# Bluetooth issues?



## SoFlaModel3

Current owners have you had any issues with Bluetooth? I just got in my car from work and my phone has disappeared from the BT device list and can’t be found. 

The phone as a key still works...


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## SoFlaModel3

Following up in case this happens to anyone. A hard reset did not fix it. Leaving the car, letting it lock, and having it be off for a few minutes did though.


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## SoFlaModel3

And to update one more time. My phone was gone again this morning and won’t reconnect....


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## SoFlaModel3

Ok final follow up since I’m talking to myself anyway 

It’s a known issue for Tesla with iOS 11. 

They have a fix coming but the workaround is to disable contact sync on your iPhone.


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## Jakesthree

Hey, there's an easy fix. Stop drinking the Kool-Aid and get a 'Droid. /jk 
BTW, congrats on the car.


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## SoFlaModel3

Jakesthree said:


> Hey, there's an easy fix. Stop drinking the Kool-Aid and get a 'Droid. /jk
> BTW, congrats on the car.


Thanks and my iPhone X bothered me enough to think about it the other day. Unfortunately Apple rules my life (MBP, Watch, iPhone, iPad, Music, Cloud, Pictures, and TV). Switching would be painful...


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## Quicksilver

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Thanks and my iPhone X bothered me enough to think about it the other day. Unfortunately Apple rules my life (MBP, Watch, iPhone, iPad, Music, Cloud, Pictures, and TV). Switching would be painful...


Ditto...I am too invested in the Apple ecosystem also! 

Good to hear Bluetooth has a fix coming soon.


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## Urs

Well, my Android phone is hardly any better. If I want to use it as a key I have to manually log in every time. Then it works fine until I leave the car for a few hours. Phone on, Tesla app on etc. does not make any difference. Tesla service center tried for about an hour too. They thought they got it, but it only worked while I was there.  they also updated the car to the latest software - don't know what version, but it was last Thursday 2/15/18.
Android 7.1 operating system.


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## LucyferSam

Urs said:


> Well, my Android phone is hardly any better. If I want to use it as a key I have to manually log in every time. Then it works fine until I leave the car for a few hours. Phone on, Tesla app on etc. does not make any difference. Tesla service center tried for about an hour too. They thought they got it, but it only worked while I was there.  they also updated the car to the latest software - don't know what version, but it was last Thursday 2/15/18.
> Android 7.1 operating system.


Something to try rather than manually logging in is turning bluetooth on and off. Seems to work for me every time and is faster, though still a bit annoying to have to do.


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## PatrickM

I haven't had any issues at all with Bluetooth since I got the car three weeks ago. I haven't had any funkiness at all - but I turned off "unlock as you get close" or whatever it's called in the menu, because the car kept unlocking when I was home and walked near the garage. But aside from that, it's always been solid since the day that I got it. I have an Iphone 6S.


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## Abezz

I have a galaxy S8 (unlocked) and I've had a similar experience as described by OP. No issues for first several weeks, then bluetooth key failed intermittently and eventually it would fail every time I approach the car. What's most unnerving is that you need to remember to hold up the key card to lock your M3 before you walk away. Several days my car was unlocked in the parking lot at work.

Tried rebooting the M3 computer, keeping the tesla app open while approaching the car, stopping and re-starting bluetooth, turning off battery saver etc etc... all these tricks worked maybe once or twice, and after that the car would remain locked upon approach.

My current solution is to clear the app data (Settings, Applications, Tesla, Storage -> CLEAR DATA). Then you have to re-enter your username and PW to open tesla app, and re-pair your key. So far no issues in the past 4 days. Only the one time I turned off the phone and forgot to turn it back on and started swearing about the f'ing key did it not work. 

I would love to see an alternative (aka key-fob like model S/X) that works EVERY time, not 50% of the time.

Also, don't know if it's relevant, but M3 is on 2017.50.12, and my phone is running android 7.0


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## SoFlaModel3

So much for the workaround — my phone won’t connect to the car again for phone/music


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## SoFlaModel3

Following up. 

Going into Controls and actually “Powering Down” the vehicle and then bringing it back up did the trick. They said I shouldn’t have to do that all the time and they’re working on it. Also, still need to not share Contacts with iOS 11.


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## SoFlaModel3

iOS app just got an update but vague details, so I'm not sure if this helps fix the Bluetooth issues...


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## LucyferSam

Android App updated at the same time, will test in a bit. Not sure if it's the update to the app or my car but it appears to have reset my phone as key so it now says it needs to be set up again.


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## SoFlaModel3

LucyferSam said:


> Android App updated at the same time, will test in a bit. Not sure if it's the update to the app or my car but it appears to have reset my phone as key so it now says it needs to be set up again.


I have a good feeling it's ultimately the car that needs an update not the app especially given that the worst of my Bluetooth issues are contacts/music and that's separate from the app anyway.

With this no noticeable improvements on my end. Maybe it connects to the car faster, but not a big enough test yet.


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## LucyferSam

Well, in the 2 times I used the car yesterday after re-setting up the phone as key, I did not have to cycle my bluetooth or wait for it to detect the phone once I was in the car to go into gear. Hoping this improvement is real and not just random chance as I've had to cycle the bluetooth every time for the last couple weeks.


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## MelindaV

LucyferSam said:


> Well, in the 2 times I used the car yesterday after re-setting up the phone as key, I did not have to cycle my bluetooth or wait for it to detect the phone once I was in the car to go into gear. Hoping this improvement is real and not just random chance as I've had to cycle the bluetooth every time for the last couple weeks.


what phone do you have?


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## LucyferSam

MelindaV said:


> what phone do you have?


Pixel 2


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## TrevP

Folks, let's not have this devolve into an iOS/Android war, there are other forums on the internet for that. Keep it Tesla please. Bluetooth sucks in general, on both platforms.


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## M3OC Rules

TrevP said:


> Folks, let's not have this devolve into an iOS/Android war, there are other forums on the internet for that. Keep it Tesla please. Bluetooth sucks in general, on both platforms.


Given that iOS and Android constantly update Bluetooth and never seem to work consistently I worry these problems are never going to end. This is actually the thing that worries me most about this car. You nailed it. Bluetooth sucks in general. Tesla may have bit off an unchewable chunk of gristle on this one.


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## John

My company has written iOS and Android Bluetooth apps. Bluetooth depends on an especially tall and touchy stack of software from multiple vendors, including iOS and Android. Probably Tesla started with a very optimistic coding scheme— assuming connections stay up, and transactions complete — and perhaps adoption of a more realistic and pessimistic model may help. For those of you who write software, it's like trying to save to a variable that sometimes might not be there, depending on the physical distances and the angle of a phone, or the recent movement history of the user. Oh, and if you try too often, you get silently locked out until reboot, perhaps of both devices. 

Imagine seeing, "I notice you just started your Model 3 with your card instead of your phone. Perhaps you should reboot your phone?"

Its almost as if Bluetooth was written for two devices that stand still — which it was. Alas.


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## SoFlaModel3

I will continue to watch this, but so far with 2018.4.9, I turned back on contacts sharing and my phone/music have been fine!!


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## atebit

I had one issue last weekend where the phone worked great for media, but disconnected as the key. Toggling Bluetooth while standing near the car fixed it.

The car has since pulled an update but due to snow here I haven’t tried it yet. 
: popcorn


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## SoFlaModel3

SoFlaModel3 said:


> I will continue to watch this, but so far with 2018.4.9, I turned back on contacts sharing and my phone/music have been fine!!


Well it looks like I had a good run of 3.5 days. Sadly my phone has disappeared from the car as far as audio/calls are concerned. Though like before it remains solid for "phone as a key". 

Unlike last time, I didn't try to fix it. I'm curious if the car finds my phone in the morning or if it's gone for good until I delete it and try to sync up again.


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## rareohs

is it true that Bluetooth is the *only* way to connect phone to car?

for phone calls?

even for music??


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## SoFlaModel3

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Well it looks like I had a good run of 3.5 days. Sadly my phone has disappeared from the car as far as audio/calls are concerned. Though like before it remains solid for "phone as a key".
> 
> Unlike last time, I didn't try to fix it. I'm curious if the car finds my phone in the morning or if it's gone for good until I delete it and try to sync up again.


To follow up on my own madness. The phone worked again today. Apparently leaving it alone is the best thing to do.



rareohs said:


> is it true that Bluetooth is the *only* way to connect phone to car?
> 
> for phone calls?
> 
> even for music??


That's correct calls and music from the phone are over BT only.


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## rareohs

SoFlaModel3 said:


> That's correct calls and music from the phone are over BT only.


No line in port?

And no SiriusXM.... so music options are FM radio, BT phone... and....?

Can you play MP3s directly off a USB stick?


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## SoFlaModel3

rareohs said:


> No line in port?
> 
> And no SiriusXM.... so music options are FM radio, BT phone... and....?
> 
> Can you play MP3s directly off a USB stick?


No line in.
No SiriusXM
Yes to MP3s off of a USB stick though I've never done it
Yes to FM
Streaming Radio is nice

I prefer my Apple Music streaming over BT though.


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## rareohs

SoFlaModel3 said:


> No line in.
> No SiriusXM
> Yes to MP3s off of a USB stick though I've never done it
> Yes to FM
> Streaming Radio is nice
> 
> I prefer my Apple Music streaming over BT though.


Streaming radio?


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## rareohs

Oh wait, do you mean SiriusXM app for the phone?


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## Love

rareohs said:


> Oh wait, do you mean SiriusXM app for the phone?


Slacker!

https://www.slacker.com/

Edit...which reminds me they still haven't given me my log in credentials. Need to hit Tesla up again.


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## SoFlaModel3

Lovesword said:


> Slacker!
> 
> https://www.slacker.com/
> 
> Edit...which reminds me they still haven't given me my log in credentials. Need to hit Tesla up again.


Is it Slacker? I never entered credentials, I just tab over to Streaming and it works....?


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## rareohs

Slacker has free (with ads) and paid (no ads) tiers... I’d assume the stock Slacker app in a Tesla is free/ads?


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## SoFlaModel3

rareohs said:


> Slacker has free (with ads) and paid (no ads) tiers... I'd assume the stock Slacker app in a Tesla is free/ads?


Well I haven't used it a lot -- really just the 2 days that my BT failed and I never heard an ad. I was also able to switch tracks without issue/ad as well. Small sample size though, so maybe someone with more playtime can confirm.


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## mig

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Well I haven't used it a lot -- really just the 2 days that my BT failed and I never heard an ad. I was also able to switch tracks without issue/ad as well. Small sample size though, so maybe someone with more playtime can confirm.


I've used slacker quite a bit, no ads! Also haven't hit any skip limits like on some other streaming services.

I'm skeptical given other developments that the LTE data service, streaming, etc will all turn into paid services at some point though...


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## Love

rareohs said:


> Slacker has free (with ads) and paid (no ads) tiers... I'd assume the stock Slacker app in a Tesla is free/ads?


It's free (no ads) and you can get your login credentials from Tesla and use it elsewhere (work computer, phone, etc.)

EDIT: Wanted to add that my wife uses hers on her iPad all the time. No commercials, an ability to select specific artists not to play, a mode that gives a bit of backstory (like if you pick a certain band, it will play music like it and explain why... like "The Killers were inspired by this band, and Brandon Flowers liked them so much, he included them in his lyrics for... " etc. It's kind of neat. I have yet to get my login credentials so I can't say for 100% it will work for Model 3 owners. I really hope it will.


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## rareohs

Lovesword said:


> It's free (no ads) and you can get your login credentials from Tesla and use it elsewhere (work computer, phone, etc.)
> 
> EDIT: Wanted to add that my wife uses hers on her iPad all the time. No commercials, an ability to select specific artists not to play, a mode that gives a bit of backstory (like if you pick a certain band, it will play music like it and explain why... like "The Killers were inspired by this band, and Brandon Flowers liked them so much, he included them in his lyrics for... " etc. It's kind of neat. I have yet to get my login credentials so I can't say for 100% it will work for Model 3 owners. I really hope it will.


Cool, thanks! Not sure if that sounds good enough to replace Spotify, but at least it's free and built-in!


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## John

For what it's worth, I've programmed apps for Bluetooth on both iOS and Android, and I'll be turning OFF the walk up to unlock feature.

If you want to hear a little technical detail, which is NOT interesting to most people, I know, read on.

The design of Bluetooth has always made certain assumptions about usage. These assumptions don't cover every edge case. Most notably, they assume that you will connect to a device and then stay within range during usage. This covers 98% of Bluetooth products, which are mostly related to audio. While Bluetooth does disconnect gracefully if you walk out of range, it doesn't always behave as well if you hover around the fringes of reception. Buried in various places in the stack are certain timeouts and retry limits that developers do NOT have access to that can "lock out" the app or the car and prevent further communication (until a reboot or network reset of either or both ends).

Bluetooth messages are transacted. Using iOS as an example, when your phone sends a message to the car ("Hey. You up?"), the car is expected to acknowledge receiving that message, THEN reply in another transaction (which your phone then acknowledges). But due to asymmetries in reception and transmission, it's possible for one end of this conversation to hear the question, but the other end can't hear the acknowledgement. If the app is written "optimistically" (i.e. keep asking the question, it will be answered when we are close enough) it can frustrate iOS, which is EXTREMELY biased towards saving power. After a certain number of failed acknowledgements, iOS will silently blackball the device to save power. It won't even bother sending any messages the app may request. The app and the app developer are none the wiser; the questions are never answered no matter how close you are to the car. To the app developer, it's like the car is not there.

My company discovered this and got around the problem (mostly) with a very pessimistic programming model. Our apps have a very short fuse (shorter than iOS's) when a question is not acknowledged. In other words, our app quits before iOS can get pissed. Works pretty well, but not foolproof, especially if you have other Bluetooth apps bugging the stack at the same time. It also requires that the user request to be connected, which is fine for our use cases, but is not acceptable for a "works automatically" key.

There may come a time that Tesla orchestrates Bluetooth unlocking a little better. Until then, I'll just touch the door handle to unlock. That's how my current car works anyway, and while it sometimes leaves passengers waiting for me to get to my door, it works very predictably. Assuming that "walk away lock" is one-time transaction, I'll probably leave that one on auto.

P.S. When Bluetooth stops working, reboot your phone and if necessary the car.


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## Love

rareohs said:


> Cool, thanks! Not sure if that sounds good enough to replace Spotify, but at least it's free and built-in!


To follow up on this, I'm having a difficult time getting my Slacker login credentials from my contacts at Westmont, They claim they are not provided for any Model 3. 
I'll try and contact Fremont and see. Maybe it's not available for the 3 the way it was for the S because all my wife had to do was email them.


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## MelindaV

John said:


> Until then, I'll just touch the door handle to unlock.


But this is still being driven by Bluetooth, no?


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## John

MelindaV said:


> But this is still being driven by Bluetooth, no?


Yes. But you're eliminating the walk-up-unlock transaction attempts, and apparently replacing them with one transaction at touch. Someone can weigh in and say whether it is sometimes laggy or not, I guess that might potentially be a drawback.

(The actual Bluetooth messages can happen in milliseconds, but sometimes phones have a fair amount of unpredictable wake up or background stuff to plow through before they are responsive to certain kinds of activities. Helps if you've just been messing with your phone.)


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## atebit

Lovesword said:


> Maybe it's not available for the 3 the way it was for the S because all my wife had to do was email them.


I inquired about this when I pre-traded my S. I was told it would "carry over" from the S. So far, they were right, I just entered my cryptic credentials and it came right up.


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## Love

atebit said:


> I inquired about this when I pre-traded my S. I was told it would "carry over" from the S. So far, they were right, I just entered my cryptic credentials and it came right up.


But is it useable in more than one place at a time? I thought I read somewhere it's one place at a time...and if you try to use it elsewhere you get an error message.

I thought my 3 would have its own account separate from my wife's S.

Edit: perhaps we should have a separate thread for Slacker, I feel I've posted off topic too much in here...sorry all.


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## atebit

Ah good point. I have had it complain in the past if I try to play it on multiple devices simultaneously. 

Tech support seems like your best bet as every time I reach out to Slacker for questions they refer me to Tesla.


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## Bokonon

John said:


> While Bluetooth does disconnect gracefully if you walk out of range, it doesn't always behave as well if you hover around the fringes of reception.


Ah, that's some good enlightenment. Now I know why my older Samsung watch sometimes becomes completely unresponsive with rapid battery drain when I take the dog out and leave my paired phone inside... the distance from my couch to the dog's "favorite spot" is probably right at the edge of Bluetooth range.


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## John

To really get Bluetooth right, Tesla may need some special love from Apple and Google. Maybe it's creative use of newer frameworks like Home Kit (in Apple's case), a better choice of BLE profile, access to some undocumented APIs, or just some insider tips—but from a first principles perspective these simple transactions and use cases, while only recently in heavy demand, should be possible to get right.


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## Killester23

I’ll be getting my Model 3 in a couple of weeks and my BT-paired phone will spend a fair bit of time at home in relatively close proximity to the car given my bedroom is right above the garage. Any suggestions for potential issues/problems I might face and things I could do to avoid/remedy them?

Thanks very much.


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## SoFlaModel3

Killester23 said:


> I'll be getting my Model 3 in a couple of weeks and my BT-paired phone will spend a fair bit of time at home in relatively close proximity to the car given my bedroom is right above the garage. Any suggestions for potential issues/problems I might face and things I could do to avoid/remedy them?
> 
> Thanks very much.


You will absolutely want to turn off walk up unlock -- although it seems like that may be forced in the latest update anyway. Basically on the current version that 99% of Model 3 owners are on if you have walk up unlock "on" and walk away lock "on", with your phone close by indefinitely your car will do the dance -- locked, unlocked, locked, unlocked.


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## Killester23

Thanks for the info. Much appreciated.


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## John

Had to do that thing today where you uncheck the "sync contacts" option to get the phone to work as a key.
Using mobile app version 3.3.4 and car software 2018.10.5.


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## SoFlaModel3

John said:


> Had to do that thing today where you uncheck the "sync contacts" option to get the phone to work as a key.
> Using mobile app version 3.3.4 and car software 2018.10.5.


Really? Are you on Android or iOS? I haven't had any issues in a while iOS side.


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## OneSixtyToOne

My car was delivered on Saturday. The build was perfect, This morning (Monday), however, when I entered my car, the Bluetooth profiles in the car were missing. I rebooted the car and everything was there again. Anyone else have this issue?


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## John

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Really? Are you on Android or iOS? I haven't had any issues in a while iOS side.


iOS. Latest everything. Thank goodness someone posted a comment about the "contacts" bug. I do want my contacts to sync, but more important than that is not fumbling around with my phone and having to pull out my wallet for the key card. Without your phone working, it's like the car forgets who you are. Very disconcerting. "Hey, it's me. C'mon!"


