# Charging Tesla Destroyed By Fire Which Spread To Owner’s House



## sonoswen

https://insideevs.com/news/550960/tesla-modely-charging-fire-pennsylvania/
Time for Tesla to really get to the bottom of this.


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## Klaus-rf

"The vehicle was plugged in and most likely charging at the time, which seems to be the time when these electric vehicles are catching fire most frequently."

They're talking about Chevy Vlots here. But Chevys catching fire aren't "News".


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## sonoswen

In this case it was a Tesla, and I just wonder why Tesla is not (or are they ) moving forward with testing on why it happens. Seems a most logical step to take. Is it the BMS or ??


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## JasonF

It looks (and sounds) like it came from the rear of the vehicle interior, which would indicate an issue with the charge port or penthouse rather than the battery itself.


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## iChris93

JasonF said:


> It looks (and sounds) like it came from the rear of the vehicle interior, which would indicate an issue with the charge port or penthouse rather than the battery itself.


Or the fire started at the house and spread to the vehicle.


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## shareef777

iChris93 said:


> Or the fire started at the house and spread to the vehicle.


That was my thought. The EVSE was likely by the back of the vehicle and a loose/improperly installed EVSE caught fire.


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## JasonF

iChris93 said:


> Or the fire started at the house and spread to the vehicle.


That's possible, but the car would have had to have been parked _really_ close for the interior to catch fire from it. What is more possible is the charging end of the cable had a short in it, overheated, and set fire to the upholstery behind the charge port.


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## $ Trillion Musk

A cheap Home Depot receptacle could overheat and catch fire as well. Glad I found some useful NEMA 14-50 recommendations on this website.


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## sonoswen

sonoswen said:


> In this case it was a Tesla, and I just wonder why Tesla is not (or are they ) moving forward with testing on why it happens. Seems a most logical step to take. Is it the BMS or ??


Looks like no one gives a Shif..


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## garsh

sonoswen said:


> Looks like no one gives a Shif..


It's only been a week.


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## iChris93

sonoswen said:


> Looks like no one gives a Shif..


What are you wanting to happen?


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## sonoswen

iChris93 said:


> What are you wanting to happen?


I thought Tesla would say something, dreaming I guess.


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## garsh

sonoswen said:


> I thought Tesla would say something, dreaming I guess.


It's only been a week.


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## iChris93

sonoswen said:


> I thought Tesla would say something, dreaming I guess.


What do you want them to say?


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## Klaus-rf

Fire. Bad.
??


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## JasonF

Odds are except for that article, we'll never hear anything about it again.


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## sonoswen

Klaus-rf said:


> Fire. Bad.
> ??


yes and some view into if it was the Tesla and if so, why?


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## iChris93

sonoswen said:


> yes and some view into if it was the Tesla and if so, why?


Tesla has over a million cars on the road. Do you expect a response every time there is an incident involving a Tesla?


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## sonoswen

When one burns up and it was caused by the the car, not the charger or the EVSE as it is knon. Was it the EVSE or something in the car itself?
Is it traitorous to ask that?


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## iChris93

sonoswen said:


> When one burns up and it was caused by the the car, not the charger or the EVSE as it is knon. Was it the EVSE or something in the car itself?
> Is it traitorous to ask that?


You're making assumptions. I don't think anything is known. I agree it would be good to know, but i don't expect to hear anything.


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## DocScott

iChris93 said:


> Tesla has over a million cars on the road. Do you expect a response every time there is an incident involving a Tesla?


An incident where part of a house burns down? Yes, I do. And if they still had a PR department, I'd think we have one.


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## garsh

sonoswen said:


> When one burns up and it was caused by the the car, not the charger or the EVSE as it is knon. Was it the EVSE or something in the car itself?
> Is it traitorous to ask that?


Let's all take a step back. Nobody's calling you a traitor. We just think that your expectations are unrealistic.

