# Car periodically wakes up for several hours



## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

OK so this is the first week since I got TeslaFi that my car has been pretty much sitting idle for a few days on end. I've noticed a little bit of weirdness, basically waking up for very long periods of time, but with not real logic as to why / how the wake occured.

For example on Tuesday, according to TeslaFi my car was asleep from Midnight until 1:34PM. At that point it was "idle" until 7:37pm and lost 1.68 kWh.

Yesterday it was again alseep (since 7:37pm the prior day) but woke at 7:36pm and stayed awake until 2:08am this morning and lost 1.31 kWh.

It also did something similar on Monday - each time it wakes for around 6 hours, although my TeslaFi settings say Sleep Mode is enabled, it waits 30 mins idle time before starting to sleep, and 15 mins to "try and put the car to sleep"

Does anyone know what's going on? I can't and don't plug in at home, and each wake costs about 1.5 kWh so the three wakes since Sunday are currently 4.5 kWh of loss which is more than all of the sleep time combined.


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

Wooloomooloo said:


> OK so this is the first week since I got TeslaFi that my car has been pretty much sitting idle for a few days on end. I've noticed a little bit of weirdness, basically waking up for very long periods of time, but with not real logic as to why / how the wake occured.


This doesn't sound abnormal to me. The car does periodically wake up on its own if it has been idle for an extended period of time. Whether it's the car itself or the "Tesla mothership" initiating the wake-up -- or what the car is doing while it's awake -- is anyone's guess. All TeslaFi is doing is giving you information that you didn't have previously, for better and for worse. 

For the sake of comparison: I have TeslaFi sleep settings set to the recommended values for Model 3, and I have deep-sleep configured for 12am - 6am. During my holiday break (Dec 22 - 29), I was 3000 miles away from my car, and the only thing I did to wake it up was open the Tesla app on Christmas morning.... yet it still woke up about once a day on average for a period of about 6 hours, similar to you. Details:

Dec. 22: Car fell asleep at 8:34pm
Dec. 23: Car woke up at 8:00pm
Dec. 24: Car fell asleep at 2:00am (exactly 6 hours awake)
Dec. 25: Car woke up at 12:59am (hi, Santa!), then fell asleep at 5:59am. Car woke up again at 12:12pm (I'd opened the Tesla app to check on it), and fell asleep at 12:34pm.
Dec 26: Car woke up at 9:02am and fell asleep at 3:01pm
Dec 27: Car woke up at 1:58pm. Car initiated a top-off charge from 3:47pm until 4:05pm. Car fell asleep at 8:05pm.
Dec 28: Car woke up at 7:11pm.
Dec 29: Car fell asleep at 1:10am
Dec 30: Car woke up at 1:09am and fell asleep at 7:27am. At this point, we had arrived home.

Going to speculate wildly here, but since both of us are in cold-weather territory, I'm wondering whether these six-hour sessions involve exercising the charge-port latch or performing other cold-weather "maintenance" that requires the car to be awake.

TeslaFi users in warmer climates who left their cars sit idle for several days -- did you see similar behavior?


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

Bokonon said:


> Going to speculate wildly here, but since both of us are in cold-weather territory, I'm wondering whether these six-hour sessions involve exercising the charge-port latch or performing other cold-weather "maintenance" that requires the car to be awake.
> 
> TeslaFi users in warmer climates who left their cars sit idle for several days -- did you see similar behavior?


As soon as I saw your times, I thought the same thing. It's not a bad theory given the information.


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## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

mine sleeps thru the night like a good toddler car, wakes up to start charging at 6am.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

@Wooloomooloo, I feel your frustration of the car seemingly needlessly using multiple kWH while sitting and the mystery of when it stays idle and when it sleeps. Idling uses so much more energy than sleeping. (For people who don't use Teslafi, idle and sleep are specific terms Teslafi uses to describe status of the car that is invisible to us from the Tesla app.)

My Model 3 is a perfect sleeping baby. She rarely sits idle for more than 2 hours before going to sleep, and sometimes as fast as 5 minutes after a drive. She goes to sleep easily and stays asleep. She is actively being driven, so I don't have long stretches of inactivity for her.

My Model X is mostly sitting in the garage, like a bear hibernating, I would hope. But he has not been getting to sleep very easily. Once awake, he typically sits idle for at least 12 hours. He stayed awake for 3 days straight at one point in December. But then he has recently slept for 3 days. It's very befuddling.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

So mine is awake right now - it woke at 6:27am EST. It had been asleep since 8:30am yesterday and seems to go in cycles of sleep for 10 hours and wake for a little over 6. I'm going to pump it into a spreadsheet. It's definitely NOT random, it's a clear cycle.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

OK so I've made a little timeline. Basically this looks at the time sleeping Vs "idle" (which is awake) on TeslaFi, and the total drain. It seems to pretty much go 24 hours asleep, 6 hours awake with some small variations. I'd have to take a larger sample to see if this is consistent. The drain awake is higher than asleep as you'd expect, but there are some oddities.

Two sleeping periods (Monday Morning and during Thursday) the drain is more than 10x other periods. Also on Monday the car seemed to 'gain' power during its idle period, which I imagine is battery balancing.

However if you remove the anomalies, the drain per hour awake is around 3x than when it's asleep with an extra 100 watts/hour being used. I don't think this can be explained by wifi activity (mine isn't even connected to wifi) or software upload/download especially given the car hasn't been driven for a week. Also bear in mind the car is not plugged in. My theory is it is waking to check the battery state, using some power to generate heat and waiting to charge, which doesn't happen because it's not plugged in.

Here is the chart showing:

- Hours
- Total Drain in kWh
- Average hourly drain in Wh


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

Adding another data point in support of the "cold-weather behavior" theory....

After 23.5 hours of being asleep in below-freezing weather, my car woke up today at 5:10pm and has not been asleep in the 4.5 hours since. I just went out and listened to the charge point door, and sure enough, it's "ticking" every other second as it exercises the latch. Per the six-hour schedule, it should fall asleep again around 11:10pm, at which point I should hear no more ticking.

For good measure, though, I did open and close a door, just to see if it makes the car sleep even while it's doing its cold-weather calisthenics. 

UPDATE: Yep, it fell asleep at 11:11pm. Cyan-colored "T" light is no longer illuminated, and the charge port is no longer ticking.