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## nameless

I've been having issues with bluetooth pretty much nonstop. In the four days since I took delivery, the car forgot all paired phones twice, stopped recognizing one of the phones as a key at least once (I could still open the trunk from the app, control fans, etc., but, in the place where it said "phone as key", it said "disconnected", and I had to use the keycard to start the car.) Once I tried to unpair one of the phones (because I was using it to play something through bluetooth earbuds, and Tesla's audio system was repeatedly trying to elbow in and hijack the playback. Annoying!) That sent the audio system into limbo: as far as Tesla was concerned, it remained paired, but it couldn't actually do anything with the phone (it certainly couldn't connect to it, and it couldn't even delete it.)

This is with two Samsung Galaxy phones (S7 and Note 4), firmware 2018.10.5 and app 3.3.4.

I sure hope that their autopilot is coded better than that.


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## smak

I've had more issues with bluetooth phone/audio not working, than bluetooth not unlocking the door.

2-1 to be exact.

Reboot fixed all 3 (the first time it was both problems).

Reboot is so fast, It's not a big deal.


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## Joan O

I am going bananas with my 3. From the time I got it 2 months ago my phone key works for maybe 3 days maybe for an hour. I never know if it is going to work. I have called Tesla at least 10 times and spent ages on the phone with each agent trying to talk me through a set of instructions that may or may not work that invariably are slightly different from each other. I have had it serviced and still my phone key is unreliable. Has anyone out there gotten a fix of some kind from Tesla? I also think the customer service is appalling. The wait times are really long.


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## Mattiuswb

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Current owners have you had any issues with Bluetooth? I just got in my car from work and my phone has disappeared from the BT device list and can't be found.
> 
> The phone as a key still works...


I have had my 3 for 2 months. No issues with access


SoFlaModel3 said:


> Following up in case this happens to anyone. A hard reset did not fix it. Leaving the car, letting it lock, and having it be off for a few minutes did though.


same issue. Have had car for 2 months. Works as key flawless but often will forget my phone and then won't find it. Happened to get a new phone (iPhone x) and it worked for 2 weeks. Now just won't connect like before. Ugh. Figure it out Tesla!


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## Audrey

Mine hasn't had phone key issues, but it forgot my phone and wouldn't re-pair. Annoying.


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## John

I now use my phone's Settings to turn off Bluetooth when I get home, then use the quick swipe menu to turn it back on when I am going to get in my car (on Android you can use quick swipe for both; Apple's quick swipe just turns it off "until tomorrow"). I don't do this at stores or at at any location where I'll be clearly out of Bluetooth range (> 100 feet, behind walls). In those cases, I leave Bluetooth on. The phone as key works all the time if I do this. Kind of a pain, but better than rebooting.

The reason I do this is because I've designed the Bluetooth products and I've had to deal with this issue on my products already. Bluetooth wasn't designed with "coming and going" in mind, so if you hover at the fringes of reception-like in most peoples' houses-you'll eventually invoke a stack ban, and restoring communications will require a restart. It's very frustrating for app developers like Tesla to deal with, because it's buried in the OS at a level app developers are deliberately not granted access to. It's never an issue for devices that are stationary, so most companies don't encounter it.

If you're lucky enough to have a home/garage that blocks Bluetooth or is far enough away from your phone, you won't have to do this.

Longer term, Apple and Google need to help app developers deal with "coming and going" Bluetooth use cases. Wouldn't take much. They could start by exposing signal strength and perhaps allowing app developers to read and reset the timeouts and retry limits that lead to stack bans. In the past, they have been loathe to do this for battery life reasons.


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## Phil Kulak

Jesus, what a PITA. My Pixel phone works randomly. Sometimes restarting the app does it. Sometimes I have to restart the whole phone. This is why every other car uses a fob.


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## SoFlaModel3

Mattiuswb said:


> I have had my 3 for 2 months. No issues with access
> 
> same issue. Have had car for 2 months. Works as key flawless but often will forget my phone and then won't find it. Happened to get a new phone (iPhone x) and it worked for 2 weeks. Now just won't connect like before. Ugh. Figure it out Tesla!





Audrey said:


> Mine hasn't had phone key issues, but it forgot my phone and wouldn't re-pair. Annoying.


What version software is your car on? I haven't had this issue since getting 2018.10.5.



Phil Kulak said:


> Jesus, what a PITA. My Pixel phone works randomly. Sometimes restarting the app does it. Sometimes I have to restart the whole phone. This is why every other car uses a fob.


Technically you still have that. You just open the app for all of the buttons that would be on a fob.


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## Phil Kulak

What Tesla needs to do is enable WiFi, then use that instead of bluetooth while you're at home and on the same network.


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## garsh

Phil Kulak said:


> What Tesla needs to do is enable WiFi, then use that instead of bluetooth while you're at home and on the same network.


WiFi isn't really appropriate for that kind of usage. It would require either the phone or car to perform some kind of periodic broadcast to see if the other was present. You'd have to perform that broadcast fairly often to reduce latency. That would also require one of the devices (car or phone) to allow incoming connections, which would then make it easier for a malicious hacker to break into it. Plus setup would be difficult (for non-tech-savvy people) when you have properly-encrypted wifi APs.

If they can't get bluetooth working reliably, then they should add regular keyfob ability to the car.


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## Audrey

SoFlaModel3 said:


> What version software is your car on? I haven't had this issue since getting 2018.10.5.


It's 2018.10.5.


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## SoFlaModel3

Audrey said:


> It's 2018.10.5.


That's a shame. It's amazing how much variation we're all seeing within the same version.


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## Audrey

SoFlaModel3 said:


> That's a shame. It's amazing how much variation we're all seeing within the same version.


I think it may related to the phones' actual Bluetooth chips; perhaps some manufacturers' chips work better than others'. Peripherals are annoying.


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## mtdoak

I've had random BT issues with my Pixel XL too. 

My favorite so was it telling me my phone key wasn't connected even though my music was streaming 

The reboot fixes it.....but still a PITA. 

Hopefully they get better with future updates. Probably happening....10-15% of the time?


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## mtdoak

So, I'm curious as to the experiences people are having with BT key and see if the quirks are similar to mine. 

I've got a Pixel XL. 

I've had:

-The car unlock, phone connect to BT, and it say to place the card on the reader. Either restarting the MCU or waiting a few seconds typically fixes it. 

-The car not immediately unlock when walking up and pressing the doorhandle. If i wait a few seconds it typically connects. 

-Car unlocking and starting, but not connecting BT audio.

Also, has anyone have the mobile app not connect to the car (Car Unavailable)?


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## MelindaV

mtdoak said:


> I've got a Pixel XL


Last night I was looking around and came across an update from Google with "bluetooth connectivity" listed as one of the fixes. (but also saw similar updates from a year ago with articles on people complaining the BT would disconnect some items and leave others running - which sounds like what you or other Pixel people have mentioned here) 
Are you on the latest update?


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## mtdoak

So. This might be nothing. I have a pixel xl on Android 8.1. I was having all the BT issues yesterday. Would unlock and not start. Would not even unlock at all.

I made 2 changes to my setting

#1. Removed a bunch of excess BT connections under settings->connected devices->Bluetooth. I had probably 5 rental cars and other devices paired I no longer needed
#2. Under settings->apps & notifications. Opened the Tesla app. Under "advanced" there is a "modify systems settings" option. I checked it to yes. 









Ever since? No problems. Not sure if it was the number of profiles or system settings that made it better or if it's just a coincidence it started working after I made the changes. Can other people with Android check these settings?


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## Phil Kulak

I know I had problems with my Pixel, and I just checked and only had three total devices paired. That other setting souds promising though.


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## MelindaV

that sounds promising! I did click Winner, but may go back to something less stellar if it does end up being just the luck fo the day


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## Audrey

I've got a Pixel XL 2 and am trying @mtdoak's method. I also enabled some device access it hadn't asked yet: storage and phone.


----------



## John

Phil Kulak said:


> What Tesla needs to do is enable WiFi, then use that instead of bluetooth while you're at home and on the same network.


Yep, that's a great idea. Stop using Bluetooth when a WiFi connection is possible. That would work.

Right now I'm 100% by flipping off Bluetooth when I'm at home, but leaving it on all other times. As I walk out the door of my house, I swipe-enable BT. Only when I get back home do I turn BT off. No more wierdness, for the time being.


----------



## John

mtdoak said:


> So. This might be nothing. I have a pixel xl on Android 8.1. I was having all the BT issues yesterday. Would unlock and not start. Would not even unlock at all.
> 
> I made 2 changes to my setting
> 
> #1. Removed a bunch of excess BT connections under settings->connected devices->Bluetooth. I had probably 5 rental cars and other devices paired I no longer needed
> #2. Under settings->apps & notifications. Opened the Tesla app. Under "advanced" there is a "modify systems settings" option. I checked it to yes.
> View attachment 7411
> 
> 
> Ever since? No problems. Not sure if it was the number of profiles or system settings that made it better or if it's just a coincidence it started working after I made the changes. Can other people with Android check these settings?


This is why Android is easier for getting BT working than iOS-developers can have some control of Bluetooth themselves. Not allowed by Apple.


----------



## EE3

John said:


> I now use my phone's Settings to turn off Bluetooth when I get home, then use the quick swipe menu to turn it back on when I am going to get in my car (on Android you can use quick swipe for both; Apple's quick swipe just turns it off "until tomorrow"). I don't do this at stores or at at any location where I'll be clearly out of Bluetooth range (> 100 feet, behind walls). In those cases, I leave Bluetooth on. The phone as key works all the time if I do this. Kind of a pain, but better than rebooting.
> 
> The reason I do this is because I've designed the Bluetooth products and I've had to deal with this issue on my products already. Bluetooth wasn't designed with "coming and going" in mind, so if you hover at the fringes of reception-like in most peoples' houses-you'll eventually invoke a stack ban, and restoring communications will require a restart. It's very frustrating for app developers like Tesla to deal with, because it's buried in the OS at a level app developers are deliberately not granted access to. It's never an issue for devices that are stationary, so most companies don't encounter it.
> 
> If you're lucky enough to have a home/garage that blocks Bluetooth or is far enough away from your phone, you won't have to do this.
> 
> Longer term, Apple and Google need to help app developers deal with "coming and going" Bluetooth use cases. Wouldn't take much. They could start by exposing signal strength and perhaps allowing app developers to read and reset the timeouts and retry limits that lead to stack bans. In the past, they have been loathe to do this for battery life reasons.


They should just learn from Garmin and other GPS watch companies. I use those all the time (garmin and tomtom) and used to be able to upload my activities via bluetooth to my phone once my activity was completed with no actions required, it just happened on its own. No matter, if I was around my phone during the activity or not. Ever since getting model 3, I have to go through entire circus of rebooting my phone or turning on and off airplane mode for my gps watch to sync with my phone, if I am in a proximity of my model 3. Same for my wireless bluetooth headphones and speakers (which are always in the same location). It seems that Model 3 required 4 (!!!!) Bluetooth channels. My phone has max of 6, 2 devices at the time. So if model 3 is connected, then either my watch won't synch or my music won't play on my home speakers or my headphones won't work. It is a lottery each day.


----------



## EE3

SoFlaModel3 said:


> That's a shame. It's amazing how much variation we're all seeing within the same version.


Shame is the right word. Pure embarrassment. Such bad design and engineering of such a basic and fundamental feature as a key. Well, at least he had fun sending his roadster into the space, what a joke.


----------



## EE3

John said:


> This is why Android is easier for getting BT working than iOS-developers can have some control of Bluetooth themselves. Not allowed by Apple.


I have android and Tesla SC (Buena Park, CA) told me that the most reliable phone to work as a phone key is iPhone right now. I told them they could get me one as a fob, since they can't fix the issue otherwise. Still waiting.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

EE3 said:


> Shame is the right word. Pure embarrassment. Such bad design and engineering of such a basic and fundamental feature as a key. Well, at least he had fun sending his roadster into the space, what a joke.


I have to disagree there as it's been fantastic with my iPhone and I absolutely love not having keys!


----------



## DWolvin

Thanks MTDoak, that's worth a shot. And I agree with the slight annoyance with iPhone working well but Android not so much. My v20 is mostly good, but 10% of the time it fails to wake up when I walk up to the car. Trying your setting change, along with trying to remember to wake the phone a minute out from the car.


----------



## rareohs

(iphone X / latest iOS)

Walk-up unlock works for me as long as phone is in hand or front pocket... does not work well at all if phone is in back pocket.

I have the same issue as others in that contact sync must be turned off. Annoying but hopefully not a permanent thing

Couple times a week I'll unlock the car (either manually from phone or walkup) and the screen stays blank. Press both wheel buttons and snaps back on quickly.

I've had to re-connect bluetooth several times.


All in all, bluetooth issues are real, but not really that big a deal. Shouldn't be too hard for them to clean up the rough edges...


----------



## Bob Hinden

We are having occasional problems were our M3 doesn't see our iPhones to unlock the car. The fix is to turn off bluetooth on the phone and back on again. That has fixed it so far. I would have thought Tesla would have worked out the bugs by now.


----------



## Annalise

hey there, i'm having a similar issue. it continues to disconnect my phone and can't find it again even if its still showing on my iphone. for the key, its about 50/50 which is my biggest concern. if i need to get into my car quickly, and i'm relying on the phone key to pick up and it doesn't, i then have to grab my phone, go to the app and hit unlock. very eager for an update to fix this.


----------



## Quicksilver

Annalise said:


> hey there, i'm having a similar issue. it continues to disconnect my phone and can't find it again even if its still showing on my iphone. for the key, its about 50/50 which is my biggest concern. if i need to get into my car quickly, and i'm relying on the phone key to pick up and it doesn't, i then have to grab my phone, go to the app and hit unlock. very eager for an update to fix this.


This is why I have my key card with me all the time inside my phone case. To date (after about 3 weeks) I have yet to need to use the key card. Fortunately, the phone key has been reliable - meaning, whenever I touch the door handle and pull on it to open the door, the door is always unlocked.


----------



## Bob Hinden

Annalise said:


> hey there, i'm having a similar issue. it continues to disconnect my phone and can't find it again even if its still showing on my iphone. for the key, its about 50/50 which is my biggest concern. if i need to get into my car quickly, and i'm relying on the phone key to pick up and it doesn't, i then have to grab my phone, go to the app and hit unlock. very eager for an update to fix this.


It happened to me again this morning. I had to put my iPhone in airport mode, and turn off airplane mode. After that it worked fine.


----------



## DWolvin

First- keeping the key with your phone is a great idea. Second, I notice that if I reboot the phone every day or two I seem to have much fewer issues (LGv20 - Android).


----------



## Peppington

Happened to me this morning. It unlocked the car. No phone found when trying to play music. Tried to sync Bluetooth and unable to. Using iPhone 8 Plus.


----------



## slasher016

It's definitely still a little bit flaky, but I love not carrying keys anymore. The keycard always works, so it's not too big a deal (as someone who keeps it in his wallet - hint for everyone - it works fine through the wallet, you don't have to take it out.) What I've been doing is if it's been asleep for a long time (4+ hours), I toggle airplane mode before I walk out to the car and that works about 99% of the time.


----------



## DWolvin

Seconded on - keep the keycard in a pocket in your wallet / checkbook / purse that is close to the outside- more than one other card in the way seems to block it, but it will read fine through leather or fabric.


----------



## Quicksilver

DWolvin said:


> Seconded on - keep the keycard in a pocket in your wallet / checkbook / purse that is close to the outside- more than one other card in the way seems to block it, but it will read fine through leather or fabric.


On my wallet case shown above, I have the key card on the outer most (closest to the outside) portion of the wallet and if needed, I just tap the wallet case on the B pillar and it works every time.


----------



## rareohs

I’m still having troubles with phone calls. For no known reason all of a sudden all phone calls will start working only through phone (iPhone X), not through the car.

Here’s what I’ve tried this time:
-in the cars bluetooth menu, made sure “contacts and recent calls” was OFF
-did same thing from phone menu
-disconnected and reconnected phone
-made car forget this device
-made phone forget the model 3 in its BT menu
-flipped iPhone BT off then back on
-reset phone
-reset model 3 screen


Still won’t make Bluetooth calls. Music works a-ok.

So frustrating :rage:


----------



## TeslaFreak

rareohs said:


> I'm still having troubles with phone calls. For no known reason all of a sudden all phone calls will start working only through phone (iPhone X), not through the car.
> 
> Here's what I've tried this time:
> -in the cars bluetooth menu, made sure "contacts and recent calls" was OFF
> -did same thing from phone menu
> -disconnected and reconnected phone
> -made car forget this device
> -made phone forget the model 3 in its BT menu
> -flipped iPhone BT off then back on
> -reset phone
> -reset model 3 screen
> 
> Still won't make Bluetooth calls. Music works a-ok.
> 
> So frustrating :rage:


Who's version of Tesla OS?


----------



## rareohs

TeslaFreak said:


> Who's version of Tesla OS?


*2018.18.3 04dfd3c*


----------



## TeslaFreak

rareohs said:


> *2018.18.3 04dfd3c*


Interesting that I also have 18.3 but using iPhone 7 with iOS 10 (I purposely declined to update to iOS 11) and no issues with Bluetooth.


----------



## PNWmisty

I've been using a Samsung Galaxy S8+ without issue. My wife's S9 works reliably as well. Both these phones have Bluetooth 5 which has better range, higher fidelity when streaming music and supports more device connections simultaneously vs. Bluetooth 4. What is the Model 3 spec for Bluetooth version?


----------



## martsishor

Annalise said:


> hey there, i'm having a similar issue. it continues to disconnect my phone and can't find it again even if its still showing on my iphone. for the key, its about 50/50 which is my biggest concern. if i need to get into my car quickly, and i'm relying on the phone key to pick up and it doesn't, i then have to grab my phone, go to the app and hit unlock. very eager for an update to fix this.


Similar behavior here with a Samsung phone. I thought that these issues were caused by the latest software update, but I now see that they were bound to happen to me too . I unpaired and re-paired my phone and somehow eventually things worked (now my M3 acknowledges that it sees my phone) ... but others have suggested removing contact sync and I will do that next. Thanks y'all for the tips!


----------



## 1st Model 3 in Huntsville

rareohs said:


> I'm still having troubles with phone calls. For no known reason all of a sudden all phone calls will start working only through phone (iPhone X), not through the car.
> 
> Here's what I've tried this time:
> -in the cars bluetooth menu, made sure "contacts and recent calls" was OFF
> -did same thing from phone menu
> -disconnected and reconnected phone
> -made car forget this device
> -made phone forget the model 3 in its BT menu
> -flipped iPhone BT off then back on
> -reset phone
> -reset model 3 screen
> 
> Still won't make Bluetooth calls. Music works a-ok.
> 
> So frustrating :rage:


I am having the same issues and have had on and off since getting the car in February. I am on my 2nd iPhone X too. Resetting Tesla screen does nothing. If I turn iPhone Bluetooth off and back on, I might get a few calls to go through and then call audio returns to my iPhone. My car is actually at the service center right now and I demonstrated the issue to them yesterday. Hopefully, they find a fix. I have rarely gotten calls to go through the Bluetooth audio and the car knows I am on a call, but when I try to switch the phone to Tesla Model 3, no audio. Aggravating. It is either Apple or Tesla...


----------



## TheyCallMeJohn

Also having issues....