The accident occurred a week ago. It's WAY too soon to expect Tesla to have investigated. The local police and fire department will have jurisdiction. Do you know if the fire department has completed their investigation yet? I'm unable to find any articles reporting on the follow-up of the incident.

To my (untrained) eye, I think it's more likely that the charging station may have started the fire. Reports are that the fire began at the back of the vehicle. I believe all Tesla fires to-date have occurred in the battery pack, which is underneath and in the middle of the vehicle.


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## iChris93

garsh said:


> Nobody's calling you a traitor.


Sorry if it came off as if I were trying to do that, @sonoswen.


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## Mr. Spacely

There are about 190,000 car fires in the USA per year-- all but a couple are ICE cars. This wouldn't be news at all if it was a Nissan...


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## sonoswen

YES, it is way too soon to find out what happened. I am keeping at least one eye on the situation.


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## shareef777

Mr. Spacely said:


> There are about 190,000 car fires in the USA per year-- all but a couple are ICE cars. This wouldn't be news at all if it was a Nissan...


Outside of this forum (us being avid Tesla/EV followers) I haven't heard about a single EV fire. I've actually seen reports of ICE vehicles catching fire (local news reports). And no one that has asked me about my Teslas has ever brought up a "do they burst into flames" concern.


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## DocScott

Mr. Spacely said:


> There are about 190,000 car fires in the USA per year-- all but a couple are ICE cars. This wouldn't be news at all if it was a Nissan...


Car fires often make the local news, regardless of the brand. Some examples for Nissan ICE vehicles:

https://www.firstcoastnews.com/arti...-fire/77-16834921-ed0c-473a-b0a3-4cc5b500a081https://www.stgeorgeutah.com/news/a...e-on-i-15-in-virgin-river-gorge/#.Yal2Xb1Ok-Qhttps://www.vvng.com/car-catches-fire-after-crash-on-sb-i-15-freeway-in-hesperia/https://www.stgeorgeutah.com/news/a...e-on-i-15-in-virgin-river-gorge/#.Yal2Xb1Ok-Q


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## garsh

DocScott said:


> Car fires often make the local news, regardless of the brand.


The one major difference is that those headlines all say "Car Fire", not "Nissan Fire" or "Chevy Fire".


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## DocScott

garsh said:


> The one major difference is that those headlines all say "Car Fire", not "Nissan Fire" or "Chevy Fire".


Agreed. It happens in reports of high-speed accidents, too. If it's someone driving a Tesla at 90 mph on a surface street, the headline will usually identify it as a Tesla. If it's, say, a BMW, it's not in the headline. Drives me nuts...


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## shareef777

garsh said:


> The one major difference is that those headlines all say "Car Fire", not "Nissan Fire" or "Chevy Fire".


I wouldn't consider it malice towards Tesla, more to do with brand recognition. You'll see similar stories when it comes to Apple or any other market leader. I remember 10+ years ago when the news would report on iPhone releases EVERY SINGLE YEAR. They'd never even talk about the iPhone, just the lines at the store. It's all about brand recognition.


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## TrevP

Early on (2013-2014) there was a similar fire in Toronto where the garage caught on fire. The media was quick to blame the car (it burned as well) but the cause was found to be faulty wiring in the wall receptacle.

Moral of the story: always have your electrical panel/wiring/receptacle inspected by a licensed electrician to ensure everything is in order


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## JasonF

garsh said:


> The one major difference is that those headlines all say "Car Fire", not "Nissan Fire" or "Chevy Fire".


I think I've said this before on this forum...the issue is that Tesla has a public perception that it moves too fast with technology, and is therefore dangerous. So any news articles about it emphasize the danger like "See? We told you so. Tesla is dangerous and shouldn't be making cars."