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## webdriverguy (May 25, 2017)

Bokonon said:


> Adding another data point in support of the "cold-weather behavior" theory....
> 
> After 23.5 hours of being asleep in below-freezing weather, my car woke up today at 5:10pm and has not been asleep in the 4.5 hours since. I just went out and listened to the charge point door, and sure enough, it's "ticking" every other second as it exercises the latch. Per the six-hour schedule, it should fall asleep again around 11:10pm, at which point I should hear no more ticking.
> 
> For good measure, though, I did open and close a door, just to see if it makes the car sleep even while it's doing its cold-weather calisthenics.


Wow so many possibilities to consider


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

webdriverguy said:


> Wow so many possibilities to consider


Actually I think it's pretty much narrowed down. What he said is consistent with my post above showing the sleep/wake cycle. Sleep for ~24 hours, wake for ~6 hours. I am going to monitor this week as well (I won't be using the car until next weekend) and see if it's the same pattern.


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## Carl_P (Jan 30, 2018)

Wooloomooloo said:


> Actually I think it's pretty much narrowed down. What he said is consistent with my post above showing the sleep/wake cycle. Sleep for ~24 hours, wake for ~6 hours. I am going to monitor this week as well (I won't be using the car until next weekend) and see if it's the same pattern.


My mid-range was sitting in the garage, with charger plugged in, from Saturday at 3pm to this morning at 8am. In between, it slept all hours EXCEPT for a 4 hour 25 minute period yesterday between 5pm and 9pm where it was awake.

When awake for those 4 hours, it lost 4 miles of range. In the other roughly 35 hours of sleep, it lost.... 4 miles of range.

This is bothersome and I'm not sure if the waking hours' huge loss rate is because of TeslaFi pinging it, or something else, but that's a lot of range to lose for something that seems preventable/useless.

The problem is that without TeslaFi, we can't see any of these numbers.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

Carl_P said:


> My mid-range was sitting in the garage, with charger plugged in, from Saturday at 3pm to this morning at 8am. In between, it slept all hours EXCEPT for a 4 hour 25 minute period yesterday between 5pm and 9pm where it was awake.
> 
> When awake for those 4 hours, it lost 4 miles of range. In the other roughly 35 hours of sleep, it lost.... 4 miles of range.
> 
> ...


I don't think it's TeslaFi waking the car, especially given the amount of time it stays awake for and the variation in kWh used during the wake period. It appears to be cold-weather related maintenance, likely battery conditioning. TeslaFi settings don't seem to change the behavior.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

Wooloomooloo said:


> I don't think it's TeslaFi waking the car, especially given the amount of time it stays awake for and the variation in kWh used during the wake period.


I concur. If sleep settings are set well in Teslafi, I don't believe it is causing the wake periods.

I think we have to remember that Tesla says that about 1% drain/day is expected - and I expect that is during "normal" temperatures (for California). My drain is mostly coming in below 2%/day, so for the winter, I don't think anything is terribly out of line (although I do hate spending energy for it to go nowhere.)

That being said, trying to figure out the cycling they are using is an interesting puzzle. My observations so far:

I see the 6 hours (usually precisely 5 hrs 59 min) awake/20-24 hours asleep cycle when the car is not used, and left totally undisturbed.
After the car has been driven, mine falls asleep in either approximately 30 min or approximately 2 hours. I have not been able to figure out which factors cause which timing.
Having WiFi on/off has not made any difference in what I see. I have not tried the opening a door while it is in the long period of awake to make it sleep, but I see the potential for it to work if my basic undisturbed/disturbed categorization is correct - that might kick it into the #2 grouping above.


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## Jay Jay (Oct 26, 2018)

Bigriver said:


> My drain is mostly coming in below 2%/day, so for the winter, I don't think anything is terribly out of line (although I do hate spending energy for it to go nowhere.)


Whenever you have that feeling just remember: about 60% of each gallon of gas used in an ICE car is WASTED as heat.


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## Carl_P (Jan 30, 2018)

Wooloomooloo said:


> I don't think it's TeslaFi waking the car, especially given the amount of time it stays awake for and the variation in kWh used during the wake period. It appears to be cold-weather related maintenance, likely battery conditioning. TeslaFi settings don't seem to change the behavior.


I'm 100% sure that TeslaFi is not waking the car, as I have studied their sleep modes and tested things like a crazy person. However, I do think TeslaFi is contributing to the terrible drain that occurs *after the car has been woken up by something else*, and before it falls back asleep.

Also, the car is in my garage, where it's 60 degrees and cloudy, all the time. So cold-weather maintenance seems odd.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

Carl_P said:


> ... and tested things like a crazy person. However, I do think TeslaFi is contributing to the terrible drain that occurs ...


I'm there with you on testing things like a crazy person. 🙃 But I've not seen anything that would lead me to believe Teslafi is increasing the drain in any way. What test and what did you see that leads you to that conclusion?


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

OK this is seriously weird. My car woke for 5 hours and 59 mins today, and GAINED range but loss battery %. I assume this is rebalancing and the BMS calibrated. It looks like good news, but really interesting.










177.5 miles with 62% charge implies about 286 miles of range (that seems like a huge loss)

181.29 miles with 60% charge is 292 miles of range.


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## _Travis_ (Dec 31, 2018)

Wooloomooloo said:


> OK so this is the first week since I got TeslaFi that my car has been pretty much sitting idle for a few days on end. I've noticed a little bit of weirdness, basically waking up for very long periods of time, but with not real logic as to why / how the wake occured.
> 
> For example on Tuesday, according to TeslaFi my car was asleep from Midnight until 1:34PM. At that point it was "idle" until 7:37pm and lost 1.68 kWh.
> 
> ...


I wish I had insight into the inner workings of the sleep system. It's been an enormous pain in the ass for me. I have the problem where I have to do hard restarts almost every time I get into the car, so every time I get into the car I have to wait 30 seconds before I have any computer use at all, and then another 120 seconds before I have navigation or audio. When I talked to phone support, they told me the story of the problem.