----------



## Nicholas Strub

I'm also having issues that I'm guessing are stemming from the bluetooth key system. There's a thread discussing the exact issue I'm having over at TMC and here's my post from there (not sure if I'm allowed to link it directly). Basically, I'll unlock my car just fine with the walk up unlock for the phone as a key, but then it won't shift into Reverse/Drive once I get in there car.

Having the same issue. It'll let me unlock the car using my phone as a key, but then it won't shift (I don't even get a message about needing the key card, it literally just does nothing). I would think that, since it let me unlock the doors using my phone as a key, that there should be no issues allowing me to "start" the car. Tapping keycard on the center console seems to work to get things going. I've also had some luck Powering Off the vehicle via the menus and then starting it back up with the brake pedal (could just be the time here that fixes it though). I'm on 18.3 as of last Friday and I have a Pixel 2 running 8.1.


----------



## slasher016

Nicholas Strub said:


> I'm also having issues that I'm guessing are stemming from the bluetooth key system. There's a thread discussing the exact issue I'm having over at TMC and here's my post from there (not sure if I'm allowed to link it directly). Basically, I'll unlock my car just fine with the walk up unlock for the phone as a key, but then it won't shift into Reverse/Drive once I get in there car.
> 
> Having the same issue. It'll let me unlock the car using my phone as a key, but then it won't shift (I don't even get a message about needing the key card, it literally just does nothing). I would think that, since it let me unlock the doors using my phone as a key, that there should be no issues allowing me to "start" the car. Tapping keycard on the center console seems to work to get things going. I've also had some luck Powering Off the vehicle via the menus and then starting it back up with the brake pedal (could just be the time here that fixes it though). I'm on 18.3 as of last Friday and I have a Pixel 2 running 8.1.


I've had this issue a few times. Usually just taking the phone out of my pocket wakes it up and makes the car realize I have my phone.


----------



## Nicholas Strub

I'll try doing that in the future. I just have to wonder why it's needed though. Clearly, it realizes that I have my phone because it allowed me to unlock the doors, so why is there a problem once I'm inside the car?



slasher016 said:


> I've had this issue a few times. Usually just taking the phone out of my pocket wakes it up and makes the car realize I have my phone.


----------



## slasher016

Nicholas Strub said:


> I'll try doing that in the future. I just have to wonder why it's needed though. Clearly, it realizes that I have my phone because it allowed me to unlock the doors, so why is there a problem once I'm inside the car?


You would think so... but the car seems to do two separate checks. Check 1: Do we allow this person in? Check 2: Should this person inside be allowed to drive?


----------



## rareohs

1st Model 3 in Huntsville said:


> I am having the same issues and have had on and off since getting the car in February. I am on my 2nd iPhone X too. Resetting Tesla screen does nothing. If I turn iPhone Bluetooth off and back on, I might get a few calls to go through and then call audio returns to my iPhone. My car is actually at the service center right now and I demonstrated the issue to them yesterday. Hopefully, they find a fix. I have rarely gotten calls to go through the Bluetooth audio and the car knows I am on a call, but when I try to switch the phone to Tesla Model 3, no audio. Aggravating. It is either Apple or Tesla...


Sounds like exactly my issue. One thing I've noticed is that the car keeps defaulting to "Contacts and Recent Calls" being ON.

This is on the Tesla end, not the phone. I'll flip to off and whenever I think about again I'll look and it's magically back "On."


----------



## RobWUSA

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Ok final follow up since I'm talking to myself anyway
> 
> It's a known issue for Tesla with iOS 11.
> 
> They have a fix coming but the workaround is to disable contact sync on your iPhone.


Thank you ! Same issue. Just disabled contact sync.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

RobWUSA said:


> Thank you ! Same issue. Just disabled contact sync.


You're welcome!

Hey follow up -- I was going crazy not having the contact sync so I turned it back on. Every so often my phone is not found when I get in the car, but I took that trade off to be worth it.


----------



## Derik

So the last two days when I have gone back to the car after work the car doesn't look like it sees the phone, I opened the bluetooth on the screen and my phone is gone from there. The icon is greyed out at the top. Only way I found to fix it is to reset by hold both buttons on the wheel.

I'm guessing this is the same thing you guys have had. Phone as a key works fine. Is the contact sync option the one on the phone, or the one in the car?


----------



## Bob Hinden

I had this happen today after driving the car. I went to play the audio from my phone and discovered the car no longer saw my phone in the bluetooth window. I rebooted the display (hold both buttons on the wheel). It came back after that.

:-(


----------



## theloneranger08

Anyone having issues with song information (artist, title, album, and cover art) not showing when streaming over Bluetooth? I also can't play, pause, skip, or "rewind" (go back) tracks with the screen or scrollwheel. It worked fine when I picked it up last week but started having issues on Thursday.


----------



## RobWUSA

There was a software update the other night without release notes. My iPhone X bluetooth issue seems to be gone.


----------



## rareohs

RobWUSA said:


> There was a software update the other night without release notes. My iPhone X bluetooth issue seems to be gone.


Actually mine is working now as well! Fingers crossed...


----------



## skygraff

Definitely a problem with iOS 11 since I only had a few minor issues with iOS 10 but never like this. Several times, I’ve been completely locked out regardless of how many times I’ve turned off and on BT or opened and closed the app; I shouldn’t say regardless because, eventually, some combination of iterations gets me in without the card.

Today, after a two day deep sleep, it wouldn’t let me in and it wouldn’t recognize my phone for media. To be honest, I rarely use my phone for media so that could’ve happened with the last firmware update rather than the iOS update and I probably wouldn’t have noticed.

Thanks for the tip on the contact syncing. I’ll check if it’s even synced next time I drive.


----------



## MrMatt

I am also seeing this issue. Samsung Galaxy S7 as key. I have a high failure rate opening the driver door, but i've noted that I've had a much better rate of success with the back door. Anyone else seen that? I also keep the phone in my back pocket so wondering if that has something like another poster said. BT is always on for me. I cleared out all the old BT pairings and turned on the Modify permission stated above.

I also have failures on occasionally INSIDE the car. The phone is shown as saved device, but will not connect automatically. When i press connect, it takes forever and then eventually connects.

As an idea/workaround, Tesla should enable my phone to be an NFC card so at least i can tap that to the post instead of having/finding my keycard.


----------



## Todd Harrison

I have to cycle bt on and off before every try, works ok but not what I had hoped it would be. Not a huge deal I keep my card close to the outside of my wallet. If they never get it to work as planned hopefully they will make it right with some kind of fob. My panasonic bt handsets have no problem finding my phone not sure why it can't be the same ?


----------



## LucyferSam

Someone over on TMC suggested disabling battery optimization for the Tesla app for improved phone as key reliability, since I did that I went from about 80% reliable to 99%.


----------



## MrMatt

rareohs said:


> Walk-up unlock works for me as long as phone is in hand or front pocket... does not work well at all if phone is in back pocket.


I thought you were crazy, but so far I've had 100% success with it in my hand or front pocket!! Is that a possible fix?? Thx!!


----------



## skygraff

Today was the worst!

Haven’t updated to iOS 11.4 and still have the fw load 2018.18.13 6a8a06e. Rainy day and just wouldn’t recognize either to open or lock on walk away. Several times I had to use the lock button on the app and, once when the rain was really falling, I used the key card to get in.

Also had the key card prompt to start (twice) even after the phone key let me in. As soon as I opened the app, though, the car recognized me.

I noticed that the contact sync had gone back to on. I did a couple phone reboots, a car reboot, and even forgot/re-added the phone as a key.

Don’t know if this is an issue with my phone’s Bluetooth (been having drops on my headphones since updating to iOS 11 even though the first day of the update was better than before) or the rain or something else but very frustrating.

Side note, even when the car isn’t showing as connected to my iPhone, there are 2-4 mystery connections (alphanumeric strings) which, based on them being there regardless of location, makes me think they’re associated with the phone key system. Doesn’t help me open the door but I seem to recall somebody mentioning that before. I took a picture but have to run to an appointment.


----------



## John

Mine was finally working perfectly on iOS 11 (with contact sync, and no Bluetooth fiddling at home), then I updated to iOS 12 at the recent Apple dev conference and it's made me stand there poking the door handle a couple of times since. Not entirely sure that's causation, but keeping an eye on it.


----------



## Noel

John said:


> ...then I updated to iOS 12...


 I also updated to the iOS 12 developer beta and have been having it not unlock for more often than on iOS 11. It does seem like a beta thing.


----------



## skygraff

Follow up:

Had my iPhone battery replaced because it needed it and was under the battery replacement mea culpa program for $30. Asked Apple to diagnose the Bluetooth at the same time.

The chip passed the tests and they informed me that they don’t do any work on the iPhones other than battery, camera, and screen replacements. Even after just asking them to see if any conncections were loose or contact tape was disturbed, the tech didn’t make any notes about what was seen inside.

The battery replacement improved things quite a bit but I’m still having issues with the car asking for the key card before driving away (have to move phone out of pocket toward center of car) and unreliable walk away lock functions. Bluetooth to my headphones was also improved but there may still be something going on with the phone rather than the car.


----------



## John

skygraff said:


> Follow up:
> 
> Had my iPhone battery replaced because it needed it and was under the battery replacement mea culpa program for $30. Asked Apple to diagnose the Bluetooth at the same time.
> 
> The chip passed the tests and they informed me that they don't do any work on the iPhones other than battery, camera, and screen replacements. Even after just asking them to see if any conncections were loose or contact tape was disturbed, the tech didn't make any notes about what was seen inside.
> 
> The battery replacement improved things quite a bit but I'm still having issues with the car asking for the key card before driving away (have to move phone out of pocket toward center of car) and unreliable walk away lock functions. Bluetooth to my headphones was also improved but there may still be something going on with the phone rather than the car.


Do you have a case on it? Tried without it?


----------



## skygraff

John said:


> Do you have a case on it? Tried without it?


Yes & yes.

Very slim Incipio case which doesn't even get in the way of using the Model 3 charge cable.

The timing of this is all so frustratingly convenient (as soon as I updated to iOS 11) but, despite Apple, I'm guessing it's hardware related. Need to find a local shop as I don't want to open it myself just yet.


----------



## John

skygraff said:


> Yes & yes.
> 
> Very slim Incipio case which doesn't even get in the way of using the Model 3 charge cable.
> 
> The timing of this is all so frustratingly convenient (as soon as I updated to iOS 11) but, despite Apple, I'm guessing it's hardware related. Need to find a local shop as I don't want to open it myself just yet.


Which iPhone model? About the only thing that's reparable are antenna components. For instance, on most iPhones a new diversity antenna costs $6-15 from iFixit if you're handy and want to try fixing it yourself...


----------



## skygraff

John said:


> Which iPhone model? About the only thing that's reparable are antenna components. For instance, on most iPhones a new diversity antenna costs $6-15 from iFixit if you're handy and want to try fixing it yourself...


6

Based on recent GPS issues during a Strava run (while holding the phone in my right hand so Bluetooth headphones would work), I'm pretty danged sure it's the "f" antenna (?). I know I can get it on ifixit and I know I could perform the work but I'm leaning toward finding a local shop just in case additional parts are required since they'd have them on hand but I'd have to close everything up and reorder.


----------



## John

skygraff said:


> 6
> 
> Based on recent GPS issues during a Strava run (while holding the phone in my right hand so Bluetooth headphones would work), I'm pretty danged sure it's the "f" antenna (?). I know I can get it on ifixit and I know I could perform the work but I'm leaning toward finding a local shop just in case additional parts are required since they'd have them on hand but I'd have to close everything up and reorder.


Yeah, sometimes when you are peeling away some of the stuff they stick together, you nick or rip a cable. I once fixed a screen on an iPad and had to buy a new button assembly and WiFi antenna. More harm than good.

Still, watch the repair video and make the call. Always cool if you have to the tools to DIY.

Also, you can get a used iPhone 6 for less that $150 if you look around...


----------



## TrickorDevice

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Current owners have you had any issues with Bluetooth? I just got in my car from work and my phone has disappeared from the BT device list and can't be found.
> 
> The phone as a key still works...


I've been having the same issue for about three weeks now, and I am on the latest firmware. I have sent the issue to Tesla via Twitter.

When I do a car reboot (pressing both steering wheel knobs) it does resolve the issue. But I have to do it almost every other day now. Very annoying.


----------



## skygraff

Confirmed: It was my phone. Verified by having no GPS for Strava on a long distance bike ride and having to use my key card for a few days.

Despite Apple’s refusal to examine it when I had the battery replaced and their subsequent chat advice to first try resetting the phone to new then, if that doesn’t work, bringing it in but expecting to pay $299 plus tax for a replacement phone if it was hardware related, I took it to a local shop instead.

It was the f antenna. The foil tape and a broken contactor. The part was $9 and labor $50 so fixed for $60 with tax.

Car know who I am again!


----------



## Drago

TrickorDevice said:


> I've been having the same issue for about three weeks now, and I am on the latest firmware. I have sent the issue to Tesla via Twitter.
> 
> When I do a car reboot (pressing both steering wheel knobs) it does resolve the issue. But I have to do it almost every other day now. Very annoying.


I have the same issue - haven't tried rebooting it, but the issue usually goes away the next time I get in my car (i.e. it recognizes my phone without any problems)


----------



## JMZ

TrickorDevice said:


> I've been having the same issue for about three weeks now, and I am on the latest firmware. I have sent the issue to Tesla via Twitter.
> 
> When I do a car reboot (pressing both steering wheel knobs) it does resolve the issue. But I have to do it almost every other day now. Very annoying.


Indeed, i'm experiencing similar issues (Google Pixel, running Android 8.1). I have to toggle bluetooth off and on almost every time I leave the car for more than a few minutes. Also, sometimes after doing so, i'll be able to open the door, but won't be able to put the car into R or D until I toggle bt off and on again. As cool as the M3 is - and I really like it in so many ways - I tell my friends who ask that, if they're concerned about being able to enter the car quickly if being chased by a swarm of bees / angry mob / hideous monster intent on eating your person, they should perhaps consider a different vehicle (or wait for a software update before putting themselves in any of the above situations).

Regards,

John


----------



## slasher016

JMZ said:


> Indeed, i'm experiencing similar issues (Google Pixel, running Android 8.1). I have to toggle bluetooth off and on almost every time I leave the car for more than a few minutes. Also, sometimes after doing so, i'll be able to open the door, but won't be able to put the car into R or D until I toggle bt off and on again. As cool as the M3 is - and I really like it in so many ways - I tell my friends who ask that, if they're concerned about being able to enter the car quickly if being chased by a swarm of bees / angry mob / hideous monster intent on eating your person, they should perhaps consider a different vehicle (or wait for a software update before putting themselves in any of the above situations).
> 
> Regards,
> 
> John


Or carry their keycard.


----------



## JMZ

slasher016 said:


> Or carry their keycard.


Indeed, though I carry mine in my backpack and find the hassle of having to fish it out whenever I want to enter my car to be just as annoying. The way my Volt worked was much simpler - I kept the keyfob in my backpack, and when I got close enough to the car, it would detect said keyfob in close proximity and let me open the door. I never had to remove the keyfob from my backpack (except once every 2 years or so when I needed to change the battery). I appreciate the M3 in so many ways, but this is one (of comparatively few) features where I preferred the Volt's implementation to Tesla's.

Regards,

John


----------



## PNWmisty

JMZ said:


> I kept the keyfob in my backpack, and when I got close enough to the car, it would detect said keyfob in close proximity and let me open the door. I never had to remove the keyfob from my backpack (except once every 2 years or so when I needed to change the battery). I appreciate the M3 in so many ways, but this is one (of comparatively few) features where I preferred the Volt's implementation to Tesla's.


It sounds like it's not Tesla's implementation that you dislike, it's that your phone is not working properly. Because if your phone worked like mine, you would have all the functionality of your Volt only better (you wouldn't need to carry a separate key fob around).


----------



## JMZ

PNWmisty said:


> It sounds like it's not Tesla's implementation that you dislike, it's that your phone is not working properly. Because if your phone worked like mine, you would have all the functionality of your Volt only better (you wouldn't need to carry a separate key fob around).


I meant to say that, with these experiences, I prefer the keyfob approach that the Volt, Model S and X employ, vs. the bluetooth approach used in the Model 3. However, I see your point that it could be the bluetooth implementation on my phone at fault. I don't participate in the smartphone wars (as I write code for both iOS and Android in my day job), but it could be that a different phone would work better. Last evening, for instance, I parked the M3 on the street in Berkeley while a friend and I went to a cafe, and when we left, it took several tries to get the M3 and my Pixel to communicate, each time with me trying to open the door and failing. I'm sure that looked suspicious to anyone passing by.

Regards,

John


----------



## slasher016

JMZ said:


> I meant to say that, with these experiences, I prefer the keyfob approach that the Volt, Model S and X employ, vs. the bluetooth approach used in the Model 3. However, I see your point that it could be the bluetooth implementation on my phone at fault. I don't participate in the smartphone wars (as I write code for both iOS and Android in my day job), but it could be that a different phone would work better. Last evening, for instance, I parked the M3 on the street in Berkeley while a friend and I went to a cafe, and when we left, it took several tries to get the M3 and my Pixel to communicate, each time with me trying to open the door and failing. I'm sure that looked suspicious to anyone passing by.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> John


I have a Pixel and mine works 95% of the time. Very strange.


----------



## JMZ

slasher016 said:


> I have a Pixel and mine works 95% of the time. Very strange.


This is interesting. Which Pixel? Mine is the original Pixel (not the Pixel 2), non-XL, running Android 8.1. Do you have to physically unlock / authenticate with the Pixel before the M3 recognizes it? Is yours in a case? What version of the software is your M3 running?

This is becoming a big issue for me. Sometimes, even if the M3 and the Pixel communicate to the point where I can enter the car and close the door, I can't put the car into R or D - even while depressing the brake pedal. Whether this is due to other communications issues with the Pixel or something else is unknown to me, but i've either had to toggle the Pixel in and out of airplane mode again or wait ... patiently ... for whatever needs to happen, to happen, before I can actually put the car out of P.

While I don't mind changing phones - i'm not ideological wrt platform, manufacturer or model - it'd be nice to get a better idea of the cause of the issue before deciding whether or not to do so.

Regards,

John


----------



## LucyferSam

JMZ said:


> This is interesting. Which Pixel? Mine is the original Pixel (not the Pixel 2), non-XL, running Android 8.1. Do you have to physically unlock / authenticate with the Pixel before the M3 recognizes it? Is yours in a case? What version of the software is your M3 running?
> 
> This is becoming a big issue for me. Sometimes, even if the M3 and the Pixel communicate to the point where I can enter the car and close the door, I can't put the car into R or D - even while depressing the brake pedal. Whether this is due to other communications issues with the Pixel or something else is unknown to me, but i've either had to toggle the Pixel in and out of airplane mode again or wait ... patiently ... for whatever needs to happen, to happen, before I can actually put the car out of P.
> 
> While I don't mind changing phones - i'm not ideological wrt platform, manufacturer or model - it'd be nice to get a better idea of the cause of the issue before deciding whether or not to do so.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> John


Don't know if it will help you, but I'm on a Pixel 2, with 100% success on the phone as key, though I did have to modify 2 settings to get it working reliably - first I gave the app permission to modify system settings, which took me from ~50% reliability to ~80%, then I disabled battery optimization. Both can be accessed by going to Settings:Apps & Notifications:Advanced:Special App Access.