This is why, as I explained to a relative, Ford's and Toyota's entries into the EV market have interiors that looks kind of Tesla-like, but still kind of conservative and familiar to most ICE owners, and the exteriors blend in with ICE cars as well. While the whole EV thing is still kind of scary to a lot of people, they looks like any other car, so those people don't feel as uncomfortable or frightened by it. Their interiors will become more like Tesla over time, the exteriors more EV purposed and radical over time but they will make it take a decade so people are slowly transitioned to it.


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## M3OC Rules

I think stories like this matter to public perception regardless of the cause. No one will care about the story anymore when the cause comes out. The Woodlands crash in Houston was a perfect storm of misinformation about FSD and EV fires that made its way through national publications and even scientific papers. The use of the misinformation continued well after it was found to be false and misleading. I was reminded of the misinformation about the water required when I saw this article about condo owners banning evs from the garage charging or not. What's almost more disturbing is the association links to news articles and blogs for their information.

https://cleantechnica.com/2021/12/02/condo-association-bans-owners-from-parking-evs-in-the-garage/
When some members of a neighboring condo building in Minneapolis were trying to get EVSEs installed fire risk became an issue and significantly delayed the project.


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## sonoswen

*Battery Fires Haunt the Electric Car and Clean Power Revolution*
Even 30 years after lithium-ion batteries were first deployed, in camcorders, risks remain with manufacturing on a massive scale.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...t-the-electric-car-and-clean-power-revolution


M3OC Rules said:


> I think stories like this matter to public perception regardless of the cause. No one will care about the story anymore when the cause comes out. The Woodlands crash in Houston was a perfect storm of misinformation about FSD and EV fires that made its way through national publications and even scientific papers. The use of the misinformation continued well after it was found to be false and misleading. I was reminded of the misinformation about the water required when I saw this article about condo owners banning evs from the garage charging or not. What's almost more disturbing is the association links to news articles and blogs for their information.
> 
> https://cleantechnica.com/2021/12/02/condo-association-bans-owners-from-parking-evs-in-the-garage/
> When some members of a neighboring condo building in Minneapolis were trying to get EVSEs installed fire risk became an issue and significantly delayed the project.


Fear moves many in this country.


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## shareef777

sonoswen said:


> *Battery Fires Haunt the Electric Car and Clean Power Revolution*
> Even 30 years after lithium-ion batteries were first deployed, in camcorders, risks remain with manufacturing on a massive scale.
> 
> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...t-the-electric-car-and-clean-power-revolution
> Fear moves many in this country.


It's kinda been the case since man invented fire and the wheel.


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## Klaus-rf

shareef777 said:


> It's kinda been the case since man invented fire and the wheel.


Man didn't invent fire. Man discovered it. Fire existed long before man did.


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## shareef777

Klaus-rf said:


> Man didn't invent fire. Man discovered it. Fire existed long before man did.


I try not to be too pedantic when making quick posts


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## android04

If the fire was caused by the EVSE or electrical outlet or wiring, you will never hear anything about it again. About 3 years ago there was a news story about a local garage fire, and they showed a short video clip of the aftermath. The fire had just been put out and the firefighters were slowly walking about. In the garage with the open door, you could see a Tesla that was damaged by the fire (but not destroyed) as well as seeing that the fire had burned the left garage wall, ceiling, and had spread to the roof and part of the roof of the attached house. A co-worker asked if I had heard about the fire and commented that the damage must have been expensive. If you know anything about battery fires, you would know that in this case that wasn't the cause of the garage fire. Yet people who saw the news though the Tesla caused it. And there was never any follow up news or info, because the fire inspector and insurance companies figure out the cause and they have no reason to or are not allowed to tell people what really happened.


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## JasonF

android04 said:


> If the fire was caused by the EVSE or electrical outlet or wiring, you will never hear anything about it


https://aroundambler.com/fire-at-home-in-maple-glen-believed-to-have-originated-in-tesla/
The article above says the fire started somewhere around the charge port. Since it was an accidental fire, that's probably as far as the official investigation will go, and it's up to Tesla to investigate the rest (but they probably won't release the results). I pretty much knew that part by watching the video clip because there didn't seem to be any high-temperature fire jets that happen when the main battery is on fire, or any flames coming from beneath the car at all.