Apparently during the first few months after the Model 3's release, the cars were programmed deterministically to wake up anytime the driver's phone came within a certain physical distance, which in household environments meant they were just staying fully awake almost all the time. This wasted tons of power, so they implemented a smart sleep feature, which they haven't told me definitively but it sounds like a learning-based system that lets the car decide on its own when it should sleep. This is producing tons of problems and tons of owners are complaining about the cars going to sleep or into full shutdown at inappropriate times.

For me, I can expect that anytime I go to a grocery store and I'm away from the car for 10 minutes, I'll have to wait 1-3 minutes for the display computer to do a full boot before I can drive home with full functionality. Which is ridiculous. I'm going to check out this TeslaFi program because I'm curious to know more about the problem.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

_Travis_ said:


> Apparently during the first few months after the Model 3's release, the cars were programmed deterministically to wake up anytime the driver's phone came within a certain physical distance, which in household environments meant they were just staying fully awake almost all the time. This wasted tons of power, so they implemented a smart sleep feature, which they haven't told me definitively but it sounds like a learning-based system that lets the car decide on its own when it should sleep. This is producing tons of problems and tons of owners are complaining about the cars going to sleep or into full shutdown at inappropriate times.
> 
> For me, I can expect that anytime I go to a grocery store and I'm away from the car for 10 minutes, I'll have to wait 1-3 minutes for the display computer to do a full boot before I can drive home with full functionality. Which is ridiculous. I'm going to check out this TeslaFi program because I'm curious to know more about the problem.


What's really weird is the completely different behavior the cars are exhibiting from one another. I've never had to do a hard reset of my car the entire time I've had it, and when it decides to open the door for me, everything is functional immediately.

My biggest grip with the auto lock/sleep is that it happens so fast. Sometimes I might just go to the truck and get something, close it, maybe gather a few things and in less than 10 seconds the car locks itself even though I'm standing right there with my phone on me. My proximity to it seems to make no difference. On trying to open the car, there is no response at all unless I open the app and press the unlock icon, in which case it responds immediately and is awake.

If I'm approaching the car after walking away for 10 mins or 10 hours, it responds immediately. It's only non responsive immediately after it auto shuts.

It appears as though the cars have perhaps different firmware or even hardware, hence the behavioral differences.


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## Jay Jay (Oct 26, 2018)

_Travis_ said:


> I wish I had insight into the inner workings of the sleep system. It's been an enormous pain in the ass for me. I have the problem where I have to do hard restarts almost every time I get into the car, so every time I get into the car I have to wait 30 seconds before I have any computer use at all, and then another 120 seconds before I have navigation or audio. When I talked to phone support, they told me the story of the problem.
> 
> Apparently during the first few months after the Model 3's release, the cars were programmed deterministically to wake up anytime the driver's phone came within a certain physical distance, which in household environments meant they were just staying fully awake almost all the time. This wasted tons of power, so they implemented a smart sleep feature, which they haven't told me definitively but it sounds like a learning-based system that lets the car decide on its own when it should sleep. This is producing tons of problems and tons of owners are complaining about the cars going to sleep or into full shutdown at inappropriate times.
> 
> For me, I can expect that anytime I go to a grocery store and I'm away from the car for 10 minutes, I'll have to wait 1-3 minutes for the display computer to do a full boot before I can drive home with full functionality. Which is ridiculous. I'm going to check out this TeslaFi program because I'm curious to know more about the problem.


Surely you've called Tesla about this? Totally unacceptable and should probably have the MCU replaced.


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## _Travis_ (Dec 31, 2018)

Jay Jay said:


> Surely you've called Tesla about this? Totally unacceptable and should probably have the MCU replaced.


I've brought it in twice and twice they've told me it will be fixed by future firmware updates. Seven or eight firmware updates have been released since they first told me this. I'm considering lemon law returning the car at this point.


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## _Travis_ (Dec 31, 2018)

Wooloomooloo said:


> What's really weird is the completely different behavior the cars are exhibiting from one another. I've never had to do a hard reset of my car the entire time I've had it, and when it decides to open the door for me, everything is functional immediately.
> 
> My biggest grip with the auto lock/sleep is that it happens so fast. Sometimes I might just go to the truck and get something, close it, maybe gather a few things and in less than 10 seconds the car locks itself even though I'm standing right there with my phone on me. My proximity to it seems to make no difference. On trying to open the car, there is no response at all unless I open the app and press the unlock icon, in which case it responds immediately and is awake.
> 
> ...


I can't confirm this, but honestly it looks like they're using some sort of machine learning. That would be very unusual. Usually you train a machine learning program once in a lab and then deploy that single trained program to all your users. If each car is learning when to go to sleep on its own, that would explain how every car is giving different results and different problems.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

_Travis_ said:


> If each car is learning when to go to sleep on its own


Tesla isn't using machine learning to decide when the car should go to sleep. That would be overkill. They just have a complicated system and it's hard for us to figure out exactly under which conditions the car will sleep.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

garsh said:


> Tesla isn't using machine learning to decide when the car should go to sleep. That would be overkill. They just have a complicated system and it's hard for us to figure out exactly under which conditions the car will sleep.


You've written that as a statement of fact (do you know for sure?) and although I agree it's highly unlikely cars are trying to adapt to their owner's behavior, it wouldn't be the first time Tesla have grossly over-engineered a simple function. For example, the windshield wipers use machine learning when sensors would suffice.

You're probably right, but it would not be the most shocking revelation. If it is true, their learning templates need a lot of work.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

Wooloomooloo said:


> You've written that as a statement of fact (do you know for sure?)


Yes. Individual Tesla cars are not involved in the "learning" part of machine learning. This tends to be a common misconception.



garsh said:


> KFORE's got it.
> 
> "Machine learning" is an extremely CPU-intensive _offline_ process. Tesla will use _thousands_ of machines running in parallel for this. You feed in a ton of data (collected from all the cars of the fleet), and out comes a new neural network (aka neural net, or NN).
> 
> ...


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

garsh said:


> Yes. Individual Tesla cars *are not involved* in the "learning" part of machine learning. This tends to be a common misconception.


We might be saying the same thing here, but of course individual Teslas _do _contribute data to the aggregated neural net for generalized machine learning, that's literally the definition of machine learning. So yes their role in any ML is the contribution of the data points, not running the deterministic algos.