With this setup I have not yet had the phone as key fail while in my pocket, and I'm going on a month of these settings.


----------



## PNWmisty

LucyferSam said:


> Don't know if it will help you, but I'm on a Pixel 2, with 100% success on the phone as key, though I did have to modify 2 settings to get it working reliably - first I gave the app permission to modify system settings, which took me from ~50% reliability to ~80%, then I disabled battery optimization. Both can be accessed by going to Settings:Apps & Notifications:Advanced:Special App Access.
> 
> With this setup I have not yet had the phone as key fail while in my pocket, and I'm going on a month of these settings.


It sounds like you nailed it! When you disabled the battery optimization, was it specific to the Tesla app or a global setting? In both my Samsung S8+ and my wife's S9, I disabled the battery optimization for the Tesla app and it's been working 100% over the last 4-5 weeks.

Although I always have the Tesla key card in my wallet, I haven't had to use it and it's super nice not needing to bring a key or a key fob. I literally just walk up, get in and drive away and the reverse at my destination. No key FOB required. Is the Model 3 the only car in the world with this functionality built into something (your cell phone) that you would be carrying anyway?


----------



## littlD

PNWmisty said:


> It sounds like you nailed it! When you disabled the battery optimization, was it specific to the Tesla app or a global setting? In both my Samsung S8+ and my wife's S9, I disabled the battery optimization for the Tesla app and it's been working 100% over the last 4-5 weeks.
> 
> Although I always have the Tesla key card in my wallet, I haven't had to use it and it's super nice not needing to bring a key or a key fob. I literally just walk up, get in and drive away and the reverse at my destination. No key FOB required. Is the Model 3 the only car in the world with this functionality built into something (your cell phone) that you would be carrying anyway?


Disabling battery optimization is done in the Phone's settings, not within the app.

On a Pixel 2, I select the gear icon after swiping down from the top of the screen. Then Search settings with "battery", select "Battery Optimization", show "All Apps", Scroll to "Tesla", touch its listing in the list, select "Don't Optimize" .

Found this for Samsung Galaxy S6 or later phones:
https://www.verizonwireless.com/support/knowledge-base-204545/


----------



## slasher016

JMZ said:


> This is interesting. Which Pixel? Mine is the original Pixel (not the Pixel 2), non-XL, running Android 8.1. Do you have to physically unlock / authenticate with the Pixel before the M3 recognizes it? Is yours in a case? What version of the software is your M3 running?
> 
> This is becoming a big issue for me. Sometimes, even if the M3 and the Pixel communicate to the point where I can enter the car and close the door, I can't put the car into R or D - even while depressing the brake pedal. Whether this is due to other communications issues with the Pixel or something else is unknown to me, but i've either had to toggle the Pixel in and out of airplane mode again or wait ... patiently ... for whatever needs to happen, to happen, before I can actually put the car out of P.
> 
> While I don't mind changing phones - i'm not ideological wrt platform, manufacturer or model - it'd be nice to get a better idea of the cause of the issue before deciding whether or not to do so.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> John


Pixel (1) XL 
8.1.0 (June 5th security update)
I'm using a Caseology case

For settings I have battery optimization turned off for the Tesla app. Everything else is pretty standard. Once a week or so I'll have an issue connecting and I'll toggle airplane mode, then it'll be good for another week or so. Pretty rare that I have to do anything "special" to get the doors to open or the car to go to drive.


----------



## Chris350

You might want to turn it off for the Bluetooth also.

I've had much better connection results having them both turned off from battery optimization.

Using pixel 2 xl.


----------



## Jan King

We have had the model 3 for a month now (since June 2018). My wife (iPhone SE) and I (iPhone 5S) both have iphones (iOs 11.4) and no data plan. The car will only open 50% of the time using the phone. My wife has given up completely on the phone and only uses the card now. I am doing the same as I never know if the car will open or not. I have tried turning off contact sync, turning on/off bluetooth, reseting the car, reseting the phone, app refresh setting is on.
Its pretty annoying to only be able to use the card as if you always have to go to the driver door before you can put stuff in the trunk or open the passenger door. You get in the car, it often needs the key on the centre console, so you take the card out of your wallet and put it in place, then because you keep the card in your wallet you don't have your seat belt on (so you can put it back) and the car seat belt alarm goes off. Does Tesla not know people might keep the key card in your wallet?

I really wish we had a fob. Nothing like walking up to the cool Tesla and it will only let you in 50% of the time. Super stupid design fail.


----------



## PNWmisty

Jan King said:


> I really wish we had a fob. Nothing like walking up to the cool Tesla and it will only let you in 50% of the time. Super stupid design fail.


Why would you blame the car for your phones inability to reliably connect with the car?

That makes no sense. Many of us have 100% unlock/lock functionality. It's like magic!


----------



## Jan King

The fact is it does not work for me or my wife. It would have been nice if we were one of the lucky ones like you where it works 100% of the time. I know the key fob on my other cars worked 100% of the time. Blame the car, blame bluetooth software, blame the iphone, it does not matter who you blame, it does not work! Try using your card 100% of the time and see how you like it.


----------



## PNWmisty

Jan King said:


> The fact is it does not work for me or my wife. It would have been nice if we were one of the lucky ones like you where it works 100% of the time. I know the key fob on my other cars worked 100% of the time. Blame the car, blame bluetooth software, blame the iphone, it does not matter who you blame, it does not work! Try using your card 100% of the time and see how you like it.


Jan, I feel for your disappointment, I wouldn't put up with a phone that didn't have 100% compatibility with keyless entry. My only point is that Tesla can only make a product that complies with the Bluetooth standard. I'm not sure your phone does. If it does, I think you just need to adjust the settings so it works 100%. Unfortunately, I'm not an iPhone expert. I wouldn't assume you've exhausted all the settings unless other Apple SE phone users are having the same problem. In that case, your beef lies squarely with Apple. Hopefully, it's just a setting you haven't found.

Look at it this way. If your phone couldn't connect reliably with your Linksys wi-fi router, but all your other devices could, would you expect Linksys to troubleshoot your iPhone? I suppose there is a tiny chance your car has a hardware defect but I'm 99% sure the issue lies with your phone or it's settings. Otherwise, why would it be reliable 100% of the time for so many?


----------



## garsh

PNWmisty said:


> Look at it this way. If your phone couldn't connect reliably with your Linksys wi-fi router, but all your other devices could, would you expect Linksys to troubleshoot your iPhone?


<devil's advocate>It would be nice if Tesla could put together a "Bluetooth configuration" page that included instructions for how to change the settings for best results for some of the more popular phones.</devil's advocate>


----------



## SimonMatthews

I had a weird Bluetooth experience today. 

The "Phone Key" was working. My car unlocked when I approached it and locked when I walked away. 

But then, the car would not connect to my phone for phone calls, etc.. In fact, when I touched the Bluetooth icon on the screen, no phones showed up -- all the phones we had paired with the car were missing. 

A reboot (press both steering wheel buttons, foot on brake pedal) fixed the issue. My phone connected and the other phones showed up in the Bluetooth connection screen. But why did the Phone key work if Bluetooth wasn't working?


----------



## littlD

SimonMatthews said:


> I had a weird Bluetooth experience today.
> 
> The "Phone Key" was working. My car unlocked when I approached it and locked when I walked away.
> 
> But then, the car would not connect to my phone for phone calls, etc.. In fact, when I touched the Bluetooth icon on the screen, no phones showed up -- all the phones we had paired with the car were missing.
> 
> A reboot (press both steering wheel buttons, foot on brake pedal) fixed the issue. My phone connected and the other phones showed up in the Bluetooth connection screen. But why did the Phone key work if Bluetooth wasn't working?


Keep in mind that it's not just having the Bluetooth radio signal that is involved.

Bluetooth has what are called "Profiles". Each of those have some code on the phone and the car that communicate over the same radio signal. So, it's quite possible that the profile used for the Phone Key was communicating fine while the one for phone call wasn't.

Any mobile developers more familiar working with Bluetooth than me please chime in. I just used it for data collection years ago.


----------



## SoFlaModel3

SimonMatthews said:


> I had a weird Bluetooth experience today.
> 
> The "Phone Key" was working. My car unlocked when I approached it and locked when I walked away.
> 
> But then, the car would not connect to my phone for phone calls, etc.. In fact, when I touched the Bluetooth icon on the screen, no phones showed up -- all the phones we had paired with the car were missing.
> 
> A reboot (press both steering wheel buttons, foot on brake pedal) fixed the issue. My phone connected and the other phones showed up in the Bluetooth connection screen. But why did the Phone key work if Bluetooth wasn't working?


That happens to me once every 10-15 days and fixes itself by the next drive


----------



## GDN

SimonMatthews said:


> I had a weird Bluetooth experience today.
> 
> The "Phone Key" was working. My car unlocked when I approached it and locked when I walked away.
> 
> But then, the car would not connect to my phone for phone calls, etc.. In fact, when I touched the Bluetooth icon on the screen, no phones showed up -- all the phones we had paired with the car were missing.
> 
> A reboot (press both steering wheel buttons, foot on brake pedal) fixed the issue. My phone connected and the other phones showed up in the Bluetooth connection screen. But why did the Phone key work if Bluetooth wasn't working?


I had this same thing one time, but didn't do the deep reboot, only 2 buttons on the steering wheel and did it while driving. Reboot completed and phone came back. It did open the car first though.


----------



## pdizzle555

GDN said:


> I had this same thing one time, but didn't do the deep reboot, only 2 buttons on the steering wheel and did it while driving. Reboot completed and phone came back. It did open the car first though.


How do you do a "deep reboot" ?


----------



## M3OC Rules

garsh said:


> <devil's advocate>It would be nice if Tesla could put together a "Bluetooth configuration" page that included instructions for how to change the settings for best results for some of the more popular phones.</devil's advocate>


I agree. This is going to be a continuous problem changing with each update for phone hardware, phone OSs, and cars. Seems like an optional keyfob is needed here. I think even if people had to pay for it they might be happy if its reliable. I don't know if worrying about having the problem helps but I haven't had any issues yet. Knock on real wood dash. Pixel 2 XL with the battery optimization off on the Tesla app. As long as it works it is pretty awesome.


----------



## PNWmisty

M3OC Rules said:


> I don't know if worrying about having the problem helps but I haven't had any issues yet. Knock on real wood dash. Pixel 2 XL with the battery optimization off on the Tesla app. As long as it works it is pretty awesome.


I agree. And it seems like it works 100% for more and more people. I don't know if one of the software updates fixed the situation or if people just learned how to configure their phones.


----------



## atebit

There’s nothing to configure in iOS for BT (at least on the SE) except on/off and if you want to sync contacts or not. 

Same problem here.


----------



## Win-T3

I found that a soft reset by hitting the two buttons on the Tesla Model 3 steering wheel simultaneous, helped. Best to do this while parked as the screen turns all black. Takes a second to reboot and then the screen reappears if you tap the screen or hit a button.

If this doesn’t work for you, then when the car is parked then hold down the brake pedal and hit the two steering wheel buttons for a hard reset.

After that, the Bluetooth phones reappeared and I could re-add then. Before that, I lost the connectivity for our 3 iPhones and powering down manually didn’t bring them back into the Tesla menu so the soft and hard reset worked. 

Hope that works for you too.


----------



## PNWmisty

Win-T3 said:


> I found that a soft reset by hitting the two buttons on the Tesla Model 3 steering wheel simultaneous, helped. Best to do this while parked as the screen turns all black. Takes a second to reboot and then the screen reappears if you tap the screen or hit a button.
> 
> If this doesn't work for you, then when the car is parked then hold down the brake pedal and hit the two steering wheel buttons for a hard reset.


I've never had to do either of those things to have perfect, 100% "phone as key" functionality so that sounds odd to me. What software version is your Model 3 on? That sounds more like an issue with your phone or phone settings.

Even if the iPhone SE doesn't have any Bluetooth functionality past BT on/off, there could be other power saving settings that could affect BT functionality.


----------



## John

Jan King said:


> We have had the model 3 for a month now (since June 2018). My wife and I both have iphone SE phones (iOs 11.4) and no data plan. The car will only open 50% of the time using the phone. My wife has given up completely on the phone and only uses the card now. I am doing the same as I never know if the car will open or not. I have tried turning off contact sync, turning on/off bluetooth, reseting the car, reseting the phone, app refresh setting is on.
> Its pretty annoying to only be able to use the card as if you always have to go to the driver door before you can put stuff in the trunk or open the passenger door. You get in the car, it often needs the key on the centre console, so you take the card out of your wallet and put it in place, then because you keep the card in your wallet you don't have your seat belt on (so you can put it back) and the car seat belt alarm goes off. Does Tesla not know people might keep the key card in your wallet?
> 
> I really wish we had a fob. Nothing like walking up to the cool Tesla and it will only let you in 50% of the time. Super stupid design fail.


My company uses Bluetooth in our products, and I've done a fair amount of Bluetooth support over the years. My advice would be to try a conservative Bluetooth approach and see if that helps.

When you walk away from your car, turn off Bluetooth (use the quick swipe control center for convenience)
As you walk up to your car, turn on Bluetooth.
Keep the Tesla app running all the time.
You may find that this makes the Bluetooth quite reliable. I had to do this with the very first firmware my Model 3 had. This helps prevent your phone from getting frustrated with your car as you walk just outside of useful range, such as when you are in your house. The errors start to stack up and the phone blocks out the connection to save power. I remember how frustrating that can be, and I sympathize.

Rumor is a fob may be in the works, btw.


----------



## PNWmisty

John said:


> You may find that this makes the Bluetooth quite reliable. I had to do this with the very first firmware my Model 3 had. This helps prevent your phone from getting frustrated with your car as you walk just outside of useful range, such as when you are in your house. The errors start to stack up and the phone blocks out the connection to save power. I remember how frustrating that can be, and I sympathize


John, doesn't your experience indicate that's no longer necessary (as long as your Model 3 is not running a very early release firmware)?

Because I never have to turn my Bluetooth on or off, I just leave my phone in my pocket or bag and the doors always unlock when they should. Samsung S8+.

With the Model 3, your cell phone becomes an integral part of the ownership experience, I'm thinking maybe we should all put the model of cell phone we use into our car's configuration in our profile. After all, if not happy with the way our cell phone performs, some of that unhappiness could be cross-transferred to the car.


----------



## John

PNWmisty said:


> John, doesn't your experience indicate that's no longer necessary (as long as your Model 3 is not running a very early release firmware)?
> 
> Because I never have to turn my Bluetooth on or off, I just leave my phone in my pocket or bag and the doors always unlock when they should. Samsung S8+.
> 
> With the Model 3, your cell phone becomes an integral part of the ownership experience, I'm thinking maybe we should all put the model of cell phone we use into our car's configuration in our profile. After all, if not happy with the way our cell phone performs, some of that unhappiness could be cross-transferred to the car.


Mostly what my experience tells me is that Bluetooth as implemented can be weird, and peoples' experiences vary widely.

My conclusion-based on a lot of experience, especially with older devices-is that the problem stems from several causes:

Bluetooth was designed for static applications (where equipment is set up and doesn't move around, like audio listening)
The software stack on mobile phones has several layers, not all of which are exposed to users and developers or each other
Mobile phones protect their battery life aggressively
My company has wrestled with "walk up connect" issues for years (we make altitude recorders for things that fly like rockets, drones, and planes).

Bluetooth protocols are transacted-one device makes a request, the other acknowledges, then responds, then the other device acknowledges the response. If a transaction is invalid (corrupted, distorted, missing) the devices will retry. When the devices move around, transmissions can partly or completely fail, and you can get a reverberation of tries, retries, acks and partial messages. Also, there may be several apps or routines using the same Bluetooth link. The worst case is if you have multiple routines using Bluetooth and hover right at the ranges of reception.

Remember, not everyone knows or remembers which apps on their phones are currently running in the background that may be trying to use Bluetooth.

At some point, the Bluetooth stack on the phone can get "frustrated" enough to block the other device. It does this silently and in a pseudo-random fashion (it only takes a few independent counters and timers before the behavior is hard to predict). At that point the link just stops working with no warnings or other indications, and it may stay that way until a system reset of some kind-on one or perhaps both ends. The most common purpose of this lockout is to preserve battery life. If a connection or external device looks like it's faulty and "just wasting power," a well-meaning safety routine can shut the connection down. To complicate matters, one or both of the devices may report that they are still "connected," despite the fact that messages aren't allowed to be sent.

In the Bluetooth world, troubleshooting advice is full of resets and reboots. Because all the layers of Bluetooth and underlying OS aren't completely manageable. Once a hidden counter gets to a certain value, the other device is banned and there's no user interface to reset it. Thus, the reboot or stack reset.

It's hard to blame the developer (in this case the Tesla app and car) too much, because to the developer the stack will appear to be working fine, with no errors. The app sends a message, the Bluetooth stack happily accepts it, but nothing comes back. Hmm, device must be out of range, perhaps? That's all the app can conclude.

So that's why I advise people that are having issues with Bluetooth suddenly not working to adopt a conservative approach and be more deliberate about when they "allow Bluetooth to even try to connect" by toggling Bluetooth on and off appropriately. When Bluetooth is turned off, it can't get into mischief.

The eventual answer to this is that all the parties involved in the communication stack need to get better at "walk up connect" scenarios, which Bluetooth BLE especially has begun to do. New application scenarios, especially around health and fitness, have really helped this because they often involve mobile, casual usage by people moving into and out of range. So Apple, Google (on the OS side), the Bluetooth standards groups who work on protocols, app developers, and the chip vendors are beginning to coordinate better on this. It only takes one misbehaving party to spoil the whole thing, remember.

Two different users with the same phones can have different experiences, because they have different apps using Bluetooth on their phones, Bluetooth shares an antenna with WiFi (so there's those apps to think about), and the physical environment (e.g. how far your parked car is from your bedroom or living room) can vary.

So, for instance, my iPhone X now works pretty much 100% (except when my car falls asleep for whatever reason and is slow waking up). But i would NOT say to someone else, "Go get a crazy-expensive iPhone X and your problems will be solved," because I realize they may not be.

It's complicated.