So we can say it was probably from charging. What we don't know is what kind of EVSE was involved, if there was a problem with the charge port not making proper content and overheating, or if it was the wiring from the charge port to the battery.


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## GDN

For now all we know is there was a fire and a house and a car burned up. We have word from the home owner it started with the car. The fire department may have found something different. That is when things get really quiet - when someone can no longer blame Tesla. I'm not saying it was or it wasn't the Tesla that started it, only noting that when things get quiet sometimes you have wonder if it is because it is no long a sensational story.

I'm sure it didn't take long for Tesla to look into some logs and could probably tell immediately - what did the outside temp sensor say compared to the battery temp sensors, was the car charging at the time. They likely already know or have insight, but truly Tesla should not comment on nor release data about ANY car that isn't released by the car owner or by court order. I've given them permission to know all these things about my car and to use them to improve, but not to release to the world about how I drive my car or what happened to my car, regardless of fault. (I likely did already give them that permission in the fine print, but reality is they need to become responsible and never release anything public about a privately owned car until legally required or to the car owner.


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## iChris93

JasonF said:


> if there was a problem with the charge port not making proper content and overheating,


The Tesla should sense this and lower the current or stop charging.


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## JasonF

iChris93 said:


> The Tesla should sense this and lower the current or stop charging.


It can shut off charging, but if the EVSE is not a Tesla model it can't stop current from being delivered to the end of the cable. Also, electrical shorts can heat up incredibly quickly, so it could be the Tesla shut off charging, but by then the cord was already either on fire, or hot enough to ignite surrounding materials. It could have also ignited at the garage end first, or maybe there was something flammable on the driveway.

If you want to take any kind of prevention lesson from what happened (even though it's extremely rare as it is), it's check in on the car a few minutes after charging begins, especially if the car is new or the EVSE is new. If the cord feels extra hot, or the car is complaining about charging being interrupted, or the outlet is really hot, or you smell hot metal, do something about it early.


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## sonoswen

GDN said:


> For now all we know is there was a fire and a house and a car burned up. We have word from the home owner it started with the car. The fire department may have found something different. That is when things get really quiet - when someone can no longer blame Tesla. I'm not saying it was or it wasn't the Tesla that started it, only noting that when things get quiet sometimes you have wonder if it is because it is no long a sensational story.
> 
> I'm sure it didn't take long for Tesla to look into some logs and could probably tell immediately - what did the outside temp sensor say compared to the battery temp sensors, was the car charging at the time. They likely already know or have insight, but truly Tesla should not comment on nor release data about ANY car that isn't released by the car owner or by court order. I've given them permission to know all these things about my car and to use them to improve, but not to release to the world about how I drive my car or what happened to my car, regardless of fault. (I likely did already give them that permission in the fine print, but reality is they need to become responsible and never release anything public about a privately owned car until legally required or to the car owner.


a fire that is believed to have originated in a Tesla (or its charging station).From the original story. Believed to have originated in a Tesla..sounds fairly clear to me. As far as your driving you car...I fail to see how that matters. What is your fear about saying how the fire started..it may help out in discovering how it really started. What is your fear? Hard to comprehend.


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## FRC

sonoswen said:


> Believed to have originated in a Tesla


Believed by whom? Believed why? In the car, or in the charging equipment? Tesla equipment, or 3rd party?

Many Tesla owners, over the years, have grown skeptical of Tesla-related disaster stories in the media. For reasons of sensationalism (I believe), they will publish stories blaming Tesla without the facts to support their report. Many, many reports have been published blaming Tesla AP/FSD for accidents that were later proven to be driver error. Last year, Tesla was blamed in the media for fatalities when a Model S crashed in a Dallas neighborhood. Tesla was able to disprove this assertion, but not before many made their minds up that Tesla was to blame. While media coverage of the incident was rampant, coverage of the discovery of driver error was minimal.