But while I agree, no one said it was done at the local individual level, and you didn't say that in your first post, you simply said "*Tesla *isn't using machine learning to decide when *the car *goes to sleep", which has nothing to do with where that learning occurs.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

Wooloomooloo said:


> no one said it was done at the local individual level


Um.. that's exactly the misconception I was responding to.


_Travis_ said:


> If each car is learning when to go to sleep on its own, that would explain how every car is giving different results and different problems.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

garsh said:


> Um.. that's exactly the misconception I was responding to.


Fair enough, I thought you were suggested I'd said that, given your reply quoted me. When I said "you've written that as a statement of fact" I didn't know you were disagreeing with the assertion the learning was done locally, given you simply said "Tesla is not using machine learning" rather than "The car isn't performing machine learning..."

...aaanyway.


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## Carl_P (Jan 30, 2018)

Here's the kind of thing I can't figure out for the life of me. All stats below according to TeslaFi:

Tuesday:
Parked M3 at train station.
Outside temp was 21 degrees F
It fell asleep in 10 minutes (per my aggressive sleep settings in TeslaFi)
It slept for 9 hours 22 mins.
It lost 2.15 miles of range.
Totally *acceptable* amount of range loss

Wednesday:
Parked M3 at train station (same time)
Outside temp was 34 degrees F
It stayed awake for 5 hours and 1 minute before falling asleep
It slept for 3 hours 54 mins
It lost 6.94 miles of range.
Totally unacceptable amount of range loss

All other variables were the same for the two days. I just don't understand.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

Carl_P said:


> Here's the kind of thing I can't figure out for the life of me. All stats below according to TeslaFi:
> 
> Tuesday:
> Parked M3 at train station.
> ...


Would you mind sharing your sleep settings in Teslafi? I'm just comparing and learning as I signed up this past weekend.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

Carl_P said:


> Here's the kind of thing I can't figure out for the life of me. All stats below according to TeslaFi:
> 
> snip
> 
> All other variables were the same for the two days. I just don't understand.


It looks like the car does a sleep/wake cycle on a 24 hour + 6 hour basis as long as you don't interrupt it. So it will sleep for 24 hours, wake for 6, sleep for 24.

I don't have enough data to work out if this cycle resets or simply pauses when you use the car, but I suspect it pauses. If it reset, then your car would ALWAYS sleep after use and start a new 24 hours cycle. If it simply pauses, then it might stay awake after you use it for the remainder of it's "wake" cycle. It would be interesting to know what state your car was in just before you drove it on Weds morning, compared to Tuesday.

If my hypothesis is correct, on Tuesday it was asleep just before you set off to the train station, but on Weds it was awake.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

I haven't visited this thread in awhile because sometimes I just have to take a break from thinking about things I don't understand. 🤨 But ultimately the puzzle draws me back to stare at the pieces a little more.

@Carl_P, yes that is puzzling behavior. And particularly puzzling with staying awake at a warmer temp. Not intuitive. Yesterday I parked my Model 3 at about 10 F and expected it should stay awake to monitor the situation. Nope, it was just a 30 min lag before it fell asleep.

Anyway, in the 2 days that you quoted, what I wonder is the presence of the snowflake in both of those situations. Teslafi doesn't report the existence of the snowflake, but it does report as a loss the part of the battery that is temporarily unavailable due to the snowflake. And then the drive that follows has PHENOMENAL efficiency (miles driven/rated miles used) if it is long enough to rewarm the battery, make the snowflake disappear, and that battery range is reclaimed. Realizing this has made me a little less enamored with my Teslafi info, as there are situations that can't be taken at face value.

As a specific example, my car lost about 14 miles yesterday while sitting in the cold. But then look at the drive home! 








Now granted, I was coming out of the mountains, had a good elevation change to my favor, and I did have for real good efficiency as the car reported 170 Wh/mile for the drive. But the drive was nowhere as good as Teslafi shows nor was the mile loss while sitting as bad as Teslafi shows.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

Bigriver said:


> I haven't visited this thread in awhile because sometimes I just have to take a break from thinking about things I don't understand. 🤨 But ultimately the puzzle draws me back to stare at the pieces a little more.
> 
> @Carl_P, yes that is puzzling behavior. And particularly puzzling with staying awake at a warmer temp. Not intuitive. Yesterday I parked my Model 3 at about 10 F and expected it should stay awake to monitor the situation. Nope, it was just a 30 min lag before it fell asleep.


I don't think the sleep/wake cycle has anything to do with temperature, or if it does, then there is a cut off where it occurs or does not occur in a binary fashion.

@Carl_P do let me know what state your car was in before you started your journey on the Tues and Weds, which may shed some light on whether the 24hr/6hr cycle is reset upon driving, or merely paused.


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## Mike (Apr 4, 2016)

Carl_P said:


> The problem is that without TeslaFi, we can't see any of these numbers.


I don't have any third party apps running on the car, but if I am in the garage and hear the coolant pump (located on front of fire wall, under 12 volt battery, passenger side) running, I know the car is awake.

I suppose one could rig up a microphone and attach it to a device that would record the times it heard that coolant pump running. .....


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

Wooloomooloo said:


> I don't have enough data to work out if this cycle resets or simply pauses when you use the car, but I suspect it pauses. If it reset, then your car would ALWAYS sleep after use and start a new 24 hours cycle. If it simply pauses, then it might stay awake after you use it for the remainder of it's "wake" cycle. It would be interesting to know what state your car was in just before you drove it on Weds morning, compared to Tuesday.
> 
> If my hypothesis is correct, on Tuesday it was asleep just before you set off to the train station, but on Weds it was awake.


I think you are on to something here. I think a more wholistic approach, looking at what has gone before, may be the key. My car continues to usually stay awake for 30 min, 2 hours or 6 hours, but there are exceptions. Two exceptions I immediately found were times when the car was awake for 4-5 hours, and they both followed days of mostly sleep. As I look at my "normal" days when sleep occurs in either 30 min or 2 hours, it seems that my total car usage + park/idle time is freakishly close to 6 hours. That's from a quick scan. I'll have to look more closely to see if this generally holds true.
Edit: And on @Carl_P specific example, I'm going to guess that it didn't matter whether the car was sleeping right before he drove it, but the general amount of use for the preceding 24 hours (or so). I would guess that it was already used/awake enough on Monday so that it slept on Tuesday. Then on Wednesday, it had not met the 6 hour use/awake rule so did not sleep as much.


