# Forbes: Supercharger vs the rest (ie: Mac VS PC)



## MelindaV (Apr 2, 2016)

Forbes has a new writeup comparing the ease of using the Supercharger network vs the others. 
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brooke...-rest-its-an-apple-vs-pc-moment/#1a1ca0f740f7

I don't think they intended the two photos to be telling, but they are 
Both located in Santa Clarita, CA


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## msjulie (Feb 6, 2018)

Sadly I have to agree, right now the game changer for many is knowing the super charger network exists; even though mostly my use of an EV doesn't require it, just knowing it's there made buying this car pretty much worry free in that regard.


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## FRC (Aug 4, 2018)

I've said before; Without the Supercharging network I would never have purchased an EV, and thus would never have known that I don't need a Supercharging network.


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## iChris93 (Feb 3, 2017)

“Integrated navigation systems, third party route planners, and a faster, more diverse public charging infrastructure will enable the next generation of non-Tesla EVs to be just as compelling and easy to use as Teslas,” Way said.

Where is the proof of that? They were just saying paragraphs earlier how that is not the case.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

I'm just waiting on the Mach E / Mustang to hit the road. I know it will take them years to reach Tesla's numbers on the road, but I think that could be the first car that might help tell how much these other chargers will be used. Or if Tesla would release a CCS adapter and the rates charged at the chargers were nominal, then Tesla's might start using them, but for the most part we have no need.

With the price of gas the EV is going to have even a harder time gaining traction at this point. Very few see far in to the future.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

iChris93 said:


> "Integrated navigation systems, third party route planners, and a faster, more diverse public charging infrastructure will enable the next generation of non-Tesla EVs to be just as compelling and easy to use as Teslas," Way said.
> 
> Where is the proof of that? They were just saying paragraphs earlier how that is not the case.


Come on, you know the Apple Car Play and Android Auto that all want built in to their car (and Ford will have) will solve that . . . . oh wait, let me check on those apps waiting to be installed. Nada.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

GDN said:


> With the price of gas the EV is going to have even a harder time gaining traction at this point. Very few see far in to the future.


OPEC will probably try keeping crude prices low to keep pushing off the mass adoption of EVs for as long as possible. But once EVs reach 600 miles of range and 300kW charging rates, combustion vehicles will lose their road tripping advantages, and the only remaining benefit to combustion vehicles will be lower initial purchase prices. Low gas prices will only hold back EV adoption at the low end of the market at that point, and then they'll have to compete against used EVs.

Anyhow, that's what I see through my rose-colored glasses.


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## iChris93 (Feb 3, 2017)

garsh said:


> OPEC will probably try keeping crude prices low to keep pushing off the mass adoption of EVs for as long as possible. But once EVs reach 600 miles of range and 300kW charging rates, combustion vehicles will lose their road tripping advantages, and the only remaining benefit to combustion vehicles will be lower initial purchase prices. Low gas prices will only hold back EV adoption at the low end of the market at that point, and then they'll have to compete against used EVs.
> 
> Anyhow, that's what I see through my rose-colored glasses.


One argument I heard when the Cyber Truck was announced that I did not have a good solution for was in the case of fleet trucks. For example, if there is a company that allows fleet trucks to be taken home by the employee but also has a pretty significant rate of turn-over they may not want to invest in a home-charging solution so the user of the fleet truck would have to spend time charging while on the road cutting into working hours. This, of course, may be solved by your 600 miles of range and 300 kW charging rate.


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## GDN (Oct 30, 2017)

garsh said:


> OPEC will probably try keeping crude prices low to keep pushing off the mass adoption of EVs for as long as possible. But once EVs reach 600 miles of range and 300kW charging rates, combustion vehicles will lose their road tripping advantages, and the only remaining benefit to combustion vehicles will be lower initial purchase prices. Low gas prices will only hold back EV adoption at the low end of the market at that point, and then they'll have to compete against used EVs.
> 
> Anyhow, that's what I see through my rose-colored glasses.