These recurring incidents of sensational media coverage cause many of us to question all such coverage (the sky is falling, the sky is falling). I for one will await additional information before I decide what actually happened. IMHO, we will find that the charging equipment, it's installation, or it's method of use, will eventually be found at fault. NOT THE CAR. But I would never disseminate this OPINION as FACT.

As to @GDN's opinion that Tesla release information only as ordered by law or as allowed by the owner, I think he's right. Many of us have given Tesla permission to "spy" on us and our cars, in order to improve the Tesla driving experience. The last time I agreed to this spying, Tesla stated that the information gathered would not be attached to me as an individual. With FSDbeta, this may have changed. I didn't have a lawyer review any of my agreements with Tesla. In my opinion, Tesla has a duty to protect my identity, unless I and/or a judge give them permission to do otherwise.

With some patience, the truth about this car fire will be determined, and someone on this forum will bring this truth to our attention. But I'll bet I won't learn this truth from the media UNLESS Tesla is proven to be at fault.


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## JasonF

sonoswen said:


> What is your fear? Hard to comprehend.


We live in a world that wants to use the power of government or the courts to destroy Tesla just for the crime of being too radical a departure from the average concept of what a car is, framed as being a reckless and dangerous thing to do. The idea is to prove that danger and recklessness to the public to the point where Tesla can legally be stopped from what its doing, and return the automotive sector to its plain, gas powered safety so everyone can relax again.

So we peripherally worry that any time a Tesla fire hits national news, or autopilot or fsd crash, it might be the trigger that either causes the company to be forced to stop producing cars, to be shut down, or sued out of existence, punctuated by the shaking of heads and "See? We told you this whole EV thing was dangerous." and a return to comfortable and familiar gas guzzling SUV's.

If that sounds silly, there is a reason most other mainstream car makers out there are dragging their feet getting into EV's. It's not just the cost, it's their fear that EV's really are just a fad, and they don't want to be caught with a massive lineup of them if the trend fades away. Most of them genuinely believe something is going to bring Tesla down eventually, and then they can just shelve their one or two EV models and make them go away.


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## DocScott

For those who don't think sensationalized fear can bring down an industry, consider nuclear power. A coal plant operating as designed will kill many more people than Fukushima did when it catastrophically failed--and that's even without including the effects of climate change. And yet after Fukushima some countries turned away from nuclear and toward maintaining coal as a bigger part of the mix. (Germany was one of those, if I'm not mistaken.)


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## JasonF

DocScott said:


> For those who don't think sensationalized fear can bring down an industry, consider nuclear power. A coal plant operating as designed will kill many more people than Fukushima did when it catastrophically failed--and that's even without including the effects of climate change. And yet after Fukushima some countries turned away from nuclear and toward maintaining coal as a bigger part of the mix. (Germany was one of those, if I'm not mistaken.)


That's actually the ultimate example of it, in fact, because Germany recently banned all fossil fuel based power generation, but didn't think it through. So now they're trying to get by with all wind and solar. But since they don't have enough of it yet, the price has gone sky high, and they have shortages and rolling blackouts.

So it's entirely possible a government would ban Teslas because they're dangerous, but then simultaneously ban fossil fuel cars as well, leaving everyone in their jurisdiction struggling to get to work using mass transit. This is a future we may be looking at.


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## sonoswen

You lost me at>>

"We live in a world that wants to use the power of government or the courts to destroy Tesla"


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## Klaus-rf

So zll of these articles are missing this comment:

P.S.
I said I was blaming Tesla, I didn't say it was Tesla's fault.


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## JasonF

sonoswen said:


> You lost me at>>
> 
> "We live in a world that wants to use the power of government or the courts to destroy Tesla"


You live in this world too, you know very well how anyone doing something at the cutting edge of tech is thought of by the general public as doing something dangerous and crazy and must be stopped. Even more so if there is a possibility of lives being at stake, like a car, or flight technology, or nuclear power. If the press starts to exacerbate those fears, the inevitable result is the average person wants the government to stop whatever company from doing whatever cutting edge thing they'tre doing.