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

Random nerdy note: there is a new "charging state" value being returned by the Tesla API that seems to indicate whether your charge port is currently operating in "cold weather" mode.


```
charge_port_cold_weather_mode=True
```
Currently, it's 30 degrees here at my office, and my car has been awake (idle) since I parked it a couple of hours ago, and it is reporting a value of "True" for cold weather mode. I just went out to the parking lot, and sure enough, if I place my ear next to the charge port, I can hear the latch is tick-tick-ticking away.


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## Carl_P (Jan 30, 2018)

I have some excellent news. Since I applied the newest software update on Monday night, my car has not sat "idle" for longer than 10-12 minutes this week while parked. It's falling right out asleep and the vampire drain has been excellent.

I'm not sure if it's a coincidence concerning the update, but my driving habits haven't changed, my parking location hasn't changed, my TeslaFi settings haven't changed, and I'm driving for only about 1 hour per day (not coming close to that 6 hour threshold). I am plugging in every night at home, and setting it at 85% charge.

I'll keep you all posted on this exciting development.

To answer the question from @GDN , here are my sleep settings in TeslaFi, under "Sleep Modes":

Time to try sleeping: 15 minutes
Idle Time before Trying to Sleep: 8 minutes (I am aggressive here because I'd rather miss a short drive every once in a while rather than have it sit idle for longer for all my drives)
Nighttime and Deep Sleep Mode Enabled
Polling Time While Idle: 2 minutes


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## ehendrix23 (Jan 30, 2019)

Carl_P said:


> I have some excellent news. Since I applied the newest software update on Monday night, my car has not sat "idle" for longer than 10-12 minutes this week while parked. It's falling right out asleep and the vampire drain has been excellent.
> 
> I'm not sure if it's a coincidence concerning the update, but my driving habits haven't changed, my parking location hasn't changed, my TeslaFi settings haven't changed, and I'm driving for only about 1 hour per day (not coming close to that 6 hour threshold). I am plugging in every night at home, and setting it at 85% charge.
> 
> ...


What software version are you on now?


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## mswlogo (Oct 8, 2018)

Carl_P said:


> I have some excellent news. Since I applied the newest software update on Monday night, my car has not sat "idle" for longer than 10-12 minutes this week while parked. It's falling right out asleep and the vampire drain has been excellent.
> 
> I'm not sure if it's a coincidence concerning the update, but my driving habits haven't changed, my parking location hasn't changed, my TeslaFi settings haven't changed, and I'm driving for only about 1 hour per day (not coming close to that 6 hour threshold). I am plugging in every night at home, and setting it at 85% charge.
> 
> ...


Just wait. You can't conclude anything in a day. I've gone 3 days with perfect sleep. Then it decides to not shutdown for 4 hours out of no where doing the exact same routine every day.

Also behavior changes depending on temperatures.

Version 50.6.


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## webdriverguy (May 25, 2017)

mswlogo said:


> Just wait. You can't conclude anything in a day. I've gone 3 days with perfect sleep. Then it decides to not shutdown for 4 hours out of no where doing the exact same routine every day.
> 
> Also behavior changes depending on temperatures.
> 
> Version 50.6.


Yes exactly if it's around 30F my car never sleeps in less than 60 mins. Plus I need to turn WiFi off manually else it won't sleep for a long time. Like I have seen more than 3 hrs. SC does not believe me on this. They are going to troubleshoot the issue with me remotely.


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## mswlogo (Oct 8, 2018)

webdriverguy said:


> Yes exactly if it's around 30F my car never sleeps in less than 60 mins. Plus I need to turn WiFi off manually else it won't sleep for a long time. Like I have seen more than 3 hrs. SC does not believe me on this. They are going to troubleshoot the issue with me remotely.


These are software bugs, or incompleted software work, or really dumb software ways to work around other issues. I'd report it, but there is nothing a SC can do to "fix it". Lots of folks are seeing it but it varies a ton based on conditions.


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## webdriverguy (May 25, 2017)

mswlogo said:


> These are software bugs, or I completed software work, or really dumb software ways to work around other issues. I'd report it, but there is nothing a SC can do to "fix it". Lots of folks are seeing it but it varies a ton based on conditions.


I have already reported this. Going to file a report again this time for a escalation


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## alexf (Dec 16, 2018)

This happens to me as ell. Anywhere between 4-6 hours a day idling. Super annoying.


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## webdriverguy (May 25, 2017)

alexf said:


> This happens to me as ell. Anywhere between 4-6 hours a day idling. Super annoying.


 Pls file a bug report. I am going to file one again and also reply back on servicehelpna email.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

Wooloomooloo said:


> It looks like the car does a sleep/wake cycle on a 24 hour + 6 hour basis as long as you don't interrupt it. So it will sleep for 24 hours, wake for 6, sleep for 24.
> 
> I don't have enough data to work out if this cycle resets or simply pauses when you use the car, but I suspect it pauses. If it reset, then your car would ALWAYS sleep after use and start a new 24 hours cycle. If it simply pauses, then it might stay awake after you use it for the remainder of it's "wake" cycle. It would be interesting to know what state your car was in just before you drove it on Weds morning, compared to Tuesday.
> 
> If my hypothesis is correct, on Tuesday it was asleep just before you set off to the train station, but on Weds it was awake.


@Wooloomooloo, have you figured out anything further about the 6 hour wake cycles? I've read back through this thread and several others with similar wake/sleep/energy loss discussions, and you get my vote for being the smartest! You most quickly honed in and articulated the 6 hour thing and I totally concur with your hypothesis that once started, the rest of a 6 hour awake cycle resumes after a drive that interrupts it. One thing I'd like to better understand is what is the rhythm to these cycles? At first it seemed to me strictly tied to inactivity -- a 6 hour cycle would start when the car isn't driven for close to a day (with some variability, plus or minus a few hours). But 10 days ago I had the car forget Wifi, and the 6 hour cycles have started between 9 hrs and 21 hrs after the last drive, and have been 2-3 days apart from each other. I'm not seeing the pattern yet, but wondered if you might have already figured it out.



Bokonon said:


> Random nerdy note: there is a new "charging state" value being returned by the Tesla API that seems to indicate whether your charge port is currently operating in "cold weather" mode.
> 
> 
> ```
> ...


