Exactly the same as not thinking about clutch pedal usage when changing gears. This is why some people tap footrest with left foot when engaging drive on automatic.


----------



## thredge

arnis said:


> ...
> 
> ** It is very important not to asses the need to use blinker in normal traffic before signalling. It is a very bad habit for any driver. It steals brain power for a process that is worth absolutely nothing. It should be a reflex, not a decision. I'm good at it. This is why I indicate when I maneuvers on my driveway and have accidentally indicated in evasive maneuver situation. I don't think when I do it. Exactly the same as not thinking about clutch pedal usage when changing gears. This is why some people tap footrest with left foot when engaging drive on automatic.


I agree with this. Just because you think there is no traffic is no excuse to not use your turn indicator. None of the US laws allow for no indicator use because there is no one around. It is not optional. If there were more drivers that didn't think that way, it would solve another handful of issues.


----------



## JWardell

arnis said:


> If there is an emergency then indicators should not be used. Crash should be avoided. In case of emergency maneuver, vehicle (modern) will turn on hazards for you.
> If you see an obstacle far away and want to change lanes, you do the normal* procedure. The fact that "there is nobody around" has absolutely nothing to do with turn indicator usage**. It's just common mistake not to use them when there is little traffic. My brother got a warning for not using blinker while exiting roundabout. Of course police said the most appropriate thing: "blinkers are not for those who you see, they are for those who you don't see".


I didn't mean emergency situation, I meant the quote "if a tree falls in the woods and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"
Of course all cars activate hazards after a collision.

I live on a very busy rotary. Care to watch my front security camera and count the number of cars who use signals exiting?
It's approximately two a day. That is, the two times I drive through it 

I used to often pick up visiting europeans at the airport and drive them up to my old work. I loved watching their reactions and amazement to how things are here. No blinkers, left lane drivers, horrible pavement, no brain cells... come visit some time


----------



## Michael Russo

JWardell said:


> (...)
> I used to often pick up visiting europeans at the airport and drive them up to my old work. I loved watching their reactions and amazement to how things are here. No blinkers, left lane drivers, horrible pavement, no brain cells... come visit some time


Don't think driving practices in Europe are perfect everywhere, Josh... !


----------



## MichelT3

Michael Russo said:


> Don't think driving practices in Europe are perfect everywhere, Josh... !


There tends to be a difference between Northern and Southern European countries (and West-East to a lesser extend). But horrible driving practices are no excuse for horribly functioning blinker systems incorporated in the car: at least 3 blinks.


----------



## ahagge

Ummm...what was the topic of this thread again?


----------



## MichelT3

ahagge said:


> Ummm...what was the topic of this thread again?


Necessity the way Model 3 blinks.


----------