So therefore, we live in a world where Tesla is using cutting edge tech in cars - where people's lives are at stake, where the average person is terrified of it, where the press is magnifying their fears, and where eventually they will want government to put a stop to it.


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## FRC

JasonF said:


> That's actually the ultimate example of it, in fact, because Germany recently banned all fossil fuel based power generation, but didn't think it through. So now they're trying to get by with all wind and solar. But since they don't have enough of it yet, the price has gone sky high, and they have shortages and rolling blackouts.
> 
> So it's entirely possible a government would ban Teslas because they're dangerous, but then simultaneously ban fossil fuel cars as well, leaving everyone in their jurisdiction struggling to get to work using mass transit. This is a future we may be looking at.


Watch TV for a couple of hours, and you'll see many EV related commercials from an assortment of manufacturers. Couple that with the proposed EV tax credit and growing awareness of environmental concerns, and the obvious conclusion is that EV adoption is growing with manufacturers, buyers, and government. They'll be no quashing of the EV revolution.


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## Klaus-rf

FRC said:


> Watch TV for a couple of hours, and you'll see many EV related commercials from an assortment of manufacturers. Couple that with the proposed EV tax credit and growing awareness of environmental concerns, and the obvious conclusion is that EV adoption is growing with manufacturers, buyers, and government. They'll be no quashing of the EV revolution.


I was with you right up to "Watch TV for a couple of hours".

Just. Can't. Do. This. NO commercial TV for this person.


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## FRC

Klaus-rf said:


> I was with you right up to "Watch TV for a couple of hours".
> 
> Just. Can't. Do. This. NO commercial TV for this person.


congratulations...


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## shareef777

JasonF said:


> You live in this world too, you know very well how anyone doing something at the cutting edge of tech is thought of by the general public as doing something dangerous and crazy and must be stopped. Even more so if there is a possibility of lives being at stake, like a car, or flight technology, or nuclear power. If the press starts to exacerbate those fears, the inevitable result is the average person wants the government to stop whatever company from doing whatever cutting edge thing they'tre doing.
> 
> So therefore, we live in a world where Tesla is using cutting edge tech in cars - where people's lives are at stake, where the average person is terrified of it, where the press is magnifying their fears, and where eventually they will want government to put a stop to it.


Thing is most people want to play the "victim card" when they're a fan of a company. I see similar comments on Apple forums regarding the App Store monopoly lawsuits. So your statement should actually be: "We live in a world that wants to use the power of government or the courts to destroy *insert any popular company here*"

This isn't "the world" against Tesla (otherwise they wouldn't be the number one EV manufacturer across the planet). Any brand will have naysayers and opportunists that will want to profit off their rise.


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## JasonF

shareef777 said:


> Thing is most people want to play the "victim card" when they're a fan of a company. I see similar comments on Apple forums regarding the App Store monopoly lawsuits. So your statement should actually be: "We live in a world that wants to use the power of government or the courts to destroy *insert any popular company here*"


That's what the first sentence implied! It's not just Tesla, it's any company that leverages advanced tech that the general public sees as moving too fast or going too far. But this is a Tesla forum, so that's the primary focus.



shareef777 said:


> This isn't "the world" against Tesla (otherwise they wouldn't be the number one EV manufacturer across the planet). Any brand will have naysayers and opportunists that will want to profit off their rise.


It is the world against Tesla, but not _only_ because they're an EV manufacturer.