@Bokonon I'm wanting to understand more about this, as it seems to be the strongest and most widely agreed upon hypothesis on what the car is doing during this wake period. I have never heard this clicking, so this has puzzled me. But as you mentioned that the Tesla API is actually tracking this... could you give more info? Is this something I can see in the Teslafi raw data feed? I see a charge port latch that either returns an engaged or disengaged. Is that the same as this? So is the Tesla API "true" what Teslafi is reporting as "engaged"? Any further theories on what temp engages or disengages, and whether this is linked only to the 6 hour cycle or any time the car is awake? My quick perusing of the Teslafi data didn't lead to anything conclusive, and I wasn't even sure if I was looking at the right thing.


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

Bigriver said:


> @Bokonon I'm wanting to understand more about this, as it seems to be the strongest and most widely agreed upon hypothesis on what the car is doing during this wake period. I have never heard this clicking, so this has puzzled me


The ticking is very faint when the "cold weather charge port mode" is active. If I'm outside, I have to put my ear right up to the charge port to hear it. It ticks about once every two seconds.



Bigriver said:


> But as you mentioned that the Tesla API is actually tracking this... could you give more info? Is this something I can see in the Teslafi raw data feed? I see a charge port latch that either returns an engaged or disengaged. Is that the same as this? So is the Tesla API "true" what Teslafi is reporting as "engaged"?


The "charge port latch" field in TeslaFi corresponds to the API field charge_port_latch, and reflects the latch's current state: "Engaged" if the connector is locked in with the latch, or "Disengaged" if it's not.

TeslaFi currently does not expose the charge_port_cold_weather_mode field --the field that seems to be set to "True" when the charge port latch is being exercised (i.e. ticking) -- in its "Raw Data Feed" grid. However, you can find it in the raw API output, which you can access in TeslaFi by doing the following:

1. Make sure your car is awake.
2. In TeslaFi, navigate to Settings > Account
3. Scroll down to the "Advanced" section near the bottom, and click "View Raw Tesla API Data Output".

This will give you an instantaneous snapshot of all current vehicle data available through the API in one fell blow. Use CTRL+F in your browser to search for charge_port_cold_weather_mode, or any other field of interest. (Ooooh, look! side_mirror_heaters, is that new? That might contain data that would be helpful in the heated side-mirror thread... but I digress...)

It's worth noting that charge_port_cold_weather_mode field being set to "True" does not necessarily mean the car is in the middle of a six-hour awake period -- for example, I just woke my car up to send it a few API calls, noted that charge_port_cold_weather_mode was "True", and then the car fell back asleep after about two minutes of inactivity.

It's also worth noting (though not surprising in my view) that charge_port_latch does not alternate between "Engaged" and "Disengaged" while the latch is being exercised back and forth.



Bigriver said:


> Any further theories on what temp engages or disengages, and whether this is linked only to the 6 hour cycle or any time the car is awake? My quick perusing of the Teslafi data didn't lead to anything conclusive, and I wasn't even sure if I was looking at the right thing.


The weather has been all over the place here in recent weeks, and I've driven my car just about every day during that time, so I haven't seen my car do the six-hour wake thing in a while.

I haven't figured out what specific temperature triggers the charge port cold weather mode, nor what specific factors lead the car to wake up for six hours to exercise the charge port. All I know is that below about 40 degrees, there's a non-zero chance that the cold weather mode will be on when the car is not asleep and not drawing shore power, and those odds seem to climb as the temperature drops. I also know that leaving the car idle for more than 24 hours in cold weather can cause the car to wake up for exactly six hours, and since it's awake, cold weather mode is naturally engaged... but I do not know what temperature triggers the wake-up behavior, nor do I know for sure whether any other time spent awake for other reasons deducts from the six-hour period.

Honestly, that level of detail is where my interest and motivation to find "the truth" starts to fade... as long as the behavior is predictable and there seems to be a rational reason for it, I trust that the Tesla engineers made it work this way for a reason, and accept it as it is.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

Bokonon said:


> The "charge port latch" field in TeslaFi corresponds to the API field charge_port_latch, and reflects the latch's current state: "Engaged" if the connector is locked in with the latch, or "Disengaged" if it's not.


That field can't be exclusively about the connector. I agree that when I've got the connector attached, it says engaged. But it is often "engaged" when I did not have it attached. Just this morning it was in a 6 hour cycle and was "engaged" without being plugged in. Actually, it was also "engaged" during part of a drive today!


Bokonon said:


> However, you can find it in the raw API output, which you can access in TeslaFi by doing the following:


Thank you! Just what I need -- more data to get tangled up in. I will eagerly dive into it when I can find some time.



Bokonon said:


> but I do not know what temperature triggers the wake-up behavior, nor do I know for sure whether any other time spent awake for other reasons deducts from the six-hour period.


 I don't think that other awake periods subtract from the 6-hour period, but I think they may affect how often the 6 hour wake cycle occurs. But I'm still trying to understand that pattern better.



Bokonon said:


> as long as the behavior is predictable and there seems to be a rational reason for it, I trust that the Tesla engineers made it work this way for a reason, and accept it as it is.


 Yeah, I'm mostly in the same camp with you on that. I definitely think the Tesla engineers are brilliant and I'm not feeling like anything is wrong, per se. But this animal at the zoo is still intriguing me, and I keep returning to it to see if I can't figure out a little more of its behavior.


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## Needsdecaf (Dec 27, 2018)

Bokonon said:


> 1. Make sure your car is awake.
> 2. In TeslaFi, navigate to Settings > Account
> 3. Scroll down to the "Advanced" section near the bottom, and click "View Raw Tesla API Data Output".


Thanks, never played around with this. WTF is THIS line of data?

[autopark_style] => dead_man

LOL. Does that mean it runs over any pedestrians while parking?


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## Bokonon (Apr 13, 2017)

Bigriver said:


> That field can't be exclusively about the connector. I agree that when I've got the connector attached, it says engaged. But it is often "engaged" when I did not have it attached. Just this morning it was in a 6 hour cycle and was "engaged" without being plugged in. Actually, it was also "engaged" during part of a drive today!


Ah, good point -- you're right, there are cases where it can be engaged apart from charging. Though I'm kinda curious why it would register as "engaged" for part of a drive, but not for all of it? 



