# Tug o war: F-150



## Nom (Oct 30, 2018)

So, seems like some folks feel that the Tesla demonstration against the F-150 might not have been fair. Ford is calling out Tesla, Elon seems to have accepted - nice.

Do the pundits have good points?

https://techcrunch.com/2019/11/25/f...to-a-fair-f-150-vs-cybertruck-tow-battle/amp/


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

They do indeed. It's not a fair demonstration

Ford in rwd mode
Tesla starts pulling first
But now I'm wondering if Tesla did that to "bait" Ford into issuing a challenge like this. Because I can't imagine that - even if they changed this to be a 4wd ford and even allow it to start pulling first - the result will end any differently.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

Ford couldn't be more right. It was the most lop sided demo you could find. Having said that every major brand does the same kind of stunt to make it look good for them.

I believe the Cybertruck would win in an equal war, but we don't know as of yet. If they'd taken a properly equipped half ton F150, give it either the big Ecoboost or 8 cylinder engine, 4 WD, bigger tires and a flat surface, then we'd know.

I haven't tried to zoom in, but reports were that the Ford had the smaller 2.7 Ecoboost and you see the front wheels rolling backwards so they weren't pulling. I'm not sure if the 2.7 even has any special badging to indicate. I know all older 3.5 ecoboost all had ecoboost emblems on the door and tailgate. 

Word on the street is that the Cybertruck used is the dual motor variant, which of course would be full time 4WD and some monster tires. 

If it'd been equal the first time Ford and the fanboys wouldn't have much to aruge on. To be very fair if it had been a tri-motor, the specs of that truck really compare it more to the 3/4 ton GM/Ford pickups, not the half ton. 

I'd never send Ford a truck to test with, but they should all come with their A game and make it a fair pull. Of course it doesn't stop there, then they can go to the track, to the rocks, then to the muddy cow pastures.


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## DanSz (Feb 1, 2019)

Tug of war is all about tire friction. It’s not a good indicator of anything but tire stickiness. 

The coefficient of static friction is always higher than the coefficient of sliding friction for any two surfaces (look it up). The moment one tire slips, you’ve lost.

Load them down. Race them. It’s the only way to be sure.


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## MountainPass (May 15, 2018)

It seems like they chose the truck based on comparable pricing, is AWD available for that model? It didn't stand a chance, that's for sure.


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## Michael Russo (Oct 15, 2016)

I am not worried at all about this ‘replay’. I agree with those who say Elon actually dated Ford to do it because he is sure of the result. Think of what he did with the Taycan vs. the scooped up S!!

Of course, he’ll make sure the result is as per his wishes...


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## John (Apr 16, 2016)

It's on like Donkey Kong.
Get your popcorn.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

https://www.foxnews.com/auto/ford-no-tesla-cybertruck-tug-of-war-rematch


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

GDN said:


> https://www.foxnews.com/auto/ford-no-tesla-cybertruck-tug-of-war-rematch


_a Ford spokeswoman said "Sunny's tweet was tongue in cheek to point out the absurdity of Tesla's video, nothing more."_​
Yeah, Sunny was fooling himself if he thought a combustion Ford would stand a chance in a rematch. Combustion vehicles can't come anywhere close to Tesla's 0-RPM torque and traction control. The Ford will eventually spin its tires, losing static friction, and that's all it will take.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

garsh said:


> _a Ford spokeswoman said "Sunny's tweet was tongue in cheek to point out the absurdity of Tesla's video, nothing more."_​
> Yeah, Sunny was fooling himself if he thought a combustion Ford would stand a chance in a rematch. Combustion vehicles can't come anywhere close to Tesla's 0-RPM torque and traction control. The Ford will eventually spin its tires, losing static friction, and that's all it will take.


Yep - basically Ford has said thanks, but uh, No. Elon says he'll do it again anyway and load em up.


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## android04 (Sep 20, 2017)

GDN said:


> Ford couldn't be more right. It was the most lop sided demo you could find. Having said that every major brand does the same kind of stunt to make it look good for them.
> 
> I believe the Cybertruck would win in an equal war, but we don't know as of yet. If they'd taken a properly equipped half ton F150, give it either the big Ecoboost or 8 cylinder engine, 4 WD, bigger tires and a flat surface, then we'd know.
> 
> ...


I also noticed the front wheels rolling in the Ford and knew that it wasn't in 4WD, didn't have 4WD, or it has no traction control. That said, I have no doubt that the Cybertruck would win anyway, but I think Tesla should have made a full faith effort to be fair and think about how their video would be viewed. It seems like they maybe just did a spur-of-the-moment video and found some random employee with a random Ford pickup to use.

Also, the engine size and type on the Ford will not matter. The tires (grippiness), amount of tires with traction (and weight on them), and traction control do. Also, you want both vehicles to start pulling at the same time. If one starts first and their tires start slipping, they are at a disadvantage because friction will lower once the slipping starts.


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## Michael Russo (Oct 15, 2016)

GDN said:


> Yep - basically Ford has said thanks, but uh, No. Elon says he'll do it again anyway and load em up.


I think this will be a heck of a lot worse in terms of PR for Ford than the glass mishap at the reveal for the Cybertruck. Also noting the reference to the fully electric F150... 'in a few years'...


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## Olds442 (Dec 12, 2018)

GDN said:


> Yep - basically Ford has said thanks, but uh, No. Elon says he'll do it again anyway and load em up.


that just made my day.


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## DMC-81 (Aug 3, 2019)

When I saw that tug of war, I was less focused on who won, but was shocked at how instantly out of date the styling of the new Ford F-150 truck was compared to the CyberTruck. To me it was literally like comparing a current commercial jet to an advanced skunkworks military aircraft that was just revealed to the public for the first time. Now, that's not fair! 😉


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

DMC-81 said:


> When I saw that tug of war, I was less focused on who won, but was shocked at how instantly out of date the styling of the new Ford F-150 truck was compared to the CyberTruck.


When I first saw the cybertruck, I kept waiting for my vision to finish rendering. Damn simulation glitches!


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## DMC-81 (Aug 3, 2019)

garsh said:


> When I first saw the cybertruck, I kept waiting for my vision to finish rendering. Damn simulation glitches!


Lol. Agreed. In these days of CG, it took 5 minutes or more for the image to register as a real vehicle, not a prop etc. during the reveal.


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