The reason other brands are forgiven for their forays into EV's is because that's _all_ they're doing. Most other companies making them are taking baby steps, leaving the interiors mostly conservative and familiar, and not investing in anything other than the drivetrain (Ford is probably the one going the farthest by installing a large screen, but even they didn't change much else). By doing that they're acknowledging most people's fear of an electric drive platform and trying to alleviate that by making everything else familiar so people can ease into the concept of electric drive. The majority of people want comfort and familiarity, which is why wild concept vehicles from most companies end up being eventually revised so they look very much like the previous model.

Meanwhile, Tesla makes scary EV's, but does nothing to alleviate that fear or make it feel familiar, and shuns the focus groups that push for more familiarity and comfort. They pile on scary and unfamiliar interiors and drive systems, and the icing on the cake, Autopilot and Full-Self-Drive Beta. It's great for adventurous people, but those who aren't so much are afraid that this is what the future of cars will look like, and it's making them very uncomfortable that it's moving so fast. So they want Tesla to stop doing it. That's succinctly what's going on.


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## shareef777

JasonF said:


> That's what the first sentence implied! It's not just Tesla, it's any company that leverages advanced tech that the general public sees as moving too fast or going too far. But this is a Tesla forum, so that's the primary focus.
> 
> It is the world against Tesla, but not _only_ because they're an EV manufacturer.
> 
> The reason other brands are forgiven for their forays into EV's is because that's _all_ they're doing. Most other companies making them are taking baby steps, leaving the interiors mostly conservative and familiar, and not investing in anything other than the drivetrain (Ford is probably the one going the farthest by installing a large screen, but even they didn't change much else). By doing that they're acknowledging most people's fear of an electric drive platform and trying to alleviate that by making everything else familiar so people can ease into the concept of electric drive. The majority of people want comfort and familiarity, which is why wild concept vehicles from most companies end up being eventually revised so they look very much like the previous model.
> 
> Meanwhile, Tesla makes scary EV's, but does nothing to alleviate that fear or make it feel familiar, and shuns the focus groups that push for more familiarity and comfort. They pile on scary and unfamiliar interiors and drive systems, and the icing on the cake, Autopilot and Full-Self-Drive Beta. It's great for adventurous people, but those who aren't so much are afraid that this is what the future of cars will look like, and it's making them very uncomfortable that it's moving so fast. So they want Tesla to stop doing it. That's succinctly what's going on.


Again, how is it that the world is against Tesla when Tesla is the number one selling EV in THE WORLD!?

Tesla vehicles are adored and admired by the masses. It's also why every other EV is compared to Teslas. It's also why Hertz is spending a few BILLION on some 3s (they know people want those cars). Why they're valued more then all the other manufacturers COMBINED!

I'm not sure where you're getting your "world news" but Tesla is to vehicles like Apple is to electronics. These are the very two companies that the phrase "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" is about. Everyone is trying to copy Tesla's formula because of their market leadership.

A few segments/articles bashing Tesla is just because the news knows anything they put out that mentions Tesla is views/clicks (ie $$$). Look at Apples earlier iPhone releases. Every one had some sort of hysteria about some minor issue, but sensationalized to catch viewers attentions.

There's no global anti-Tesla conspiracy.


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## JasonF

shareef777 said:


> Again, how is it that the world is against Tesla when Tesla is the number one selling EV in THE WORLD!?


I guess since I'm up against an immovable object, it's my turn to bend. Ok, you convinced me, there is no anti Tesla or anti-EV bias anywhere in the world, it was just imaginary.


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## shareef777

JasonF said:


> I guess since I'm up against an immovable object, it's my turn to bend. Ok, you convinced me, there is no anti Tesla or anti-EV bias anywhere in the world, it was just imaginary.


Oh there's lots of anti-Tesla hate out there (just as there are lots of Tesla/Elon zealots). They're all a very minor (but loud) crowd. A majority of the people in the world likely just see Teslas as cool cars, nothing more.