----------



## PNWmisty

John said:


> Mostly what my experience tells me is that Bluetooth as implemented can be weird, and peoples' experiences vary widely.
> 
> My conclusion-based on a lot of experience, especially with older devices-is that the problem stems from several causes:
> 
> Bluetooth was designed for static applications (where equipment is set up and doesn't move around, like audio listening)
> The software stack on mobile phones has several layers, not all of which are exposed to users and developers or each other
> Mobile phones protect their battery life aggressively
> My company has wrestled with "walk up connect" issues for years (we make altitude recorders for things that fly like rockets, drones, and planes).
> 
> Bluetooth protocols are transacted-one device makes a request, the other acknowledges, then responds, then the other device acknowledges the response. If a transaction is invalid (corrupted, distorted, missing) the devices will retry. When the devices move around, transmissions can partly or completely fail, and you can get a reverberation of tries, retries, acks and partial messages. Also, there may be several apps or routines using the same Bluetooth link. The worst case is if you have multiple routines using Bluetooth and hover right at the ranges of reception.
> 
> Remember, not everyone knows or remembers which apps on their phones are currently running in the background that may be trying to use Bluetooth.
> 
> At some point, the Bluetooth stack on the phone can get "frustrated" enough to block the other device. It does this silently and in a pseudo-random fashion (it only takes a few independent counters and timers before the behavior is hard to predict). At that point the link just stops working with no warnings or other indications, and it may stay that way until a system reset of some kind-on one or perhaps both ends. The most common purpose of this lockout is to preserve battery life. If a connection or external device looks like it's faulty and "just wasting power," a well-meaning safety routine can shut the connection down. To complicate matters, one or both of the devices may report that they are still "connected," despite the fact that messages aren't allowed to be sent.
> 
> In the Bluetooth world, troubleshooting advice is full of resets and reboots. Because all the layers of Bluetooth and underlying OS aren't completely manageable. Once a hidden counter gets to a certain value, the other device is banned and there's no user interface to reset it. Thus, the reboot or stack reset.
> 
> It's hard to blame the developer (in this case the Tesla app and car) too much, because to the developer the stack will appear to be working fine, with no errors. The app sends a message, the Bluetooth stack happily accepts it, but nothing comes back. Hmm, device must be out of range, perhaps? That's all the app can conclude.
> 
> So that's why I advise people that are having issues with Bluetooth suddenly not working to adopt a conservative approach and be more deliberate about when they "allow Bluetooth to even try to connect" by toggling Bluetooth on and off appropriately. When Bluetooth is turned off, it can't get into mischief.
> 
> The eventual answer to this is that all the parties involved in the communication stack need to get better at "walk up connect" scenarios, which Bluetooth BLE especially has begun to do. New application scenarios, especially around health and fitness, have really helped this because they often involve mobile, casual usage by people moving into and out of range. So Apple, Google (on the OS side), the Bluetooth standards groups who work on protocols, app developers, and the chip vendors are beginning to coordinate better on this. It only takes one misbehaving party to spoil the whole thing, remember.
> 
> Two different users with the same phones can have different experiences, because they have different apps using Bluetooth on their phones, Bluetooth shares an antenna with WiFi (so there's those apps to think about), and the physical environment (e.g. how far your parked car is from your bedroom or living room) can vary.
> 
> So, for instance, my iPhone X now works pretty much 100% (except when my car falls asleep for whatever reason and is slow waking up). But i would NOT say to someone else, "Go get a crazy-expensive iPhone X and your problems will be solved," because I realize they may not be.
> 
> It's complicated.


Whew! Thanks for the very comprehensive Bluetooth primer!

Maybe I have 100% reliability with "phone as key" because I don't have other apps that use Bluetooth. This is all good to know.

I do think the fact that my Android phone has worked 100% for the last six weeks or more pretty much proves that there is nothing about the Android OS that prevents it from working 100%. Do any iPhones users have 100% reliability? For example, I've never found my Model 3 to be in a "deep sleep" state, at least not in any way that made it known to me. And my wife reports the same 100% functionality with her Samsung S9.

I have noticed one change for the worse that I believe happened with an OTA update that rolled out about 4 weeks ago. My Model 3 used to have much quicker connectivity to the phone app via LTE and would report back on the cars state within a few seconds. At some point, it starting taking about 20 seconds to connect via LTE. But this change did not affect the responsiveness of "phone as key". I will note that I have never tried to make "phone as key" fail (for example, by sprinting up to my Model 3 and immediately trying to get in). I'm not sure how it would handle that as I always walk up at a normal walking pace and push the handle. I feel maybe a 1/2 second delay is all. I may have to test how it responds to sprinting up to it.

Thank-you for your expertise and your patience!


----------



## John

PNWmisty said:


> Whew! Thanks for the very comprehensive Bluetooth primer!
> 
> Maybe I have 100% reliability with "phone as key" because I don't have other apps that use Bluetooth. This is all good to know.
> 
> I do think the fact that my Android phone has worked 100% for the last six weeks or more pretty much proves that there is nothing about the Android OS that prevents it from working 100%. Do any iPhones users have 100% reliability? For example, I've never found my Model 3 to be in a "deep sleep" state, at least not in any way that made it known to me. And my wife reports the same 100% functionality with her Samsung S9.
> 
> I have noticed one change for the worse that I believe happened with an OTA update that rolled out about 4 weeks ago. My Model 3 used to have much quicker connectivity to the phone app via LTE and would report back on the cars state within a few seconds. At some point, it starting taking about 20 seconds to connect via LTE. But this change did not affect the responsiveness of "phone as key". I will note that I have never tried to make "phone as key" fail (for example, by sprinting up to my Model 3 and immediately trying to get in). I'm not sure how it would handle that as I always walk up at a normal walking pace and push the handle. I feel maybe a 1/2 second delay is all. I may have to test how it responds to sprinting up to it.
> 
> Thank-you for your expertise and your patience!


I guess if someone was to take one thought away from that long screed I wrote, it would be to realize that the phone-as-key experience is more complicated than "if you use this type of phone you are okay." You can have two people with the same phone-either your Android phone or my iPhone X-and not get the 100% success that we enjoy.


----------



## PNWmisty

John said:


> You can have two people with the same phone-either your Android phone or my iPhone X-and not get the 100% success that we enjoy.


I was under the impression that your reliability was not quite 100% since you said: "except when my car falls asleep for whatever reason and is slow waking up". That hasn't happened to me (at least not yet, in seven weeks of usage).

I understand that situation may be very rare but is it the phone or the Model 3 that is "asleep"?

And I fully understand your point because, before we adjusted the settings on our phones we had a few failures of "phone as key".


----------



## John

PNWmisty said:


> I was under the impression that your reliability was not quite 100% since you said: "except when my car falls asleep for whatever reason and is slow waking up". That hasn't happened to me (at least not yet, in seven weeks of usage).
> 
> I understand that situation may be very rare but is it the phone or the Model 3 that is "asleep"?
> 
> And I fully understand your point because, before we adjusted the settings on our phones we had a few failures of "phone as key".


Haven't noticed it lately, but once or twice I've walked up to the car and had to hang out for 5-10 seconds while the car woke up and got its act together. The phone still worked as a key, there was just a delay.

I think since I started monitoring it with Teslafi it doesn't get away with sleeping on the job as often.


----------



## Jan King

I deleted my wife's iphone off the car lock and off her phone and now my iphone has been working for 4 days. I read elsewhere that she may need her own Tesla account, or two people can not have the same phone models. We just got her an account today and will see if this works or if she can't use her phone.


----------



## GDN

Jan King said:


> I deleted my wife's iphone off the car lock and off her phone and now my iphone has been working for 4 days. I read elsewhere that she may need her own Tesla account, or two people can not have the same phone models. We just got her an account today and will see if this works or if she can't use her phone.


Interesting to see your results, but I've never heard of having two iPhones on one account having a problem. I've also heard just the opposite, you'll have more problem with 2 Tesla accounts. Several reports of this on the forums.

We've had a 3 for 6 weeks, one Tesla account and two iPhone X's paired. Only one or two times that the phones have failed to open the car. Had a problem playing music once in the car, but a car reboot fixed the problem, didn't do anything to the phone.

Hope the experiment goes well, but I would not plan on 2 Tesla accounts fixing anything, will make things more difficult.


----------



## RobOC9

Not sure if anyone else is having this issue but I thought I'd post just to be safe. So I took delivery of my Model 3 on Sunday, July 8th and I've been unable to use my phone as a key ever since. In addition, I had a touchscreen issue where the brake sensor and low washer fluid lights stayed on for approximately 30 seconds after I would start driving (this only happened intermittently).

I called Tesla support and they told me it was a firmware issue and to take the car into a service center and have the firmware updated, which I did (which resulted in getting Summon and it's amazing). So I took the car home and low and behold, I still can't use my phone as a key. I have an iPhone 7+ with the latest software update that came out today.

I call Tesla support again and the tech tells me that he isn't able to get a reading from my car's antenna and he believes the Bluetooth Low Energy antenna is not functioning properly. So I did a full system reset, deleted and reinstalled the app, everything. Turns out I have to take it back into a Service Center and hopefully have them attempt to fix it with me and my phone there in person. Another point of interest - I downloaded the Tesla app on my mom's phone and tried to use the phone as a key but to no avail.

I've read in this thread (and others) that people haven't been able to use their phone as a key, and this could be another reason why. If so, use it as an excuse to take your car into a service center, hopefully get it fixed, and get Summon at the same time.

My appointment is next week so I'll be sure to update you all with the results. And if anyone has had a similar problem (and had it fixed without going to a Service Center), please pass on the info!


----------



## PNWmisty

RobOC9 said:


> Another point of interest - I downloaded the Tesla app on my mom's phone and tried to use the phone as a key but to no avail.


Looking forward to the update. It sounds like there is something wrong with the cars Bluetooth. I only say this because two phones cannot connect. But you were able to pair them?


----------



## xnappo

Just for the record, mine worked flawlessly for two weeks, then started getting weird and unreliable, the stopped being weird and unreliable - without any change on my end. So I vote in the 'it is finicky' camp. It is the way to go, just needs more work. Galaxy S8.


----------



## PNWmisty

xnappo said:


> Just for the record, mine worked flawlessly for two weeks, then started getting weird and unreliable, the stopped being weird and unreliable - without any change on my end. Galaxy S8.


Did the change coincide with a firmware update of the car? If not, I would suspect something on the phone end, it could be as simple as a misbehaving app. that has been installed all along but just started over-flowing the BT stack, etc.

If it's on the car end, and the firmware wasn't updated, a reset should bring it back to how it was.


----------



## xnappo

No firmware change.

I am fully capable of dealing with it. Problem is it will be a disatifier to many and needs to be delt with. Some systematic debug here might be helpful to others. We should come up with a procedure to try to understand the issue. 

When it happened I was doing random things, not sure what fixed it as there is a delay.

If it starts happening again I will try to put together an information gathering and recovery procedure. Recovery is pretty easy, figuring out why is harder.


----------



## rareohs

4 months into ownership and multiple firmware updates later, BT still won't consistently work for phone calls. Music works 100% of the time. Audio for phone calls maybe 5% of the time, at best.

Super frustrating. I guess this is what you get with Tesla - an amazing product that does things no other car maker could (or would) do, but at the same time they can't nail down the most basic of things that every other car maker can do flawlessly.


----------



## Jan King

Jan King said:


> The fact is it does not work for me or my wife. It would have been nice if we were one of the lucky ones like you where it works 100% of the time. I know the key fob on my other cars worked 100% of the time. Blame the car, blame bluetooth software, blame the iphone, it does not matter who you blame, it does not work! Try using your card 100% of the time and see how you like it.


After 2 months of ownership, many and many experiments (I am a electrical and computer engineer, not a noob) , the car still locks us out daily. It seems the software can't handle two phones. A key fob is required.


----------



## GDN

Jan King said:


> After 2 months of ownership, many and many experiments (I am a electrical and computer engineer, not a noob) , the car still locks us out daily. It seems the software can't handle two phones. A key fob is required.


To be fair, I didn't go searching your posts, but can you give us the model phones you use? If Android have you taken steps to optimize the app and keep it running, etc?


----------



## Jan King

iPhone 5S and iPhone SE. Various setting changed.


----------



## PNWmisty

Jan King said:


> After 2 months of ownership, many and many experiments (I am a electrical and computer engineer, not a noob) , the car still locks us out daily. It seems the software can't handle two phones. A key fob is required.


My wife and I have 100% reliability with our Samsung S8+ and S9 so it can't be that the car can't handle two phones. On what information did you base your conclusion that the software can't handle two phones? Makes no sense.

Key fob not required (or desired). I have enough fobs to maintain with fresh batteries and keep track of. I wish all of our vehicles were on my one phone (and my wife's)!


----------



## GDN

Jan King said:


> iPhone 5S and iPhone SE. Various setting changed.


Thanks - and I so wanted to blame Android !!!

Are you able to keep the older handsets updated with the later OS's? Do you have multitasking? I'm just wondering if the phone is shutting your app down vs keeping it running in the background which is required.

There is another thread where someone has asked about how an iPhone behaves when closing the Tesla app. Bottom line is to always keep the Tesla app active, don't close it. Also, for a check, go in to settings. When you are somewhat near the car you should see at least 4 bluetooth connections to your car., that are active connections Those are critical. If they aren't staying connected, then it will make sense the issues you are seeing and having problems using the phone as a key.


----------



## Jan King

If we turn off my wife's bluetooth my iPhone works more reliably. My wife can only use the card now. This is the best solution we can find. Very sad that such a nice car has such a huge flaw. Even then the iPhone does not work all the time. Its not that we want a key fob, we just want to be able to get into the car without any software drama.


----------



## FF35

I'm getting annoyed with the bluetooth. Never had this issue in my Volt because the two were never paired.......because I had *Carplay* and only connected with the cable!

Anyhow, lets say I take a phone call. After the call ends, sometimes I can't get the music (streaming) to work even though the streaming is selected. The only way to get the streaming to work is to turn off bluetooth on my phone. However, if I turn it back on, the phone connects and cuts out the streaming. 

Related to the problem above, I'll drive home without the bluetooth on from my phone. My car is parked in the garage, which connects to the kitchen. I like to watch podcasts while making dinner and use a bluetooth speaker for the audio. When I turn the bluetooth on, the model 3 takes the audio instead of my speaker!

While I can turn off the bluetooth or go into the settings and click "disconnect," it's really annoying. Am I doing something wrong or is this how the bluetooth is supposed to work?


----------



## slacker775

You didn’t mention what kind of device you are using, but I can say Bluetooth has been flawless with my iPhone. If I’m streaming off the phone, I can get a phone call and everything resumes after I end the call. Car unlock/lock has worked every time. Zero issues at all. 

Potentially related, potentially not, my phone is the only one paired with the car, and I do not have any Bluetooth speakers, headsets, watches paired with the phone to potentially ‘compete’ for the phones attention.


----------



## FF35

iPhone 6s and my phone is the only bluetooth device paired with the car.


----------



## PNWmisty

Jan King said:


> This is the best solution we can find. Very sad that such a nice car has such a huge flaw. Even then the iPhone does not work all the time.


The iPhone 5s only has Bluetooth 4.0. Which had a lot of problems, Bluetooth 4.2 was developed to take care of most of those issues and is a lot better. Most modern phones have had 4.2 for some time now, the newer phones are all coming out with Bluetooth 5.0 which is better in a number of ways. It sounds like the problem lies with the iPhone 5s's implementation of Bluetooth or it could also be variation in the quality of the RF components.

Apple has never been known for their expertise in radio frequency technologies and the 5s in particular has a Bluetooth system that is cobbled together from various suppliers. The iPhone 8 and above offer more integration and that helps the Bluetooth be more robust. It's not a simple thing, in your 5s there is the Bluetooth chip made by Broadcom (BCM43342) which must integrate with the RF front end which includes power amplifiers, T/R switches and low noise amplifiers. The quality of the integration of these components is key to Bluetooth functionality, one component that has too much noise or cross-feedback can cause issues. So functionality can vary, even with two identical iPhones.

But it appears that you prefer to blame it on the car, which is certainly possible, but unlikely. If it's the car, you probably just need a new WiFi/Bluetooth module installed. If it's the phone (and that's where my money is at), you likely need a new phone as it's more difficult to replace those components in a phone. I say "likely need a new phone" because it's possible it's just a software problem (like an app from a third party developer that is misbehaving with the Bluetooth stack).

I know iPhones are expensive but they are also built with strict cost savings in mind. That's how they became the most profitable company in the history of the world.


----------



## xnappo

In a poll(just google it), 55% of iPhone users and 80% of Android users report an unacceptable failure rate. And this is from tech savvy people who can try things like turning off power saving modes. I am happy it works great for some of you, but this is going to be a problem for a LOT of people.

Mine has actually been working solid for two weeks now (no change on my side) for opening the door, though it did lose the audio/phone pairing earlier this week (had to reboot car).


----------



## PNWmisty

xnappo said:


> In a poll(just google it), 55% of iPhone users and 80% of Android users report an unacceptable failure rate.


You would have to be foolish to believe everything you read about Tesla on-line. It's well known that Tesla is the most shorted company in the world and the shorts write deceptive articles, troll online Tesla forums and report non-existant problems. The true rate, once people learn about certain Bluetooth and power saving settings on their phone, is much, much lower.

I believe KarenRei's Model 3 Owner's poll will be released soon and it had questions about failure rates using phones as keys. As I recall, it had one question about initial success and a followup question for those who had replaced their older phone (or perhaps just changed some settings). Granted, there will still be some failures due to misbehaving 3rd party apps (I avoid running 3rd party apps unless necessary), incorrect phone settings and possible hardware issues with the analog radio frequency side of things. But I don't think the failure rate is anywhere near where the online poll you refer to claims. Those numbers are not consistent with what I see reported here by confirmed owners but we will have a much more definitive answers when Karen releases her poll results.

I absolutely love the phone as key feature because I always bring my phone when I leave the house.


----------



## RIP_OPEC

FF35 said:


> I'm getting annoyed with the bluetooth. Never had this issue in my Volt because the two were never paired.......because I had *Carplay* and only connected with the cable!
> 
> Anyhow, lets say I take a phone call. After the call ends, sometimes I can't get the music (streaming) to work even though the streaming is selected. The only way to get the streaming to work is to turn off bluetooth on my phone. However, if I turn it back on, the phone connects and cuts out the streaming.
> 
> Related to the problem above, I'll drive home without the bluetooth on from my phone. My car is parked in the garage, which connects to the kitchen. I like to watch podcasts while making dinner and use a bluetooth speaker for the audio. When I turn the bluetooth on, the model 3 takes the audio instead of my speaker!
> 
> While I can turn off the bluetooth or go into the settings and click "disconnect," it's really annoying. Am I doing something wrong or is this how the bluetooth is supposed to work?


No issues with iPhone X, would highly recommend one if you're getting a new phone soon, as it includes a bluetooth 5 module too.


----------



## Gavyne

The iPhone of cars works great with actual iPhones  iPhone 6 Plus here and never had to wait on opening the car or the trunk. I feel bad for those with issues, but do look into your phone, the apps you have installed, and how certain apps work in the background. I had one hiccup once but found that I had an app that got stuck running in the background, it was youtube music that I was using airpods with earlier (airpods also use bluetooth). It was stuck, it should've closed once I put away my airpods but it didn't. I had to force reset the app. After I did that, everything was working fine again.


----------



## xnappo

It is a poll on TMC, didn't know if linking there is allowed.


----------



## PNWmisty

xnappo said:


> It is a poll on TMC, didn't know if linking there is allowed.


I've seen that poll. A lot of early owners also had a Model S or X and it's necessary to pen the proper car. For example, if your phone app is on Model S it won't open the doors of your Model 3! Also, anyone can join/post and take surveys at TMC. Including the shorts.