Needsdecaf said:


> [autopark_style] => dead_man
> LOL. Does that mean it runs over any pedestrians while parking?


Oh noes, the secret is out!!!! Quick, someone tell the news medias!!!!!!11

A better name would have been "require_continuous_press" which is what the setting is called in the UI. It's a lot clearer in meaning -- and potentially less hysteria-inducing -- than "Dead Man's Switch". 

EDIT: I should clarify that this is a Summon (internally known as "autopark") setting, unrelated to the Auto Park feature that automatically parks the car in a parallel/perpendicular space.


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## Wooloomooloo (Oct 29, 2017)

Bigriver said:


> @Wooloomooloo, have you figured out anything further about the 6 hour wake cycles? I've read back through this thread and several others with similar wake/sleep/energy loss discussions, and you get my vote for being the smartest! You most quickly honed in and articulated the 6 hour thing and I totally concur with your hypothesis that once started, the rest of a 6 hour awake cycle resumes after a drive that interrupts it. One thing I'd like to better understand is what is the rhythm to these cycles? At first it seemed to me strictly tied to inactivity -- a 6 hour cycle would start when the car isn't driven for close to a day (with some variability, plus or minus a few hours). But 10 days ago I had the car forget Wifi, and the 6 hour cycles have started between 9 hrs and 21 hrs after the last drive, and have been 2-3 days apart from each other. I'm not seeing the pattern yet, but wondered if you might have already figured it out.


So my theory was really that the sleep cycle is constant, regardless of whether or not the car is driven. Obviously it won't sleep while you are driving it, but if you wake it during a sleep cycle, and drive it down the street and then lock it up and go for coffee, it will go back to sleep within 15 - 30 mins, depending on your sleep settings in TeslaFi.

What I don't know is whether the sleep timer is paused while driving, or continues and you can go past it.

So if a 6 hour sleep cycle starts at noon, and you drive at 1pm for an hour. At 2pm are there 4 hours remaining, or 5? I suspect the latter but I don't know.

I'm going to look at the last week, I actually took my car for a detail and it looks like it slipped during the time it was in the garage, so I will be able to work it out from projecting the weekly sleep cycle and then overlaying the behavior during that day. I'll post back here when I've done it.


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## eXntrc (Jan 14, 2019)

Sorry to revive an old thread. Just wondering if anyone ever made any further progress on figuring this out? I seem to actually have the opposite problem of most people here. I leave my car plugged in all the time and my pattern is that the car rarely wants to go to sleep because it's always topping off the battery. Seems like about every 2 hours it adds 0.10 kwh to the battery. Did anyone ever find a way to get codes or history from the car to determine why it woke up or why it didn't go to sleep?

Here's one days worth of charging logs from being parked all day:









And here's the overall stats for the day:









Total range loss of 2.72 doesn't seem horrible from what I've read in this thread. But 5 sleeps, 7 attempts and 10 idles sure seems chaotic.

I'm in Houston BTW. It gets hot. But it's parked in an attached garage which shouldn't get much over 80 and I don't see conditioning at all in that report.

Thanks for any thoughts!


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

eXntrc said:


> Seems like about every 2 hours it adds 0.10 kwh to the battery.


That is bizarre behavior. What software version are you on? When did this start?

Starting with 2020.20.5, my model X hasn't slept at all. It is now on 2020.20.12 and still not sleeping and loses between 3% to 6% per day. My model 3 went directly from 2020.16.2.1 to 2020.20.12 and I have not noticed anything unusual. I don't usually keep either plugged in when not charging. Just went out to charge the model 3 and will leave it plugged in to see if I get anything like that. I'm also a Teslafi user.

You know that if you unplug it that would be one way to stop the spurious charging! 🤨


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## sduck (Nov 23, 2017)

I would hope and assume that the two posters above have both set their sleep setting in teslafi correctly, and that it's another problem, but one can't be sure. So if you haven't, do so! One of the common myths about teslafi is that "it causes battery drain", which is partially true IF one hasn't set the sleep settings up correctly.

I had a wall of charging reports in teslafi (like the one above) with one of the software updates a while ago (not recently) - I believe it was fixed by several types of reboots and a second fine tune of the teslafi seep settings.

Since I started quarantining and haven't been working since March I've only been charging once I go below 40% SOC, and then charging to 90%, so I'm only charging about once a week. I have my display set for percentage, and don't get any phantom drain. You might want to consider not leaving it plugged in all the time, unless you're doing enough driving that you're running the car down significantly every day.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

sduck said:


> I would hope and assume that the two posters above have both set their sleep setting in teslafi correctly, and that it's another problem, but one can't be sure. So if you haven't, do so! One of the common myths about teslafi is that "it causes battery drain", which is partially true IF one hasn't set the sleep settings up correctly.


Yes, someone's sleep settings in Teslafi should always be suspect. I totally agree that if set right, Teslafi shouldn't be creating the problem.



sduck said:


> so I'm only charging about once a week. I have my display set for percentage, and don't get any phantom drain.


Same, same, same for my model 3. Model X has always been my problem child with phantom drain. It goes through periods of being ok, and then not. They really do change things in some of the software updates that affect the cycles. I've just submitted a service request for my model X.


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## eXntrc (Jan 14, 2019)

Bigriver said:


> What software version are you on? When did this start?


I'm currently on 2020.20.12, but it seems like it's been this way for quite some time. Well, I guess I should be accurate so let me go back and search the history [...]

The first instance I can find of these little 0.10 kwh charges appears to be on 4/24/2020. That's the same day I got 2020.12.6. But at that time they were fairly infrequent. Things started getting worse around 5/4/2020, which is when I got 2020.12.11.



Bigriver said:


> Starting with 2020.20.5, my model X hasn't slept at all. It is now on 2020.20.12 and still not sleeping


Yikes! Man, I hope you find the source of that.



Bigriver said:


> You know that if you unplug it that would be one way to stop the spurious charging! 🤨


Hahah. Yes, I thought of that. And I also thought about scheduling my charges. I may play around with that.



sduck said:


> I would hope and assume that the two posters above have both set their sleep setting in teslafi correctly


Well, when I first got TeslaFi more than a year ago (February 2019) I looked at the Sleep settings and let it use all of their recommended values. If you have suggestions on how I should change from their recommended values to more "correct" ones, I'm certainly open to changing them.