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## DocScott

shareef777 said:


> Again, how is it that the world is against Tesla when Tesla is the number one selling EV in THE WORLD!?
> 
> Tesla vehicles are adored and admired by the masses. It's also why every other EV is compared to Teslas. It's also why Hertz is spending a few BILLION on some 3s (they know people want those cars). Why they're valued more then all the other manufacturers COMBINED!
> 
> I'm not sure where you're getting your "world news" but Tesla is to vehicles like Apple is to electronics. These are the very two companies that the phrase "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" is about. Everyone is trying to copy Tesla's formula because of their market leadership.
> 
> A few segments/articles bashing Tesla is just because the news knows anything they put out that mentions Tesla is views/clicks (ie $$$). Look at Apples earlier iPhone releases. Every one had some sort of hysteria about some minor issue, but sensationalized to catch viewers attentions.
> 
> There's no global anti-Tesla conspiracy.


EVs, while gaining in popularity, are still only about 4% of light vehicle sales. It's possible to dominate a small market segment and still be widely feared/loathed.

On the other hand, almost all people in the US, and a very large number of people around the world, have a smart phone. So Apple is in a rather different situation. Tesla's position is more like being the leader in foldable smart phones, or something like that.

Having said that, I think the jury on public opinion of Teslas is still out. Five years from now, Teslas could be _widely_ accepted, or it could encounter a growing and hardening wall of resentment and fear. In some ways, they make a great product (including the SC ecosystem), but if they allow themselves to be vilified, that's not always enough.


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## shareef777

DocScott said:


> EVs, while gaining in popularity, are still only about 4% of light vehicle sales. It's possible to dominate a small market segment and still be widely feared/loathed.
> 
> On the other hand, almost all people in the US, and a very large number of people around the world, have a smart phone. So Apple is in a rather different situation. Tesla's position is more like being the leader in foldable smart phones, or something like that.
> 
> Having said that, I think the jury on public opinion of Teslas is still out. Five years from now, Teslas could be _widely_ accepted, or it could encounter a growing and hardening wall of resentment and fear. In some ways, they make a great product (including the SC ecosystem), but if they allow themselves to be vilified, that's not always enough.


I've had hundreds of people ask about my Tesla(s) over the years and the only fear they had about getting one has always been the price tag. 🤣


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## sonoswen

I think I am a ways off topic, but we had an "incident" in a crowded parking lot on Sunday. An old woman in a Volvo approached the only open parking space next to us(we were waiting for a food delivery) on a 45 degree angle. When she was within 4" (aprox, I was in our car ) I tapped the horn. She stopped and then a guy on a bike stopped in front of our car..yelling " You Ass H.....s, she has a right to park there. I got out of my car (mistake) and tried to reason with him, but quickly realized he was out of control, and got back in our car. A crowd gathered, the old lady came up to our car, and said "you don't own the road, f...king rich people, who do you,,,etc."
A lot of Tesla hate out there. Our first up close experience.

Maybe I should chalk it up to The Disturbing times we now live in......


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## Mr. Spacely

Here is a partial list of people who want Tesla to fail:

big oil companies
car dealerships
legacy car manufacturers worldwide
car repair shops
parts suppliers
gas stations
insurance companies (eventually far fewer accidents with self drive)
motels (why stop when you can nap while your car drives itself?)
airlines (why fly when you can ride instead?)
ad agencies (Tesla doesn't need to advertise)
most media including car magazines (see above)


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## M3OC Rules

Mr. Spacely said:


> Here is a partial list of people who want Tesla to fail:
> 
> big oil companies
> car dealerships
> legacy car manufacturers worldwide
> car repair shops
> parts suppliers
> gas stations
> insurance companies (eventually far fewer accidents with self drive)
> motels (why stop when you can nap while your car drives itself?)
> airlines (why fly when you can ride instead?)
> ad agencies (Tesla doesn't need to advertise)
> most media including car magazines (see above)


Short sellers
People who like manuals
People who like loud cars
People who see EVs as a green unnecessary evil for combating climate change that they don't see is a problem.
People who think EV owners are smug. 
Carjackers
Unions
People who don't like Elon Musk


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