I'm OK with it, like it and truly also think battery range has to get to the 400 comfortable miles minimum even in the cold (I like more). We all know now we don't truly need that, but it is preference, it is perception and truly given the option I would never buy anything less than 400 again either. It's the only thing that will truly rid all of range anxiety.

Almost no one in America wants to buy a car that is only 98% usable. They want that same car to be the one they road trip with once a year without any worry of range. I'm firmly in that boat. I love the technolgy in the Tesla. If I'm going on a 3000 mile journey I don't want to leave my tech at home and have to rent a gas car for my once a year trip, I want my fun to drive car along, so I buy more battery than I need and it sits unused most of the cars life. It's who we are, and no the current pandemic won't change it, might slow it down, but in two years we'll be right back to the excess most of us are used to having at our disposal.


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## iChris93 (Feb 3, 2017)

GDN said:


> truly given the option I would never buy anything less than 400 again either.


Agreed. If I don't need another car before Tesla releases a Y with >400 mile range, I am not going to "upgrade" from my 3 for less range.


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## garsh (Apr 4, 2016)

GDN said:


> I'm OK with it, like it and truly also think battery range has to get to the 400 comfortable miles minimum even in the cold (I like more). We all know now we don't truly need that, but it is preference, it is perception and truly given the option I would never buy anything less than 400 again either. It's the only thing that will truly rid all of range anxiety.


The more important part of a 600 mile battery is that the fastest supercharging only happens from 0% to 50% SOC. A 600 mile battery allows you to add 300 miles at full supercharging speeds. At 300kW, that could be around 10 minutes. That's now comparable to the time it takes to fill up a tank of gas.


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## iChris93 (Feb 3, 2017)

garsh said:


> The more important part of a 600 mile battery is that the fastest supercharging only happens from 0% to 50% SOC. A 600 mile battery allows you to add 300 miles at full supercharging speeds. At 300kW, that could be around 10 minutes. That's now comparable to the time it takes to fill up a tank of gas.


Exactly!


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## JasonF (Oct 26, 2018)

garsh said:


> But once EVs reach 600 miles of range and 300kW charging rates, combustion vehicles will lose their road tripping advantages, and the only remaining benefit to combustion vehicles will be lower initial purchase prices.


I think you just hit on the reason why EV's will stick with the 300-400 mile range for a while: To bring down the initial purchase price.

A large portion of car buyers don't have access to cash to buy a car, and don't really care what car they get. They just want something that has a low monthly payment, goes A to B, and doesn't use too much fuel, _in that order. _Nissan gas cars are huge sellers because they're in the golden $25,000 to $30,000 range, and even people with very little income can finance it for 6 or 8 years to get a low monthly payment, and have a reliable, warrantied generic "car". They don't even think about the $200 a month in fuel or $20 a month in maintenance.

I believe that if Tesla can get the battery cost down a bit, and start the "standard range" at 300 miles, it's conceivable they might be able to start selling cars soon starting at $32,000 (or maybe Kia or even Nissan could pull it off). That would be close enough to the golden price range where EV's can finally be considered generic "cars" as well, and that's when they fully plunge into the mainstream. In fact, at that point gas cars would have a really difficult time competing, and you'd see more brands convert their fleets over to electric.


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## SalisburySam (Jun 6, 2018)

Wow! An entire thread of moderators here with a couple of top contributor posts to spice it up. Great discussion, and thanks @MelindaV for the very insightful pictures.


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## Drake12321 (Apr 2, 2020)

I would also never buy an electric car, if not for supercharging.


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## RonAz (Oct 16, 2018)

Even though the information is available in your Tesla, wouldn't it be nice if the freeway signs for gas and diesel at the next exit would also have a Tesla logo for Superchargers. The gas drivers would then be able to see how easy it is to "fuel" a Tesla on a road trip. Perhaps we might get to the point where a separate sign would list all the types of EV chargers available at the next exit.


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