It does seem as time goes on, people are learning how to adjust their settings to keep the Tesla app active in the background. So a poll that was closed over 3 months ago is not very relevant to what's happening currently. My wife and I both had issues the first couple of days until we figured our phone settings out. Both phones have been 100% ever since.


----------



## garsh

Jan King said:


> More info on the Model 3 phone lock problem


It's already being discussed here. We don't want to become a link farm to other websites.


----------



## Gavyne

I posted this elsewhere but this might be helpful to others.

Your car checks for the proximity of the phone via bluetooth. If it can connect, it knows you're there, and it allows you to unlock and start the car. It also locks the door once you walk away as long as it can connect to your phone via blueooth. If your car is unable to connect to your phone via bluetooth, then these things don't work properly.

Things to check...

-Make sure your phone's bluetooth is on and doesn't go into sleep or battery saving mode.

-Make sure you don't have a background app hogging the bluetooth, something we know about bluetooth is that it doesn't work well when multiple apps are trying to use the bluetooth connection at the same time.

-Make sure you don't have anything on you or near you that blocks the bluetooth connection. These things include:

Microwave, it uses 2.4Ghz, same as bluetooth.

Your body, since bluetooth's radio frequency is blocked by water, and your body is made up of mostly water, you could be blocking the bluetooth connection. If you have your phone in your backpocket, try placing it in your front pocket so your body isn't in the way between the car and the phone. Or simply have the phone in your hand would work as well.

Wifi, yes unfortunately most wifi routers use 2.4Ghz and wifi & bluetooth could cause interference with each other. If you have this issue at home, then changing your wifi router's channel and channel width would help. You can also try to improve the situation by disabling your phone's wifi so it doesn't try to use wifi and bluetooth at the same time (some phones have difficulties doing that).

Metal, if you are using a metal case, container, suite case, etc.. your car will have difficulties connecting via bluetooth to your phone.

==

All in all, key to fixing the phone key issue is to solve the bluetooth issues.


----------



## FF35

How about a keyfob? Problem solved.


----------



## PNWmisty

FF35 said:


> How about a keyfob? Problem solved.


Key fobs introduce their own problems. I actually prefer the phone solution. Works great for me!


----------



## ahagge

PNWmisty said:


> Key fobs introduce their own problems. I actually prefer the phone solution. Works great for me!


So don't buy a fob. But don't dismiss the issues that others are having just because your solution is working for you. Obviously there are enough issues with enough people to warrant an alternative solution from Tesla (namely a keyfob). It would be an extra-cost, after-purchase option, so it would have no impact to you.


----------



## PNWmisty

ahagge said:


> Obviously there are enough issues with enough people to warrant an alternative solution from Tesla (namely a keyfob). It would be an extra-cost, after-purchase option, so it would have no impact to you.


They already offer an alternative solution, the key card (of which Tesla supplies 2 with every car and spares/replacements are only a few bucks).
Compare that to the cost of a key fob which, even high volume manufacturers often charge hundreds of dollars for. Tesla might have to charge more due to low volume because I assume people who have a modern phone that works as well as mine are not going to pay hundreds of dollars more for a redundant item. So with such low volume the price would be even more. If I recall, a replacement fob for my Volvo was ~$300 or more. You could buy a fully functional cell phone for that price and wouldn't have to pull it out and push a button to open your car. Or are you suggesting that Tesla offers an auxiliary proximity key fob that works much as the current phone as key works?

I am not aware of any other manufacturer that offers three different methods for unlocking a car. Tesla is a relatively small manufacturer and it costs time and money to develop a key fob as an additional accessory. And how well do you think it would be accepted that Tesla charges hundreds of dollars for something that comes with every other car? Certainly, no one that has a fully functional phone is going to want that!


----------



## garsh

PNWmisty said:


> They already offer an alternative solution, the key card


Not as convenient as a keyfob, since you can't leave it in your pocket.


> Tesla is a relatively small manufacturer and it costs time and money to develop a key fob as an additional accessory.


It's a commoditized technology at this point, so the costs shouldn't be too high. But yes, there will be a cost associated with it.


----------



## PNWmisty

garsh said:


> Not as convenient as a keyfob, since you can't leave it in your pocket.


True and even less convenient than a phone that sends out proper Bluetooth signals. Because my Model 3 makes me finally feel free of keys and bulky key fobs with replaceable batteries. I just jump in and go. And climb out and leave. I guess if my phone didn't have proper Bluetooth, I would buy one that did. All I carry around these days are a single house key. Unless I go to the cabin, then I grab a single cabin key. No more bulky key chains with fobs dangling around.

Maybe I should get Bluetooth locks for my house and cabin so everything is on my phone (except for my legacy cars/motorcycles whose key fobs can live by the back door). I just remembered its time to stock up on more key fob batteries. Now which type do the various ones take?


----------



## NEO

Android Pie is out of beta for the Pixel. It was just sent to me as my monthly update. Hopefully it fixes some of these connection problems


----------



## freerogers

NEO said:


> Android Pie is out of beta for the Pixel. It was just sent to me as my monthly update. Hopefully it fixes some of these connection problems


I've been running the beta version for the last week, and I just updated to the official one today. Prior to version 9 I had problems no matter what I tried. Since version 9, I have not had to turn off and on Bluetooth or Airplane mode once, and it has worked flawlessly. Hope it's the same for you!


----------



## Jan King

Pretty much everyday our iPhones fail to work reliably with the car. Nothing has worked to improve it. We are stuck using the keycard all the time now. Was considering buying a new phone, but I don't have confidence it will work any better as both our phones are less than a year old. Clearly there are some car software issues, as frequently the car would unlock the doors with the iPhone, but then require the key card to drive. *The unreliable phone key is the worst thing about the model 3.*


----------



## pyrotech6

Jan King said:


> Pretty much everyday our iPhones fail to work reliably with the car. Nothing has worked to improve it. We are stuck using the keycard all the time now. Was considering buying a new phone, but I don't have confidence it will work any better as both our phones are less than a year old. Clearly there are some car software issues, as frequently the car would unlock the doors with the iPhone, but then require the key card to drive. *The unreliable phone key is the worst thing about the model 3.*


Wow. That is the complete opposite of my experiences. I have owned the car for 2 months now and never once have I had to use the keycard. Mine, and my wifes, phone has worked flawlessly 100% of the time. It sounds like something is wrong with your phone or your car. I would have to tweak your quote a little...*The phone key is the BEST thing about the model 3.*


----------



## PNWmisty

pyrotech6 said:


> I have owned the car for 2 months now and never once have I had to use the keycard. Mine, and my wifes, phone has worked flawlessly 100% of the time. It sounds like something is wrong with your phone or your car. I would have to tweak your quote a little...*The phone key is the BEST thing about the model 3.*


I agree, I think the reason some people's phones don't work as keys is they either have an older phone with flakey Bluetooth or their phone is newer and adheres to Bluetooth specs but they have loaded apps that don't. This could corrupt the Bluetooth stack in the phone and make it inoperable as a key. Also, battery saving settings need to be configured such that Bluetooth is not put to sleep or only be active periodically.

I only load third-party apps on my phone from trusted developers and that are absolutely necessary.


----------



## Jan King

pyrotech6 said:


> Wow. That is the complete opposite of my experiences. I have owned the car for 2 months now and never once have I had to use the keycard. Mine, and my wifes, phone has worked flawlessly 100% of the time. It sounds like something is wrong with your phone or your car. I would have to tweak your quote a little...*The phone key is the BEST thing about the model 3.*


Which phones do you have?


----------



## PNWmisty

Jan King said:


> Which phones do you have?


My wife and I have a Samsung S9 and a Samsung S8+. Both work every time.


----------



## pyrotech6

Jan King said:


> Which phones do you have?


iPhone 7 plus for me. 
iPhone 7 for my wife.


----------



## xnappo

Since they made the app a persistent notification in Android, it has been 100% reliable for me.


----------



## kort677

Using Iphone 6s plus, and the blue tooth is wonky! sometimes it works fine, sometimes it will allow entry but not start the car and sometimes it just doesn't work. I keep a key card in the wallet and one inside the car


----------



## kort677

ahagge said:


> So don't buy a fob. But don't dismiss the issues that others are having just because your solution is working for you. Obviously there are enough issues with enough people to warrant an alternative solution from Tesla (namely a keyfob). It would be an extra-cost, after-purchase option, so it would have no impact to you.


re key fob, I've never had any problems with my Model S's using the keyfob system


----------



## PNWmisty

xnappo said:


> Since they made the app a persistent notification in Android, it has been 100% reliable for me.


That's great! But who are "they"? I recall you were one of the owners having real problems with your phone working reliably as a key. What exactly changed for you?


----------



## garsh

PNWmisty said:


> That's great! But who are "they"?


Tesla. He's talking about the (new) option in the Tesla app to constantly display a "Phone Key Status" notification.


----------



## PNWmisty

garsh said:


> Tesla. He's talking about the (new) option in the Tesla app to constantly display a "Phone Key Status" notification.


I just updated my app but I don't see that option anywhere.

Mine works as key all the time anyway so maybe it's an iPhone only fix?


----------



## garsh

PNWmisty said:


> Mine works as key all the time anyway so maybe it's an iPhone only fix?


Nope, it's available on Android.

Settings App -> Apps & Notifications -> App info -> Tesla -> App Notifications
Under "Categories", there is "Notifications" and "Phone Key Status".
"Phone Key Status" leaves a notification always present in the notification bar, saying whether you are connected to the car or not, and providing controls to unlock and pop trunks when you are connected.


----------



## Ken123

I have a Samsung S5. Don't have any problems with the phone key but couple of weeks back, the Bluetooth audio/phone connection stopped working, The phone doesn't connect to the bluetooth for audio/phone but car unlocks when the phone comes close to the car.
Some Telsa Model 3 update in last 2-3 weeks broke this fucntionality.


----------



## slarty

Mine stays connected fine (iPhone 7+/iOS12), but I did have an issue where I declined an incoming call, and then the audio cut out, and just made faint clicking/buzzing sounds. This was for everything from the car, not just bluetooth. To fix it I had to reboot the touchscreen.


----------



## Chriseckman

I've got a Google Pixel and LG V20 and even if the apps running as system notifications and unoptimized for the battery it doesn't work to unlock the car about 70% of the time. Frustratingly though is my bedroom and kitchen is close to my parked car outside and I'll notice door mirrors unfolded consistently. Luckily I live in a safe neighborhood, but having the car randomly unlock from inside my house isn't great.


----------



## Rich M

Chriseckman said:


> I've got a Google Pixel and LG V20 and even if the apps running as system notifications and unoptimized for the battery it doesn't work to unlock the car about 70% of the time. Frustratingly though is my bedroom and kitchen is close to my parked car outside and I'll notice door mirrors unfolded consistently. Luckily I live in a safe neighborhood, but having the car randomly unlock from inside my house isn't great.


When you walk away from the car and it locks/beeps/folds the mirrors, it should not be unlocking at all until someone physically touches a door handle or the trunk button, no matter how close the phone is.


----------



## PaulS

Jan King said:


> Pretty much everyday our iPhones fail to work reliably with the car. Nothing has worked to improve it. We are stuck using the keycard all the time now. Was considering buying a new phone, but I don't have confidence it will work any better as both our phones are less than a year old. Clearly there are some car software issues, as frequently the car would unlock the doors with the iPhone, but then require the key card to drive. *The unreliable phone key is the worst thing about the model 3.*


This is exactly my experience. I have an iPhone 6, but updated to iOS 12. Very frustrating.


----------



## Dan Burnett

So, picked up my model 3 a week ago and phone key worked fine as well app allowing access to charge status, heat on etc. Then, on Sunday phone key stopped working as well as access to car info. clicking on app opens only a screen of tutorial video's and no access to car. If you X out the tutorials, you end with a blank screen. Service dept has no idea so far and say they are working on it..... I have an iphone 8 and wife an iphone 6. Both disconnected at same time.
Any ideas?


----------



## Rich M

Dan Burnett said:


> Any ideas?


uninstall then reinstall apps. Check in car settings that 'allow mobile access' is still turned on?


----------



## PNWmisty

garsh said:


> Nope, it's available on Android.
> 
> Settings App -> Apps & Notifications -> App info -> Tesla -> App Notifications
> Under "Categories", there is "Notifications" and "Phone Key Status".
> "Phone Key Status" leaves a notification always present in the notification bar, saying whether you are connected to the car or not, and providing controls to unlock and pop trunks when you are connected.


Yep, you're right, that worked. Thank you. But I had to turn it off because I don't like persistent notifications (I always have the actual Tesla app open at all times so it's just as easy to bring that up).


----------



## Dan Burnett

Rich M said:


> uninstall then reinstall apps. Check in car settings that 'allow mobile access' is still turned on?


Thanks, yes, I have tried reinstalling apps, have checked the mobile access feature and still no luck. The bluetooth works for music and phone so that isn't the issue. It is like the app doesn't know who I am even though in my account on line, the car is identified.


----------



## Plenty

Generally, my BT unlocks and starts the car but for some reason my phone won't maintain the media and phone call capabilities in the pairing setting on the phone. O can sit in the car and manually open the BT setting on the phone and turn on the switches that allow me to play music and make phone calls but I'll have to go through the manual process the next time I get in the car, also.


----------



## Dan Burnett

24 hr tech service resolved my problem. When we picked up car, sales guy set up both our phones using same email address and password. This apparently confused car and eventually booted us both out. Separate phones need separate accounts. Once set up, you need to contact tech to allow 2nd account to be merged with car.


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## John Slaby

Well, I just recently upgraded my phone from the original Pixel to the Pixel 3 XL and what a difference! I can now walk up to the passenger side door and open it when locked (couldn't do that previously). Also, I no longer need to take the phone out of my pocket (as a lefty, I usually keep it in my left pocket). Previously, I could open the driver's side door with the phone in my pocket, but I had to take it out and put it in the console to put the car in drive. With the Pixel, I would periodically need to put the phone in/out of airplane mode to reset the bluetooth. So far, it has not happened with the Pixel 3. It is now acting like the key fob replacement it was intended to be. Really great!


----------



## Rick Steinwand

LucyferSam said:


> Something to try rather than manually logging in is turning bluetooth on and off. Seems to work for me every time and is faster, though still a bit annoying to have to do.


Toggling airplane mode on/off fixes a lot of stuff too and might be easier.


----------



## AndyN

I think I've experienced THE 'ah-ha' moment on this. Yesterday my Moto G5+ updated from Android Nougat to Oreo (8.1). OMG. Model 3 bluetooth key WORKS now. Reliably. Even without the Tesla app running. Now it's only been 24 hours or so, but so far so good!


----------



## GDN

AndyN said:


> I think I've experienced THE 'ah-ha' moment on this. Yesterday my Moto G5+ updated from Android Nougat to Oreo (8.1). OMG. Model 3 bluetooth key WORKS now. Reliably. Even without the Tesla app running. Now it's only been 24 hours or so, but so far so good!


Thank you for posting this. I've never wanted this to be one brand of phone vs another or phone vs car, but I think this continues to definitely say that the car is doing it's think, but it truly is the phone and software and BT implementation that gives so many people a bad experience with the Phone/BT as a key. Tesla has done their part of the implementation. It's lax and cheap standards on most of the phones that cause the problem. With time, I hope this improves so that everyone has a pleasant working experience.


----------



## Jim Brown

Has anybody had this happen? I have a Samsung Galaxy S8+. I've had my Model 3 for almost a month. I can open the door pretty regularly. Once in a while I have to try 2 or 3 times. But if I try to play music from my phone, or heaven forbid, answer a phone call, forget it. I have noticed the Bluetooth symbol in the upper right corner of my car screen flickering on and off. Usually it's on and off about 50/50. But occasionally it's mostly off. I've tried the screen reset a few times. I've tried pairing and unpairing my phone numerous times. Nothing seems to work. I love my car. But this is very annoying. Especially trying to answer a phone call. If somebody calls while the Bluetooth is on, everything is wonderful. Then it flickers off and I have to pick up my phone. Back on and I hear them through my car speakers again. Back and forth. Back and forth. This is making me crazy. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## Marcie Apelt

If I am on a phone call and then get into my car, it transfers to the Tesla bluetooth, but there is no audio. If I change it back to the phone, I can hear the call again. This is not intermittent. Happens every time. If I hang up and start the call from the car, it works fine. Anyone have any advice?


----------



## gmtom1

I have a Samsung Note 9 that I use as my Model 3 key as well as have paired for media playback. I know BT connections are finicky, but I've had increasing issues with my Model 3, especially with the latest update and/or since I've had my Galaxy watch.

First off, the car will not unlock if my Note 9's screen is off and the device is locked. I'm standing right next to the car and it will not open until I turn on my Note 9 screen and (sometimes) unlock the device.

Once I'm inside the car, the Note 9 will randomly disconnect from BT and only through a combination of toggling BT off/on, re-scanning/connecting on my Note 9 and connecting (via BT screen in car) will it re-connect in the same driving session. If I leave it disconnected, about half the time it will reconnect like normal the next time I get in the car. The BT media/phone disconnects in car have no impact on my ability to drive and the car lock when I get out.

I've had my 3 for about 4 months, but the BT/phone key issues have gotten much worse in the last month. I've tried all the various tips for Android phone key use (making sure the Tesla app isn't put to sleep, granting all permissions). I do notice that the BT media/phone connection tends to be more stable if I don't have my Galaxy watch on. 

I'm hoping someone else out there has a Note 9 and a Galaxy watch and can comment if they have any issues.


----------



## Jim Brown

Marcie Apelt said:


> If I am on a phone call and then get into my car, it transfers to the Tesla bluetooth, but there is no audio. If I change it back to the phone, I can hear the call again. This is not intermittent. Happens every time. If I hang up and start the call from the car, it works fine. Anyone have any advice?


Is the Bluetooth icon in the upper right corner of the screen in your car on all the time? Does it flicker on and off? That's my problem. I'm trying to find out if this is just me. Or if anybody else is having this same problem. When my Bluetooth icon is on, everything works wonderful. But it continuously flickers on and off. On for about 15 or 20 seconds. Then off. Back on. Then off again. At one point I thought i had it fixed. It was on continuously for about 30 minutes. But now it's on and off again. I can't play music from my phone. And I can't answer phone calls in the car.


----------



## mswlogo

GDN said:


> Thank you for posting this. I've never wanted this to be one brand of phone vs another or phone vs car, but I think this continues to definitely say that the car is doing it's think, but it truly is the phone and software and BT implementation that gives so many people a bad experience with the Phone/BT as a key. Tesla has done their part of the implementation. It's lax and cheap standards on most of the phones that cause the problem. With time, I hope this improves so that everyone has a pleasant working experience.


No it's not lax standards. It's Android. Every version of Android from every vender is different. iPhones have way less issues with BT and is about 7 years ahead. It was only until recently Samsung got BT LE (needed for unlocking) working correctly. iPhones have been doing BT LE correctly since the iPhone 4s (2012 I believe) !!