Bigriver said:


> Yes, someone's sleep settings in Teslafi should always be suspect. I totally agree that if set right, Teslafi shouldn't be creating the problem.


Sure. My only issue is if their recommended settings are not the "right" settings for my vehicle then I'm unclear how I find the right ones. If there's a forum post or something that anyone can link me to, I'd be more than happy to read up on it.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

eXntrc said:


> I looked at the Sleep settings and let it use all of their recommended values.





eXntrc said:


> My only issue is if their recommended settings are not the "right" settings for my vehicle then I'm unclear how I find the right ones


Yeah, I mostly have the default settings too, and they should be fine. I think the one fatal flaw is when people don't know there are sleep settings and they don't have that all important sleep mode enabled box checked at the top of the menu.

I don't think your car has a sleep or drain issue. What is unusual is the "compulsive charging." Unless someone else pipes in having seen this too, I would make a service appointment. I don't expect it is likely to result in an actual visit, but it will cause someone to review your logs and hopefully diagnose remotely.


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## sduck (Nov 23, 2017)

eXntrc said:


> Well, when I first got TeslaFi more than a year ago (February 2019) I looked at the Sleep settings and let it use all of their recommended values. If you have suggestions on how I should change from their recommended values to more "correct" ones, I'm certainly open to changing them.
> 
> Sure. My only issue is if their recommended settings are not the "right" settings for my vehicle then I'm unclear how I find the right ones. If there's a forum post or something that anyone can link me to, I'd be more than happy to read up on it.


I don't think there are any "magic" settings that will fix your situation. I think I just use the recommended ones, and they work well. The main thing as bigriver says is to make sure the main ones are enabled, like the one at the top, and also the Deep Sleep Mode one.

The problem with using teslafi to determine if you car is sleeping or not is that when it doesn't, and you reach out to tesla to see what they think, the first thing they're going to ask you is to disable teslafi. And then you won't really know if anything has been fixed or not.


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## eXntrc (Jan 14, 2019)

I do have the primary sleep mode checkbox enabled and *Time to Try Sleeping* is set to 15 minutes. I have not changed any of the Advanced mode options such as "Do not check the vehicle state during sleep attempt". If anyone is using those advanced options, I'd appreciate knowing which options you decided to set and your logic behind setting them.

I actually have NOT enabled Deep Sleep because all of my compulsive charging happens during the day. I never see the compulsive charging happening at night, but I can enable this option and see if somehow it helps. In fact I'll do that now.

I think I'm also going to schedule my charging to happen at night since we recently switched to a new electrical providers with "free nights" after 9 PM. I was just hoping to kind of figure this out before I "hid" it by not allowing charging during the day.

Thanks everyone who made suggestions. If I ever solve the mystery I'll follow up.


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## Bigriver (Jan 26, 2018)

eXntrc said:


> If I ever solve the mystery I'll follow up.


Any update? Still experiencing the weird behavior?


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## eXntrc (Jan 14, 2019)

Well, yes and no. I scheduled the car to only charge at 4:00 AM. Now it charges, then does one final top off and then just sits all day. The car just NEVER sleeps.

Here's a photo of a very common day:









I have been noticing this sort of unusual message on TeslaFi:









"Polling is disabled while the car is trying to be put to sleep. 0 minutes remaining."

That was captured at almost midnight, but I have night time sleep mode enabled from 9:00 PM









And Deep Sleep mode set at 11:00 PM









I honestly have no idea why the car isn't going to sleep. I kind of want to disconnect TeslaFi from the car, but then I'd have no idea what's going on. I REALLY wish there was some way to get a report of when APIs are getting called and from where.


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## Long Ranger (Jun 1, 2018)

eXntrc said:


> I honestly have no idea why the car isn't going to sleep. I kind of want to disconnect TeslaFi from the car, but then I'd have no idea what's going on.


If you disable TeslaFi, you can at least determine whether the car is sleeping at any given moment. On IOS just use the Tesla Widget. It will tell you if the car is asleep without waking it. I assume there's a similar capability on Android, but haven't verified that.


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## eXntrc (Jan 14, 2019)

Long Ranger said:


> If you disable TeslaFi, you can at least determine whether the car is sleeping at any given moment. On IOS just use the Tesla Widget. It will tell you if the car is asleep without waking it. I assume there's a similar capability on Android, but haven't verified that.
> View attachment 34659


Unfortunately I'm not aware of a similar widget for Android. If anyone knows, I'd love to hear about it.

Last night I went and disabled everything I could in the car too. I already had Summon and Sentry set to disabled while home, but I went ahead and turned them off. Still no sleep today.


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## eXntrc (Jan 14, 2019)

*TL;DR*

If you can't figure out what's keeping your car from sleeping, consider changing your Tesla account password. Any sites that you have previously given access to will no longer be able to poll for data.

*Full Story*

After more than a full month of not sleeping I finally found the issue. I feel pretty embarrassed about it, but here goes.

Several months ago I decided to give OptiWatt a try. This showed up on Reddit and even though I already had TeslaFi, I liked the design and the way it tracked gas savings. After several days of using it though, I kind of forgot about it. It didn't give me enough valuable information beyond what I was already getting with TeslaFi.

The problem is, I never signed out of the OptiWatt service. This is very out of character for me because I knew it used my Tesla credentials.

Three days ago I remembered OptiWatt and signed out of their service. My car has been sleeping soundly ever since (even though TeslaFi is still connected).

I have notified OptiWatt technical support of the issue. I won't personally be using their service again, but hopefully they can address their sleep issues for others that would like to continue using the service.

As embarrassing as it is, I'm glad I figured it out and I hope maybe it helps someone else.


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## casey_optiwatt (Aug 30, 2020)

eXntrc said:


> *TL;DR*
> 
> If you can't figure out what's keeping your car from sleeping, consider changing your Tesla account password. Any sites that you have previously given access to will no longer be able to poll for data.
> 
> ...


Hey eXntrc, this is Casey here I'm the developer of Optiwatt. When we first launched we had a few issues with cars not sleeping, but we have since fixed all those issues and I can assure you all cars will now sleep 100%. This has been thoroughly tested, Optiwatt will not cause any additional phantom drain. I'd love it if you gave us another chance.


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