----------



## PNWmisty

mswlogo said:


> No it's not lax standards. It's Android. Every version of Android from every vender is different.


Ummm, then it's not Android, it's the manufacturer. Let's be logical about this. If every manufacturer of Android phones has their own version of Android, and some work perfectly, 100%, and others don't, then it's not Android that's the problem. It's the implementation by those manufacturers who don't have 100% functionality.



> iPhones have way less issues with BT and is about 7 years ahead. It was only until recently Samsung got BT LE (needed for unlocking) working correctly.


That's a nice claim but it's not supported by observation. iPhones have notoriously weak BT radio performance in challenging environments (relative to other flagship handsets) and I suspect that explains some of the instances of them failing to be 100% reliable. They also have pretty aggressive battery saving routines and they are not nearly as customizable as those on Android. My wife and I took delivery of our first Model 3 in mid-May and both our Samsung S8+ and S9 worked 100% from May until now. That's through numerous Model 3 firmware upgrades and different versions of the Model 3 app. So it's pretty hard to blame all Android or Tesla themselves. I suppose you could assume that Samsung is doing BT incorrectly but Tesla programmed their system to work with it but there is no evidence of that since some users with different varieties of Android also have 100% functionality and so do some iPhone users.



> iPhones have been doing BT LE correctly since the iPhone 4s (2012 I believe) !!


You will notice by reading Model 3 forums that there are plenty of examples of iPhones having inconsistent unlocking functionality. I suppose that's Androids fault? Or is it Tesla's fault and Samsung is so skilled they just programmed around the flaws in Tesla's software? 

If one applies logical thinking to the known information at hand, your comments can't be reconciled with reality.


----------



## SimonMatthews

Our Model 3 worked with my wife's Nexus 5, which is a model first introduced in 2013.


----------



## mswlogo

PNWmisty said:


> Ummm, then it's not Android, it's the manufacturer. Let's be logical about this. If every manufacturer of Android phones has their own version of Android, and some work perfectly, 100%, and others don't, then it's not Android that's the problem. It's the implementation by those manufacturers who don't have 100% functionality.


You can call it what ever you like. And yeah technically you're right. It's because manufacturers are allowed to twiddle Android to their liking. In my opinion there is only one true Android that obeys the Android docs 100% and that's on Pixels. Android also releases features and bugs fixes most promptly along with images to debug with and emulate with are based on Pixels images as well. Every other Android phone is some derivative of Android and you might wait years for it to catch up with what is "current". It might work for your needs it might not. Android 8.0 (now 18 months old) is still only 6% of all Android devices (and that still means across 50 manufactures tweaked version). I just call the whole mess "Android". Not all Android 8.0 phones are the same, even when it comes to really basic functionality.

It's not all Android's fault some is Tesla's. But it's a nightmare supporting Android. Absolute nightmare. I think if you looked at the stats there are way more problems with Android phones than iPhones.


----------



## justaute

Picked up my White TM3 AWD 4 days ago. Have been experiencing issues with phone/bluetooth integration. I'm using an Essential PH-1 and it has the latest Android OS. I frequently cannot make phone calls in that I can't hear the other party, nor can that party hear me; however, when I switch the sound to my phone's speaker, it seems to work fine. 

Anyone has similar experience? Thanks.


----------



## Jim Brown

justaute said:


> Picked up my White TM3 AWD 4 days ago. Have been experiencing issues with phone/bluetooth integration. I'm using an Essential PH-1 and it has the latest Android OS. I frequently cannot make phone calls in that I can't hear the other party, nor can that party hear me; however, when I switch the sound to my phone's speaker, it seems to work fine.
> 
> Anyone has similar experience? Thanks.


Check the Bluetooth icon in the top right corner of your car monitor. Does it flicker on and off? That's what's been happening to me. And it's been making me nuts. I can't make or receive calls while I'm in the car, or play music from my phone through the car stereo. I have hardly any trouble at all using my phone as the key.


----------



## justaute

Jim Brown said:


> Check the Bluetooth icon in the top right corner of your car monitor. Does it flicker on and off? That's what's been happening to me. And it's been making me nuts. I can't make or receive calls while I'm in the car, or play music from my phone through the car stereo. I have hardly any trouble at all using my phone as the key.


Doesn't seem to be flashing.


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## sraatc17

I've got a similar problem, where my phone as key has worked 100% of the time since I got my car 3 weeks ago, but it seams like very frequently my s8 does not connect for calls or media at all. I don't notice that it's connected and then disconnects, just eventually I see that it isn't connected at all more than half of the time. When I tap the icon my phone is still there and when I press connect it does, but it doesn't seem to want to do it on its own.


----------



## PNWmisty

sraatc17 said:


> I've got a similar problem, where my phone as key has worked 100% of the time since I got my car 3 weeks ago, but it seams like very frequently my s8 does not connect for calls or media at all.


I don't use my S8+ for media but it has connected 100% of the time for use as a hands free phone. You might need to change a configuration setting. Which one is beyond my pay grade.


----------



## mxw

I have a Model 3 and an Essential PH-1 phone and they do not work together for phone calls (as is pointed out earlier). Opening the doors work, I believe audio will play, phone calls can be answered but neither party can hear the other. Also worth noting is a short burst of "static" played over the car's audio system, when the call is "answered".


----------



## justaute

mxw said:


> I have a Model 3 and an Essential PH-1 phone and they do not work together for phone calls (as is pointed out earlier). Opening the doors work, I believe audio will play, phone calls can be answered but neither party can hear the other. Also worth noting is a short burst of "static" played over the car's audio system, when the call is "answered".


Yup...mirrors my experience. Love my Essential.


----------



## skrmusic

PNWmisty said:


> I don't use my S8+ for media but it has connected 100% of the time for use as a hands free phone. You might need to change a configuration setting. Which one is beyond my pay grade.


Hey Jim, have you solved your intermittent bluetooth issue? I have BT issues where it is stuck in "initializing" cycle so the icon is grayed on the screen.


----------



## Jim Brown

skrmusic said:


> Hey Jim, have you solved your intermittent bluetooth issue? I have BT issues where it is stuck in "initializing" cycle so the icon is grayed on the screen.


No. I haven't figured it out yet. My wife and I have the same phones (Samsung Galaxy S8+). She says her phone works fine in the car. I sat down and compared each phone side by side to see how they are configured for Bluetooth. I can't find any difference. I was hoping to figure this out myself. I'm just hard headed. But it seems I may have to call somebody for help. It's gotta be something silly that I'm just not seeing.

My son has an iPhone 8. We connected it to the car to play music and everything worked fine. A few days later, I was sitting in a parking lot waiting, and decided to play around with the Bluetooth to try to get it to work. I decided to delete my son's phone just to see what would happen. All of a sudden, my phone connected, the Bluetooth symbol lit up, and stayed on. No flicker. I sat there for over 30 minutes playing the music I have stored on my phone and making phone calls through the car, one after the other with no problem. I thought maybe his phone was interfering somehow and that now everything was good. I was happy and didn't even think about it the rest of the day. The next morning I was right back to having problems and it's been that way ever since.

When I get in the car, I have no difficulty using the phone as my key. Opens 99% of the time on the first try. I can use the phone app without any difficulty. I have tried deleting and re-pairing my phone. I have tried re-booting the screen. I think I have touched all the bases (a few times each), but I can't get it to work. The Bluetooth icon in the upper right corner of the screen comes on for about 30 seconds or so. Then goes gray. And it just cycles on and off. I don't know what happened that one time while it was working. But I haven't been able to get it to work consistently since.

If ANYBODY has ANY suggestions, I'm all ears. I'll try anything. It really makes me nuts when somebody calls me while I'm in the car and the call keeps cycling back and forth through my phone, and then through the car. Phone -> Car -> Phone -> Car -> Phone -> Car ...

Otherwise, I'm gonna have to get professional help ...

For the Bluetooth connection.


----------



## JML

sraatc17 said:


> I've got a similar problem, where my phone as key has worked 100% of the time since I got my car 3 weeks ago, but it seams like very frequently my s8 does not connect for calls or media at all. I don't notice that it's connected and then disconnects, just eventually I see that it isn't connected at all more than half of the time. When I tap the icon my phone is still there and when I press connect it does, but it doesn't seem to want to do it on its own.





PNWmisty said:


> I don't use my S8+ for media but it has connected 100% of the time for use as a hands free phone. You might need to change a configuration setting. Which one is beyond my pay grade.


I have an S8 and it is also does not connect reliably. If I don't do anything it will connect for calendar and contact sharing. Sometimes it will connect for calls, and rarely it will connect for media. To check this, go to bluetooth settings on the phone (long press the bluetooth icon in the pull down menu on the phone). Tap the gear by your Model 3, and you should see that your phone can connect for two or three things. I often have to tap the media slider several times to get the phone to connect for media. I also have this problem with bluetooth headsets, so I don't think it is just the Tesla, but rather the phone. Once I finally get the phone connected for media, it will almost always play without a problem.

I have a different problem with calls, which I also have with bluetooth headsets. When bluetooth is connected and I answer a call, the audio frequently goes to the phone instead of the bluetooth device. With a headset it is easy enough to toggle the audio to the phone and back to the bluetooth, and then it works fine. In the car that is a problem.

Anyway, I hope Android 9 for the S8 fixes some of these problems.


----------



## Jim Brown

My phone works reliably 100% of the time with any other Bluetooth device i have ever connected to it. Just not with my Tesla.


----------



## Jorden

Mine also started connecting and disconnecting every 10 or so seconds. Really a PIA. Was working flawlessly for 6 months before that.


----------



## Bokonon

Just adding a data point as another Samsung Galaxy S8 owner:

Similar experience here. Phone as key has always worked (close to 100% of the time), but the phone's media connection is spotty for some reason. Often times the phone doesn't show up as a connected media device, and I have to re-add it to stream music or sync my calendar. Other times, it just shows up and works as expected. 

The last time I tried to stream a podcast (on 39.7, I think?) the audio would occasionally stall out after something like 8 minutes, and playback would pause on my device. To fix it, I would have to cycle Bluetooth on the phone, restart the audio, and advance to where I had left off. (Maybe they've fixed that bug since then? I'll have to try it out sometime...) 

As for phone calls, I don't make or receive many of them while driving, but they have all connected without issue (except when I try to transfer an in-progress call from my phone to the car).


----------



## ricarmz

SoFlaModel3 said:


> Ok final follow up since I'm talking to myself anyway
> 
> It's a known issue for Tesla with iOS 11.
> 
> They have a fix coming but the workaround is to disable contact sync on your iPhone.


I just posted my solution: See Phone Connectivity and Bluetooth Solution - FINALLY (Software and Firmware)

Let me know if this works.


----------



## garsh

ricarmz said:


> I just posted my solution: See Phone Connectivity and Bluetooth Solution - FINALLY (Software and Firmware)
> 
> Let me know if this works.


https://teslaownersonline.com/threads/phone-connectivity-and-bluetooth-solution-finally.10880/


----------



## SoFlaModel3

ricarmz said:


> I just posted my solution: See Phone Connectivity and Bluetooth Solution - FINALLY (Software and Firmware)
> 
> Let me know if this works.


I actually haven't had any phone issues in a very long time


----------



## justaute

Jim Brown said:


> My phone works reliably 100% of the time with any other Bluetooth device i have ever connected to it. Just not with my Tesla.


Exactly.


----------



## justaute

Had two incoming calls during my drive today, but could not hear the callers (until I switched to phone speaker) at all. Car showed connection to the phone. I switched on/off the airplane mode -- to no avail. This is ridiculous.


----------



## JML

Jim Brown said:


> My phone works reliably 100% of the time with any other Bluetooth device i have ever connected to it. Just not with my Tesla.


My phone (Samsung S8) used to work reliably with bluetooth 100% of the time until an update in September or October.. Then it started showing two new problems:


justaute said:


> Had two incoming calls during my drive today, but could not hear the callers (until I switched to phone speaker) at all. Car showed connection to the phone. I switched on/off the airplane mode -- to no avail. This is ridiculous.


This is first. When a bluetooth device is connected, be it the Tesla, a headset, or whatever, and I answer a call, the audio is not directed to the bluetooth. It works perfectly if I make a call, and it works once I click the phone to send audio to the bluetooth.

The second problem is that when a turn on a bluetooth device and it connects to the phone, it doesn't always connect media audio automatically. I've not been able to figure out any pattern as to why it works sometimes and not others.

On top of that, the Model 3 definitely has bluetooth issues. Even with the wonky bluetooth on the S8, it will connect quickly and reliably (just not always with media audio) to headsets, the $100 Kenwood in my other car, etc. It does not connect quickly and reliable to the Model 3. If I'm listening to Slacker, the phone will be connected by the end of my drive, but I don't want to get in the car and wait 5-10 minutes for the phone and the car to sort out their problems.

I use bluetooth daily, and it used to be really good on the S8, so I was very aware of when it started sucking. Some days I get so frustrated with the Tesla bluetooth that I'm tempted to install the bluetooth FM transmitter I used to use in my truck (before the Kenwood).


----------



## SimonMatthews

JML said:


> The second problem is that when a turn on a bluetooth device and it connects to the phone, it doesn't always connect media audio automatically. I've not been able to figure out any pattern as to why it works sometimes and not others.


I had never seen this behaviour until recently when it happened on connection my phone (LG G5) to my Nissan Leaf. It's never happened with my Tesla.


----------



## JML

Hopefully some good news for people with the Samsung S8, S8+, and Note 8. A few days ago I received the official Android 9/Pie beta, and bluetooth seems to be better. Or at least, my problem of media audio (now just called audio) failing to connect has not reappeared in the car or with my headsets. Additionally the phone key seems to be working better. Or rather, the few times since then I've gone to the car and pulled the handle, it has unlocked within five seconds, and without having to wake my phone.

Bluetooth connection within the car is still very slow, but once connected it works fine. If I do nothing, it seems to connect within a minute or two, so I've still been long pressing the bluetooth symbol in the car, and telling it to connect to my phone. This cuts it down to maybe 30 seconds.

The final Android 9 update for the Samsung 8 series should be out in February or March. These are some popular phones, so I hope it means better interaction with the Model 3 for lots of people.

Finally, starting in Android 8.1, but for the first time available on the Samsung 8 series, native reporting of bluetooth battery level is supported. Of course this has been on iOS for some time. I really think Teslas should report their battery state of charge this way.


----------



## PNWmisty

JML said:


> Hopefully some good news for people with the Samsung S8, S8+, and Note 8. A few days ago I received the official Android 9/Pie beta, and bluetooth seems to be better. Or at least, my problem of media audio (now just called audio) failing to connect has not reappeared in the car or with my headsets. Additionally the phone key seems to be working better. Or rather, the few times since then I've gone to the car and pulled the handle, it has unlocked within five seconds, and without having to wake my phone.


But Android 8 on the Samsung S8+ unlocks without having to wake the phone and without any delay. I would be very dissatisfied if there was any delay to unlock (let alone 5 seconds).



> Finally, starting in Android 8.1, but for the first time available on the Samsung 8 series, native reporting of bluetooth battery level is supported. Of course this has been on iOS for some time. I really think Teslas should report their battery state of charge this way.


I don't know why anyone would even want to go into their Bluetooth menu, let alone use it to determine your batteries state of charge (the Tesla app seems more convenient and easier to use for that purpose). What am I missing?


----------



## justaute

Still no luck with my Essential PH-1 phone. 
- works 100% as phone-key
- BT does connect, but cannot use the phone. When first answering an incoming call, there's a short burst of static "noise" over the TM3 speakers, but I am not able to hear, nor can the caller hear me.
- my phone connects with every other BT device I own, plus my two previous vehicles (Acura MDX & Bimmer 3-series).
- phone is on Android 9 and, besides Pixel phones, mine likely has the most pure Android OS.
- phone has BT 5.0.

sigh...would hate to have to get a new phone just because Tesla's incompetence.


----------



## PNWmisty

justaute said:


> sigh...would hate to have to get a new phone just because Tesla's incompetence.


Most people's Android phones use Tesla's Bluetooth features just fine so I wouldn't jump to conclusions as to exactly where the problem lies.


----------



## justaute

PNWmisty said:


> Most people's Android phones use Tesla's Bluetooth features just fine so I wouldn't jump to conclusions as to exactly where the problem lies.


Perhaps you are correct. That said, plenty of Android phones have problems -- whether it's "most", it's up to debate. Plus, as mentioned, my phone works with each and every BT device I have encountered, as many others do.


----------



## sraatc17

I previously reported that getting rid of any characters in my contacts solved my issues of my s8 not connecting when I got in my car. It did get better bit after a few days I noticed the issue returning. The next thing that I tried was deleting my wife's iPhone from the car, and I haven't had a problem since then. My s8 connects every single time now.


----------



## justaute

sraatc17 said:


> I previously reported that getting rid of any characters in my contacts solved my issues of my s8 not connecting when I got in my car. It did get better bit after a few days I noticed the issue returning. The next thing that I tried was deleting my wife's iPhone from the car, and I haven't had a problem since then. My s8 connects every single time now.


Appreciate the update. I "deleted" my wife, but still didn't work.  In all seriousness, my Essential is the only BT phone connected to my car.


----------



## JML

PNWmisty said:


> But Android 8 on the Samsung S8+ unlocks without having to wake the phone and without any delay. I would be very dissatisfied if there was any delay to unlock (let alone 5 seconds).


I wish mine was as good as yours. Today for example, I went into the garage and the car opened immediately. I closed the door, and then shoveled snow for 10 minutes. Then I came back to the car, pulled the handle, and got the "Tap Key..." screen. I held the door handle for probably 15 seconds, and then I heard the clunk and such of the car waking up. I reset and pulled the handle again and the door opened. No idea why it was so perfect one instance, and a few minutes later it was slow.



PNWmisty said:


> I don't know why anyone would even want to go into their Bluetooth menu, let alone use it to determine your batteries state of charge (the Tesla app seems more convenient and easier to use for that purpose). What am I missing?


The point is just a silly easter egg. Some phones will show bluetooth battery level in the status bar, which is even better. Showing your airpod battery level in the status bar? Useful. Showing the Tesla battery level in the status bar? Entertains me as much as the fart simulator.


----------



## PNWmisty

JML said:


> Then I came back to the car, pulled the handle, and got the "Tap Key..." screen. I held the door handle for probably 15 seconds, and then I heard the clunk and such of the car waking up. I reset and pulled the handle again and the door opened. No idea why it was so perfect one instance, and a few minutes later it was slow.


If the screen says "Use Key Car" it means the car is looking for a Bluetooth signal but doesn't see it.

It could be the BT signal is transmitting from your phone but is blocked (BT is largely line of sight). If that's not it, your phones BT radio is probably not transmitting for whatever reason. While there is a small chance it's a hardware issue with your phone, this really sounds like a software issue, perhaps with another app on your phone that doesn't play nice with your phones BT. My wife and I have minimal other apps that use BT on our phones which probably explains our 100% functionality. Our phones do have whatever is necessary to use Samsung ear IconX (BT earphones) but we don't have other 3rd party apps that might not comply with Android BT.

I hope this helps other owners clean up their phones or do whatever it takes to get 100% BT functionality because it really is nice not to have to bother with a key fob or the card.


----------



## PNWmisty

justaute said:


> Perhaps you are correct. That said, plenty of Android phones have problems -- whether it's "most", it's up to debate. Plus, as mentioned, my phone works with each and every BT device I have encountered, as many others do.


I've been analyzing these forums for a long time and it's my strong impression that the vast majority of Model 3 Android users don't have any "BT as key" issues (beyond the occasional blocked BT signal from the phone being behind something in their purse, etc). Obviously, this is just an observation, not a scientific fact, but I would be very surprised if it were not true. As usual, it's the "squeaky wheel" we hear, not the well-greased one.

The fact that a phone works with other BT apps is not all that meaningful in terms of "BT as key" functionality because this is a very intensive use of BT that involves much more than just transferring audio to a headset or other basic audio BT uses. I think for security reasons there are strict timing checks involved in the BT "handshake" as well as encryption and probably other complexities I don't know about. So, if your phone streams BT audio with other apps but doesn't reliably function as a BT key, that doesn't really surprise me. It's not a sign that the car has a bug, I still think it's likely software on your phone. If the car had flaky BT, I don't think so many people would have such reliable functionality using a wide variety of phones. The difference comes down to a phones configuration or the software loaded on it.


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## justaute

PNWmisty said:


> I've been analyzing these forums for a long time and it's my strong impression that the vast majority of Model 3 Android users don't have any "BT as key" issues (beyond the occasional blocked BT signal from the phone being behind something in their purse, etc). Obviously, this is just an observation, not a scientific fact, but I would be very surprised if it were not true. As usual, it's the "squeaky wheel" we hear, not the well-greased one.
> 
> The fact that a phone works with other BT apps is not all that meaningful in terms of "BT as key" functionality because this is a very intensive use of BT that involves much more than just transferring audio to a headset or other basic audio BT uses. I think for security reasons there are strict timing checks involved in the BT "handshake" as well as encryption and probably other complexities I don't know about. So, if your phone streams BT audio with other apps but doesn't reliably function as a BT key, that doesn't really surprise me. It's not a sign that the car has a bug, I still think it's likely software on your phone. If the car had flaky BT, I don't think so many people would have such reliable functionality using a wide variety of phones. The difference comes down to a phones configuration or the software loaded on it.


I don't have any BT-as-key issues. Just the using-as-a-phone issue.


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## gmtom1

I have a Note 9 and Galaxy Watch. My phone as a key issues have improved once I realized that keeping my phone in my back pocket was the issue. I'm still having significant issues with the BT phone/media connection in the car however. Through trial and error, I believe there's a conflict with my Galaxy watch/wear app. If my watch is off or on airplane mode before I get in the car, my phone will connect much more reliably than if I have the watch on/connected to my phone before entering the car. It's still not 100% however. We'll see if the update to Pie will improve things.


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## JML

PNWmisty said:


> It could be the BT signal is transmitting from your phone but is blocked (BT is largely line of sight). If that's not it, your phones BT radio is probably not transmitting for whatever reason. While there is a small chance it's a hardware issue with your phone, this really sounds like a software issue, perhaps with another app on your phone that doesn't play nice with your phones BT. My wife and I have minimal other apps that use BT on our phones which probably explains our 100% functionality. Our phones do have whatever is necessary to use Samsung ear IconX (BT earphones) but we don't have other 3rd party apps that might not comply with Android BT.
> 
> I hope this helps other owners clean up their phones or do whatever it takes to get 100% BT functionality because it really is nice not to have to bother with a key fob or the card.


I think you might be on to something. To refresh, the bluetooth beacons in the car are visible to a phone about 50 feet away, or 30 feet away through walls. The car will use the signal strength (and maybe other things?) to determine if the phone is within a few feet of the side of the car, and if so, it will allow the doors to unlock. Anything that degrades the signal from the phone will make it appear farther away than it actually is.

A brief digression. I have in the past tried to use bluetooth locking on my computer. This works almost exactly like the car. The phone and the computer are paired over bluetooth, and the computer locks if the phone goes too far away. I've given up on it, because I didn't find it reliable enough. The computer locker has debugging, unlike the car, so I could see what was happening. Displaying the distance of the phone from the computer quickly showed the problem. Sitting at the computer, with my phone in my pocket, the computer would think it was anywhere from 0-10 feet away, and this would change every second. Set the locker too sensitive, and the computer would lock while sitting in front of it, but set it too permissive, and I could walk too far away from the computer and it might not lock. So a lock setting of >10 feet, might mean the computer didn't lock until I was 20+ feet away. For my purposes, this wasn't good enough, as I wanted the computer to lock when I stepped away, even though I was only going 15 feet or so.

Anyway, that is a long way to say, that in my experience the distance detection features in bluetooth are not very reliable. So, if the phone has to be within 3 feet for the car to open, keeping it in a pocket or bag, might make the phone appear to be 2-10 feet away, instead of in the open air where the phone might appear to be 1-5 feet away. I think this is also why, in my experience, the trunk is much more likely to open on the first press than the doors. Because the antennas are on the sides of the car, it will allow the trunk to open when it detects the phone much further away. In fact, I can frequently walk up to the car, open the trunk, then walk around to the side and NOT open the door.

Also, as you mention, other bluetooth apps might be interfering. I have an app on my phone from my insurance company, which is supposed to use a bluetooth beacon in the car to record all of my drives, so they can sell my data to the Illuminati or something. Anyway, the app crashes frequently and uses lots of battery when it does, so I put it in the "always sleeping" category. The phone key seems to be more reliable for me since then. Of course, it is incredibly difficult to tell with things like this that are intermittent. It might just be sunspots.

The second phone and bluetooth thing is connecting the phone to the radio. Since about October I had been having problems with bluetooth on my Samsung S8, which prior to that had worked great. I tried lots of things, but on the Samsung Android Oreo OS, I couldn't find a way to reset bluetooth, which is what everybody recommended for the problems. I am now on the Android Pie beta, and was able to clear cache and data for bluetooth, and that seems to have made things much better. All of my bluetooth devices, including the car, have connected as they are supposed to. The Model 3 is still slower to connect than the $100 aftermarket radio in my other car, but this morning it was connected and working by the time the garage door closed, without any interaction on my part.

TL;DR I think the problems are due to sunspots, or maybe the earth's magnetic field.


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## JML

Here's a new one, audio plays through the car, but the car can't control the phone. I'm pretty sure it was a phone problem, because when I rebooted the phone, the problem went away.

This morning the phone paired well with the car, and after work it also paired on its own. I made a quick stop on the way home and it would not pair, so I went into the car's system and told it to connect. It then connected, but as mentioned, none of the in car controls work. For example, I couldn't skip to the next track or pause. I made another stop, and after getting back to the car, the phone paired, but the controls still didn't work. After getting home I confirmed the problems till existed, then rebooted the phone, and then the car controls started to work again. So I conclude a phone problem.

I also did some brief time testing. If left on their own, the phone takes about 1:30 seconds to pair with the Tesla, and about :30 seconds to pair a $100 Kenwood in my other car. Both are reading the contact list. 1:30 seems very long, as a headset pairs with the phone in under 2 seconds. I'm sure the it's more complicated to wakeup/boot the Tesla headunit (and the Kenwood) than a headset, but still, that 1:30 seems excessive. I have a Tasker task that maximizes the volume on the phone when connected to certain bluetooth devices that have their own volume control, including the car. I get a message from this task about 10 seconds after opening the car door, but the phone and car aren't ready for bluetooth audio for another 80 seconds or so. I don't know what that's all about.

In all this time the phone key has been working very well. Only once did I have to wait 10 seconds for the door to unlock, and in all other cases it was instant. To test, I re-enabled my other app that uses a bluetooth beacon in the car, and the phone as key still worked instantly.


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## gmtom1

My 3 is in for service for the last week and I got a brand new S 75D loaner from Tesla/Enterprise. I've had none of the in-car connectivity issues in the S that I've experienced with my 3. My Note 9 connects almost instantly every time and has not dropped the media/phone BT connection yet, whether my Galaxy Watch is connected or not.

Thanks.


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## pwenter

justaute said:


> Picked up my White TM3 AWD 4 days ago. Have been experiencing issues with phone/bluetooth integration. I'm using an Essential PH-1 and it has the latest Android OS. I frequently cannot make phone calls in that I can't hear the other party, nor can that party hear me; however, when I switch the sound to my phone's speaker, it seems to work fine.
> 
> Anyone has similar experience? Thanks.


I have the same exact problem. My Essential phone connects very well with many other devices and other rental cars and my wife's minivan etc. But with the Model 3 it works about 10% of the time for phone calls (everything else on the M3 works perfectly with my Essential); if I try to redial, or transfer the call from my phone, then back to the model 3, it may work. I called Tesla about the issue; they first had me reset the car, and disconnect/re-connect the bluethooth etc, but eventually said they had to escalate to a more technical team; I have not heard back from them. I do suggest you call Tesla.


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## justaute

pwenter said:


> I have the same exact problem. My Essential phone connects very well with many other devices and other rental cars and my wife's minivan etc. But with the Model 3 it works about 10% of the time for phone calls (everything else on the M3 works perfectly with my Essential); if I try to redial, or transfer the call from my phone, then back to the model 3, it may work. I called Tesla about the issue; they first had me reset the car, and disconnect/re-connect the bluethooth etc, but eventually said they had to escalate to a more technical team; I have not heard back from them. I do suggest you call Tesla.


I already did. Tesla seems to have other fish to fry. At this point, I just use my protocol of: call using phone speaker, after connection, transfer to TM3, increase volume by using the left steeringwheel roller, then voila.


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## JML

Here is a new wrinkle to my bluetooth connection problems. When the doors are all closed, and there is no weight in the driver's seat the screen turns off, and bluetooth pairing stops. I frequently open a rear door to put in a bag, child, etc., close the rear door, and then open the front door. This interupts the pairing and leaves either my phone or the car in a confused state for bluetooth pairing. It can take several minutes for the two to sort it out. Or possibly I have to tap the bluetooth icon and manually start the pairing process to the phone.

As an experiment, today I opened the rear door, dropped in my stuff, then opened the front door, then closed the rear door. The screen stayed on, because by the time I all four doors were closed, I was in the front seat. The phone connected quickly when I did that.

I'm not sure if this is really the cause of any of my problems, or just pecking at the corner, because sometimes everything works fine, and other times it doesn't.


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## TheHairyOne

Ah cool I’d been posting about this issue on the black screen thread so glad to find a group of other poor bastards with this issue 

So BT unlocks the door, what then fails for it to turn start the car vs. show a screen asking for the valet key?

I’ve been using summon on the phone to wake it back up vs. reboot.


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## TheHairyOne

Ok got 5.15 with sentry mode,and it happened differently today.

Instead of letting me in and then showing black after a valet key screen. It locked me out until I used the valet key, but then didnt need the valet key to start the car because it then recognized my iphone.

Going to reboot my phone and see if the problem goes a way. Otherwise I think tesla owes me a bluetooth signal strength log or something to figure this out.


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## JML

I switched phones from a Samsung Galaxy S8 to a Google Pixel 3, and my bluetooth issues are *gone*. I mean, I don't have to do a little dance to move the pocket with the phone in it close to the doors, they just unlock every time. I also don't have to wait 1-2 minutes for bluetooth to connect to the audio system, or in the worst cases manually force a connection several times before it works. I haven't timed how fast the Pixel 3 connects to the audio system, but by the time I have my seatbelt and sunglasses on, the phone is connected and ready to stream to the car. It's only been a week, so I'm sure there will be glitches, but it is so much better so far, though. If this had been my experience from the beginning, I would have wondered what the whole point of this thread was.

I'm still disappointed that when the car and phone connect, the phone doesn't have a popup that says "Tesla Model 3 connected with 70% battery" like it does for other bluetooth devices. Mostly because it is a terrific joke that only I find funny.


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## Frully

NR4P said:


> And today like a few other times. I am only one in the car. Car recognizes my phone, unlocks door, lets me drive but shows no BT device connected. Thats is so strange. It has to be connected or I can't unlock and drive.
> Did it this morning.
> 
> Hopefully these are addressed.


That's most likely a problem with the phone, not the car. 'Bluetooth' is a physical, transport, and protocol layer setup that has many different connections tunneling through a wireless link. In the case of unlocking the car and driving it's a serial data connection handshaking with the app. For audio it's A2DP, and for phone it's Headset protocol. While one might show connected, the other might not link up because so much of the stack is software instead of hardware. 
9/10 times it's solved by turning bluetooth off and then on on the phone side. Easiest method is using the airplane mode toggle.


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## MelindaV

NR4P said:


> Today with the BT phone key, when I open door for my wife, often times her phone shows up as BT connected although mine was last used. So it would be wrong profile.


the audio bt connection and the lock bt connection are independent of each other.


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## NR4P

I have two phones. Android and iOS. BT issue is with both. So car is likely the problem area. 

Like I wrote, I hope the BT improvements mentioned address this quirk.


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## Frully

NR4P said:


> I have two phones. Android and iOS. BT issue is with both. So car is likely the problem area.
> 
> Like I wrote, I hope the BT improvements mentioned address this quirk.


Reiterating - it's a bluetooth problem. It will exist with all devices from time to time.


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## WhiteFalcon

NR4P said:


> I am only one in the car. Car recognizes my phone, unlocks door, lets me drive but shows no BT device connected


This has been standard for me for a while now. I either have to go to the calendar or music and hit connect. Sometimes it does but 80% the car can use the phone to unlock and drive but the Media portion doesn't connect asap


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## airj1012

WhiteFalcon said:


> This has been standard for me for a while now. I either have to go to the calendar or music and hit connect. Sometimes it does but 80% the car can use the phone to unlock and drive but the Media portion doesn't connect asap


I've constantly had this issue. I just chalked it up to my phone. Still on iPhone 6. What's frustrating to me is that I'll get in the car and it'll play music for a few seconds and then it drops. Then I need to go to the bluetooth icon in the top right and reconnect. I need to do this more often than not. I was hoping it would go away when I upgraded phones this year, but maybe not...


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## fazluke

airj1012 said:


> I've constantly had this issue. I just chalked it up to my phone. Still on iPhone 6. What's frustrating to me is that I'll get in the car and it'll play music for a few seconds and then it drops. Then I need to go to the bluetooth icon in the top right and reconnect. I need to do this more often than not. I was hoping it would go away when I upgraded phones this year, but maybe not...


Did you try to turn off Bluetooth then On? That always solves the issue for me.


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## airj1012

fazluke said:


> Did you try to turn off Bluetooth then On? That always solves the issue for me.


Many times. Airplane mode, bluetooth off, phone off...Not sure which one, if any, works for the longest time before reverting back to the old ways, but in my opinion this shouldn't continue to happen. Annoying, but still LOVE the car.


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## airj1012

airj1012 said:


> Many times. Airplane mode, bluetooth off, phone off...Not sure which one, if any, works for the longest time before reverting back to the old ways, but in my opinion this shouldn't continue to happen. Annoying, but still LOVE the car.


So here is another example from today. I opened my car, the audio started playing. I sat down, realized I left a list in the house. Left the car door open, walked back into the house for ~15 seconds, and went back to the car. Sat in the car, music is still playing. I close the door and then bluetooth dropped. The icon in the top right was no longer dark grey and I had to reconnect my phone through that bluetooth menu. That makes ZERO sense to me.


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## zosoisnotaword

airj1012 said:


> So here is another example from today. I opened my car, the audio started playing. I sat down, realized I left a list in the house. Left the car door open, walked back into the house for ~15 seconds, and went back to the car. Sat in the car, music is still playing. I close the door and then bluetooth dropped. The icon in the top right was no longer dark grey and I had to reconnect my phone through that bluetooth menu. That makes ZERO sense to me.


I had been having issues with my iPhone 6 too. The bluetooth key wouldn't connect unless I took the phone out of my pocket, both for unlocking doors and allowing the car to drive. I did a little research and found that it could be the antenna cable in the phone. It was only a $20 repair from ifixit ($10 repair kit, $5 antenna, $5 shipping), so I gave it a shot. Phone key has now been flawless for 10 days. This is worth a shot because it's a cheap attempt, and it worked for me. Based on the number of comments in this repair guide, it seems to be a common issue with the iPhone 6. Flex Cable Repair Guide

The introduction says that it's a fix for a poor WiFi signal, but this cable is also for the bluetooth antenna. If you don't have the vanilla iPhone 6, make sure you go to the correct phone for that specific repair guide/part, because the 6, 6s and 6+ are slightly different from what I gathered. You have to remove 20+ screws of different sizes, so be prepared to be highly organized. Make sure you read all the user comments from others who have done the repair.


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## Enginerd

My own experience (Samsung S5) is that BLE unlock has been _fairly_ reliable (say 80-90%) until recently. Now with 2019.24.4, it seems to be really horrible, like 10-20% success rate. I can nearly count on doing an airplane mode reset about twice before the car will let me in, unless I give up and use the card.

That said, Bluetooth audio seems to be connecting much quicker, generally within a second or two of entering the car. Ironically, when BLE unlock fails and I use the card, it seems that Bluetooth audio plays instantaneously when I sit in the driver's seat. How can it connect to audio without connecting to unlock? I suspect that quicker Bluetooth audio is to blame for the poor unlock performance, but I don't know the details of how they may be related.


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## MelindaV

Enginerd said:


> My own experience (Samsung S5) is that BLE unlock has been _fairly_ reliable (say 80-90%) until recently. Now with 2019.24.4, it seems to be really horrible, like 10-20% success rate. I can nearly count on doing an airplane mode reset about twice before the car will let me in, unless I give up and use the card.
> 
> That said, Bluetooth audio seems to be connecting much quicker, generally within a second or two of entering the car. Ironically, when BLE unlock fails and I use the card, it seems that Bluetooth audio plays instantaneously when I sit in the driver's seat. How can it connect to audio without connecting to unlock? I suspect that quicker Bluetooth audio is to blame for the poor unlock performance, but I don't know the details of how they may be related.


the two are not connected/dependent on each other. 
In nearly a year, the only time my walk-up unlock hasn't worked is when I forget I had turned off my phone's BT for one reason or another, or it is in a back pocket. BUT every other time it has worked flawlessly. Audio BT has also always connected immediately when a door is opened (to the point of it being annoying).


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## Enginerd

Enginerd said:


> BLE unlock has been _fairly_ reliable (say 80-90%) until recently


@MelindaV , FYI after getting upset (unable to quickly get into the car in the rain), I deleted my phone key and reset the pairing. Since doing so, BLE unlock and BT audio been extremely reliable. Now the phone-as-key works, and BT audio connects very quickly. Maybe un-pairing/re-pairing is warranted every once in a while after receiving firmware updates.


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## Gabzqc

Phone will not stay connected to the car for calling or playing media, unless both Media and Calls are selected in my phone options. 
Before software update 24.4, the phone would be happy to disable media, so my music would not automatically transfer to the car when I opened the door... helpful when washing the car and listening to music from phone on bluetooth headphones...


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